Hello everyone. First thank you for allowing me to lurk for so long. I'm a little (a lot) embarrased that this is my first topic but I haven't found a lot about it on the boards and I'm really struggling right now.

I've just finished the chapter about SF in HNHN and it's left me feeling overwhelmed and somewhat hopeless...?

Here's a little background. H had A with coworker for 4mths (give or take). It's been about a month and a half since d-day and things are looking promising...? His fog lifted relatively quickly but not painlessly and NC took a few tries...although I still wonder...have no proof of continued contact though so perhaps it's just my lack of trust. I'm reading a lot and trying to meet his EN. I admit that I still need some work with LBs...my anger sometimes gets the best of me and sometimes I let those damn visions get the best of me.

H completed EN questionnaire and says SF is #4 on his list and SF once a week would make him happy...a little background...we don't have the most active sex life. My H has always been more interested than me and I suppose I could be called 'frigid'. As I learn more about myself I realize that my ENs were not being met for a very long time...which I just thought was normal and something I had to deal with...and perhaps that is the reason for my low sex drive????

Anyway, since we've been working on our M and EN have been being met more regularly by us both our sex life has 'improved'...which, I guess, is to say that SF occurs more frequently and with more 'variety'. While I'd say I have more 'desire' than I used to I'm still not wanting it anywhere near what my H does. I've asked him to revisit his EN questionnaire because once a week is by far not enough for him. Every evening we spend time together he's always touching me, kissing me, etc which usually leaves me feeling like he's dissatisfied with just enjoying my company unless it includes sex. He says he's fallen so much in love with me again that he just can't get enough of me. I feel 'gropped'.

As I said, we're having more 'variety' in the bedroom but I have to admit that I'm doing what I'm doing because he wants it not because I do and not because I'm enjoying it. HNHN says that 'A woman does her husband no favors by sacrificing her body to his sexual advances. He can feel sexually satisfied only when she joins him in the experience of lovemaking' (page 52). I questioned my H about this and he agreed...hmmmm? So if I'm not enjoying what I'm doing should I be doing it? I don't want to say I'm 'faking' enjoyment but...well, that's what's happening.

Wait...I think I need to be a little more clear...I do enjoy sex with my H...he is tender and loving and my satisfaction is important to him. I have no problem having one O...and many times have 2. The problem comes in because I guess you could say I'm overly 'conservative'. Sigh, I hope this is okay to write..if I'm being too detailed please let me know that and I'll delete this post...I don't mean to offend anyone... but I really do not enjoy giving oral sex...which, of course, he loves, and there is a particular position I dislike...his favorite <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I'll talk about the 'position' first since that is probably easiest. I could/would/have done it his way because...well, I got tired of fighting about it. Not only do I not enjoy the position but it is always physically uncomfortable for me and usually painful. My H knows this but it doesn't seem to make a difference. He's said we won't do it if it brings me pain but we're still doing it. I just grin and bear it so to speak. I know that it is the most satisfying for him and he always makes sure I'm satisfied before we go that route but it doesn't leave me feeling good.

Okay, so I've never been a fan of giving oral sex. Someone on the recovery board put up a post saying that if a woman feels like a wh*** having sex with her H she needs counseling. Maybe I do because that's usually how I feel. Pre-A I would do it...I admit not much and usually because I was tired of fighting...and usually my H would have an O so I'd thought I'd done my 'job'. He said he enjoyed it but if not for his O I wouldn't have known...leaving me wondering if I was inadequate in this area...my issue, I know.

Post-A I've done it much more frequently...at least once a week but I'm left feeling even worse than before. Back up a bit...my H send OW an email telling her she's the best sex he ever had and that she gives him the best oral sex he's ever had...for a person already feeling inadequate this hit home hard. The other thing is that he's only had an O once this way since the A and has lost his erection several times in the middle...talk about a blow to my ego. Back up a bit again, during the A my H told me that he was having 'problems' and wanted to get some viagra...turns out it was for OW but that's another topic all together. Round about the start of their A my H was under extreme pressure (honestly if we look at the list of the top 10 stress causers he had 5 at once) so I thought that's why he needed the viagra. Because viagra takes a half hour to work my H doesn't usually have it in his system during oral sex...I'm sure he thinks if he stops to take a pill I might lose my train of thought, so to speak...and he's probably right. Anyway, he's also 'verbal' during oral sex (moans and such) now but when he loses an erection I'm thinking...is he faking it? I don't want to do it and he's not reaching an O but he says he doesn't want me to stop.

So what is my question? I don't know...I guess, how do I become more interested? How do I enjoy...if I'm doing something that makes my H happy, shouldn't that be enough to make me happy...or at least happy enough to want to do it...and to want to do it as much as he does? Should I continue to do it even if he's not reaching O and just 'get over' my feelings?

I know this need is great for a man and I want to meet it for my H...and I want enjoy it with him. My EN are starting to be met so why and I still struggling with meeting this one for him?

I'm sorry I'm all over the place with this. I'm not overly comfortable even discussing this but I don't want my H having to go elsewhere again so I figure I need to do some work on my end.

Thanks.

<small>[ March 20, 2004, 07:13 AM: Message edited by: faithfultohim ]</small>

Faithfultohim,

I have no idea about how to address your desire to have sex w/your H, nor how to get you to enjoy oral sex. I would suggest you both go back over the EN questionnaire you filled out and be sure your top 2 or 3 are being met. If a woman doesn't feel close to her H then frequently sex is the last thing on her mind.

Regarding him losing his erection during oral sex... IMO that is NOT a reason for you to feel inadequate. Heck, he had to buy viagra to get it up with the OW! It is NOT about you.

Lots of things can contribute to erectile dysfunction. General health, whether he smokes, his age, if he's stressed worrying about whether you're enjoying yourself...

Did you know that a man can orgasm even when flaccid? If my H has trouble getting or maintaing an erection, I consider that prime time for oral sex. Fun for him, and lots easier for me. Doesn't break the jaw, I can get all of him in my mouth, I don't worry so much about my teeth scraping him and hurting him, I can manipulate his penis and my tongue a lot better (less crowded in there). What I'm saying is, rather than taking it as an ego blow, take it as an opportunity on a silver platter!

I don't know if this is too graphic, either. If it is I'll edit it.

Ladies - I think this is a great topic. We might want to put a disclaimer - "very graphic" on the title. That will get all the men's attention.

But seriously, no wonder you are having doubts. It has to be upsetting after reading his letter. And it sounds like your are planning how to do a job, not SF. I would lighten up and sometimes just have fun in the bedroom.

I enjoy hot sex, get it over with sex, playful sex, and fun sex - one time we even fell off the bed, and ended up laughing hysterically. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

It is very early in your recovery, things should get better. But please don't stress out and make it one more chore to do before you can sleep.

From a M perspective and BS I think I would look at this as an opportunity. An opportunity to solve a problem as a team. Communicate to H how uncomfortable the one position is, then consider replacing that with oral sex. Still doesn't solve the problem of oral but I think a give and take discussion, that is open and honest, would go along way. Rome wasn't built in a day and I would suggest as long as you're moving in the right direction that should meet with both of your approval. Of course these needs are important for a man but equally important is the womans satisfaction. If your not having fun it's eventually going to wear him down anyway.

WOE

Thanks for your responses. I have added 'graphic' to the title as suggested.

believer - I wish I knew how to stop stressing about it so much. I even had a few drinks last night (not a drinker) hoping to losen myself up but it just wound up making me more depressed.

turtlehead - yeah, my H always tells me 'it's not you' when his erection fails but if oral sex is such a hot thing for a man how could it fail when I'm giving it...if not that I'm doing poorly at it? It's not like it's not working in the beginning. Of course, now he tells me he told OW she was the best simply because she did it...he didn't have an O with her either...is that supposed to make me feel better?

Ahhh....sigh....any other comments welome.

Faithful,your name says it all. You didn't do this so stop beating yourself up. He had the A and he is responsible for making things right.

Now, back to SF. The fact that he didn't have an orgasm during oral with her SHOULD make you happy. When you and him can get to that point together it is something you two will OWN. There will be no triggers and it will be mutually satisfying. Because just like it's important for a man to make the woman happy I'm sure the reverse is true. The goal is to make him happy without compromising you. Sex isn't supposed to be degrating of course.

Having said that I think your husband needs to back off, at least for time being, on the uncomfortable position.

Faithful

My WH came home for 6 weeks after I found out about A, we would call it a false recovery because he left for OW in the end. Anyway I had some sex issues with him also. Are you on any medication would be my first question? I was on Prozac and I had no sexual desire at all. I went off of it and I was like a wild woman. You need to think about what meds you are on and adjust them accordingly. Also there are medications out now for women who have low sex drive. Some women are just tired or stressed or just don't have the hormones they need to be sexual anymore. It happens after kids too! As far as the OS thing, I never liked doing it either, then one day I just thought to myself I really love this man and if it makes him feel good then that is what I should be thinking about. So I quit thinking about me and started thinking about him and how he felt, it made things better for me and I actually really got into it after that. Sorry to be so graphic also this is a strange thread. I would say look inside yourself and see if there are issues of why you aren't interested in sex. I was a victim of rape and I kept it to myself, so when my H wanted to do different positions it made me feel dirty. Do you have any sexual abuse in your past? If not how about getting some books that are just for women on how to feel sexy from within, or how to change your sex appeal. Keep your chin up, it is early for you and I am sure it has nothing to do with you at all. It is a strange place for both of you to be at this time.

NY <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Faithful,

It would help if you could describe what issues you have with oral sex that make it distasteful for you. What things make it uncomfortable for you? Some ladies have cleanliness issues. Some have religious/moral objections. Some don't like the taste. If you can be more specific...perhaps we can help you address the individual things about OS that you don't like to help make it more satisfying for you as well as he. I love giving OS...but not for instance when H isn't freshly showered. So when he wants sex.....and he is less than fresh...I've done a very good (an exciting job) of washing him up...almost as good as the OS I think. Then I can enjoy it and he is more excited because I do.

As far as the position that hurts you....pain is a love buster...and a huge one. If sex is uncomfortable for you, then you won't enjoy it. This one...requires radical honesty...preferably not in the middle of sex when your discomfort has already occurred and your body and emotions are bruised. You are allowed some sexual boundaries...especially when it's a matter of pain. So setting that boundary would go something like this. "Honey, position X is going to have be out our repetoire because has become to uncomfortably painful for me. I know you want me to enjoy sex more, and I can't do that when I'm hurting. Can we please look for some other positions that will be exciting for you, but not painful for me? I am open to some experimentation."

WOE - Damn. I never thought of that...something I've got over her in the bedrooom...now if I can just get it to happen at least that will make me feel good.

NY - I don't think it's a medication issue. I am on birth control but that's it. I have an appt with the GYN in a few weeks and hope that I can stop worrying about being embarrased long enough to have this conversation with her. I do have some hormonal things going on that prevent me from ovulating without medication but I've never read anything about it causing a low sex drive.

star*fish - Thanks. I don't know if it's really cleanliness or not but I just don't think a person's face should be in that area. Taste, smell, just the knowledge of what goes on there <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> My H is a clean person and usually wants to shower before sex anyway but still... I used to join him but read a few too many graphic emails about their showering time and now going in together literally freaks me out...it's like she's in there with me...hopefully that will fade with time because I used to enjoy showers with him. I guess it's just something I have to get over if I plan to meet this need for him. I'm just not sure how to do that. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

We've talked a lot about sex since d-day...and that was very difficult for me...huge step on my part and since I initiated it also I think I blew my H's mind. I was clear that I don't care for the painful position and he said that we didn't have to do it anymore but I know he prefers it to all others (not just personally prefers it but it's most satisfying or him also) so I usually wind up just saying I'll do it even if he doesn't initiate it.

When we first got together and I said no to something I thought it was great that that was respected (I was never sexually abused but have done some things I didn't want to do because of pressure from people I've been with). I always felt safe saying no to my H...even before we were M...but I guess he's gotten frustrated with my resistance to some things and now no has turned into 'here she goes again'. Actually, I guess he's gotten sick of a lot of things with me...obviously since he engaged in an EA/PA with someone else.

I'm sorry for my pity party...I guess it's not like he's asking for bizarre things in bed...thank God...I know this is my issue...I'm really not one who likes to do things I'm not comfortable doing or things I don't think I do well...now that he knows I read his emails he tells me 'You know I don't like to compare people...especially in this area...it's not fair to anyone...but you are the best...so much better than her...I wish you'd believe that.' Well, if he hadn't left me for her it might have been easier to believe. "I'm with you now though, aren't I", he says...

URGH!!! I'm going to sign off because the pity party is getting out of hand. I have to refocus on something else. Thanks everyone!

No sex is as good as married sex. So wipe all of those thoughts out of your mind. You are early in recovery, and it is hard.

Continue on the path you are on. Things will get better.

I've found that, since the A (which was oral sex but not intercourse), I have lost the desire to perform oral sex. Oh, well...

I think that what you are up against is the desire to meet HIS needs at your expense. That's a violation of POJA. The only way for you to be passionately in love with him is if everything sexual is enjoyable for both. You're feeling inadequate and so forcing yourself to do what you don't like, which is a downward spiral.