Here I am seeking out some info for someone else and I run across this great thread from a poster named "H"...a WS...where he explains a lot of his thinking while in the fog...

it's long but keep reading if you are struggling with a WS in withdrawal/fog right now...I think you'll find it helpful...

inside the WS fog

much of what H talks about is how his BS was able to support his decision to come out of the fog by her loving, supportive attitude...

this conclusion mirrors a lot of the comments I have made to various folks recently -- the importance of stopping all LBs and listening to your WS -- so I thought it was worth opening a new thread here so you could read and talk about it...

sure: you can kick his/her WS a** to the curb, yell, scream, rant, rave...you can threaten and punish your WS...I grant you, with some of your WS this approach will no doubt work...and there are posters here who will happily tell you this approach worked for them (at least in the short-term it did)...

however, there is another path you can choose to follow if you want to...time, patience, love...

work on yourself, understand why you are so emotional...understand how you can take control over your reactions...stop reacting based on how you feel and start reacting based on your choice to save your M...develop and cultivate other interests/friends/support networks...change the things about yourself that you have wanted to for years...

there are lots and lots of things you can do while you wait for your WS to make their own choices...you don't control them, but you do control YOU...

hope this helps...awed

<small>[ March 26, 2004, 02:52 PM: Message edited by: awed18 ]</small>

This is an incredible post and I think it applies to most of the people who come to this site. You can NOT let your emotions dictate your behavior and you can't change the other person, you can only change you.

Awed,

They need to make that post required reading for anyone seriously trying to recover their marriage.

I never knew just how similar are situations are. The moment of clarity that your husband had while talking with a friend is what I pray for everyday.

I going to finish reading his comments at lunch. Please let him know that he has helped someone he'll never meet get through one of the toughest times of their life.

Wow, it's amazing what you can read here!

There's Hope!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Titleist

Awed, it is a great thread. Is that your H?

I like to know what you've done, how strong you are. Please help me. I am very weak now. I know that I got to be strong for this. I almost read through my WH's mind. I am half way though now reading the thread. How I wish my Wh can communicate with your H.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> however, there is another path you can choose to follow if you want to...time, patience, love...

work on yourself, understand why you are so emotional...understand how you can take control over your reactions...stop reacting based on how you feel and start reacting based on your choice to save your M...develop and cultivate other interests/friends/support networks...change the things about yourself that you have wanted to for years...

there are lots and lots of things you can do while you wait for your WS to make their own choices...you don't control them, but you do control YOU...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks awed. This is what I'm striving for, but sometimes it is so hard to keep the emotionality in check. I try and try. Maybe once my H moves out it will be easier. Its like he wants to start over and work on being friends. This is just so hard. I think about him not being here 24/7. Gotta go.

WG, I have the same feeling as you. I haven't had time to read your thread yet, but I will.

InGreatPain: good for you to realize this already! truly...I spend a lot of time trying to get this across to folks...

there's lots of proactive stuff you can do (exposure, etc.), but you cannot change the other person...the sooner you realize it, the better the chances of saving your M, personally recovering, and making it through the long-haul of M recovery...

Titleist: keep hope buddy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

but I had to laugh...and then went back and edited my original post...he's not my H, his "name" is "H"...gosh no, my H would NEVER write here...oooh I'm chuckling now at the thought...thanks for the Friday giggle!

keep your chin up and do NOT lose hope..."H"s story is a good one for demonstrating that hope is an incredible driving force...his post gives so much detail of the foggy thinking, the excuses, the rationalization, the same old lines we BS have heard but with an interesting explanation in hindsight...

lostnhurt: listen, you too can get strong but you have to WANT to do so...did you read my thread to MK? I've got a few others too where I go into lots of detail about techniques I used to get me back on track...to stop the LBs, to deal with the anger, to smile in my WH face as he left to see OW...I learned a lot of control over myself and that is what you need to do if you expect to make it through recovery...

have you done the emotional detachment exercise yet? if not, I'll find it and bump it for you...or maybe post some links here for anyone who needs them...I've been threatening to post a tips & techniques thread for months now...

I guess I should get to it!

take care of yourself first and foremost...okay? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

wontgiveupyet: actually, I read your thread today...hey, being friends could easily be the first step you know? sure, he's probably not done with OW yet but sometimes it can be a silver lining that they go right to the brink before pulling themselves back...

do you know what I mean? it is THEIR choice to end the A, one way or another...and renewed contact can start everything up again...this is a hard road (as I am fond of saying)...sometimes brinkmanship means your recovery will go smoother as a result...

if you try N/C with your H, you'll discover first-hand how hard it is to do...recovery has its own special bumps!

that is why I counsel patience...with boundaries of course, but patience nonetheless...you need to teach yourself some new skills first and foremost, and look after yourself well, prepare for the long-haul...

truly...learning the skills I identified above will give you such a grounding everywhere in your life that in 1-2 years time you will look back and feel blessed, no matter what happened with your M...

but if you do not take this opportunity -- yes! OPPORTUNITY -- to learn in the midst of your very great pain, your trials and tribulations...then you may well find yourself no better off than you are today...

shoot...don't mean to be doom and gloom, quite the opposite! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

essentially: try hard to work on yourself...make the most of your time and effort...he will or won't come back to the M...that is not in your hands (although certainly take the proactive actions suggested by others)...but understand that you cannot MAKE him do anything that he does not want to do, nor can anyone else...

hope you feel stronger soon...you should not lose hope either...okay? awed

Awed, you're doing good work around here these days. It's nifty.

Hey J! Well...thanks y'all! of course, with you busy elsewhere, someone has to step in with a few choice words... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ...or in this case, just copying someone else's choice words...

funny world...I just wrote a nice compliment about you to a mutual friend...you keep up your good work too <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ...hope all's going well with the courtcase/petition...awed

Why thanks! And tell the mutual friend I said hello! (Though if it's the one I'm thinking about, I just talked to her today... and if it's not the one I'm thinking about, I probably talked to him or her today anyway!)

The legal stuff.... goes. I've decided not to contact my attorney again until 1) a week has passed or 2) she's done what I asked for.

And if it's 1), then it's time for a new attorney. If it's 2), then I'll be happy.

Awed, Can you please bump those links for me about the technique and detachment. I am lost in so much information here. Thanks.

LNH: a big hug to you sweetie...you are having a truly rough time all around aren't you?

here's the thread on emotional detachment...someone else mentioned it's straight from Melody Beattie's (sp?) book...she's the co-dependency "guru"...
emotional detachment

I've suggested this exercise to many folks...it's a simple exercise but it helps you see where you need to detach...hence it helps you to detach from the EMOTIONS...helps you to remain calm...

here's another link for you that you may have already read, but it helps you get perspective on the nitty-gritty feelings associated with Plan A...

doormat in Plan A

I need to collect the other pieces on coping techniques...they are extremely simple but will work for you in the long-run...

quick references:

1. deep breathing, never underestimate the importance of deep breathing when you are in the grip of any strong emotion (anger, pain, fear)

2. lots and lots of physical activity...what are you doing?

3. go someplace "safe" (ie. forest, deserted tunnel) and scream/yell out your anger, fear, pain

4. again, on your own (ie. don't scare WS or kids!), kneel on floor in front of bed, extend arms out over head, and pound the crap out of the mattress...yell and scream as you need to

5. just have a darn good sobbing cry...release the pain regularly (rather than dribbling all the time!)

6. when you are having rambling, non-productive thoughts...visualize a stop sign in your head. say out loud, "STOP ______" (your name). stop whatever you are doing and go do something else (physical movement will often break a "thought-wheel")...repeat until the useless thoughts stop...you WILL get better at controlling your thoughts over time

have you tried any of these techniques? they all worked for me...I'll see what else I can round up for you...awed

Awed,

Thank you so much. I don have a lot of pain. I will try them tonight. I am not an angry outburst person. But I may cry. I will read all those threads after putting kids to bed. I praise GOD for leading me to this site.

Awed,

I stumbled onto this post and want to thank you so much for adding the links to the post about emotional detachment and the one from the wayward husband. I found that one especially inspiring and have copied both for reading again when I need to.

I wish I could get my own WH to read the post from "H" because it is so good. I think it is what my WH experiences from time to time--the fear that if he leaves the OW, he will give up something that feels good for something that is no different (or worse) than it was when he left.

I just have to pray for strength to stay strong and never give up (but I have to learn to detach, too.)

My WH has confided many times lately to me things that OW has done that have made him angry, because she's "controlling" him. And I think to myself "isn't this one of the reasons he supposedly had this A, because he felt like this was what I was doing?"

I just pray that as time goes on, he can get past his fears that our marriage will be awful if he comes back, and he can see that the OW is a leach and a user, and that the warm, fuzzy feelings he has for her will eventually die, and that he'll be brave enough at that point to come back to me and not run away out of fear.

LL

LNH: usually I work with folks to reduce anger...I think anger hurts yourself most of all...and anger is a secondary emotion, usually covering fear...so if you get to the root of the anger, you can deal with the primary emotion...

but in your case...you really do appear to be in loads of pain...I don't know why you would say you are not in pain?

and frankly, anger would be good for you! pain turned inward as I've seen you doing is injuring you...I'd like to see you stop before major damage is done...

try the bed thing...see if you can reach inside and unlock your emotions in order to release them...try something new...you need to get stuff out of you...

that's my opinion -- pushy I know but I sure hate reading what you are going through...

lordslady: you are most welcome! listen...do the detachment exercise...I've wanted to post it to you actually...

let go of your fear...it is keeping you locked in a bad place...your WS is going through a "natural" process and it will take awhile...he is going to blow his own A apart with the help of OW...

let it happen...let it go...repeat those lines to yourself over and over...

use the stop sign technique I described to change your thinking forever...FOREVER...don't fool yourself, DO it...you are denying yourself freedom right now...

give YOURSELF this gift...you know others have also been urging you to do so for some time now...I can speak from the other side...I didn't even realize I was hanging on! but once I let go, the release was incredible...

it is YOUR fear...you, and only you, can release it...you've given that power into your H's hands but it isn't there -- that's just an illusion...even if he came back repentent today, your fear would still be there...

take it back into YOUR hands...stop denying that you have control over YOU...

let go...work on you...you know the drill...it takes courage to change yourself...

see if this helps: you desperately want him to change...how about if you lead the way? provide leadership by changing yourself first? that will help him to understand that change truly IS possible...

you CAN do it...okay? awed

P.S. the changed YOU is not someone he'll want to run away from...

^^^ for lordslady and LNH...awed

So all I am hearing that going to Plan B will make me to have less pain. Is that right? I really don't know. What if he never come back?