I'm in need of a little brain picking here! As some of you may have noticed, if you've read any of my posts, I'm not too patient with Plan A. At least I don't feel like I am. It has been almost 5 weeks of NC. H's EA and PA started about a year ago, and came to a halt when he finally told me about the EA on 1/29/04. The OW was his office manager for 5 yrs., he developed a friendship with her, and then the A.

H is trying. I feel like there is closeness between us. Unfortunately for me, I am very intuitive and know when he is grieving his loss of OW. This morning was one of those times. I could tell he was there last night also. The thing is I just want to bag the whole thing when I see this. The A makes me sick enough, but witnessing this grief is a double kick in the gut.

Comfortably Numb, I asked you about sex. I'll get into more detail on that subject maybe another time. Except to say when referring to H and OW's sex, H wants me to call it "having sex". He gets very disturbed when I call it "F"ing. I can get kind of crude. It's probably my defense mechanism. What pisses me off more than anything is we didn't follow the typical stereotype of the WS is sexually deprived. I was the one who was deprived because of his sexual dysfunction due to meds he was taking. So he got that straightened out and the horny "B" was waiting and willing.

My question to all of you is this. How long did it take you to get over the withdrawal? I am afraid I will just kick him out because I can't tolerate it anymore. At least twice a week I basically tell him to go to OW, even though he's not asking to do that. He was forced to break it off in the IN-LOVE stage, and I don't want to live with his fantasy forever. How do us BSs even know it was a fantasy? I can't and won't be the one he is settling for. If it was so great with OW then maybe he should be with her. Then I could move on.

Did you all get to the point of REALLY seeing the bubble world you were in? OW would not discuss anything conflict producing. H sees that, but still sees her in some sort of idealized way. She actively pursued him during a really bad year in our lives. Sickness and deaths were non-stop, not to mention other stressors. And please, for you men, explain this to me. I asked this question a few weeks ago and no one responded. H remembered some things she did before the EA started. She would blow kisses to him across the desk. He asked her to stop but she kept doing it. She would pretend a cat was in the office and make meow sounds. What is the turn on with that? Sounds kind of sick to me. And of course there was the sucking the popsicle like she was giving a blowjob incident. Sorry, but actively going after someone's H is not a nice person to me. Did any of you actually get to the point of realizing that? Did any of you think about the fact that the OP cared nothing about your kids, just what they wanted?

H and I before the year of sickness and deaths had a good M, except for H's sexual dysfunction. I still can't believe how he dismantled our M. How he allowed this little twit to invade our M. I am willing to try to heal from this, but I don't want to waist my time. A whole year was taken out of my life already. So what advice do you FWSs have to give me? Should I hang in here? Will H ever get through this withdrawal? Will I ever be the one he knows he would grieve if I was gone? I've been telling him to think about that, but he says he can't picture it in his mind.

Thanks! Sorry if any of my comments offend any of you. Just realize I am talking and venting about my own personal fogged out WS when I say something nasty. I admire you folks who have come out of this still married. CV

CV, sorry if I'm jumping in where not requested. The difference in our situations is I sit and guess what's going on where you actually discuss the matter. But I do believe my W is starting to see what a piece of crap she succumbed to. A young pot head who boasts 10 married woman. I'm not bashing or bitter but the guy is pathetic and it amazes me the rosey glasses she has for him. So I do believe your H will start to realize he met a predator and nothing more. Also you lost a year of your life?
No, you learned a valuable lesson that will serve you well the rest of your life wherever you go.

I also agree with you that I don't want to be the boobie prize. That's why I need W to end this as I could do it with a phone call. The OM doesn't know I know. It would break his spirit if I gave him what I know. And W would have the stones you have to show her face with the team. But I sit tight and let her do it in her time. Anything less is settling for me. I have always been very empathetic to the WS because I know they are at a low place when the A starts. In my W's case it was friend after friend kicking her in the teeth. I wasn't much support as I used to think it was her that drove people away. But now I see there are really two sides to everything. My real message, and then I'll leave you alone on this thread, is hang in there. Be a success story. If things work out like they can, there is no one on the planet that could make you happier than a loving, remorseful husband. Remember the letter from Trueheart? That's whats possible. That's why were all here.

Walking, I don't mind that you jumped in here. At 1st I thought you were a FWS also.

Thanks for the encouragement. It's strange, but at the beginning of this (near d-day), when the pain was the greatest, I could actually see that there might be a lesson in all this. If you will, on a spiritual level, maybe the grand plan that H and I had to go through. As you said, not a year lost, but a valuable lesson learned. As time goes on, even as H's fog begins clearing out a bit, I seem to have a harder time continuing. Not sure why. I told H that I don't want to be looking over my shoulder the rest of my life. I want to know he's with me because he wants to be with me. Can a WS really know that if the A didn't play out to its conclusion? H said he has no closure with OW. Bottom line is I'm just in a "I'm so tired of the A and the consequences of the A" mode. Maybe I need to try and focus on my boys and how a D would effect them. Maybe that will keep me strong! You hang in there too! I can't believe you have been doing this for so long. That is the sign of a strong man, not a weak man. Hopefully your W will realize what she's got! CV

CV, if nothing else I'll keep your question in play by responding. Hope you get the responses you're looking for. In short I can easily see the shoe being on the other foot. That's why I empathize. I know lots of people as you do who you would never have thought would have done this. Are they lousy people? No they're just like you and me. A lot of bad stuff happening at the same time and the wrong person comes along. I'm not excusing it but looking at it like an addiction. And as far as my resolve goes; I will never forget the fact that my W spent the first 9 years of our marriage in an apartment because of my gambling addiction. Our next home had 3 major floods. Now that we're finally in our dream house she has two consecutive affairs. Go figure. But that helps me support her through this. I don't think she would support me, I KNOW she would. How would your husband respond in the reverse.

WOE

CV-

I like to think that I'm past my withdrawal. I say "I like to think" because I thought I was a while back, and was wrong... but I'm DEFINITELY in a different place than I was then. I know that for certain. I think that I was at my worst at the time that your H is at right now. It was pretty hairy at that point... and I know that it was terribly difficult for my H to have to deal with my symptoms. I was open with my H about what I went through as I went through it... and even while I was in my pain, I marveled that he was willing to listen to me and even hold me as I struggled. Talk about deposits in a Love Bank... that helped me to see that he really loved me... and made me feel closer to him than I had in so long.
I can't say when the worst was over... possible at the 2 month mark? Don't really know... it was the sort of thing where I just realized one day that I hadn't cried about OM for a while... and that my H was finally the first person that I thought of to call when I walked out of a class or just wanted someone to talk to. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I've heard people say that it takes at least 3 months... but there are lots of different views on that, as well. I just know that it happened for me... somewhere between 2 and 3 months, I guess. I don't hate OM... most likely never will... but I don't need him anymore, either. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> That feels really good to say!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

CW

I took a break from writing on here. However, since I'd still like answers to my post, hopefully some of you FWS MB friends will respond. I am getting dangerously close at times to sabatoging the progress H and I are making just because I can't tolerate his withdrawal. Yesterday I actually told him the biggest mistake I made was following the MB principles and that I wish I would have let him go in the beginning. That way I would already be moving on with my life. We ended up talking, and me crying later about the impact of this A, and ended up close. But I know I need to get beyond these episodes of wanting to kick him out.

Walking, I wish I could say my H supported me during the rough times. He hasn't always let me down, but especially early on he didn't support me during some really bad times. I think it was his inability to deal with his own feelings. And he obviously gave me no support during my dad's declining health, dying, and death. He was too busy being satisfied by OW. That will be a huge area of forgiveness for me if we make it to recovery.

Captain's wife, thanks for your input. It gives me some hope. I know I'm impatient. It is going on 6 weeks of NC. Given the enormous amount of time H and OW spent together, intellectually I know 6 weeks is a drop in the bucket. Emotionally I start to feel close to H, and think he feels the same, and then his grief emerges. I then think, how can you be grieving someone who actively set out to destroy your family for her selfish gains? I don't need H to hate OW, but I hope one day he really gets the manipulation she used that almost and maybe will destroy our M, and did destroy his friendship with his expartner. It's very sad to me that he sees this, yet still can't at the same time.

Thanks for any additional feedback! CV

CV55, I think this is the post you wanted me to look up (isn't it?)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> How long did it take you to get over the withdrawal? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It took me over 18 months to finally let the fantasy of the affair and the OW go completely. I was functionally over with it in about 8 months.

The ONLY reason it took me this long is that I never addressed the base mental health issues I had. Only within this last year did I seek IC that helped me see why I couldn't let go. I highly recommend the same for your H.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did you all get to the point of REALLY seeing the bubble world you were in? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I saw this very early on, but part of the withdrawal process is the "what if" game. Would we have been able to have a relatioship outside the bubble? Would it have been good since we seemed so well matched inside of it? So yes, I was absolutely aware of the affair "bubble" - even while I was in it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Will I ever be the one he knows he would grieve if I was gone? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Take heart...you always were. He's back because you mean more to him than she did. Even so, he's still got to go through the process of letting the fantasy/addiction go. That can be hard. But it's doable...I'm living proof.

One piece of advice...during this time of withdrawal, grieving, whatever...avoid lovebusting. It's a time of serious confusion where he's asking himself if he did the right thing. Of course he has, but he's so fogged he can't see it yet. Don't give him ANY excuse to think that he hasn't. It won't be this way forever. This doesn't mean you can't express your hurt to him. You can and should do this without lovebusting.

Low

Low, thanks for searching for my post. I decided to just forget about it because I'm not exactly in the same place anymore as when I wrote that post. However, reading your response was very helpful to me.

H is behaving like his withdrawal is lessening. I did tell him during the time of this post that I didn't need to be a witness of his withdrawal distress on a daily basis. I think he got that and began to fake it a bit more. We haven't talked about his withdrawal and whether he still wants to call OW in a while. A part of me wants to know, and then another part of me just doesn't.

I hope it doesn't take H 18 months. Thanks for being honest. H is getting IC. He is having wild dreams. From the beginning I'm the one he is with in the dreams, not OW. I know this because he wakes up in the middle of the night from a nightmare and tells me. Being a counselor, and just because I love dreams, he knows I'm into it. I love the dream he had last week. In the dream he was walking by a house in our neighborhood. An armadillo was blocking his way. He tried to beat it off with a broom and a bat, but it kept approaching him anyway. The armadillo promised him candy if he wouldn't tell his parents. Of course it doesn't take a brain surgeon to know who the armadillo is. That dream will be discussed with his shrink this week he told me.

It's nice to hear from you that he would grieve me and that's why he's here. Sometimes it's difficult to see that. At some point I need to heal from the pain of this. I'm doing OK living in the present, yet I know it's there under the surface. I felt like he needs to get on more solid ground before we really begin that process. How did you and your W approach that? I think MB does a great job is saving the M and hopefully regaining the love back. But I don't think it addresses dealing with the healing process.

Thanks again for answering this post! CV

CV - I rarely post on this forum, and I'm trying to get out of the habit of lurking around this place, but your post caught my attention. I struggled through H's withdrawal too, and wanted to share our timeline in the hopes that it can offer you some reassurance. Your H being in IC is great, by the way.

D-day was December 2002. NC started in March 2003. The summer had its ups and downs, and there were times where I too could sense that H was missing OW (yuck!). By October 2003 I was just about at the end of my rope - still didn't feel like H was *present*, if you know what I mean. Fortunately, our MC helped me to express this, and it was a wake up call for H. On October 30 he 'came out of it', from my perspective. He made it clear, for the first time, that he was committed to me, and to our M, and to rebuilding. He was finally *present* in our M, no longer there but missing OW.

We talked about it later, and H told me that he felt that his withdrawal was significantly over by August/ September (~6 months of NC). After that he was 'wallowing' (his words!) in feeling bad about missing OW. In October he realized this, and that's when he 'came back' to our M fully (from my perspective).

Gosh, sorry to be so wordy. It's not an easy road, but it has been well worth it.

Good luck, take care of yourself, and be strong!

Hello CV:

How are you doing? Better I hope.

Take a deep breath. This sh@t takes a while.

Withdrawl sucks. Watching someone you care about go throught it . . . watching them being sad about missing someone else sucks too. I think that part hurt my wife more than the affair. Watching me mope and act like a hurt child who lost their favorite toy.

It is real and it is painful. . . but it does pass. It just may take a while. Give him some good feelings about you to replace the ones he has formed about the OP. Be nice to him until it makes you want to vomit, then get out for a while and blow off steam with some friends. If you act *****y etc. it just makes the OP look better in his eyes.

I know it isn't fair that you have to play nice. Think of it as your husband being ill and you are just trying to get him well. Once this withdrawl thing is passed he will begin to see the mess he as made. It took me a long while . . . I just didn't want to admit that my affair was unique . . . just like everyone else's. I'm so glad that that is all passed.
Cheers,

Numb