Folks, I swore to myself that I wasn't going to post today...I only seem to post when I'm not feeling good and I decided I was going to 'get myself through this one alone' but it's not working...

It was a rough weekend for me and it's really bothering me. Everything seemed to trigger me and I'm really struggling with this rollercoaster. I just want this d@mn pain to go away. I just want it to be over. I want my life back and I'm just not seeing happiness for my future. I just really don't think I'll ever get over this. I just really don't think I'm ever going to get over this hurt, this pain, this betrayal.

I had a few 'good' days (good as compared to what I've been having but certainly not 'good' in terms of a 'normal' person) and then the weekend. The weekends are harder for me because I'm on MB less (I try to 'hold it together' when H is around and stay off this site) and I'm spending more time with H. Spending time with H should be good but sometimes it just makes things harder. It just seems like every time I look at him I'm reminded of how he betrayed me. I look at him and have such hatred for him. He's doing everything he 'should' be doing (telling me he loves me, an encouraging hug, helping with kids and house, spending some time alone with me, etc) but I'm 'not feeling it', if that makes sense? I feel like I'm walking around with an empty heart and nothing he does seems to fill it up. Even if he does something that deposits those love units...that I actually feel that he's sincere about something it doesn't last...the next trigger or thought comes and out flys that deposit.

I hate that he just 'puts it out of him mind by focusing on other things' (his words). Why is it so easy for him to do that? Why was it so easy for him to put me (and our M) out of his mind, sleep with another woman, share intimate thoughts with her (things about his childhood that it took many years for him to share with me...and some I just recently found out AFTER he had told her), and now, after everything is out in the open he can, again, so easily shut off?

I feel love for him but it's love when I think about our past together. I appreciate the things he's doing for me now but I don't know that I feel love about them. What is love anyway?

I am really struggling with meeting his needs. SF is his top need and I have no desire. Every day I try to mentally psych myself up to initiate but I have not been very good with my follow through. My sex drive has never been very high and SF has always been an issue for us (which, from my readings, I'm now understanding that that 'content' life I was living...the life I was willing to accept even though it meant my needs weren't usually being met, probably caused my low drive). I know that I need to step up to the plate but letting my H touch me just triggers a whole bunch of visions and emotions leaving me feeling empty, used, and, often like a whore...yes, I know I'm his wife so I shouldn't feel like a whore having SF with him but...well, I'm sorry but I do.

I'm trying to meet his other top needs and I think I'm doing okay with them but I know that without SF being met we're in trouble.

I'm sorry that I'm all over the place with this post. I usually feel better just writing things out...organizing my thought, so to speak...but today...I guess this is the downward spiral of the rollercoaster <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Hugs for you (((((Losing Focus)))))

The feelings you describe remind me of the way I felt sometimes after some of my WH's past affairs. I really feel for you. I guess I don't really have any specific advice for you (other than pamper yourself more in general and especially on the worst days)

I'm sorry, I just don't know what else to say.
I suspect I'm more the type of poster who likes to respond in the more analyze/lecture (and rant/confront) style?

Hang in there, you're not in this alone, we do understand. It anything maybe it will help to know what you're feeling is expected after what you've been through.

Hey LF!

I was just thinking about you this morning...wondering when your H's IC appointment is today...and then you posted.

Your problem is that YOU ARE NORMAL. Everything you have described are the normal feelings of a BS. The first 3 - 4 months are the worst.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hate that he just 'puts it out of him mind by focusing on other things' (his words). Why is it so easy for him to do that? Why was it so easy for him to put me (and our M) out of his mind, sleep with another woman, share intimate thoughts with her (things about his childhood that it took many years for him to share with me...and some I just recently found out AFTER he had told her), and now, after everything is out in the open he can, again, so easily shut off? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I wonder if this is a guy thing? My H says the same thing...if OW or the A enters his mind he just "puts it out of his mind"...his exact words LOL. Is it really that easy? Who knows. H makes it seem that way. Maybe you'll learn more as your H goes through counseling.

I, like you, tend to dwell on it, rethink everything, make myself crazy and sick! I find it very hard to just put it out of my head.

I had a rough weekend also - just to top off my rough week. I was in the same boat as you...H being extremely nice, sensitive, loving, caring, helpful...actually trying to communicate with me...but I was like *whatever*. I get in these hurt modes that everything he says sounds like a line to OW during his A. I just can not get A stuff out of my head since discovering the hotel bills. GRRRRR! I was in such a good place a week ago!

I know I'll get out of it. I know it's just a dip in the rollercoaster!

I guess another thing that sticks in my mind is what my IC said to me. She said that if H can follow the boundries, continues in AA, tries to improve himself...IC personally thinks his A days are over...then I should stick in there and recover my M. IC said that if I gave up on this M, that eventually some other pervert would be knocking at my door.

I thought of that several times this weekend. I do know H better than anybody else does. I have learned more about H than ever before. H knows me better than anyone. We do have fun together. We can get along really well. There has been a closeness at times that is unbelievable. Do I want to have to learn about someone else all over again or them me? No. Plus, I really do love H.

Focus on the positive...IC for your H tonight! Nearing the end of the first 3 months!

Let's make our rollercoasters head to the top...or maybe we should just jump off!!!

I'm sorry you are having a rough time. It will get better *says sss who is having her own pity party at 10 months past d-day*!

Take care.

sss

i too don't know what to say and i'm sorry for your continued struggle. but i would give just about anything for my WS to give us another shot. wishing you much strenght and prayers to you.

BEWARE...THERE IS A VENT IN HERE!!!

Thanks everyone. I just don't understand how this is 'normal'. Everything I've read says that if your needs are met...if your love language is spoken...so how come I still feel so empty? He's trying...not always succeeding but he is trying...I see he's trying so why am I not feeling better? I'm not vomiting and I certainly have gotten my 'emotional eating' back but other than that my insides feel somewhat like they did just after d-day. I'm not sleeping and when I do I'm having nightmares and I'm just so d@mn tired of crying all the time.....URGH!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> IC said that if I gave up on this M, that eventually some other pervert would be knocking at my door. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Couldn't we just lock the door <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I have learned more about H than ever before. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What I've recently learned about him I hate...that he had an A, that he could so easily put his family aside, that he planned to leave me for OW and try to take my children from me, that he shared intimacy with someone else, that he allowed another into his heart, and that even when he swore it was over he was still mocking me to OW...simply, what I've learned about my H is that he can/will ask another to join him in bed and in life, without even the slightest hesitation of my feelings or of our marriage/family...yes this is in the past but it haunts me every day.

...and what I hate even more is that I should be past this by now...I actually thought I was getting past this...and then *SLAM* when I wasn't looking it...here are all those thoughts again.

I know that I am one of the 'lucky' ones whose WS did not ever move out...there is n/c and no fog left... and yes, sss, my H has his first IC session today. He's not overjoyed about it, is not looking forward to it, and I'm sure won't want to go back after today...hopefully he'll continue with it though. I thanked him for going today and I'll hug him when he gets home.

Thanks all for letting me vent. Maybe I just needed to get it out...???

Try this analogy. Your Love Bank had been depleted for so long that you can't expect in a few months that it will be filled again. Keep working and eventually it may if you allow it. Takes time. Good luck and God Bless. With God's strength you can recover!

It is really an ordeal because a lot changes after you find out that the person you considered your other half, your best friend, the person you trusted more in life, has put you through this. I did not know that women went through what you are describing, since I thought it was only men who felt like that. It goes to show that the pain and disappointment are such that they affect the way you live day to day and your outlook on that person next to you. It is very sad that they do not think about the consequences of their actions and expect you to put it aside as if nothing ever happened. After you find out, you are left wondering if they really loved you as they say they did.
I too have had horrible nightmares and difficulty sleeping. The only suggestion I have is to keep your mind busy with other things. Enjoy your children. And try to maintain a friendly atmosphere at home. Will the romantic love ever return? Will life be normal again? I guess those are questions that each of us will be able to answer as time passes. One additional thought, many here in this forum have said that self steem is a common problem in the unfaithful spouse's part. If that is your husband's case, be supportive and let him find out his strengths and unique talents.

<small>[ May 03, 2004, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: Why-me? ]</small>

&%$*#

My post back to you just went...somewhere.

Gotta go for now.

I'll respond tonight.

Take care LF.

sss

RecoveringH - I see your analogy and since I've learned about my LB I've realized that it was low...I was surviving with it that way...accepting it. The A depleted it completely...and I think the triggers/thoughts of the betrayal just keep it empty. It's like my LB is coated with oil and anything trying to go in it is coated with water.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">from why-me? It is really an ordeal because a lot changes after you find out that the person you considered your other half, your best friend, the person you trusted more in life, has put you through this. It goes to show that the pain and disappointment are such that they affect the way you live day to day and your outlook on that person next to you. It is very sad that they do not think about the consequences of their actions and expect you to put it aside as if nothing ever happened. After you find out, you are left wondering if they really loved you as they say they did.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am so very hurt by his actions. I came from a life of no love...a single parent mother who, to this day, hasn't ever made her children feel loved. I lived my life hating men...or, at least, not trusting men (F had an A...parents divorced...F left our lives completely...lots of negatives because of it). I mean, seriously, I NEVER trusted men...any man. Then I met my H. I was leary of him from the start...too good to be true. We met our Sr. year of college and started dating in March. I truly thought we'd graduate in May and that would be that. He'd go his way and I'd go mine (we lived about 4 hours from each other). It would be a fun few months. He made me feel good...worthy...loved AND he never went away. We graduated and he never went away...wouldn't go away... He'd call me at 2 in the morning and tell me he missed me and was on his way to see me. He wouldn't let me get away. Try as I might to keep my wall up...to never trust him (after all he was a man) he snuck in the tiny little crack and tore my wall down. He's been by my side ever since...we've had our share of tough times and we've ALWAYS faced them together...prior to his A I never thought we'd be apart...we'd survive all the down times as we always have...we'd grow old together...we'd be the couple eating at the diner that the young couple looks at and says, "I hope that's us when we get old". He has shattered my dreams. He has shattered my esteem. He has shattered me...

SSS - I hate when that happens! H went to IC and is home now. I think it was rough for him but he likes C and says he's going back next week. I didn't ask him to share just hugged him. He did say that she asked him if he would have rather had an A or a D. I guess she's his C so it's all about him but SH*T do I get a say in this...nope...once again, I don't have any say in my life...I don't know...I guess when he told me that (and I prompted nothing from him...didn't expect him to share at all...didn't ask) I felt like she was saying the A was okay because it's better than a D. He also said that she told him he wasn't alone...many people having A...D@mn it!!! I didn't have one...it's NOT OKAY!!!!!

Well, I think I have to go...this is just not productive...I've vented and I still am not feeling better. URGH...GRR!

LF- I want to say this , although it may not bring the comfort you want ,, here it is .....

ITS ONLY A COUPLE OF WEEKS ,,, THIS IS NORMAL , NORMAL SUCKS , BUT THIS IS THE PROCESS .

DO you relize you where hurt, embaressed, lied to , manipulated ... (((((HUGS)))) sorry if that hurt .

LISTEN if you where beat up on the streeet , and had your head bashed in, 2 legs broken , arms as well , and lets through in a bat to the face where you requered plastic surgery ....DO you think you would heal in 6 weeks ?????????????????


YOU NEED TIME TO HEAL , please no that no matter how much chicken soup or laundry your H did your body would heal one part at a time ..

SO your heart is broken , the inside of you destroyed and the M you had , well you question it all . So time is what you need .

VENT away , thats great , but don't expect something of yourself that you can not force to happen . OR is that do not FORCE something of your self ... ANYWAY ,,, GET IT

TIME is the hardest thing to except . It seems to fly when we are having FUN and wish it to move slow .

IT takes forever when we are in pain , and wish it to go quikly .

((((((((((HUGS))))))))))) and my thouhgts are with you .

LosingFocus, I think I know exactly what you mean. I also thought the same and had the same dreams of growing old together and being an example to others. So much for that. Now, I will never have the face to try to advice a family member or a friend on how to treat a spouse because I would feel like a hypocrit. Not because of anyting I did, but because what I did not do that may have allowed her to do that or that made her feel like she needed to look somewhere else. You know what are the first words I heard from the first counselor I went to and who was a minister at the church? That it was my fault because I was not meeting her needs. I felt worse than what I felt before I went. But I must also tell you that it is unfair to label everyone for what a few do. I am a man and never ever considered doing anything like that. I am of the opinion that marriage is for life and that the person you marry deserve our respect.
Believe me, I know how you feel, but if you have children, find the positive in them. Somehow, believe in yourself and lift your spirit.

LF -

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> ...and what I hate even more is that I should be past this by now...I actually thought I was getting past this...and then *SLAM* when I wasn't looking it...here are all those thoughts again. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can't tell you how many times I've said this just to be smacked up-side the head with a trigger or something. Don't have unrealistic expectations or set them too high. Healing/recovery from an A is a process and you won't be able to rush it.

Not sleeping, not eating, nightmares, etc. are normal...but if this stuff continues much longer you might want to go on AD's.

Also, have you considered seeing an IC yourself? I did and it did help. IC helped me to see when I was being unrealistic, let me vent, let me cry, let me yell and told me when I was making WAY TOO BIG A DEAL out of the OW (insignificant) and A (wake-up call). Gave me a good outside view or perspective other than H, MB, friends or family.

Another thought I had was for your H to get tested for STD's (if hasn't already). Having positive test results may help you out a little in the SF area.

I was also one of the *lucky* ones...if there is such a think involving A's. My H did not suffer from withdrawals, he established NC on d-day and maintained it, did not leave to be with OW, etc.

Do I feel *lucky*? Nope. Still hurts just the same.

GOOD that your H likes C and is going back next week. Don't worry about it being all about him (still is for now), but C should ask to see you at some point...my H's C did that with me. I then got my chance to tell her the REAL story...LOL! Sounds like H's C is just stating the facts or stats...my IC did the same thing in our first session. Said that she counsels a lot of people in an A. Your H's C probably said the same thing. He'll eventually share. It took my H a while before he started sharing since he wasn't used to expressing his feelings either.

Everything is normal. much as it is hard to believe.

If you don't think you are normal, just picture sss right after d-day. After going through an initial two week crying frenzy, sss then decided to chart everything she found out about the A. SSS was obsessed. She dug, snooped, questioned, snooped some more. Couldn't believe that her H had a second *secret* life that he had lived right under her nose for so long. With her world and heart shattered, SSS' obsession with the A grew. She charted, charted, charted until she was a hysterical mess. She had meltdown after meltdown.

SSS now has most of the A details. Does she feel any better? Nope, still hurts, but just a little less each day.

Is sss normal? We can only hope.

Take care LF.

sss

Yes, I'm thinking about IC for myself because life just really sucks right now. I guess I'm a little closed minded about it since I once did some counseling (meaning that I was the counselor)...scary thought when I look back on that. I jumped out of college and thought I could save the world...what did I know?

I guess I also have some worry about what might come out of it...what if it's not positive? You know I've sat here for several days now wondering if I'm even in love with my H. I mean, how could I possibly love someone who would do this to me? How can I possibly think I can live the rest of my life with someone who would do this to me? I know I love him but am I in love with him (now who does that sound like)? How could I be in love with someone who would knowingly hurt me so badly? If he hit me would that be okay? If he was verbally abusive would that be okay? Of course not. Why is this different?

He used one of the standard excuses of "I didn't think you loved me" for his A...Hmmm, so let's say I didn't (which would be untrue) how does that justify an A? Wasn't he really trying to say, "I didn't think I loved you."? Obviously he didn't...don't I deserve better than that?

Why-me? - I hear you, saying that spouse might have self esteem issues and I know that in some areas that's true but that really doesn't cut it for me (as an excuse for an A). I've got esteem issues too...heck, who doesn't? You haven't seen me having an A though.

H said he liked C. Of course, she validated that he's a 'go out and get what you want person' so 'naturally he had an A'. You know, I thought I'd be too pushy wanting to know what he talked about but truthfully, I don't want to know. The little I heard was really just more smacks to my face.

The STD thing is a whole other story. She's 'clean' so my H says but she's had other As (supposedly not sex but she didn't hesitate to jump into bed w/ my H so I doubt she's telling the truth). I asked several times for him to get tested and he yesed me but never did it. The other day I went myself...humiliated as I was to tell a total stranger (new gyn) my problems and ask for some tests. She just looked at me and said, "Honey, the minute you realize all men are scum you'll feel better." Her reaction to my story tells me that either she's been through it or she's heard enough stories...

I so appreciate you all letting me 'melt down'...yes, sss, that describes how I feel perfectly.

Hi LF!

I tried posting to you last night and *poof* it was gone again. I wonder where the posts go and who is reading them? LOL

Anyway, I heard the "I didn't think you loved" me crap also. It just infuriates me to no end! I'm learning that what H should have said is "I didn't love myself" and that's the reason for the A.

And, I think what hurts even more after you discover an A, you have to sit there and listen to your H defend the OW. I also heard "she's not like that" (when brining up STD's or pregnancy), "she's a nice person", "she's alot of fun to be with", "not attractive but a good body"...whatever. I also had to be the one to get checked for STD's because H wouldn't do it.

Didn't I read that your H came out as an 8 when you worked with Stillwed? Same for my H. So I think it is huge when they (finally) seek IC.

I wouldn't worry about what H is telling you the C is saying right now - although I also freaked out during my H's first couple of sessions. His C labelled him a "thrill-seeker". I was like, SO WHAT, that's no excuse for A's. So whatcha gonna do to help him stop!!

This is another reason why it might help you go to IC yourself. You can bounce stuff that you are hearing from your H off of your C and hear it first hand. That's what I did and it helped. I learned that what may sound like a positive thing out of H's mouth, probably didn't come out that way in IC. My C, and H's, started off the first session by giving stats or info regarding how many couples deal with infidelity...STATS...not that it was okay or cool to do.

I want to try to post some other information for you tonight (which is what I tried to do last night). I found some information in one of my books that describes what you are feeling very well. Thought that would help you feel *normal* and not crazy.

I also found some good information about what happens when people don't get their 5 core emotional needs met during childhood. It really seemed to nail my "H" with reasons for his multiple A's. It might apply to your H also.

Hope you have a good day.

Take care.

sss

<small>[ May 04, 2004, 07:30 AM: Message edited by: stillsosad ]</small>

sss - thanks for checking on me this morning. It was a rough night for me. H and I didn't talk at all...about anything and it was horrible...that said, I think I needed it...some quiet time.

Yes, my H did come out as an 8. He was mortified by that since when you look at the negative of that personality it makes him really look like a creep.

I know that H going to IC is a HUGE deal AND the fact that he spilled his guts is even more amazing. He's been to counseling twice in the time I've known him...both times I guess he would beat around the bush and when the real issues came out he didn't return...so it's big that he spoke of the real issues. He said he just exploded when the session started. He had tears in his eyes when he told me about it. I know he is hurting so bad and I know I should be strong for him now...encourage him, etc...I've just really got nothing left to give. I've been running on fumes and even they are running out.

Anyway, when I'm being realistic I know the IC wasn't supporting what he did. She said that his childhood led him to the A...from what I know of H and his childhood I believe this to be true but it's so hard to be taking all the **** for something I had nothing to do with. I feel like I've been the target of his pain for so long...is that why he married me? I'm a 6...loyal til the end...I've heard it said that we often hurt the ones we love because we know they won't go away...that unconditional love cr@p. I am VERY low maintance...I have tolerated a lot...I have lived with what he could give me even when I wanted more (not talkin monetary things...they are not important to me) but this betrayal...well, 'loyal til the end' I may be but the end seems to be here and it's scaring the crap out of me. I've never thought of my life without him...until now.

I'd be interested in anything you've read that you think might be helpful to me. I'm in the middle of several books now...the people at Barnes and Noble are probably ready to have me committed with all the self help books I've bought recently. I'm also very interested in anything about childhood...I know this is the core of my H's issues. He had a horrible childhood and repressed everything. I got a book out of the library on childhood pain and it's effects but haven't gotten to that one yet. I thought if I left it laying around maybe H would pick it up but I decided against it...didn't want to be too pushy.

Well, I stop chewing off your ear...again, thank you for thinking about me today. While I hate knowing others are going through this pain, it's nice to feel that you really do understand...and that maybe I'm not as crazy as I feel. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

The sun is shining today and I'm off with the kids to play group...trying to be more positive today <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I hear ya LF!

I am very loyal/caring/loving with my friends and family. If they hurt me, it hurts me deeply and sometimes takes me a long time to get over it. I came out as a three on the enneagram stuff.

That's why the "I didn't think you loved me" hurts so much. I'm like really confused. I think, okay, I've put up with your alcoholism, selfishness, confusion, pushing me away and pulling me close...I adapted, tried different things, stood by your side even though I was sometimes so embarrassed I could have died...and you didn't think I loved you. I'm about in tears just typing that...

Anyway...I know what you mean about B&N...I log onto Amazon.com and a list of recommended books come up...Hey sss, we thought you would like these:

Another book on A's
Another book on forgiving
Another book on childhood wounds
Another book on healing
Another book on *murder* tips LOL

They must think I'm a complete basket-case psycho on the loose!

Post to ya later!

sss

<small>[ May 04, 2004, 08:25 AM: Message edited by: stillsosad ]</small>

LF,
I think we are living this nightmare exactly the same way. I read your post and everything seems to be happening to me the same way. I look forward to your thread everyday, to see what help you are getting, because it helps me, too. I pray your strength and everyone else also.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I am very loyal/caring/loving with my friends and family. If they hurt me, it hurts me deeply and sometimes takes me a long time to get over it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The thing with me is that I'm loyal til the end...or until I feel you've turned on me and then I'm GONE. I give everything I have but if you turn on me that's it (not that it happens often but it has happened a few times in my life). I am not one to forgive and forget (perhaps a bad quality but a defense mechanism that has worked for me). My H is the first person who has betrayed me that I'm still talking too...he's also the only person who has ever hurt me like this...I suppose he's the only person I've ever 'let in' this far...dumb dumb dumb...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That's why the "I didn't think you loved me" hurts so much. I'm like really confused. I think, okay, I've put up with your alcoholism, selfishness, confusion, pushing me away and pulling me close...I adapted, tried different things, stood by your side even though I was sometimes so embarrassed I could have died...and you didn't think I loved you. I'm about in tears just typing that...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's all cr@p! If you didn't think I loved you then leave. If you were that unhappy than leave. He didn't think I loved him so he decided to have an A...yup, that makes me love him, alright. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

jasmine3 - I am sorry to hear that you are also feeling this pain. Rollercoasters have never been my ride of choice...but than this wasn't my choice either, was it? I hope that someday I will be able to post something positive for you to read...or maybe you will and I'll benefit from it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

LosingFocus, it is interesting to see the excuses that you hear from WSs. Things like "I didn't think you love me" or "we got into a routine", etc. I wonder if there is a book that they all read and that is why the excuses are all the same. When I alluded to self steem issues, I meant to say that your H may be very insecure and when he got the attention from somebody else he jumped to that. Is he controlling and jealous? These are two other characteristics that I have seen by reading posts in this forum. Actually, some time back one person was conducting a poll to find out how many people had WSs who before their A were controlling and jealous. By the way, the comment by the gynecologist was to establish rapport, but I would consider it innapropriate. It is a good thing that you went to the doc even if he did not want to go. Take care.

So I was looking for a file on the computer (my computer...my file...not snooping) and I found something I wish I hadn't found.

Poetry, song lyrics, and a letter.

1) Poetry to OW. H has never sent me poetry...guess OW is smarter than me...I can be sure that H doesn't think I'm smart enough to understand Shakespear.

2) Song lyrics to go with a CD that H burned for OW prior to our moving. He included a little explaination for why he included all the songs. Moondance...the song we had our first dance to...the song that started 'us'. His explaination to her...'it's good for romance...I'll leave it at that.' This song means more to me than our wedding song...it means a lot to him also (according to him) but apparently not what it means to me.

3) The letter. This one hurt a lot. First, the letter was dated 10 days prior to our move...so while I was packing the house he was on the computer writing to her <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> It detailed his feeling for her...from the moment she became his boss...he thought she was HOT (his words). He said that he would go to work for free every day if he could know that he could look into her baby blue eyes...she became his boss 7+ years ago. He insists that because he thought she was hot doesn't mean that he ever thought about her sexually or thought about being with her...I guess I'm nieve that I thought he wasn't looking at other women.

The hardest part was reading him tell her when he first realized his feelings for her...Sept 19, 2001...the day her M died. He said he wanted to climb throught he phone to be with her...to hold her tightly into his chest, to make her pain go away. He knew that his feelings were inappropriate...that it wasn't his place to comfort her but that he knew that he would make it his mission to make her happy from now on (she was very close to her M so he knew that this loss would be difficult for her). Okay, so if that's not bad enough...Sept 19, 2001 was our 8th year anniversary...nice to know what he was thinking about that day.

You know, I've always said that I thought our M was good, not great, but good. I thought that I was a good wife...not perfect but good. Apparently I was wrong on both counts...

So I asked my H why he asked me to marry him. Why he actually married me. Why he stayed with me. Why he had children with me...he loved me, of course. We had common goals. He wants to grow old with me. I asked him if he felt he settled with me...before he married me and now (he's asked me several times before if I felt I settled when I married him). I asked him if he was in the 18 year plan (the 'plan' that we stay a family until our youngest goes to college...18 years from now). No, he said he wasn't in the 18 year plan. He thought about whether he had settled and said he 'didn't know'...hmmmm. He took a short walk outside and then said he wanted to change that answer. He said that he hadn't settled. That he feels we have a lot in common (I had previously told him that we have nothing in common...and we don't...other than our kids) and that it's his fault that I don't know that. He has never opened up to me...shared himself with me. He asked me to give him a change...he feels his IC can help him. He knows that our problems are all because of him. He knows that he needs to change.

I cried through the entire conversation, of course but I focused on not LB, not screaming, not using DJ. I think I did well. I asked the questions because I wanted to know the answers...not to blame, not to fight, but to really find out if this is really worth it...if I'm what he really wants.

I brought up the song a little later. We both got a little snippy and he wound up going to bed shortly after. He commented that he hopes for the rest of our lives I find something on the computer or wherever to bring this all up again...so we can be reminded of this every month forever (a sarcastic remark, of course).

I've been really good about not talking about us...probably why I'm such a mess. You know, if they hadn't been so stupid to leave things on the computer I would never had known about most of what I know about. Why did he save these things? He has his own computer now (purchased so he could have privacy with her) so why didn't he delete things off this computer? Why did they save their emails? I wonder if he didn't want to get caught so I would end our M. I've always said I would never tolerate an A...haven't we all? Is that what he wanted?

Ahh, yet another vent...but this one left me feeling a little better...only because he seemed sincere when he asked me to give him a chance to work with his IC...for now, I guess I'll take what I can get.

Goodnight and thanks for listening.