H was gone all morning taking ACLS..got home around 1:30 or so. Then all the sudden he needs to go out to get my mother's day gift. Told him I dont want jewelery again unless it is diamond studs. Cant afford that...The only thing I want is for H to be honest, open, affectionate and meet my EN's. Things were going well all day. I cooked a nice roast, we ate dinner around 4:00 and we were going to go get a movie and go get some yuppy juice later. Well, he leaves to go get me something (could have done this earlier, but whatever)...that's a whole other subject...but while we are on it I will go into it!

He says "I'm not a good H I never have been" I said " but you CAN be" meaning he never gets me anything ahead of time and he never really THINKS of me...I tried to explain to him that he CAN think of me more and make me happy...but he just doesn't..never has, not sure if he EVER will!

OK, so he leaves to go to the flower shop, i told him where to go (nothing is ever spontaneous for him) I was going to take the kids to get a movie...while we pull up to Blockbuster the haircut place is right next door so I sign them in and call H from cell phone. he doesn't answer so I page him. He calls back and I said "we are here at the movie place and I signed them in for haircuts, would you like to meet us over here" he says "oh, well, uh, I was going to go to Josh's house to show him my new seat..I just called him" Well, goes down hill from there! in the meantime I am dealing with a whihny 3 y/o who is mad cuz he cant get his movie he wants and the othres cant make up their minds. he walks into the stroe about 5 minutes later. I asked him what he was doing here he said "I can go to Josh's later"...he just doesn't get it I said "when is it going to sink in with you"

so we go next door to get the boys' haircuts and then I said "you want to go get some juice now" he got all pissy and said "NO, I dont want any juice" I just looked at him and said "oh your still mad at me cuz you cant go to Josh's house"

wait, let me back up to the movie store...I also said while I was on the phone with him then that he could go ahead and GO to josh's house cuz if he doesn't then I will look like the B!TCH of a wife as usual. We hung up with the notion that I thought he was going over there.

anyway, we are out in front while the kids are getting in the car and I said to him that I thought he couldn't handle all this...this being honest and such...he said he didnt' think this had anything to do with honesty, he was out anyway, so he thouht he would just stop by Josh's house and I would never know...but that is just it..that is not telling me everything and being secretive..then he said "well, why dont you just hold my d!ck while I pee from now on!" Do you think he was being sarcastic? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I told him to go ahead and go to his friends house cuz I am not going to be the cause of his unhapiness. It is all to make HIM happy at all times. HE must be the taker and the taker never the giver. He asked me where I was going and I said "HOME"...Next thing I know he is walking in the back door. He has some flowers with him. Real thought was put into this Mothers day gift see....

I got up and asked him if he understood WHY I was upset at this handling? he said he was tired and ws going to bed. (He's been up since 5:00 and driven to San Antonio and back) I said "well, that's just it, you never want to talk about anything, you just shut the door" then he brought up the d!ck comment again. Very rude and crude acting. He left the room saying he had a H/A.

It is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, about him. I dont know how else I should have handled this. If POJA is supposed to be used, then shouldn't he have used it? yesterday, he did the same thing. Comes in and says "OK< I need to go get my car...lets go"...no discussion, or anything! Those flowers dont mean anything to me now. They were bought because he felt he HAD to buy them.

I mean, if I go out and I want to make a pit stop, I will call him and let him know. That is how it SHOULD be. he thinks otherwise...he thinks that he can do whatever he wants anytime he wants. How long am I supposed to put up with this behaviour?

OH! I just went into the kitchen where these flowers are that H bought me for Mother;s day! They are silk and they are in a bunny vase! I am just sick to my stomach! Silk flowers! Shows how much thought he put into this! I know I sound like I am being a mean angry b!tch, but that just tells me he realy doesn't care. He bought OW a $400 neclace for V Day and me some ugly silk flowers for Mother's day! I can make my own arrangements for that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

momto3boys,

ok ... I 'm 2x4 you.

You r kidding yourself if you are in recovery or he is in withdrawal.

You are in plan A ...

What do it mean ?

well read SAA ... you suppose to show your WH that you could change from your usual you that contribute the down hill mess of this M. YOU HAVEN'T show him changes.

In plan A it has nothing to do w/ fillin your ENs or he work on M. Don't expect anything until you address his complaint about you before the d-day.


How to handle this ... drop it and be focus & serious on working on M ... you aren't right now.

Have you reviewed your plan A ?

-rh-
<strong> OH! I just went into the kitchen where these flowers are that H bought me for Mother;s day! They are silk and they are in a bunny vase! I am just sick to my stomach! Silk flowers! Shows how much thought he put into this! I know I sound like I am being a mean angry b!tch, but that just tells me he realy doesn't care. He bought OW a $400 neclace for V Day and me some ugly silk flowers for Mother's day! I can make my own arrangements for that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> </strong>[/QUOTE]

Dear Mom.
I agree with 'redhat'...You sound very nagging and very unappreciative. You told him not to get you jewelry yet you complain because he bought the OW jewelry previously...I think he bought you some nice jewelry not too long ago, didn't he?

So he bought you silk flowers...Spray some perfume on them and tell him you love them!You are NOT his mother, he didn't HAVE to buy you anything...The kids could have colored you a picture for your frig!

Your quote "I know I sound like I am being a mean angry b!tch"

Yes, you really are being just that.

I have a feeling that you are very very hard to please. You expect your husband to be a mind reader in trying to please you.

If BW's could just learn to play the part of the OW, they would ALWAYS be: sweet, kind, agreeable, givers, never nagging, listeners, lovers, (you get the picture here)

When you husband said you might as well hold his d*** while he Pees is saying he thinks you are trying to control his EVERY MOVE!
Can you see this?

Sincerely, Julie

<small>[ May 08, 2004, 08:43 PM: Message edited by: Blessed TIME ]</small>

mom -

I'm with you. I used to expect very little from my WH, and that is exactly what I got - very little. For our anniversary this year, he left flowers for me at the house. I was at work and he left them on the table. You guessed it, they were dead and droopy by the time I got home and put them in water. That is the way they stayed.

Last year he got me flowers that looked that they were dead when he bought them. I tried to be appreciative, but let's face it, they were drooping when I got them.

For me, it is the lack of thought. When WH gets me anything, he shows no thought at all. And I am easy to please. I would enjoy a nice live plant, and he knows it, but has never bought me one. It is almost like he does it on purpose.

2x4s many of them. You are destoying your chance at marital recovery all on your own Mom.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I said " but you CAN be" meaning he never gets me anything ahead of time and he never really THINKS of me...I tried to explain to him that he CAN think of me more and make me happy...but he just doesn't..never has, not sure if he EVER will!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That's an intersting way to try to get a man to do something nice for you?!?!?!


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> OK, so he leaves to go to the flower shop, i told him where to go </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This makes it hard for him to see you as anything more than a nagging, instructing MOTHER who doesn't seem to think he can handle the task on his own. Why couldn't you just let him go where ever?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I asked him what he was doing here he said "I can go to Josh's later"...he just doesn't get it I said "when is it going to sink in with you" </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He's not likely to feel attracted to this either. You treat him like a little boy, not with the respect a W should show her H, WS or not. If you want to recover you're going to have to show your H some respect or he's not going to ever feel attracted to you. Your comments are disdainful.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I said "you want to go get some juice now" he got all pissy and said "NO, I dont want any juice" I just looked at him and said "oh your still mad at me cuz you cant go to Josh's house"
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This sounds like an interaction between a mother and her son, not between a H and W.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> anyway, we are out in front while the kids are getting in the car and I said to him that I thought he couldn't handle all this...this being honest and such...he said he didnt' think this had anything to do with honesty, he was out anyway, so he thouht he would just stop by Josh's house and I would never know...but that is just it..that is not telling me everything and being secretive..then he said "well, why dont you just hold my d!ck while I pee from now on!" Do you think he was being sarcastic?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You just can't stop dragging him down. How does this work for you mom? It's not. It's not helping him fall in love with you one bit. Actually it's making OW look like the more attractive option. You're shooting yourself in the foot. He obviously is telling you he feels SMOTHERED by his comment. Don't you get it? He's saying he pretty much feels like next you're going to insist on wiping his butt for him. You are driving him away by trying to micromanage every minute of his time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I got up and asked him if he understood WHY I was upset at this handling? he said he was tired and ws going to bed. (He's been up since 5:00 and driven to San Antonio and back) I said "well, that's just it, you never want to talk about anything, you just shut the door" then he brought up the d!ck comment again. Very rude and crude acting. He left the room saying he had a H/A. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you see he's trying to get AWAY from you here. I'm surprised this didn't make him run out the door to OWs house. He deserves credit for going to the bedroom to remove himself from your obnoxiousness instead of running to OW like he probably wanted to.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If POJA is supposed to be used, then shouldn't he have used it? yesterday, he did the same thing. Comes in and says "OK< I need to go get my car...lets go"...no discussion, or anything!.............I mean, if I go out and I want to make a pit stop, I will call him and let him know. That is how it SHOULD be. he thinks otherwise...he thinks that he can do whatever he wants anytime he wants. How long am I supposed to put up with this behaviour?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You've got the wrong idea if you are thinking you two need to POJA every, single minut decision to be made in the day. I would never expect my H to have to let me know every little step he makes. Again this is treating him like a little boy and not a man. Don't try to give me the "trust" issue as your defense either because if you can't loosen your grip to some degree you are going to end up divorced sooner or later. No MAN will live with a woman this controlling and he shouldn't have to, WS or not. Your H is trying and you just beat him down. Doesn't matter what he does, it's just never good enough for you or just never quite measures up to your expectations of how things should be, how things should have gone or what or how he should have done something.He can never get it right.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OH! I just went into the kitchen where these flowers are that H bought me for Mother;s day! They are silk and they are in a bunny vase! I am just sick to my stomach! Silk flowers! Shows how much thought he put into this! I know I sound like I am being a mean angry b!tch, but that just tells me he realy doesn't care. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maybe he had a reason for getting you silk flowers.You don't even think to give him any benefit.You could ask nicely why he made the choice he did and then appreciate his efforts. The way you act I can see why he put so little effort into it, he already knows from your consistent behavior that nothing he does is going to be "right" for you anyway. Why don't you thank him and enjoy the fact that he's HOME and made ANY effort at all.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">They were bought because he felt he HAD to buy them.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yep, your right about one thing! You even told him where to go to get them. If I were your H M23B, I wouldn't WANT to buy you anything.

You can be angry with me but any time we try to point out the fact that you haven't changed you immediately tell us how you have. You have a poor ability to look at yourself and see how you contribute to your H's lack of attraction and feelings of love towards you. If you don't fix this and get serious about YOU and let go of all your anger and resentment towards OW and H and focus that energy on controlling yourself and getting some individual counseling, your marriage is going to stay miserable, if your lucky enough to continue to have a marriage. It's not likely that any man would find your behavior alluring, attractive or any other positive adjective.

I sincerely wish you all the best Mom.

How about we replay like this:

[QUOTE] H was gone all morning taking ACLS..got home around 1:30 or so. Then all the sudden he needs to go out to get my mother's day gift. Told him I dont want jewelery again unless it is diamond studs. Cant afford that...The only thing I want is for H to be honest, open, affectionate and meet my EN's. [Quote]

Thank you for being so thoughtful. What should we get your mother?
[quote] Well, he leaves to go get me something (could have done this earlier, but whatever)...that's a whole other subject...but while we are on it I will go into it! [quote]

I am so happy he remeber to get me something.

[quote]He says "I'm not a good H I never have been" I said " but you CAN be" meaning he never gets me anything ahead of time and he never really THINKS of me...I tried to explain to him that he CAN think of me more and make me happy...but he just doesn't..never has, not sure if he EVER will! [quote]

Honey, you've tried very hard. You ARE a good husband becase you chose your family.

[quote]OK, so he leaves to go to the flower shop, i told him where to go (nothing is ever spontaneous for him) I was going to take the kids to get a movie...while we pull up to Blockbuster the haircut place is right next door so I sign them in and call H from cell phone. he doesn't answer so I page him. He calls back and I said "we are here at the movie place and I signed them in for haircuts, would you like to meet us over here" he says "oh, well, uh, I was going to go to Josh's house to show him my new seat..I just called him" [qote]

Ok, honey, have a good time, just come home to enjoy the movie with us.

[quote]he walks into the stroe about 5 minutes later. I asked him what he was doing here he said "I can go to Josh's later"...he just doesn't get it I said "when is it going to sink in with you" [quote]

Wow, thanks for helping with a big smile.

( What do you want to sink with him any way?)

[quote]so we go next door to get the boys' haircuts and then I said "you want to go get some juice now" he got all pissy and said "NO, I dont want any juice" I just looked at him and said "oh your still mad at me cuz you cant go to Josh's house" [quote]

Honey, do you mind to get some juice while the boys having their hair cut?

He has the right to say no. Otherwise it is selfish demand.

[quote]wait, let me back up to the movie store...I also said while I was on the phone with him then that he could go ahead and GO to josh's house cuz if he doesn't then I will look like the B!TCH of a wife as usual. We hung up with the notion that I thought he was going over there. [quote]

You do sound hash.

[quote]anyway, we are out in front while the kids are getting in the car and I said to him that I thought he couldn't handle all this...this being honest and such...he said he didnt' think this had anything to do with honesty, he was out anyway, so he thouht he would just stop by Josh's house and I would never know...but that is just it..that is not telling me everything and being secretive..then he said "well, why dont you just hold my d!ck while I pee from now on!" Do you think he was being sarcastic? [quote]

No. I would say the same thing, not in that way.


[quote]I got up and asked him if he understood WHY I was upset at this handling? he said he was tired and ws going to bed. (He's been up since 5:00 and driven to San Antonio and back) I said "well, that's just it, you never want to talk about anything, you just shut the door" then he brought up the d!ck comment again. Very rude and crude acting. He left the room saying he had a H/A. [quote]

He IS tired.

I don't understand why you wer upset either.

Mom, please be more appreciative. He is working very hard. If I were him, I feel a lot of controlling, selfish demand and disrepectful judgement. I don't see any appreciation. I feel that nothing I did was right, nothing can please you.

Please forgive my 2x4s.

mthrrbard is exactly right, Mom, and I hope you listen to her. She laid it out beautifully and did you a huge favor. It would be so much easier to just pat you on the back and tell you "oh you poor thing," but she took the time to tell you the truth.

I read your post and wondered whose side you were on: yours or the OW? Because your behavior is much more helpful to HER than it is to you. All of your ingratitude and disrespect makes her look very attractive.

Please take Diane's advice and additionally, go give your H a big kiss and thank him for the "BEAUTIFUL" silk roses!

Dear Mom.
Almost everyone posting to you is seeing the error of your ways with your H. Can you see them?

I repeat:
I have a feeling that you are very very hard to please. You expect your husband to be a mind reader in trying to please you.
He is your H, you act like his Mother!

If BW's could just learn to play the part of the OW, they would ALWAYS be: sweet, kind, agreeable, appreciative, givers, never nagging, listeners, lovers, (You get the picture here? You are absolutely pushing him away with your attitude!)

When you husband said you might as well hold his d*** while he Pees is saying he thinks you are trying to control his EVERY MOVE!
Can you see this?
Julie

Mom,

Everyone else has done very well at pointing out the intensity of your ugly feelings and your expression of them.

I'm just going to say that I have silk flowers next to me.

They were a joint effort between me and WP one day when we decided to splurge (we were very young and very broke) and spend 30 whole dollars.....

They are still lovely, even though they're a bit bedraggled and the worse for wear. It's been nearly a decade since that day.

I loved WP more than I could say the day we bought these flowers.

Even all the ugliness can't take away their beauty.

It's not the flowers that are ugly, Mom. It's the eyes that are looking at them through rage and fear and horrible emotions.

What are you going to do about that? How are you going to cleanse your own spirit of the hatred that's in your heart?

If I were talking to Dad, I would counsel him to go into Plan A with you (and go into NC with OW, of course).

And if it didn't work after a few months, I would counsel him to enter Plan B.

The things you're saying are -that- ugly, Mom. I am not joking even a little bit, here.

Mom, maybe I have too much empathy for you to be helpful. Last year my H bought me a $13 cd. At the time I thought it was really cheap. For father's day I wanted to be equally cheap, but I couldn't do it. Of course now I know why he was so cheap. And I am hoping tomorrow he will be extra thoughtful for mother's day. I'm not dwelling on it, but I'm hoping. After the hell we've been through those little gestures of caring mean a lot. If I felt like my H just carelessly got me something I'd be hurt too.

We are human, and careless actions do hurt. Acknowledge that hurt. Do it here, in a journal, to a friend. Acknowledge it and get it out. Then Mom you need to start faking it. As Shattered Dreams used to talk about winning the academy award, go for that. Within the last couple of weeks I had an icredibly down day. When H came home he commented on what a good mood I seemed to be in. Now that was an academy performance. Fake it and see if H's behavior begins to change. If time goes on and you notice nothing different, then look at your options.

I've mentioned on here before that I can't imagine going through this with small children. I get the feeling that you feel like a single mom. I also think you need your h to just give you a little hope. I hope you get some positive reinforcement soon mom. If you don't, give it to yourself. Are you in IC? If not, go see a therapist. Figure out what you need for you. Give your H the rope. He will either hang himself, or he will come back to you.

Maybe I'm not 2x4ing you because I feel your hurt. Today I had thoughts about OW that I wanted to express to my H. However we were taking out his new business associate and his W, and I didn't feel it was a good time to get into that subject. I didn't want to spoil the evening. Sometimes we need to know when to talk, and when not to. I would also strongly suggest using "I" statements as apposed to "You" statements. Instead of saying "You never want to talk about anything, you just shut the door", how about saying something like "I feel lonely and anxious when we don't communicate. I like spending time with you."

OK, I'll stop blabbing. Just work on you Mom. You can't control how your H behaves, but you can control you. Have a Happy Mother's Day! CV

This is probably over-kill here, but, I have to say that I agree with the others that your naked anger and resentment are really damaging your chances of ever recovering your marriage.

I also see a certain amount of Mars/Venus conflict, played out in the ugliest way - "that's the trouble with you, you never want to talk..." - and he never will if you keep expecting him to do it when YOU want him to.

BTW, I don't expect my H to tell me everywhere he goes, and yes, I have trust issues with him, too - but badgering him as if I had a right to be his personal policeman would get me nowhere. My H tells me where he goes now because he WANTS to, and that's because I have NOT made an issue about him telling me everywhere he goes, but because he knows I need to trust him. I made the decision that whatever my H did or did not do, I was in control of what kind of person *I* wanted to be - yes, I could say he had an obligation of truthfulness and commitment to me - but if I stood over him with a whip in hand to make sure I got my due, it wasn't worth having.

One last thing - why do people measure their worth by the amount of money spent on them? Sure, he spent $400.00 on OW - of course that rankles BAAAD. But your worth to each other isn't measured in the amount of money you spend on each other. My H ALWAYS forgets Mothers Day, because he ALWAYS works on a Sunday - he is usually scrambling on a Saturday night to do something for me - and I always spend the day without him - I'm glad he remembers at the last minute - and we have hardly any money - ANY jewelery would be just too amazing to contemplate for me - silk flowers are more expensive than real flowers where I live, so I would consider that a compliment. What means more to me than gifts, flowers, or jewelery, is that he is still here with me, scrambling at the last minute to give me something, even if it is just a cup of tea in bed in the morning before he leaves for work.

LIR

This is probably over-kill here, but, I have to say that I agree with the others that your naked anger and resentment are really damaging your chances of ever recovering your marriage.

I also see a certain amount of Mars/Venus conflict, played out in the ugliest way - "that's the trouble with you, you never want to talk..." - and he never will if you keep expecting him to do it when YOU want him to.

BTW, I don't expect my H to tell me everywhere he goes, and yes, I have trust issues with him, too - but badgering him as if I had a right to be his personal policeman would get me nowhere. My H tells me where he goes now because he WANTS to, and that's because I have NOT made an issue about him telling me everywhere he goes, but because he knows I need to trust him. I made the decision that whatever my H did or did not do, I was in control of what kind of person *I* wanted to be - yes, I could say he had an obligation of truthfulness and commitment to me - but if I stood over him with a whip in hand to make sure I got my due, it wasn't worth having.

One last thing - why do people measure their worth by the amount of money spent on them? Sure, he spent $400.00 on OW - of course that rankles BAAAD. But your worth to each other isn't measured in the amount of money you spend on each other. My H ALWAYS forgets Mothers Day, because he ALWAYS works on a Sunday - he is usually scrambling on a Saturday night to do something for me - and I always spend the day without him - I'm glad he remembers at the last minute - and we have hardly any money - ANY jewelery would be just too amazing to contemplate for me - silk flowers are more expensive than real flowers where I live, so I would consider that a compliment. What means more to me than gifts, flowers, or jewelery, is that he is still here with me, scrambling at the last minute to give me something, even if it is just a cup of tea in bed in the morning before he leaves for work.

LIR

MOM,

Is this behavior any different than normal?

I only ask because my wonderful Dr.Husband took me out for dinner (horrible restraunt) then to the threatre for a great production. Dr. Husband proceeds to fall asleep in the first act, and snores so LOUD that the people around us moved.

We left at intermission, Happy Mothers day to me!! OH YEA, he was suppose to have coverage for the whole weekend. Guess where he is? in the OR <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Dr's DONT get it. IT is about them. MOM It has to be, your H was always like this. Now that he had an affair you tolerate it less. I know what it is your missing. Thats what brought me to marriage builders in the first place. Last night while my H was sleeping (LOUDLY I might add). I wondered what it would be to "be" with the OM. I had actually never wondered what it would be like...just knew I was vunerable. Now I think about it. or at least I did last night.

I know having an A is not the ans, thats what I learned here. But I also know what it is like not even to be 3rd on my H's list. KNOWING I will never be. I wanta know what it would be like to be no 1 just for a week, But then again I might like it.

I have to work real hard on my advice to you. And that is to work more on ME. Having 4 kids does not make it that easy, but I do have help (paid help, not H help).

Happy Mothers Day, MOM...Dont let the silk flowers get to you, at least you didn't have to cover your H's face during the first act <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ May 09, 2004, 10:51 AM: Message edited by: StressedOutMom ]</small>

Mom,

I love Lostnhurt's replay. Pay attention to that.

As I read your rant (understandable, but it has to end), I kept seeing opportunities you were missing. You see things only through your eyes, Mom. You have to start stretching your mind to see things from Dad's point of view. If you only could, I think you would understand his d!ck comment only too well.

When he detoured from Josh's to be with you, you completely disregarded the point: he COULD have ignored your badgering comment (I would have been tempted) and gone to Josh's anyway. He didn't. He knew you were upset. Maybe he had a momentary thought that he needed to support you and he turned around. He did what was right.

And you berated him and beat him down.

See? You could have seen that gesture for what it was: Dad's attempt to change, to put YOU first. But you didn't. Maybe it is too hard for you to believe that he CAN change. Mom, do you think you are the only one in this relationship who is capable of making change?

I agree with the others, too, hon, that you are treating your man like a boy. I don't talk to my 18-year-old sons the way I speak to my 10-year-old. But you address (and scold) Dad like he's one of your kids.

Try printing this thread out and giving it to dad, along with a heartfelt apology for the way you behaved yesterday. Perhaps this can be the opening for a dialogue between the two of you. I mean a REAL dialogue between man and woman. Let him tell you if any of what we are saying rings true. LISTEN TO HIM. Don't interrupt. Give him a chance to say what he is thinking.

That's honest communication. Listening and learning. You both need to do a lot better at that.

Hugs to you both.

~ Snow

PS I have silk flowers in my kitchen that an aunt gave me on the birth of my daughter. That daughter will be 17 this month and my aunt has passed away. Yet the flowers greeting my little one into the world remain a testimony of an Aunt's love for her niece and grand-niece. It's all the way you look at it.

...I tried to explain to him that he CAN think of me more and make me happy...but he just doesn't..never has, not sure if he EVER will!

Ouch!

Why not just hit him over the head with a bat?



I said "when is it going to sink in with you"

How attractive is this?

...I also said while I was on the phone with him then that he could go ahead and GO to josh's house cuz if he doesn't then I will look like the B!TCH of a wife as usual.

How loving is this?

I said to him that I thought he couldn't handle all this...this being honest and such...

Disrespectful and deliberately hurtful.

he said "well, why dont you just hold my d!ck while I pee from now on!" Do you think he was being sarcastic? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

No ... I think he was trying to express how frustrated he is ... do you care about how frustrated he feels?

I told him to go ahead and go to his friends house cuz I am not going to be the cause of his unhapiness. It is all to make HIM happy at all times. HE must be the taker and the taker never the giver.

Very counter to Plan A

He asked me where I was going and I said "HOME"...Next thing I know he is walking in the back door. He has some flowers with him. Real thought was put into this Mothers day gift see....

Un grateful

he was tired and ws going to bed. (He's been up since 5:00 and driven to San Antonio and back) I said "well, that's just it, you never want to talk about anything, you just shut the door"

You were not very nice... the man was exhausted, and you did not care.

It is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, about him.

Sorry ... you are wrong.

I dont know how else I should have handled this.

Here's a tip .... remain quiet when you can only think of something cruel to say.

Treat him like a man, not like a criminal.

Those flowers dont mean anything to me now. They were bought because he felt he HAD to buy them.

Your attitude is so ungrateful.

How long am I supposed to put up with this behaviour?

I imagine your hubby is asking himself the very same question.

Pep

<small>[ May 09, 2004, 03:51 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>