Alrighty then...

I've not been here much lately for the past 2-3 days. I've been busy writing this post. I did it in Word because I expected it to be long. Well, it turned out to be long indeed. About 5000 words actually, and I'm sure I missed at least a few of the nitty gritty details...

Anyways, my intial idea was to post it here, but I thought about it and realized that nobody wants to read 5000 words about what a loser I have been. Besides, the nitty gritty details of every instance I've let my wife down and failed to handle things the way a good husband and adult should are not what's important... Ok, well they are important, but... it's the issues themselves that are important, and issues get lost in details very easily.

So I edited it down, then edited it down some more and now I'm going to summarize the many ways in which I've failed to be deserving of my wife's undying love.

Over the years, and with multiple examples:

1. I have low self esteem. I need constant reminders that I'm loved and cared for. I need to feel it, not just hear it. When that doesn't happen, I lose faith very easily and without even thinking about it, start to seek it out. This means that when there are stuggles at home, I'm very weak willed when it comes to turning down the advances of Other Women.

2. When it comes to work/career, I'm a pipe dreamer. The idea of working in a factory or doing some other job that does not 'feed my soul' is repulsive to me. This has led to me having some pretty stupid and non-lucrative jobs. A few that didn't even pay at all. When the chips were down, I failed to to what I needed to do to bring home the bacon.

3. To try and overcome #2 I've repeatedly tried to go into business for myself. Many of my attempts were just plain silly. A few were not silly but indeed have some serious potential. My most recent attempt was almost successful and would have been except for my lack of self discipline and business sense. I was selling excellent contracts and leaving behind happy clients, but did not have the skills, time or self discipline to keep it all together.

4. I've been a habitual pot smoker for close to 20 years. My wife and I have a serious problem. We have both acknowledged this but each time that we decided to do something about it, we slipped. I say we, but I feel that I failed in that I did not support our efforts when our resolve was tested. At least half the time, it was me who cracked first. I failed to set a good example and lead the way to sobriety.

5. I've no idea how to budget. Even during the years where I made good money, I spent it foolishly and without regard for the future. I did not pay the bills. I did not pay my child support. I bounced cheques. I made promises to debtors that I did not honour. As a consequence, we've always been afraid to answer the phone or open the mail.

6. When things were unhappy at home, instead of facing the issues and dealing with them, I withdrew. I did not go to the bar, or go out to friends, but instead stuck my head in the computer and gamed each night away for many years.

7. I didn't stand up for my wife when I should have. When my ex made unreasonable demands, I capitulated in an effort to keep peace that could not be kept. I inconvenienced Dylan repeatedly even though she repeatedly expressed disatisfaction with this. I'm a conflict avoider and have let the consequences of this affect my wife many times over the years.

8. Whether it was a result of the lack of motivation caused by regular pot use or a complete lack of self discipline, I've repeatedly avoided responsibilities that should have not been avoided.

9. After my affair, which should have been a real eye opener, I did not seek therapy. Not just for the marriage, but for me personally as well. This could be true for just about any point over the last 7 years. I took my own unhappiness and Dylans way too lightly and just assumed it was part of life and marriage to have some needs left unsatisfied.

10. I've shown myself to be insensitive to her emotional needs in little ways as well as big, for example getting tattoos done on her birthday. Which may not seem like a big thing, except that they add up.

11. I encouraged her to have an affair last year.

12. I did not speak my mind when she started the one this year. Instead, like a stupid sheep, I followed the advice of others who told me I 'was overreacting' and that I should let it follow it's natural course. Not only should I never have allowed it to start, I should not have allowed myself to crumble slowly over two months.

13. I've failed over the years to help around the house and that includes teaching the kids to help as well.

14. I gave up on her too quickly and resorted to internet/dating to try and fill the void.

15. I should NEVER EVER have allowed myself to have sex with my ex-wife.

16. I didn't go and help her sort out/clean up the house when I said I would. I should have found the stregnth to face her and my fears and dealt with it and removed her excuses to stay away from us.

17. I have failed in every way I can think of to earn her love and more importantly her respect.


There. That's it in a nutshell.

After I've had a few days to absorb this, I will post again detailing the things I'm doing now to address all these issues. (Just so you all don't think I'm just saying "that's the way it is" and come-a-swinging 2x4s)

dewt

<small>[ May 08, 2004, 09:06 PM: Message edited by: dewt ]</small>

{{{{{{{{{{{{{Dewt}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

My goodness, I honestly didn't mean for you to pick yourself apart like that.

I know both you and Dylan have been kind of emotionally closed from one another for a long long time now. It must be a horrible place to be in for a long period of time.

I also know that Dylan is on many levels coming around so to speak. (I had a short conversation with her today, and she seems to be doing ok with a lot of things).

My hope for the 2 of you is that you can come to terms with your own demons and pasts as well as the past that you share and move forward in the love that I know you share for each other as well as for both the boys. (minidewt and biggermini (or is it maxidewt?))

I think as either JL or K stated though you are one who needs a definite plan to keep you on task and focus (it's been shown here and in your life skills as well), so I think step one should be going over this list with your psychiatrist or another counsellor and coming up with an action plan to implement these changes and addressing these issues in the most effective way.

God Bless Dewt.


{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Dewt}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Wow dewt!

I expected to see a post from you, but not this! It sure adds up doesn't it? I want to caution you that you cannot do everything all at once or fix it overnight. Break it down into steps you can do consistently. Remember to include an appropriate amount of R&R. Start with the most important things on your list. Remember life's daily things and being a good day-to-day father.

And quit calling yourself a loser!! You've definitely had some losing behaviors, but you still have life left and can change any of those that you want to. Calling yourself a loser is self-defeating and might be your justification for not being successful in anything that is important to you. Besides, if you really believed that you are a loser, you wouldn't want or have custody of your son--you would want someone who is not a loser to raise him so that he had a chance to grow and develop into a responsible member of society.

There, I'm done with the 2x4 about you calling yourself a loser. So much for preventing 2x4s with your last statement--just goes to show that you cannot control what others do, only what you do.

Btw, I wouldn't have swung a 2x4 if you had made a Respectful Request that I not <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Cmon dewt, humor arr arr arr (Mork from Ork laughing noise).

Take care dewt

'Morning folks,

The reason my original writings on this subject were so long was because I had lots to write. I don't think of it so much 'as picking myself apart' as so much as looking in the rearview mirror. Did you really think I believed Dylan was so unhappy and did all this because I was such a cool, awesome, well balanced guy? Nah... ok, well I am kinda cool... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

As for the 'loser' thing, well, that's the conclusion I draw when I look back at my life. And I don't do so in a self-depreciating way, just a matter of fact analysis of my history. This post is really only the tip of the iceberg. I can look back further and understand WHY all these behaviours occured.

Now, that being said, I'm proud to announce that as a human being, I have the power of decision... I have the power to take control of my destiny... I have the ability to stand up and say, "enough is enough", and to look forward and say I don't want to live like this anymore.

I don't mean to imply that instant healing is within my grasp. No, far from it. It took years... decades... for me to get this messed up, and I expect it'll take at least a couple of days to turn it all around! (just kidding- humour arr arr arr)

No, in all seriousness, I've been putting A LOT of thought into all this over the past 4 months. Why do you think I'm still waiting for Dylan? How else do you think it's been so easy to forgive her for all that she has done? I know she loves me as much as I love her. I know that she could never have just up and left me anymore than I could have just up and left her. That's why all this makes soooooo much sense. (and that's another 5000 wrd post right there)

And sorry to disagree with you Nicole, but I don't think I've been emotionally closed to Dylan... she has been one of my 'escapes' from the stresses of my daily life for so long. Being with her, making love to her, just smoking a joint and hanging with her is the most effective way for me to forget about everything in the world that is bugging me. My heart has been open, and longing for hers to be the same. I've been aware of much that I posted above for many years but the pattern and habits of our daily lives allowed me to keep up the, er, well, pattern and habits. But I would not say I've been closed to her. I have no walls or defenses against her. As scared and hurt as I am right now, I still don't. Although one could possibly argue that my recent actions were on some level designed to drive her away in an effort to protect myself... but that's a matter for counselling. I'm not afraid to look at myself in the harsh light, but I won't pretend that I think my vision is 20/20...

Anyway, another reason I'm not calling myself a loser (I actually said "what a loser I've been) is that over the last 4 months I've really tackled a lot of these issues and am making fantastic headway. Yes, there have been some screw-ups but mostly I'm doing really well. I haven't bounced a cheque or missed a payment since I got here. My apartment is spotless and I'm working daily with minidewt on his homework and starting to see results... Anyway that too is another post... one that I'm going to wait a few days to tackle.

Yes, I need a plan. I think I have the beginnings of one already started. I still have a lot of issues there. No matter how great or detailed my plan is, I can only do so much. For me, in my life, I alone hold the reins. But for this to really work, for our family and marriage to have even the slightest beginnings of a chance, Dylan has some work to do too.

My first post here was difficult to write. Not because I had trouble facing the truths, but because I constantly had to be wary of delving too much into 'why'... my upbringing, my past, the dope smoking... all these contributed to the mentality that allowed all this to happen. And furthermore, Dylan's behaviour over the last years helped allow the chain to continue. I'm not absolving myself of responsibility here, no no no no... but I'm saying she could write a similar list of issues and until she does, we don't have a hope.

We BOTH have some serious changes to make. And that's the main problem with my plan. I could make all the changes in the world, and maybe even win her back... but if she is unwilling to change too, where would we be?

I can accept and own the things I've handled improperly, but I cannot shoulder ALL the blame for the way things have turned out.

What do I do with those thoughts?

dewt

Hi dewt,

You said and asked:
We BOTH have some serious changes to make. And that's the main problem with my plan. I could make all the changes in the world, and maybe even win her back... but if she is unwilling to change too, where would we be?

I can accept and own the things I've handled improperly, but I cannot shoulder ALL the blame for the way things have turned out.

What do I do with those thoughts?"


You put those thoughts on hold until you have implemented and MAINTAINED a good Plan A for at least 3 months, IMHO 6 months is better. You do what other BSs are advised to do--concentrate on your 50% of the "state of the marriage" issues and pave the way for the WS to join in if they choose to. You live in the here and now, with no guarantee of what the future holds. You do your best without judging or expecting the same of the WS.

Welcome to BS 101 dewt! I mean that sincerely. It's not an easy road, but is certainly a worthwhile one to travel.

Take care

Hey Dewt,

I will have to agree with LovingBoundaries on the point you made about Dylan doing her part.

Although it would be nice to move into Plan A with the full knowledge and expectation that our spouse will "do their part" for the marriage and the relationship and their own healing it is never a guarantee. My relationship with Arik was a prime example of that, as you are well aware. The 'trick' with Plan A and what usually takes awhile for most people to figure out is, (and I know it's been said to you before but I think it warrants repeating) "Plan A is not about your spouse" it is completely 100% about you. If you look at the list that you created and the ways you have failed Dylan and tackle those issues (and by saying that I mean tackling the issues behind the issues), you will find that you will end up a much more rounded, well grounded person, more suited to be a spouse to anyone and a parent to mini and maxi. My hope is that the spouse will be Dylan; and you and she can create the homelife that mini and maxi deserve, desire and need.

Now for this to happen I realize that Dylan will have to do her part (are you listening JL - I'm not letting Dylan off the hook here - <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ). All I'm saying and have been saying is somebody has to start and it usually is the BS who has to do the initial work (not fair but a reality).

Anyway, that's about all for now.

Much love to you Dewt, mini and maxi <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Originally posted by dewt:

Now, that being said, I'm proud to announce that as a human being, I have the power of decision... I have the power to take control of my destiny... I have the ability to stand up and say, "enough is enough", and to look forward and say I don't want to live like this anymore.

It is my 100% sincere hope that you listen to what I have to say and ACT on it:

Here it is....

You need a 12-step program....

Not just for the pot issue.... but for the life skills you lack.

If you could find a 12-step program and commit yourself to working the program for at least 6 months ~without question~ your life would begin to feel "managable".

So much hope in the 12-step programs. So much growing up. So much learning. So much fun of self-discovery and self-love.

I strongly hope you listen to this .... and do not dispute my suggestion with "yes, but" rebuttals...

You have no idea what life could hold for you as a sober man ... a man working his program.

It would be the BIG GIFT you give yourself...

And your son would have an ADULT MAN instead of a Peter Pan for a father.

Take care...

Pep

PS .... The first step is to surrender and admit you are powerless.... which stops this madness ... you need a program..... you cannot do this alone.

<small>[ May 09, 2004, 11:39 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

Originally posted by Pepperband

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You need a 12-step program....

Not just for the pot issue.... but for the life skills you lack.

If you could find a 12-step program and commit yourself to working the program for at least 6 months ~without question~ your life would begin to feel "managable".
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Exactly!!!

I had never really thought about it, had suggested counselling and support groups, but a 12 step program would be ideal.

Hey Dewt...

I've read some of your stuff, but this latest 'self revelation' might be the start of REAL change for you.

PEP suggested a 12 step program. She was reading my mind. You see I'm an alcoholic and an active member of AA. There are many people with drug addictions that come to AA for help. You see it's all the same thing. You use pot, I used whiskey. Your M will ever work until you are fixed (notice I did not say cured). Find a local AA meeting, go there, listen, buy the Big Book($6), read it, go to at least one meeting per day for a while, find a sponsor in the group and work the steps...

Work the program one day at a time, every day.

IMHO, you should not put much effort in your M at this time. Quite frankly you are not healthy enough to be a viable partner at this time. Your effort should be kids and sobriety (12 Stepping).

As you have said, the decision is yours. No one can fix you except you.

If you are curious about my experiences with AA please let me know...

God bless and good luck,

Gib

Y'all are making me jump the gun on my "this is what I've already done post"...

One of the reasons I came here, back to family, is that I have no sources to buy pot. In a way it was kind of a one-step program. Anyway, I know this battle isn't over, but just so you all know... marijuana is not a daily activity for my anymore. Not even a weekly thing. In fact the few times I've smoked over the past 4 months it's been socially. I'm cleaner now than I've been since I started smoking all those years ago.

Hey, I'm not saying the problem's licked. There are some nights I so miss the numbness that I'm ready to hop in the van, cruise to MTL and get some. But I don't. And I avoid meeting people here who smoke, so I purposely don't make any connections.

Just a quick note to let you all know.

dewt

"Just a quick note to let you all know."

You let us know how much you don't understand the purpose of a 12 step program.

The program is not about stopping whatever drug you use to self-medicate ... anyone can be a pot smoker who is not smoking pot at the moment.

12 step IS about developing the life skills you did not learn or practice while you were high or stoned.

Anyone who has remained high has not matured normally .... and lacks skills of adult living.

Here's a question:

WHY NOT TRY IT FOR A MONTH?

What have you got to lose?

Pep

Hey, I'll try it. I'm cool <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

See, I may not be smoking right now, but if someone were to walk into the room and offer it, I'm not sure I'd say 'no'. (assuming mini wasn't around, mind you) So, I know I still have an issue there. My trick right now is just making sure it's not around. Avoid the temptation in the first place. Above all, my priority is to clean out my system - which I've pretty much done.

Anyway, no. I don't know what a 12 step is all about. I'd be very interested in finding out, though. Is this a google search kind of thing or is it something available in neighbourhoods?

dewt

Thanks. I'll let y'all know what I find out.

dewt

Dewt,

12 stepping in AA is about changing you, not just the pot smoking. Booze, drugs, even porn are really not the core problem. The problem is the way you think and the way you process data between your ears.

Your original post in this thread was what we talk about and deal with everyday in AA. All of those self realizations you typed show an ability for inward reflection that you need to nurture and understand better. AA will help you adrees those issues, put them behind you, and help you deal with life's difficulties.

I don't do this very often....but Pep I disagree about the 'try it for a month'....

Dewt, if you go into it thinking about just trying a 12 step, then your chances of self improvement are slim. You will get out of the program what you put in...pure and simple.

I see over and over court ordered people and others who want to 'pretend' to 12 step. They are always the ones who remain unhappy, resentful, and depressed. Like Pep said, 12 stepping is about making you a better you. That's what you really want, right?

Gib

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by dewt:
<strong> In fact the few times I've smoked over the past 4 months it's been socially. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Dewt:

First of all, I commend you on your willingness to really analyze yourself. It sounds like you're making a good start towards personal recovery <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> .

But the above quote caught my attention. You smoke pot "socially"? Just my opinion, but maybe you need to disassociate yourself from that "social" group, and find some nice non-pot-smoking friends? As I tell my teenage son, it DOES matter who you hang out with.

Just my opinion. I hope you go thru with the 12-step program. It will likely help you more than you think...and what's the worst that could happen if you try it?

Lori

(edited because I'm all thumbs today <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> )

<small>[ May 09, 2004, 07:03 PM: Message edited by: at peace ]</small>

Er, the social group we're talking about is Dylan. Also my best friend of many years is a smoker. If I told him that I was totally quitting and not to offer, he'd respect that. I'm sure Dylan would too.

Only, to be honest, I haven't quit. I've stopped. There's a difference. Once I say 'I've quit', I get ravenous for it. You should've seen me the few times I've tried to 'quit' smoking cigarettes. Yipes. Anyway, that's one of the reasons I'm not against checking out the 12-step. And I wouldn't just 'give it a try' either... if I was to do it, I'd throw myself right into it. I'm that kinda guy.

Daily, I'm doing pretty good. I think about it less and less and now, when it does pop into my head, I ask myself how I would feel if I smoked a joint right now. My answer is usually, "nauseous, lethargic, blech." All of a sudden, the urge seems much less.

dewt

So anyways, I said after a few days I'd post and write about the things I've done about everything I 'confessed' too... and about the things I'm doing, and about the things I WILL be doing...

I gotta admit I don't really feel like doing this right now, but I earlier today I told myself I was going to do it. So now I'm doing it.

That's one of the changes I've made. When I say I'm going to do something, I really make darn sure I do it. I have yet to perfect this, but lots of things are getting done that 6 months ago would have perpetually stayed on my 'to do list'. Things like pick up the mail, do the laundry, work on my sons 'town', etc... all stuff I did today. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

There's the dope issue. There is no local chapter of AA or NA, so I'm stalled on that issue. Meanwhile I continue to not smoke dope. My body continues to clean itself out and I'm continuing to learn to live without it. Almost 5 months into this I feel I'm getting that hang of it. I actually rarely even think about it anymore.

The benefits of living clean are far reaching and many of the other issues I face are being helped by that fact alone. The 'getting stuff done' issue is a good example.

Work is going great. It is not without it's challenges, but I'm happy and my boss is happy with me. That's saying alot, as he is pretty particular. I'm always on time and bring a good attitude to work. I'm looking at a good future here and have every intention of pursuing this as far as I can. Last week I was sent off to complete a small repair contract on my own (with a helper) and got great comments back from the client and my boss. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I'm happy working for someone else, provided I'm treated fairly and allowed to grow and learn. Running a business, even if I had all the skills is far to time consuming and as much as I like my work, other things are important to me too. Like my children. Fishing. Fishing with my children. etc...

Most importantly, I'm bringing home the bacon. We even actually have some real bacon in the fridge right now. A luxury I could ill afford at any other point in my life. Mmmmmm.... bacon....

I'm still working on the budget thing. I wrote up a spreadsheet in XL but it still needs some tweaking. As things stabilize, it will become easier to use. I have no problems answering the phone or checking the mail and I usually check my bank balance every few days just for the fun of it. When a check goes through, I mark it off and do a little dance. I have no fear of any sort of seizure on my account because I have no debts in crisis mode. Weird, but I like it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Things are definately not happy at 'Home'. In fact, it's hard to even call it Home without Dylan here. But instead of gaming or running, I'm here posting. Thinking about things, and just generally facing it rather than fleeing.

I've sought the counselling I need, am reading the books and doing the research required to educate myself in regards to healing myself and changing my behaviours. This, in conjuction with the clean living is starting to pay off.

Did I mention my apartment is spotless clean? I do laundry and dishes regularily and I never 'let it go' and so consequently I'm never left with a mess or a pile of stuff that is discouraging. At any point, 20mins of solid housework is all that's required for things to literally shine. (*bling*bling*) My son has a checklist on his wall that details his daily duties, including cleaning his plates from the table, cleaning his room every day, brushing teeth, washing hands/face etc... He gets a star and a little something for his savings jar every day he gets checks in all categories. It was a slow start, but lately he's been getting %100 everyday.

I've set a date to go out to smalltownsville and help Dylan organize the rest of the house there. I'll take a load of stuff and have set a date for when I will show up with a U-haul for the rest.

As I'm making these changes, my self esteem is improving because I'm removing the reasons I had for having low self image in the first place. I'm having success and it's making me feel successful. Neat. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I'm still resolved that I will wait for Dylan. That means no dating, no cruising, no nothing until I get an answer from her one way or another. It also means keeping my heart open to her (becoming more challenging by the day- but that's another thread) and meeting her emotional needs whenever I can.

As far as standing up for my wife, well if the situation ever calls for it, you can bet I will. And if there was an honest attempt at reconciliation on her part, determining and meeting her needs would be number A-1 priority.

So that's were things stand with me right now. Like the original post, this is kind of a nutshell version, but y'all get the idea.

ttfn,

dewt

good for you, dewt. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It sounds to me like you've taken a hard look at yourself. Not only that, but you're doing something about it.

I'm sure there will be people who will tear apart your post and delve a little deeper into your motivations, but I just wanted to send a positive note your way to say...

WAY TO GO.

- WHB

Hey, thanks.

Yeah. Heh. My motivations. Devious cur that I am...

I confess...

I want my wife back.

I want a life that I can be happy in.

I want to provide a good example to my children how to live.

The secret's out.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

dewt