You are a SWEETIE, Kiwi <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Love, Julie

okay darn it, this is my last post. I L you guys, it is like having friends over. I will have to check into the library thing, thanks.

Kiwi, I do feel I have let it go, I really have a great H, he has done everything right to help me let go. We are going to be great.

You guys are all so sweet. Thank you for the brief but much needed interaction.
good bye <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Jenny, Your thread is going all over the place - so I'll thow in another direction if I may? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Very regretful, I think your comments about using the OP and the OP using you, in an A, are probably the most profound words, I've ever read here. Well done for hitting the nail on the head big time.

I probably should start a new thread about this, but will mention it here. I have been in the clutches of temptation for a revenge A, for about 3 weeks. It is more than a revenge A though. I have met someone who is very good looking and charismatic, and I am experiencing what it's like to be drawn to him strongly. As my H was unfaithful to me, after 30 yrs of a very happy marriage, I feel the contract between us has been broken. I do have loyalty to my H still, but know that his loyalty to me is questionable.

I have been going thru the A script, (all A's seem to run pretty much to a script) and identifying the stages and trying to adjust my reactions according to logic rather than to fog. I think I have identified a new area of the process that I have not read about here. Part of the process, that gets you in, that you don't see at the time, but is a powerful undercurrent to the continuence of the A. (for another post though) I wish other BS's could experience what I'm experiencing, in order for them to get more insight into how their S's got in so deep. I am astounded that a significant part of me, is so drawn to this other person. Logic tells me that he is not a person I should be invovled with - yet there is powerful chemistry that transcends my logic, at times. It's not even a desire for sex with him - it's a desire to get the kind of reinforcement and feedback that I believe he would give me. I think that is what I give him too. It's flattery and ego pumping. It's childish and shallow, but we humans seem to desire this kind of intense feedback from certain other people, who we are vulnerable to and we need it so badly, we are prepared to mess up our entire lives to get it.

I should not be writing posts on MB's this morning. I should be writing a NC email. But I can't quite bring myself to let go quite yet. This is the insanity of it: It feels like someone has given me something really, really wonderful and I have to hand it back and I just want to keep hold of it a while longer. I want it to be mine, even though I know I can't keep it.

The reality is: Someone has handed me a bomb which could go off in my face at any minute. Why the hell do I keep seeing it as a precious gift???? More than anything else though, I don't want to be VERY REGRETFUL. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

JL: Hi! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

anyname

Anyname, are you serious?

I'm speechless.

You MUST be serious.

You aren't BlessedTIME are you?

I'm still speechless and shocked.

Jenny

Anyname,

I don't have much time and will be out of the country for the rest of the week. So this will be short (yeah right) and to the point.

DON'T DO IT!!

It is just that simple.

You may feel your H deserves it, but I can tell you that since he has been busting it to make it up to you, if you do this it will do more harm than you can imagine. Because whether you intend for it to seem like this or not, it will be something you do to INTENTIONALLY hurt him.

He was a Dumb**s to have done what he did, what will be your excuse? I also recall he is doing all he can to fill your LB, but you have been holding him off. So if you now let another man do this, while holding H off, how do you propose to rebuild the marriage after that. You might want to look at Finally Learning's posts. She had an A while her H spent over two years trying to rebuild the marriage from their mutual neglect. Guess what? It is very very hard going. He is very hurt, and feels she made this decision intentionally to hurt him.

Don't go there. I have tried to teach my kids that it is always the "second guy" that gets caught so retaliation is usually a loser for the person hurt first.

Must go, got to get some sleep before the plane ride tomorrow.

God Bless,

JL

Jenny,

I have often felt like posting a new thread to ask others whether they feel like they have been puppets on a string. So much of what has happened to us has been the stuff of fiction novels. Sorry if the following is a bit long.

I have had such a hard time coming to terms with what FWH did. A few weeks ago I was home in OZ and I told my H on the phone (he was back o/s), that the next good opportunity that I got to be unfaithful to him, it was a done deal (e.g. someone I fancied). This because I wanted H to know, 'up close and personal', how it felt.

Three days later I meet someone. How is that possible? I had already told myself I wasn't going looking, I was going to sit back and wait. Three days later this absolutely gorgeous 50 yo materialises.

This is how it happened. I'm on long flight back o/s. Six hours in and I'm beginning to feel like *&^%. So I get up and stand at the back of the plane (kitchen area). Some idiot is still drinking wine at 5.30 am and boring the flight attendents with jokes about the mile high club. I start stretching. (remember my great bod?) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I ask the male flight attendant for a cup of tea. I don't even see him, as in notice him.

I can't remember how I got from drinking his tea to him telling me that he loved his wife but he was in love with someone else. Suddenly I'm looking at him. And I'm telling him about MB's. I'm telling him all about the big trouble he's getting himself in to - as he hasn't acted on his feelings for OW yet. Another half an hour of talking and he's telling me he thinks I'm sexy (saw me stetching) and how he can't be too in love with OW, if he is attracted to me already.

I then notice how incredibly attractive he is. He flies to my city every week or two. I give him the MB's URL on the back of my boarding pass. He sees my name on the front. I also give him my email address. We had a hug and a peck goodbye at the luggage collection (yum), and agreed to keep in contact by email - I was meant to be writing to him to save him from OW, yikes! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

We have been in email/phone contact and he has been back to this city twice.

I'm not impervious to other men just because my H cheated on me - in fact since my H cheated on me, I don't need to do mental gymnastics to give myself permission. I do not adhere to the christian belief system, so I am free to make my own moral judgements. I do not observe the MB's mantra that I need to D before I go with another. My beliefs were known to my H long before he cheated. They are that you do not cheat on a good partner (not open to negotiation). If one partner cheats, this renders them a bad partner. They have forfeited their rights.

I also support women's rights. My H cheated on me with a MUCH younger female. Many middle aged married women are passed over because their H's are attracted to younger women. Most of these women have let themselves go. I am not in that category. I wanted to strike a blow for all
middle aged women who've been treated in this way. I do not have to take this kind of mistreatment - why should I? If I am able to strike back and show my H that he cannot treat me like this, then I should.

Matters came to a head this weekend. Somehow, over the last couple of weeks, my H has come to accept my sense of justice about revenge A's. He met me at the airport after I said goodbye the the flight attendant. He knew the big grin on my face was not for him. He saw the email contact and knew that I was seriously thinking of paying him back. An email came thru on Friday nite that the FA was going to be here on Saturday nite and could I meet him for drinks? I told H that the moment had come. H had already agreed that it might be the best thing to help my shattered belief system. He said as long as it meant we could survive his infidelity, then he wouldn't stop me.

I spent the day telling myself and H that I was going to meet the FA for *drinks* that nite. By 6.15pm H went out. He couldn't stand to watch me get ready. He even left me money for my nite out. He tried to talk me out of it, just before he left, but he could see I was gone from him already. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

After H left I took off my wedding ring, as if I really was going ahead with it. I sat in the flat and read MB's. I knew that I couldn't do it, but part of me was doing it. I made no attempt to get ready. I believed I had justification, but the reality was that I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it to my long held beliefs about myself and I couldn't do it to the OM's wife. I really wanted to be with the OM, just for one nite, but I thought the price was too high. I wanted all the things that WS's want from OP. I knew I would get them from this OM. I felt that incredible pull towards him - but I also projected to the day after. I was afraid of how I would feel about what I'd done. I was afraid of how hurt my H would be. I was afraid of the bad karma that I would create by my actions. I was afraid that his wife would hate me with a hate so pure that it would burn into my soul.

So I sat here and opened the last bottle of Hawkes Bay Chard. And waited for a suitable amount of time to pass before I called my H on his mobile. For two hours I let him sweat on it. He was home in 15 minutes and he cried uncontrollably when he saw me. I felt satisfied that I had made my point without having to compromise myself. The hours that followed were unreal. My H was totally exhausted. He was very tearful and said he really believed I had gone to the OM. (H was never tearful before his A) I had sown so many seeds throughout the day. Shaving my legs and painting my toenails. Found some condoms and put them out etc. Normally I'm very open and like a puppy in his face, but I did not waver from my act of: I'm doing this.

H said he spent two hours of excruciating fear imagining me with OM having sex. He thought that he had brought down a truly good person - as that is what he thinks my greatest attribute is. He told me that he thought he would go crazy when I arrived back and did not deny having sex with OM. He thought he would have to knock himself unconscious, by head butting a wall (cement here).

And of course, he could further appreciate what his A had done to me. Is still doing to me.

We had sex that nite, as we have every nite since the A, but it was the most beautiful sex ever. I felt like I had given H a priceless gift. Instead of him having to face 2 to 5 tortured yrs of accepting that I had sex with another man, he had just two hours of agony and then he got to have sex with me knowing I was his alone. He was washed but but eager to savor that moment as long as possible. It was indescribable. Surely better than had I chosen OM???

My H thinks I triumphed. That I went one better than paying him back. That I paid him back, without having to take anything from myself. He thinks I did strike a blow for other women who are left at 50, because I showed him, that I could/should pay him back, and instead, I chose to rise above it in spite of justification and desire to do so.

To finish on a sad not, to me, what my H did to me, was the same as if I'd gone out on Saturday nite and taken my pleasure/revenge with OM in cold blood. Basically, I've given my H this gift my entire life. It was just a bit more clear cut on Saturday nite.

Anyname

JL, thank you for input. As you can see, some of us bumble thru on our own instincts. Funny that I always said that I learn everything the hard way. God I've learned a lot that way. But there are somethings that I just know are not for me. Though the experience with OM has helped me understand more. I really must write a NC email. You can't imagine how good it is to have a special friend of my own, and he's soooooooo cute. Oh well. Not gonna happen in this life. As I've always said about affairs...... in my next life time I'll.................. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Have a great holiday. Or is that vacation???? And stay away from the internet cafes!!!!

anyname

anyname...ok girl..I've some words of wisdom for you...DON'T BE AN IDIOT LIKE I WAS. You now understand how A's happen, hence, the chemistry, the man who is charismatic and who says all the right things to hook you. I am nearly one year past d-day and still struggle with it all. I can see how a revenge A would be easy to get yourself into but let me tell you. You will be the one hurt the most by it. Trust me!!!

Hey Anyname, (Sorry Kiwi, what's happened to your thread? Emergencies come up, don't they?) I read your posts with a sinking heart but I'm so glad you didn't go through with this in the end. You do not ever want to stand where Jenny, Lisa, Mrs.X and I have stood.

Cutie pie sounds like too much of a smooth talking a**w*pe anyway. He's been there and done that a million times before. Waaay too common for a woman like you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> So yeah, your H blew it but you have the chance to work together like never before.

Now that you've made your big point to H, it's time for you to stop entertaining fantasies. This is probably mistake number one for women like us. We're of a certain age, we're looking very good, confident and guess what? We're MAGNETS for guys like FA, especially if we are not feeling loved at home. It's just the way it is. You came so close to falling into a snare, Anyname. Scary.

I know you're not completly on board with all the MB principles but there is so much common sense in the concepts. I know I'm not the only one who wishes I had known these before I acted on the A.

Write the NC email, send it and PUT THE GUY OUT OF YOUR MIND! Don't treat yourself with thoughts of him, don't waste your precious mental energy on anything but loving that H of yours. You gave him a heck of a scare! (Us too!) Keep us posted. (Maybe new thread, you could title it, My Narrow Escape! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ) KB

::Cutie pie sounds like too much of a smooth talking a**w*pe anyway. He's been there and done that a million times before.

Hi KB, Yes, I guess that was buried somewhere under my more light weight thoughts. He acted so helpless, with all that stuff about what's wrong with me, my wife's a good woman, but..... Cwmac's post re the Tempted Woman, alerted me to the "I need help in my marriage" routine. But such is the nature of our desperate emotions, we make allowances...... the likelyhood that he has a special friend in every city had also occurred to me. Not that I cared really - because I wasn't looking for a deep emotional committment. (STD's crossed my mind though) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

:::Now that you've made your big point to H, it's time for you to stop entertaining fantasies.

Boy have I learned a lot though. I've made another discovery IMHO about the A process. It's to do with the politeness aspect of A's. How when the border is crossed, be it all so subtle, the WS and OP enter into a kind of twilight zone (even before A is fully realised). There is an understanding between them - and the greatest facilitator of it is accute politeness.

We feel we have to consider this person more than we would normally consider those around us. A kind of responsibility or accountablity sets in. e.g. Sat nite, before I started to read MB's, I thought I should SMS the FA. I felt I needed to apologise for not meeting him and tell him nice reasuring things about himself. So I tapped away at my mobile phone (I'm so slow at messaging), and then I pressed the wrong button and lost it. I felt annoyed to have to start again, and then it occurred to me, why the hell am I worried about what this person thinks? He's just a womanizing cheating H, why am I feeling accountable to him? Lightbulb moment!!!!

I have since gyrated in and out of feeling I should let him down nicely, and feeling like I might never write to him again - leaving him hanging, as it were. The latter is a great way to reject a preditor, but it's really, really hard to let go of being considerate to OP.

As Very Regretful said, both WS and OP are using each other, and the game rules consist of an extra helping of good manners and politeness. Is this behavior our expression of gratitude? Gratitude for someone showing interest in us and making us feel worthwhile?

Have you seen some of the NC letters people write? Their first attempts? - and the rest of us are scratching our heads and wondering what is wrong with saying P*ss off a*sh*le! I think that this politeness aspect needs further discussion.

:::I know you're not completly on board with all the MB principles but there is so much common sense in the concepts. I know I'm not the only one who wishes I had known these before I acted on the A.

I certainly think there is much to be learned on MB's. But I spent 10 yrs in a cult religion - so I tend to question a lot of things closely and often reject certain ideas, if they don't sit 100% right with me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" />

:: don't waste your precious mental energy on anything but loving that H of yours.

I feel the experience has helped me move closer to understanding and acceptance of our situation. H said yesterday that we have been engaged in a high stakes fight for 18 months. I can hardly remember who we used to be now. We not only have to move on from mopping up the A mess, but we also have to learn to live normal lives together again.

Lisa: thank you for you advice of learn from my mistakes. Us humans are not usually that good at learning from the mistakes of others. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I will totally disconnect from this OP now. He has served his purpose.

anyname

Good job, Anyname. I was interested in your thoughts on the politeness factor. How about a new thread? KB

Kiwi, you were right about this thread getting to three pages. You are awfully quiet, is everything ok? I hope you guys are getting over that last development. Update?

Hi, I'm still around. My son completely crashed our home computer trying to load Windows 2000. Total and complete meltdown. But at the same time I've had time to get on with some "real" life.

I'm at the library right now but haven't had time to read and post much.

I haven't even read this thread LOL.

Jenny