Alright I am so confused and not sure where to even start. Tonight I got a call from the OW (remember she was my best friend) and she wanted to meet to talk with me. I agreed (don't know whether this was right or wrong). I met with her and she apologized for all the pain she has caused me and my family. She did tell me that my WH called her to tell her he was getting a divorce and that he called her again last week (no idea how he got the unlisted number??). She has asked him not to contact her and he keeps coming up with excuses to phone her. She wants her marriage and they are in counseling. She is terrified that he might keep calling her . She said that she realized that the affair was a fantasy and that she was never in love with my WH. I told her if she was serious she should write a NC letter (not sure if that was good or not either), which she said she would.

Now here I sit thinking am I being played a fool all over again. Is she lying?? I feel like she was sincere but I also thought she was sincere and my best friend before and she was sleeping with my husband. So anyway where do I go from here?? I also so think if they are not still in contact why is my husband considering divorce?? Is he still in the fog?? I mean he has contacted her but she keeps shooting him down. What is he thinking???

Any comments or advice??

H&F -

My closest friend slept w/ my WH - I know how you feel. She was the one that told me she slept w/ him - I think it gave her alot of pleasure. She was also responsible for giving me my 2nd D-day three months later.

My WH told me on 5/3 he wanted a divorce - so when I called him on his bluff, he said he needed time to work through his feelings. Felt ashamed, etc. Also told me same stupid fogese - I love you but not the way I should.

So I have decided to Plan B (after 13 months of pretty solid Plan A) - now he thinks we are going to take a "break". I don't begin Plan B till 06/01 when I fly to Boston w/ my belongings & daughter, but I pretty much gave him a verbal Plan B letter. Now my WH is telling me he'll commit to NC, etc. We'll see. It's hard to believe when he has lied so very much.

My OW already has a new boyfriend but she is still text messaging him or was up till 4/29. She sent plenty of mixed messages to him. He seems to be bitter about her new relationship - so obviously he has some feelings for her. My OW has serious abandonment issues - no one leaves her. So I think she is going to make this hard on him.

I am sorry for your situation - it is hard when you have to deal w/ your WH, but then to think about a friend that you confided in, using your info, history and you knowing things about her that would help end the A. But, of course in Plan A - no bad-mouthing the OW or you'll look vindictive.

Hope, this might just be exactly what she says it is, which is a very good omen for you. Now you know what is probably going on here. I suspect your H is chasing her and may have left you in the hopes that it would lure her away.

Time is your friend here. Once he sees that she won't take him, he can start withdrawing seriously. In the meantime, just do the best darn Plan A you can muster so he has some place welcoming to return to. A few more weeks of this and you might consider Plan B.

I would also ask you to consider selling that house. That house will be a constant reminder to him of the OW and make it almost impossible for him to stay detached. If you moved, he could think of home without thinking of the OW.

I am for sure putting my house up for sale. I can't afford it anyway and I don't want to be here. Can you explain a good plan A? I have read the articles but someone said that you have to follow the steps of Plan A. What steps??

When do I decide to go to Plan B?? When he is still trying to contact her??

Time is my friend. I hope OW is serious about no contact.

h&f -

Wow, my FWH had an A with my supposed "best friend," too. What the he!! is this world coming to?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

The OW in our case broke off the relationship with FWH as soon as he told me about the A. She was afraid of losing business with her daycare, and being known in our small community as a Home Wrecker. Even so, my H pined after her for 3 months! Totally fogged up.

Then, as I Plan A'd and made home and myself appealing, he came around. I worked on me, lost 30 pounds, had my hair done regularly, painted my toenails, went out with my girlfriends, had fun with my boys, etc.

In my mind, the SS train was moving out, with or without my H. And when he realized this, that our life was going on with or without him, he jumped on board. He suddenly realized that Sunday morning pancakes and bacon continued without him. That we went to friend's houses for BBQs and cards without him. We went on trips without him.

I still remember the looks on his face as his fogged-in brain grasped these concepts.

And now he is home, there is NC (HIS choice), he has no feelings for OW at all. He said once he stopped putting so much energy into having feelings for her to justify his actions, all of those illusions melted away. The love he felt he had never had for me was there all along, just buried under all the other crap.

It is all layered like an onion. Follow the concepts here, believe in you, and know that you will be OK. There is always hope.

Lots of love and support and HUGS!

SS

SS Holy cats our stories sound exactly the same. My supposed BF/OW broke it off with my WH because of her daycare and family. She did not want to be known as breaking up a marriage. She has apologized to me and I believe she is sincere.

You say your husband was after her for 3 months?? Did he leave you and move out?? You just went through Plan A, never Plan B??? My husband threatened to file for divorce and then called OW to tell her and see if she would leave with him. She did not and he still has not filed. It has been 2 months since DDay in he still seems so deep in the fog. I would love to hear more of your story and how it worked out. It sounds so close to mine. I am working on me, lost 35 pounds and am going out with friends and moving on but I still pray that my WH will wake up and see what he is missing.

Hope, it really sounds like your WH is going after OW and she is sincere. I may be wrong...I dont know....Lord knows I was in my own case!

How do you know when to start Plan B? When you feel you cannot take the pain of his A anymore. Plan B is to protect you. It is not to punish your WH, it is simply to protect you from the daily pain that you have to endure from your WH actions. I didn't think my WH was in the A this entire time during what I thought was recovery, but he was and still is. I chose to go into Plan B BEFORE DDay number 2 on Monday. Now he wants to end it with OW. But, I still wont let him come home. I am counseling with SH and trying to get an emergency session with him today.

Anyway, sorry about that...you need to be comfortable with your Plan A before going into Plan B. dont look at me...I was only good with my Plan A while he was out of the house and by the time I kicked him out the second time, I was too angry to plan A again. i was worn out. My Plan B is going well...sort of. I am doing well...I feel good. But WH keeping trying to contact me...OK, WH got into the house yesteday. Dont know how. I changed the garage door openeer and the locks, but I think he snuck in thru the doggy door! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Then he called me at 1:00 AM.

OK, i will shut up now! I am just one confused BS! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Add me to the "with friends like this....." list.

h&f - ditto Mel.

One question, does OW's H know?

I suggest you put aside for the moment any hesitations with further contact with OW. Take advantage of her perceived sincereity and ask her to send a NC letter to your H. DIRECT HER TO THIS SITE to learn how she can better salvage HER marriage.

The potential exists that she's zooming you, but if she isn't this is a golden opportunity for you. If she IS, you'll know it soon enough and you won't have lost anything, except the gamble. Again, does her H know? This is vital to knowing her sincereity.

About Plan A - there are no "steps." Here's my canned explanation:

The way I understand Plan A, it's based on two premises that must be accepted:

1. The BS cannot end the affair.

2. The affair developed, to some extent great or small, due to a poor marital environment which the BS, to some extent great or small, contributed to.

If a BS cannot accept these two statements as givens, they will not be able to implement Plan A.

With these facts established, there is only one constructive thing a BS can do to influence the course of an affair: change the affair-friendly marital environment by eliminating the BS's contributions to it.

To this end, the BS must perform an introspective search for all the things they were doing or not doing that contributed to the WS's decision to have an affair - and then eliminate those negative contributions. These may include failure to meet emotional needs or disbursing too many love busters - but is usually some combination of both.

This DOES NOT mean that the BS "caused" the affair. This DOES NOT mean that the BS can or should try to change failings of the WS.

It simply means that the BS needs to change and improve the only thing they have control over - themselves - to eliminate love busters and begin meeting as many emotional needs of the WS as they can.

Central in this is stopping all disrespectful judgements, angry outbursts, and demands. This is agonizingly difficult in the face of an affair. A BS has to counter the common knee jerk reactions of demanding the WS "straighten up" and delivering ultimatums and threats. Acting in this fashion simply reinforces the WS's rationalizations to conduct the affair in the first place - because the marriage "is over" or expendable and the spouse is unreasonable, therefore the affair is justifiable.

Invariably, this course leads BSs to feel like doormats and [censored] kissers. It also conjures up thoughts of enabling the affair by not resisting it. But the better logic to apply is that the BS isn't a doormat or enabling because they're doing the only things in their power to stop the affair - it's just counterintuitive to the initial reactions. This doesn't mean that boundaries shouldn't be set and protective measures shouldn't be taken.

Let me add that Plan A is all about the BS. You do not "Plan A" your WS. It is not intended to change ANYTHING but the BS.

I'll end this by offering that there is one additional thing a BS can do to alter the course of the affair - but I call it "destructive" rather than "constructive" (to separate it from the one and only constructive thing, discussed above). It's to expose the affair to the light of day. But this is NOT part of Plan A and deserves it's own discussion.

OK, one more thing. The affair is very, very likely to end DESPITE what the BS does or does not do. Until it ends, there is NO chance for reconciliation. Ideally, Plan A improvements can encourage the WS to end the affair sooner because the spouse's "causes" of it are eliminated. But regardless, following Plan A prepares the BS for a successful reconciliation whenever and for whatever reason the affair ends by jump starting the process - their share of pre-existing marital problems are already confronted.

mom -

I have seen your posts elsewhere and can see he is giving you a hard time in Plan B. Hang tough and you will make it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I am doing really good with Plan A. I don't feel in pain right now. It is very easy for me to Plan A him when he is not in the house. I feel very good about things right now. Positive that I will be fine with our without him. I truly want to believe that OW is sincere. She seems to be but as a BS you know we have all been there. Thinking that our WH or OW is sincere but they are really just playing a game. OW said she was going to send WH a NC letter. I hope this knocks some sense into him.

Do you know in Plan A they say that you should do your best to fulfill needs, right now my husband is not living with me and I cannot fulfill any needs obviously. I am positive and upbeat at all times with him and try to be pleasant and helpful when he is around but is this a good Plan A or should I be doing more??? I can't afford counseling with SH or I would so be doing that...

hope&faith -

Spiderslayer went through a long, hard Plan A. Her WH wanted nothing to do with her, or the marriage. He even asked for a D, during a sushi lunch. Now they are working on recovery and very happy. I think that will happen to you. Give it some time.

Mom - Woof, woof, dad is back! That picture is too funny.

Believer can I find her story somewhere on this board??? Is she normally on here in the evenings?? I would love to talk to her. So her husband even asked for D?? Did he ever file???

I am trying to be patient and do the best darn Plan A I can. I am just not so sure I am doing a good Plan A. I want to do my absolute best at this so I can look back and say that I gave it my all. My religious beliefs are very strong and I don't want to give up on my marriage. It is all in God's hands and I have faith that he will work it all out.

Hope, yOU are doing fine...That is all you can do when they are not at the house. Do not LB him and NO DJ's..that is where I went wrong while he was home. when he talks the babble to you, talk it back. It will confuse the crap out o fhim. I did this to mine and he was so confused I think his head starting spinning.

Right now, I am very confused about what I want from my WH. I cant say much here...but only time will tell. The wheels are turning if you know what I mean. hang in there!

hope&faith -

You can go to search, and there is a box to type in her member number. That way you will see all of her story. It is very long, but a good one.

Her H was deeply in the fog, and acting really strange. She stuck with a great Plan A, and all of a sudden one day, he started pursuing her. She was stunned and didn't know what to do.

Her WH did not file for divorce, but did not want anything to do with the marriage or her. Her story sounds a lot like yours. Plus she has a great sense of humor and fun. Check it out.

wow, WAT, that was a great explanation of Plan A! You are the master!

Hope, please carefully read what WAT said about Plan A, because he outlines it very well. You are doing a good Plan A if you are being kind, thoughtful, and friendly and avoiding all lovebusters. And please look for an opportunity to tell him you are sorry you made him so miserable at home. I want him to know that you REALIZE it was too much so he can be assured there will be no repeat performance in the future.

I also think it may shake him up a bit if you put your house on the market. He may be biding his time without any real intention of divorcing you. This may have the effect of pulling off the fence.

How soon can you put the house up for sale?

WAT - Great explaination. OW husband knows about the affair because OW told him. He took a crow bar to my husbands truck and front door. It was a great experience <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Anyway OW and her husband are doing good and want to work through this but my husband continues to call and chase. I am having discussion with OW right now but I am afraid to speak with her too much because we used to be BF and I don't want to fall into the trap of getting sucked in again. I did direct her to this site and asked her to do a NC letter, which she said she would do after she spoke with her husband.

ML - I am hoping to get the house up for sale by the end of this month. I have some cleaning to do and all that. I believe I am doing a good Plan A, I just thought I was supposed to be trying to fulfill some EN and that does not seem possible right now with all of this going on. I also believe my husband may just be threatening divorce and not actually going to do it. He seen the lawyer two weeks ago but has done NOTHING since that point.

h&f - kids? I apologize for not knowing your details.

Yep, pretty good evidence OW's H knows!

I suggest you give serious consideration to Plan B. This assumes you've communicated to your H your Plan A revelations about your negative contributions to the marriage.

With him gone, you are not in a good position to fill ENs. So, once you've gotten everything else out of Plan A that you can, Plan B is the next logical thing to do. With OW cutting him off and then YOU cutting him off, all he'll have is a beat up truck, huh?

WAT

Yes I have two kids D7 and S3. I did not do a good Plan A when he was in the home. He moved out two weeks ago and I have been doing the best Plan A I can since. So I should consider Plan B right now??? Should I wait and see what happens with the NC letter he gets from OW??

What do you mean good evidence that OW H knows??

Also just for information purposes on Plan A/Plan B. I really pushed my husband when he was living with me to try to work on our relationship to give up on OW (not good for Plan A). Right now my WH is out of state visiting his sister. His sister is going to try to talk to him about all that he is giving up and how he is chasing after someone who is not going to give him anything. I am hoping that this will make a difference in him and his choices. She is going to ask him to move down and live with them and get a job so the environment would also change for him (if he chooses to do that).

I am very intersted in if people think I need to move to Plan B at this point.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> What do you mean good evidence that OW H knows??</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The crowbar!!! Of course, I don't for a second believe that OW told the WHOLE truth to her H. She likely blamed it ALL on your H. But this doesn't matter.

What improvements have you made in YOU?

Have you communicated and demonstrated, to the extent you can, these improvements to your H?

The answers to these questions are needed to assess whether it's Plan B time. It may not be.

As I said before, I think a good time to go dark (Plan B) will be when OW sends her NC letter, if she sends one. This is why you need to hold your nose and stay in touch with her for a bit - to see if she does it.

WAT

Hope, I dont think IMO that you are ready for Plan B...Plan B is very difficult if you are not ready for it...on the other hand if your WH is still waffling or fence sitting then yes, Plan B is in order...but give your Plan A few more weeks/months...in SAA Dr H says Plan A can last up until about 6 months. You are not even near that! I went into Plan B early cuz my WH was waffling, in actuallity he was fence sitting. There is a difference. I could not take the pain any longer, so I needed to protect MYSELF! Remember Plan B is to protect YOU not your H.

you can email if you want to...!