Tinman

When working on a M also means looking inside yourself, it must sometimes seem less painful to escape into a fantasy world where nothing is wrong with you. OP tells WS they are perfect and it must be the BS who has got it all wrong. WS likes to hear this and believes they have finally been understood.

All of this must be much easier than resolving your own issues and failings.

Perhaps you didn’t have an A because you are confident enough in your own self image and you’re not afraid of owning and dealing with your own issues. You don’t need someone else to tell you that you’re OK.

I’m no expert. It’s just my opinion, for what it’s worth.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by The Tinman:
<strong> Good post lot's of food for thought. The problem I have is I don't see how it's easier to have an A then to talk to the person you vowed to spend the rest of your life with.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Tinman, in my last marriage, [20 years, D in 1999] my H did talk to me, over and over and over again. To no avail. I didn't care. I didn't care when he told me with despair in his voice "I can't live like this," after not having sex for 3 months.

I didn't care when he told me he felt lonely and like he was living with his sister rather than a wife. I wouldn't do anything with him and only agreeed to have sex with him when I couldn't take his whining anymore. And I felt put upon every time it happened.

I never missed any opportunity to put him down in front of anyone and everyone. I never missed an opportunity to make him feel stupid and rub my "superior" intelligence in his nose. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> I never missed an opportunity to remind him that I bought our home, our cars and almost every stick of furniture in our house. I scrutinized and criticized almost every word he said to me.

In addition to talking me for about 10 years [he gave up after that] he left me in 1995 because he couldn't handle it anymore. I talked him into coming back by acting affectionate towards him and having sex with him. As soon as he got back I went back to my old ways of ignoring and disrespecting him.

So, I think after 20 years of being deprived and being treated like a dog, when he met a woman who treated him like a man and would have sex with him, he was a goner. He was a starved man who found a buffet. And I am the one who starved him. I imagine he was overcome with desire and I can understand why knowing what I know today.

I have never ever told anyone what I just told y'all and want you to know that I am deeply ashamed of tearing that man down for 20 years. May God forgive me for treating another human being so shabbily.

But understand that he did EVERYTHING to get my attention for years and years before he ever had an affair. I didn't care. So he didn't care anymore. He stayed around because he didn't want to lose his boys. He was just an affair waiting to happen because I made him vulnerable to it.

I just wanted to thank everyone for their replies.This is a really good conversation,it is getting all of us to look deep into our reasons for marrying and why WS's cheat and many other worthwhile issues.We each have a story to tell and feelings,beliefs and experiences,all different but somehow similar too.

There is no one right answer nor is any one belief or experience that supercedes another.We are all learning and hopefully we can grow and change and mold our current or future relationships into what we all want and need.

O <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ May 21, 2004, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

Wow take a couple hours off an look what happens. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Great posts!

OG - You asked why a WS gets married?? I am sure that WS get married because they are in love. My WH and I were best friends but we grew apart because we never concentrated on each other. We did not fulfill each other's needs.

Horizon - I so agree. I would never be here if I had fulfilled my WH needs. He is a good man who was lacking and NO he should not have looked outside of our marriage but like MelodyLane's FH he was deprived for many years of the needs he needed. I would also agree that it would not have happened if my WH detached. People are really going to kill me for this but I thank God that he is willing to give us another shot. To try to give us the opportunity to make right what we have done wrong all these years.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The problem I have is I don't see how it's easier to have an A then to talk to the person you vowed to spend the rest of your life with. M is not supposed to be so trivial a thing is it? I mean it's like it's easier to quit on a M then it is to put any effort into working on a M for some people. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">TM - I don't think it was easier for my WH to have an affair then to talk. I think he tried communicating the best he could and I did not hear him. Just like ML's H. I was not listening. I did not care. I would guess that it is where a lot of WS are coming from. I also do not believe it is always easier for the WS to quit working on the marriage than to work on it. Again, I think that in my case my WH had tried to work on it and finally he quit because he was frustrated. Again, thank God he still has enough love for me to give it one more shot. This time I think we will make it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I'm not saying that I'm not to blame for some of the things that were wrong in our M. My W told me that she was unhappy in our M on Christmas. I asked her what needed to change with us to make this work? Her response was we never did anything together anymore. Well guess what I'm not a mind reader so how am I supposed to know this unless my W talks to me. I did ask her several time's if she wanted to go to a dinner and a movie or go do something. She at this point didn't want to do anything and I suspect that she was already in a EA. I asked if she wanted to do MC and she said no, she didn't want to put any effort into our M at all. I'm sorry but I am a good man and have never treated my wife with anything but respect and love. I do house work I cook, clean always did the dishes, cleaned kitchen floors on my hands and knee's because she believed that a mop wouldn't get it clean enough. She did the laundry but never folded it and she also cleaned the bathrooms. I pretty much took care of the rest of the house. I'm not a drunk, I never beat her up, or had an A. So I have a hard time looking at myself for the problem's in our M. I think my W is a happiness Vampire, she finds her happiness through other people instead of herself, so this will be her life from now on, she will get board with OM and then move on to someone else and this will be a viscous cycle that she will be in for the rest of her life until she work's on her issue's.

Tm -

I think that it is always hard to find our fault in our marriages. It is very difficult to stop and focus on what we might have done wrong when we feel so hurt. I also don't believe that I am a horrible woman. I simply believe there were needs that my husband had that I did not met. I just did not pay attention to what it was that he was truly needing.

Is your wife interested in IC?? What worries me is that she finds happieness in someone else. I truly believe that that was one of the problems that I had in my marriage. I was always looking at my husband for happiness; imagine that kinda pressure. My IC has helped me work through some of my issues and I now look to myself for the happiness that I desire. It is a dramatic change from the person I used to be.

HH

I don't think my W know's that she has this problem, but I did tell her that if she wanted her current relationship with OM to work she better start working on herself. I know not a good thing to say but I can't take it back. She is making me look like a demon in her eye's to make herself feel better about what she has done. Calling me a stalker and such, like when I found her living at OM apartment, and then finding OMXW and talking to her. She said I stalked his XW down. It's sad I love the person my W used to be, but I don't want to have anything to do with the person she is now. If she finds that person she used to be I will take her back with open arm's, but I don't see that happening anytime soon. I'll just keep working on myself and do the best I can. I know that if my W was willing to try the principal's here we'd be fine, but I think she is too selfish right now. I am public enemy number one in my W eye's, I am the Tinman for now.

TM - I understand where you are coming from. For awhile I was public enemy #1 with my WH. He thought I was stalking him and that everything was my fault.

I also went through a period of time where I did not want my WH back because he was I did not recognize who he was. I wanted the old husband back, the sweet caring guy. He is coming around now and he has moved back in. I see glimpses of the man I know and love with all my heart. It takes time and effort. He is putting in the effort, he posts here and reads the principles.

I agree that if your WW would read these principles and believe in them that you would be alright as well. However I know that trying to force my WH to do it did not work. He had to make that choice for himself. He started making those choices when he started seeing changes in me. Focus on yourself and do an awesome Plan A. She will begin to see what she has. I am praying for you!!

No Plan A here I've graduated to Plan B as Jennifer instructed, so here I sit in Plan B with no contact with my W. Well maybe a couple of time's once her disreguard for my feelings and Plan B letter and once my fault. I've been dark for the past week or more so right now I just take care of me and go have fun. As the line in Shawshank Redemption goes "Get busy living or get busy dieing." So I'm living.

HH I also wanted to add thank you for the prayer's, I need all the help I can get. I feel without any kid's involved and my W having an A and woman get more emotionally attached in an A I might be at this for a while, I just hope I can hold on.