I have given mine 3 chances and each time I find he has lied about NC. WH usually contacts within days of the promises. I believe there is no PA, but still talking everyday--several times. This last time he knew I was done. I have a meeting with an attorney in 8 days. I want to give him the chance to change things. Is it wrong to let him know that I want him to try (the right way with me getting all passwords, NC letter, and password) or i am filing for D. I am so tired of being used and then having my world flipped upside down only to find I'm right back where I started. I really am thinking that a D would be better. Is this how to go about getting on with my life?

What about Plan B?

I tried plan B twice and he came running home. Only for the same thing to happen. I can't do this anymore. He has to make the choice. It has been going on for over a year and I am so tired of life being this way. I just see the days passing. Is throwing the possiblity of a D at him wrong? I really think that he wants me, but just unwilling to let her completely go.

HI CD,

Plan B includes stipulations for allowing the WS to return.

"You can return if you write a NC letter and agree to go to MC with me within one next week. I need have access to any information that allowed you to continue behind my back (cell ph records, phonemail passwords). Without these assurances, it would be too painful to have contact with you"

I'd try one more real plan B. What have you got to loose? Sounds like you're pretty done. I am sorry. I know how much this sucks! Please take care - Dru

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by CoolDuck:
<strong> I tried plan B twice and he came running home. Only for the same thing to happen. I can't do this anymore. He has to make the choice. It has been going on for over a year and I am so tired of life being this way. I just see the days passing. Is throwing the possiblity of a D at him wrong? I really think that he wants me, but just unwilling to let her completely go. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">How long was your Plan B and did you send a Plan B letter?

The first time i tried Plan b it lasted one week and he was back for four. I didn't send a letter because I didn't know about this sight. I just wanted time away from him to sort my feelings. Then i found this sight and realized that i did a great Plan a without knowing it. I read everything that I could get my hands on. The second Plan b I sent the letter and we got back for a week. I found out about communication by checking his email. Disgusting. "I want your body"--from him. Her discussing getting her hair cut. It was so childish. I literally puked after reading it. He said it was a mistake, blah blah. I am so hurt. He knew I was close to being done. Yet he played me once again. I want him back, but I'm not sure if it will ever happen. I see my life passing in front of me. I have found myself and I'm trying to enjoy life, but I find in the middle of a great moment I want him there with me and it throws into a decline. I know some many out there understand, because I read almost every post. I just don't understand how you move on with them still somewhat a part of your life (husband. I see a D as closure to something that appears to possibly go on for longer than I can deal.

Try Plan B a little longer but this time do NOT allow him to come homw unless he sends the OW a no contact letter, gives you the password to his e-mail, access to his phone bill, gets into counseling, etc.

My WH got away with several false recoveries too.

Now I'd rather go through with the divorce than go through another false recovery.

I don't know how to answer your question for anyone but myself.

Your question:

~~~~How many chances do WS get?~~~~

For me...

one and a half.

Then I am not in the mood for any more chances.

Exceptions.... WS has a medical condition that prohibits good decision-making. Like a brain tumor.

Other than that, I have learned it is important FOR ME to have a spouse I can look up to and respect...

Without that level of equity is the relationship... I cannot function.

If my H were to cheat again... there are not left over chances.

I would forgive him, and love him, and divorce him. Because my tolerance for staying in a relationship without respect... has expired.

These are MY choices. Not necessarily for everyone.

Pep

Coolduck, I think if you did a proper plan B and had stipulations about coming back, that your marriage might have a chance. One of the biggest mistakes BS's make is taking the WS back too soon and with NO stipulations. A week long Plan B is not enough to make any WS take you seriously.

I would start over again and this time set down firm boundaries, such as some fairly long term PROOF that ALL CONTACT has ended. Number one on your list should be to END CONTACT by finding another job. As long as he works with her, you can consider the affair to be active.

I really think you should give Plan B a REAL chance before you jump to D.

As far as giving chances, for me personally, I would have no interest in staying with a spouse who continued to have an affair. That's not something I would ever deal with. There would be no second chance if that happened.

Now, if my H had another affair, I wouldn't bother with him, I would D him.

At the risk of sounding cold, I've written you 3 long responses, with no response back from you.

So, I'll just repeat them, because after 4 years in recovery, my opinion doesn't change in 2 weeks.


May 19, 2004 10:33 AMMay 19, 2004 10:33 AM                      My H & I separated 7 times, so I know a bit about failed reconciliations, and I believe that once a reconciliation has failed, that the procedure should be different.

If your H cannot be successful at NC while out of the house, moving home won't actually help. You'll know when he is missing or unaccounted for. It will upset you. You in fact become the jailer, not the marriage partner.

When my H & I reconciled the last time, 4 years ago, so I'm pretty sure this one is a keeper , he became accountable before he moved home.

The PA was over, but the FOW was/is a co-worker, and EA communication had continued. He set up a system so that he did not work directly with her. Her issues were passed onto one of her other supervisors.

He stopped going to bars.

He went to counseling on his own.

He gave me his email & voice mail passwords and the ok to check them.

He read some of the books I had earlier given him. Smedes "Shame and Grace" was particularly helpful to him.

I think it is fine if you want to spend time together, to date, to have family time. I would hold off on his actually moving home until the 2 of you come up with a plan and see if he is able to do his part while separated. I'd recommend a month at the very least.

MC is very useful under these circumstances because the C's office can become the place where you do have the dreadful relationship talks. When you date, you just communicate and hopefully have some fun and save the pain for the MC.
You can give him a chance without his moving home.

May 19, 2004 05:22 PMMay 19, 2004 05:22 PM                      Cool duck,
Co-worker situations are very difficult. I want to add that the list of things I wrote about what my H did were all things I had requested and he had refused, prior to his hitting bottom and really wanting our marriage enough to back that wish up with behavior.

Does your H have to interact with the OW? Can he, like my H did, have a reassignment made?

Are their workspaces near each other?

You won't get traditional no contact, which means this uncertain situation is likely to be long-lasting, with set-backs, as you've already seen. Can you prepare yourself for that possibility?

My pastor termed it as being "long-suffering". I do prefer "steadfastedness".

What is your H willing to do to be accountable?

The passwords? And, my H is military, and giving me a password was a strict no-no, but when he was serious about our marriage, he did it voluntarily. He also knew I was serious, because I served him divorce papers in that 7th separation when I found EA computer contact (pre-password).

I would not recommend divorce papers, unless you want, or are ready for, a divorce because it is far more likely that you will end up divorced than reconciled. Some WS continue their bad behavior to almost force the BS into taking action, so that it becomes the BS "fault" for the divorce happening. "The BS is the one who filed."

You are in a tough spot. You can't do anything to ensure his NC, because you'll never know for sure...until years pass and he remains committed to the marriage...& he's never caught again.

Member
Member # 545
May 19, 2004 09:40 PMMay 19, 2004 09:40 PM                      Did you read my last post to you on your other thread?

Really, my answer is the same:

What is your H willing to do to show his accountability that the A is over?

On your C...you might need another that is more familiar with affairs. OBVIOUSLY you cannot control your H's behavior and CANNOT MAKE HIM GIVE UP THE OW.

This is not in your control and I question a MC who says you should be able to do this. If, the MC is saying that you have no contact yourself until the WS says he has given her up...that might be different. But, the way you stated this doesn't sound like the the MC is on the right track.

The MC needs to work with what is under your control--you.

And, no, separating this way is not hurting your chances. Your H's behavior is hurting your chances.

When words & actions conflict, believe the actions. And, so, your H needs some concrete actions that he does want the marriage.

--Going to counseling himself
--Giving you passwords to email/voice mail
--Being voluntarily accountable in time
--calling you a couple times a day so you don't have to

Whatever you request that is reasonable.

If NC is tough, it is tough. And he is not a candidate for successful reconciliation.

Real consequences are playing on your H. Either he wants his marriage and he is proving that by showing you the A and personal contact is over. Or, the affair continues, and there is no use his thinking about moving home.

I'm sorry you are so upset. I know welcoming him home seems right and loving, but...you've done that.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. And, I did it myself.

I'm sorry Lor that I didn't reply. I try to take everything in and sort it for a few days. I know what you are saying is true. I guess thus far I wanted my H to be different and I wanted to believe that I could trust. Big mistake. I plan to talk to him tonight and let him know that I am done with playing games. since he isn't living with me, I want him to stay away except for contact with out daughter.

The work situation is hard. He is a manager and makes great money. She is a sect. in another section of the business so contact isn't necessary. Although they seem to make it. I am so embarrassed to show my face there, because I am sure everyone knows and is feeling sorry for me. I have asked for him to get her fired/reassigned but of course he protects her and says you can't play with someone's life like that. Perhaps he is right, but they seem to be playing with mine.

I know that she is being lied to and doesn't have a clue about what is truely happening when he is with me. He and others in my life think the NC letter/phone call is childish and doesn't make a lot of sense. H says that he could just tell her it was to appease me and she would continue contact. I think it would let her know where we stand.

Perhaps another chance at Plan B, but I don't think my H will get it until he sees i am really serious and taking serious actions. Plan B has always been a joke.Perhaps because I have never been very good at it. Can anyone tell me anything about Legal seperation??

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by CoolDuck:

He and others in my life think the NC letter/phone call is childish and doesn't make a lot of sense. H says that he could just tell her it was to appease me and she would continue contact.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Who cares what he thinks? It makes ALOT of sense when done sincerely. It should be one of your stipulations that he not only do it and send it, but MEAN it. If he laughs about it, then you know he doesn't mean it.

It is the LEAST he can do to show that he is sincere about his committment to his marriage. But I think you know he is not serious about a damn thing.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Perhaps another chance at Plan B, but I don't think my H will get it until he sees i am really serious and taking serious actions. Plan B has always been a joke.Perhaps because I have never been very good at it. Can anyone tell me anything about Legal seperation??</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Why not do a REAL Plan B and stick to it? You haven't stuck to it in the past so of course, it was a big joke to him. I am sure it accomplished nothing but make him lose more respect and question your credibility. Do it seriously and do it RIGHT this time, Coolduck.