</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> What exactly does he want from you?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">he wants me to tell him why this happened. he wants me to make sense out of it for him.

last night he talked about how much this has impacted him to his very core. how worthless he feels, totally and utterly worthless.

i guess he also wants me to give him time/patience. which means i need to not need anything from him. i need to not need him to work on this at my pace but at his. what does that mean. i'm supposed to ignore the huge elephant between us unless he brings it up first?

he also wants me to get in better shape. i have made NO progress in that area <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Haven't had much experience with IC myself, but if you don't feel your making progress, perhaps you should find another C. You were recently frustrated to distraction and now very depressed, did any of that come up in you session. Perhaps you could show your recent threads to the C if you feel that they are just not getting the whole picture (though I would think a decent C would be able to draw it all out)

I don't recall, are you on A/Ds or anxiety medecine?

when i look at what i just wrote. it should be totally clear as to why he does not believe i have changed at all.

i am NOT doing what he is telling me he needs. instead i am being sad around him all the time and about once a week i get to a point where i HAVE to talk about us and i force it on him

no, not on any meds. i hate to be on meds. i was on them once for a short period of time after my dad had died. incidentally, that was also when i started the A. nice huh?

he says he wants to stay married but honestly i don't really think he WANTS to recover and you are right, it is TOTALLY impacting my ability to recover. but how can i move forward into recovery without him. it seems so wrong. i caused this, its not fair for me to recover if he is not able too, don't ya think???

he was not interested in reading at first. last weekend he said he might, so i went out and bought after the affair (i wanted surviving an affair but bookstore was out, i intend to get that too) now that we have it, he is back to saying he does not want to read now.

have you ever seen the Robin Williams movie, something with the word dreams or heaven? about a couple that lost a child (or maybe it was 2 kids?)

but the point is, at the end, he decided that he would rather stay in hell with her than go back to heaven without her. i don't want to go into recover without him. i don't want to leave him in his hell.

FL -

I think we were posting at the same time. My separation will be till he can get a transfer. He's with the Federal Gov't and that may be awhile. This time is going to be for me - I have been in a limbo, struggling for 14 months. I need a break.

I was never angry at WH or my former friend, OW. It was devastating, but anger never came to me - came to my family though. I had to defend WH to everyone including his Mother & the OW.

My WH said I had a peace about me, he stated that kept him around - listened to everything I said - it just took a long time to sink in. He said I wasn't like most women. His line of work - 90% Dv rate - and the fury some ex-wives have would make your hair curl!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I cried alot, told him I loved him alot and tried to be - I guess the lighthouse. I did a Plan A instinctively, started reading everything - both perspectives. That's how I landed on a site that is not so kind to us BSs.

Your H has to deal in his own way, its almost like you'll have to do a Plan A, coax him from the anger. Anger is understandable, especially only a few months from D-Day. It will get better - that I do know!!

I leave next week and my computer will taken apart in a few hours, probably will be gone for a few weeks - so I wish you all the best, lots of hugs and little baby steps grow into big ones!!!!

BB2

guys, you have been wonderful. your postings have helped me calm down a lot. i'm glad i decided to reach out.

i am actually at work and i had better get something done!!!!

thank you from the bottom of my heart.

i'll check in a bit still, in case any of you write more but then i'll have to get focused on work. i only have 2.5 hrs left and many tests to run.

Are you on ADs? They might help if not. Also, why not take a small break? I mean honestly quite beating yourself up for a couple of days and take a break from the whole R and M talking and just try to have fun with each other. Have you done anything fun together at all? Have you tried going away together alone for a couple of days? It sounds like you are concentrating so much on fixing this that you aren't living life. You can not go through life beating yourself up every single day, trying to come up with answers that you dont have right now and might now have for a while. Will he post here? That would be helpful to him I am sure. There are many of us that can help him with his feelings esp. in recovery. I honestly think you are trying too hard.

I suggest taking a couple of days to digest what has been said between you .

Have some fun together (or apart) just have some fun for a day or two.

and really look deep and see if you are an emotional rollercoaster every time he looks at you. You have to live with yourself now, it isn't going to help you if he can't live with you either. You have to really dig deep and say I have changed and I can look at myself in the mirror today and see a new me. A me that wouldnt do that to my family again. A me that I can live with, it isnt just about him. You have to be able to live with you also. Lay down and shut everything off and just think. Cry if you have to, scream with a pillow over your head, just get it out. Then get up and deal with your emotions and show him how much better you are, how you are a bigger and stronger woman. Not so needy and not so dependent on him. I know you can do this. You came clean that was the hard part. Now you have to wash the pallette clean and keep it that way.

HINY

Off to bed. Will check in on you in the morning. Sleep well! And may god bless you every minute of your life, you are a better person.

BB2, thank you!!!! your words are so very wise. what i was just saying about how i don't want to go to heaven without him.... i think the point is, i have to, i have to coninue to recover and be a light for him to follow. i will keep at it.

and BB, have a very SAFE trip!! all the best to you.

thanks HINY. your words are so full of wisdom too. i think i will print this post out and reread it when necesary. you are right. i have to become stronger. and you are right, if i had the courage to confess, i can be stronger emotionally too.

<small>[ November 07, 2004, 07:51 AM: Message edited by: cipher ]</small>

finally learning -

Yep, you better get some work done. I was just thinking about your situation while making dinner. I am the BS, and I really needed to know why. WH is still with OW, but I have talked to him a lot. He doesn't know himself.

I did get the book "Torn Asunder" which as a chapter on the "message of the affair". You might read it and see if you can figure it out.

I suspect it has to do with your dad dying.

cellophane, your post has sooooo much wisdom in it!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

actually it does, cuz you are right and you are not the first to say it. i need to have more patience.

it was not 2.5 years to come clean. the A was 2.5 yrs in duration <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> it took me from Nov, 03 when i stopped the A until 3/21/04 to confess and it might of taken longer if not for the people here prodding me along.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> CP <------- has no M to save </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, that DOES NOT make me feel better. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> i'm sorry, this stuff really S*CKS!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> BTW, "What Dreams May Come" was the movie, that scene you described was quite heart wrenching.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">yes that is the one and yes it is very heart wrenching but so powerful too. i really liked that movie.


believer, thanks for the post. i will look that book up when i am done with some of these others. i (and H) know it is partially because of impact of my dad illness/death. i think maybe my H wants me to state it was ALL about my dad and then he wants me to, finally, look at that in depth and get whatever needs working out worked out!!! problem is, I DON"T KNOW HOW to do any more than i have done. i did talk with C about this back in 2002 (dad died in 2001). I wrote my dad a note and read it to an empty chair in her office. i don't think H thinks that was worthwhile at all.

I would quote some of the "messages of the A", but I don't have it. WH took it and reads it. But it hasn't helped him have NC - although he does see himself in it.

I guess part of the problem for the BS is if they don't know why the A happened, they cannot be secure that it won't happen again. And we seem to take it so personally, when in reality it often has very little to do with us.

Hang in there. We will figure this out.

A lasted 2.5 years...

recovery will take double ...

5 years...

now before you get all weird about that...

it's like taking a very long walk in one direction...

you just keep going...

and eventually the horizon has changed...

And besides, you have no choice! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Even if you did not attempt marriage recovery ... it would STILL take YOU 5 years to recovery of self..

so be patient

be grateful

be awake

love,

Pep

thanks pep, i'm hearing ya, i'm trying!!!

FL

You listen to PEP now. Quit rushing it. Just slow down. I know you want it to go away, we all do even as BS. It isn't going to just go away.

It takes time, energy, breaks , fun, lots of love, determination, honesty, openess, hurt feelings and all those other things that are part of an A also. You and I both know that you will make it, and PEP is right in both our situations in two years we will be okay with or without SP. Right? I know I will. If I was you, I would look into another IC honestly if you aren't happy or don't feel challenged enough. Also Torn Asunder....I'd loan you mine but H has it, not sure what for as he has never even opened it, but he has it just the same. You can get books already used and cheap at www.half.com. Hope you are better today.

HINY

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FinallyLearning:
<strong> he wants me to tell him why this happened. he wants me to make sense out of it for him.

last night he talked about how much this has impacted him to his very core. how worthless he feels, totally and utterly worthless.

i guess he also wants me to give him time/patience. which means i need to not need anything from him. i need to not need him to work on this at my pace but at his. what does that mean. i'm supposed to ignore the huge elephant between us unless he brings it up first?

he also wants me to get in better shape. i have made NO progress in that area <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well there ya have it!

1. Why did it happen? Does the Harley paradigm explain it? Were there unmet emotional needs? Was your marriage in some ways unfulfilling? What was the scenario that allowed this affair to start and continue? What were you thinking? (and I present that as an honest question, not as an accusatory statement)

2. If he actually came out and told you how he feels worthless, he's giving you a golden key!!! There's an emotional need you should be rushing to meet. Start making him feel like he is worth something. No-one can change the past but we can all work in the present to change the future. Sounds like a major EN for him is admiration. Start showing him how much he means to you. Not just with words, but with actions. You've mentioned being kind of mopey and emotional. That's a good way to make a guy feel worthless. (take it from me) We men like to feel like we make our wives happy. Can the mopey stuff. Act like you really enjoy being with him. That is so important, I can't stress it enough!!!

3. Now is the time for you to be the lighthouse. He needs time and patience? Ok. That's understandable, but do your best to make that time as pleasant and fun and fulfilling and wonderful as you can. As long as you carry and display the pain of this affair and keep demanding he work on it, you are shooting your own self in the foot. Be a lighthouse, but make sure your light is a welcoming one, not a black light of doom. Big elephants are hard to ignore, but they can be worked around.

4. Start getting in shape! Start today! This and a more positive, upbeat demeanor are two things you can start today that he will definitely notice. AND these are two things that will benifit YOU as well!

Enough is enough, FL! You can do this.

Do not lose hope. Becoming a better person is a process, not a destination.

dewt

FL, are you feeling better today????

I just read Dewt's post. It is very insightful, sometimes it is so much easier to see what is happening when it isn't right in front of you.

Has your H tried to learn the dynamics of an A. MB has great ex. of them. He does sound very angry, My C says usually anger is just the outward emotion, try to find out what is really going on, the real emotion.

I'm with Dewt, he needs reassurance and admiration. Act like you love him and that he is the only man for you. Plan a specail evening, plan a weekend. Make him feel special.
I guess Plan A him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I'm taking ST. Jon's Wort. I'm not a med girl either. It is helping me, I think, or maybe it is just a sugar pill, and I'm pretending it is helping me. Who knew being happy was so difficult. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

We are in a bad place FL, we sinned, we hurt the one we loved the most. It doesn't feel good, it doesn't look good to others, but God has forgiven us, we need to learn to forgive ourselves. I'm struggling as well.

Pick yourself up Toots, dust yourself off. You can do this. And when I post, I'm down and out and feeling like the worst person in the world, pick me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />