My W wants to go to CA to say goodbye to the OM in person. She called me at work saying, "I am not asking for your blessing, I just want to know what you think." I told her it is a VERY BAD idea. I told her it is like the alcoholic saying "just one last drink and then I quit". She hung up on me. I called her back and asked how she would feel if the roles were reversed, she said, "I don’t know how I would feel". I say that is CRAP! I feel like she wants me to validate what she KNOWS is WRONG! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

She is being a typical WS. They all want to say goodbye in person. Mine said his "first" goodbye in a motel room. Guess what, after over a year, he is still with OW.

I live in Southern California. Want me to show up at his door?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by believer:
<strong> I live in Southern California. Want me to show up at his door? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think that would be a violation of MB principles, but thanks anyway. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It is not over if she needs to see him to say good by. Tell her flat out ... No Way!! If she goes anyway, your loseing her to the other man.
Rich

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by NorCalRich:
<strong> It is not over if she needs to see him to say good by. Tell her flat out ... No Way!! If she goes anyway, your loseing her to the other man.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well she has not gone to CA, at least not yet. She put me in a loose-loose situation. If I say "ok go", then I condone the SERIOUSLY WRONG behavior. If I say "no way" (which I did) she can be bitter at me for not allowing her closure.

BTW, this is not the first L-L situation she has created, did this in December too. She wanted to go to CA for her sisters Bday. She said either she could go and be happy or not go and be bitter. I was against for three reasons, 1. OM, 2. Money, 3. It was the day after Christmas and I was off work for the week. It seems to me there is always another choice. One can accept that in this case things are not going to happen the way you want.

My wife put me in the same situation. The lies that she would tell to get my permission. She said let me go, I'll prove that you can trust me. That was a lie, I let her go and she proved that I was right in suspecting that it was not over. Bottom line DO NOT LET HER GO. b-day is just another excuse. BTW all this desire to go to ca should be telling you something.
Rich

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by zippyTWM:
<strong> My W wants to go to CA to say goodbye to the OM in person. She called me at work saying, "I am not asking for your blessing, I just want to know what you think." </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Possible response: "I feel very insecure and hurt by the idea. I'm afraid you will decide you love him more or have sex with him. Even if you don't do that I'm afraid I will not be able to trust you. I feel that you love him more than me and care more about his feelings. I feel very unimportant to you."

There really was no reason to state anything other than how you felt about it.

April

Zip, what State or Region are you located.

Just curious if it is similar to my WS own longdistance A.

What if you offered to go with her? How do you think she would react if you told her she could go, but you were coming with her? If she thinks it's a good idea, then maybe she really is going just to say "good bye". If she is hostile and insists on going alone, then you know why she really wants to go...

I don't see this as lose-lose.

If you let her go - you're denying your true feelings on the subject AS WELL as allowing her to go forth in very destructive behavior.

Now - if you tell her to stay, you're right that she will pout and threaten and may even do it anyway - but it will be 100% her choice and all consequences associated with it as well.

DEFINATLY try to find a way to convince her to stay. Going will only resume contact and it won't be over for a LONG time again.

I would have fought my husband all the way - yet deep down I WANTED my H to have solid boundries. It HURT that he let me do whatever. I was exhausted from having to make all the decisions all the time!

Tell her no - but tell her gently and with caring. "Honey, I don't want you to go because I feel that contact won't end there. I feel like if you were really committed to working out our marriage, you would come home and start now."

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hope4future:
<strong>
If you let her go - you're denying your true feelings on the subject AS WELL as allowing her to go forth in very destructive behavior. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He can't "let" her go. He had no control over her behaviour. All he can do is be Radically Honest about how it makes him feel. She makes the decision from there.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hope4future:
<strong>
Now - if you tell her to stay, you're right that she will pout and threaten and may even do it anyway - but it will be 100% her choice and all consequences associated with it as well. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The corrolary being he can't "make" her stay. Once again, all he can do is state how he feels now and he will feel when she gets back (i.e. lack of trust in the future, etc.).

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hope4future:
<strong>

DEFINATLY try to find a way to convince her to stay. Going will only resume contact and it won't be over for a LONG time again. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There's no magic wording that will make her stay with him. All he can do is be radically honest with how he feels about the situation. If he knows this is a firm boundary then he tells her this.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by hope4future:
<strong>
Tell her no - but tell her gently and with caring. "Honey, I don't want you to go because I feel that contact won't end there. I feel like if you were really committed to working out our marriage, you would come home and start now." </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That last sentence sounds like a possible DJ. Basically you're saying that if she were "really committed" she'd do xyz. She may feel committed to the relationship so try to stick to how "you" feel.

April

Listen to RoanWard. She is dead on target if you ask me.

Another thing you might try to do is POJA this. Might be impossible, depending on how volatile your WW is right now.

If POJA is a possibility, you could begin by following RoanWard's ideas of Radical Honesty. Then you could suggest perhaps the two of you could come up with something you're *both* happy with. Ideas could include:

Goodbye via NC letter
Goodbye via phone conversation
Goodbye in person with you there
etc.

I suspect she just wants "one last fling" and there is nothing you can do to *make* her stay. You can only be honest. Re-read RoanWard's two posts on this thread. She is wise.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by zippyTWM:
Well she has not gone to CA, at least not yet. She put me in a loose-loose situation. If I say "ok go", then I condone the SERIOUSLY WRONG behavior. If I say "no way" (which I did) she can be bitter at me for not allowing her closure.

[/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She can't put you in any position without your permission. You are not the bad guy if you protect your interests and refuse to condone her plot; rather she is the bad guy for having an affair.

You are letting her define you with a WARPED set of standards designed to suit her whims rather than reality.

Don't let her manipulate you anymore.

Hi zippy,

My WH has said "good bye" to the homewrecker 3 times now and he is still committing adultery/Infidelity.We all know that saying good bye in person is a very bad idea and is just more contact for the affairees.

I agree with Roanward and other's that suggest that you just be honest and caring but firm in your discussion of how saying good bye in person hurts you and you do not feel it's in the best interest of your marriage,etc,etc.I did that to my WH but it didn't matter.He went anyway. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

All you can do is be the one with as much integrity and dignity and show that to your WW by enacting it.Stand up for yourself and your marriage and do what's right.I know you are hurting,I am very sorry for that.This is such an awful circumstance to be in.

O

<small>[ June 14, 2004, 08:17 AM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

Thank you all. I am taking a stand. As far as I know the idea of going to CA is now moot. However, the topic will come up at the MC.