Starting to sag a bit lately and could use some encouragement or help keeping my eye on the ball. Last week I told W how I know it hurts her that I spend my time on MB just like it hurts me that she calls OM. She responded "I don't call him anymore". Well on Monday she traded calls, then Tuesday (which is pool night) she called him at 11:44PM and didn't get home until 12:40. This signals to me that she leaves the first bar where the team is and goes to a second bar with just him where they may have a nightcap. But because both IC and SH have told me to stop checking her cell I feel like I shouldn't confront. She is cruising happily along cake eating unaware to the pain she is causing. Somewhat unaware because she thinks she is deleting the calls prior to me checking or that I simply stopped checking. I was ready to end my IC sessions but my recent surge of anger tells me to continue. Anger is a new emotion for me. I can no longer dismiss her actions as "foggy" but simply indifference. I am so angry now that I set an appointment up with SH for Friday. I will speak to him alone and may not even mention to W I have the appointment. We are so far apart it astounds me. This morning she asked why it took me so long to get excited and I just bit my tongue the whole time thinking of the midnight phone call. Dying by the inches. She talks about starting another pool team including me (for the first time in 5 years flying solo) and some other married friends. While I might consider it I certainly wouldn't entertain the idea of being in the same league with OM. She also mentioned the possibility of putting my office manager on her team. This is a woman in my office who is married and our age. I will not let this happen even if it becomes an "office" mandate. How sad she could think this way. Anger is definitely the feeling of the day. Not panic just anger.

I do not know how to respond except to sympathize with your plight. I do check cell phone bill behind my husband. It is the only way for me to know if he is contacting her. I feel the same rage and anger you feel. Sometimes I cry, and sometimes I just feel anger, more at OW than at my husband but some at my husband because I want him to be honest. I do confront and would because I feel I have a right to an explaination for his behavior.

WOE -

Just letting you know that I read your post and I am sending you best wishes.

Good idea to continue IC especially if you feel anger and need to express it.

I don't understand </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But because both IC and SH have told me to stop checking her cell I feel like I shouldn't confront. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is this to eliminate your anxiety over her continued contact?

It's amazing how inconsiderate your W is to you.

Keep your eye on the ball while waiting for your SH appointment on Friday!

Take care.

sss

Genia, thank you. It's a double edge sword. You check because you want to know and then you find what you feared, and wish maybe you hadn't checked.

SSS, yes it is a tremendous amount of disrespect. Absolutely in my face. I suppose SH wants me know to check to preserve LB balance and knows it does no good. Almost like a power struggle for W as much as addiction. Not sure on this though. IC considers it a breach of trust and thinks I should ignore it and try to get "connected" with with. He described our communication as "oblique". I had to look that one up, but I think it is a fit. We communicate through signs and sublety rather than full frontal I suppose. Today at physical therapy W was filling out a form and outloud she said Married or Single? I responded "circle both, you have one foot in and one foot out". She laughed and said at least we still have fun together. So that really is her feeling that I just can't accept. She really isn't committed. I sometimes think of doing what Eric did to see if that gets her attention. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> But for now I know that calling SH is the right thing for me as I'm growing weary as I approach the fork in the road (the summer events that are more geared towards the entire family). After the second event it will be impossible for W to pretend we're just peachy. And that was really SH's message to me; to just keep adding one brick at a time to this fantasy. That it will get to be unbearable for her. Seems I'm not the only one who believes in Chinese Water Torture. W, me and SH. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

eggs,

SH and IC's give guidance, not stick to the letter directions. Your W is taking advantage of you...again. I would tell her you know she is talking to the OM.

It might be harder for her to "lie" to you if you let her know you know. Plus it would explain to her why it "takes you so long to get excited."

Hi,

I usually got positive results after confronting. I told husband that I knew what he was doing. I did not tell him how I knew. I just told him I knew very confidently, and that I would like to know if he had an explaination. Of course he did have an explaination but this gave him opportunity to open up without me condemning him.

d_rose, you know I think you're onto something. This is simply enabling and it's doing W a disservice because she thinks she floating along not doing anymore harm. I would never have believed I'd still be here (not MB but in this position) after all this time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Today at physical therapy W was filling out a form and outloud she said Married or Single? I responded "circle both, you have one foot in and one foot out". She laughed and said at least we still have fun together.

"Well, actually, it is breaking my heart and crushing my spirit. This is not fun for me. I will not live this way forever. It hurts too much."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ just a suggestion.

Pep

WOE

A sense of humor is important. That's one thing I lost right after d-day.

This cracked me up:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I responded "circle both... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But your W's response did not!

I believe in Chinese Water Torture.
I believe in Chinese Water Torture.
I believe in Chinese Water Torture.
I believe in Chinese Water Torture.
I believe in Chinese Water Torture.
I believe in Chinese Water Torture.

Add me to the list!

Take care.

sss

WOE -

Well, sounds as if somewhere, somebody took a wrong turn. I was so hoping you were not still in this same place.

In fact, last I read, your WW was going to quit that pool team, or it was going to be split up, or something.

One thing that you said that I want to say something about - your WW asked if you would be interested in being on her pool team, if she got a new one. I say, you jump on that wagon, boy! So what if it is in the same league as OM?

Your face will be there, your arm could be around W's neck when OM looks over at her. You should walk in there, with your head held high, and be your W's H! Be on her pool team. This seems to be a very important area of her life, and she has invited you in - after being solo for 5 years! I see this as a tremendous opportunity for you.

I have had to deal with the same thing with Scouts. OW's S is in FWH's Scout patrol. Scouts is very important to H. Quitting wasn't an option he was too interested in. Fortunately, I think OW is quitting the Troop, for whatever reasons. BUT, even though I didn't want to see her, I go each week. Because I am with H, and she needs to that - see us all together as a family.

That is just my 2 cents. I have had to face it, and luckily OW kind-of ran away, but I was willing to face it and stand my ground. Just making that decision, gave me back so much of the power I had given away - without even realizing I had!

Take care of yourself. You deserve so much happiness. I truly think when/if she comes out of the fog, she will be everything you remember her as. Don't give up hope. Keep keeping on. And I am so glad you have another session with SH. The expert.

SS

Pep, I'm really getting very close to having "this" conversation with her. What d_rose said does make sense. I'll keep you posted.

SSS, yeah someday hopefully I'll be able to look back at the absurdity of this. But right now it hurts too much but I think W is hurting to so maybe a little laughter is our connection.

Spider, interesting. I never looked at it like that. I do need to remain flexible and not get so pig headed about how I'm going to achieve my goal. The important thing is to achieve it. A lot of satisfaction in that, no matter how many compromises I must make. Maybe I will let the team thing go and see where it leads. Could be a winner especially if we're out together 9 nights for every one night that we're in OM's company. That's likely how it would work. Not bad odd's and it would give her an out and still keep her favorite activity. Yes, it's important to her and I'm not interested in taking this away. Just need to get rid of cutie petootie. And yes it's AMAZING I'm still stuck in the same place. But we are approaching a fork in the road for sure.

WOE

not sure what to say but wanted to offer a "push" since you asked. let us know how the appt w/SH goes and may God contiue to bless you, prayers to you, RR

WOE,

Don't know if you remember, but I posted to you a while back and said that I had similarities in my situation with what you are going through.

In your post, you said "I'm really getting very close to having "this" conversation with her".

Well I had "this" conversation with my wife on Sunday and I feel incredibly lucky today. I have been doing preparations with Jennifer, lawyers, etc for 2 months getting ready. I was scared to death going in and mentally/emotionally prepared for the for the worst. Now I am just scared that the happiness of our week will last a lifetime. Not here today to talk about me though.

From reading your posts it sounds like we may have some similarities in the way we think and approach problems. I wanted to suggest that if you haven't already read it, you may want to check out a book called "I Will Never Leave You" by Hugh Prather. I think you might get encouragement there for what you are doing. All situations and all people are different. This can also be read as the solutions that work for most people may not be the best for you. As my SIL told me the other day...you have to follow what your heart tells you. I know that that contradicts what is sometimes advised on this site, but it seems to have worked for me.

I will be back when I have more time.

Dave

<small>[ June 17, 2004, 09:43 AM: Message edited by: burtonzoo ]</small>

WOE, you've been such a great support through my recent dark days. I need to add my 2 cents here. Your W is really pissing me off. Hey, I'm already pissed off enough lately, I don't need to be pissed off at her now too.

I'm really glad you're talking to Steve. I spoke to him Friday and I always feel better. I can't always remember what the heck we talked about, but I do feel better. I'm curious to see what he says to you. In my humble opinion she is taking major advantage of you. It's BULL$$$$! Fog or no fog. I'm into choices. If this is making your LB$ get depleted than you will have to look at her behavior. The one thing I couldn't take was the lies.

Let us know what happens. I wrote you a little note 2 days ago over in Recovery under SD's thread. Hang tough, and remember, you do deserve better than what you're getting! CV

RR, thanks very much for the encouragement. I haven't visited your posts in awhile but I will check in and see how you're doing. You've been so kind to keep up with me.

Spider, I am really giving your suggestion a lot of thought. It may be pride that is keeping me from healing. Maybe I'm becoming my own worst enemy, like a self fulfilling prophesy. Lord I don't want to drive her away. It really might have a wonderful effect to be on a team with her. Something she swore was not possible up until recently. No spouses was her anthem so since she is showing flexibility maybe I need to. I will discuss with SH.

Buttonzoo, I remember you're story very well. It gave me inspiration and your recent success is even more awesome. I would love to hear your continued progress. I know that you told me you would attend business functions just to make OM feel uncomfortable but not confront. Very similar to my style indeed. Anyway I will absolutely get the book and let you know what thoughts. I'm am really glad for you and if things keep moving forward lots of other posters could use this type of recovery story. Congratulations and continued good luck in recovery.

CV55, thought you got tired of hearing my stale replies of press on, press on. But as you can see even I need to get a push from time to time. Anyway I'll respond on your other post and we'll give SD a well deserved rest on his post. He said he'd be back on the 20th so I bet you can look for his posts on the 19th. He can't keep away. Hugs, WOE.

WOE is me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

just a thought i wanted to share after reading this thread and the other one and especially for your thank you to me. i'm not sure what it will mean to you, i'm not even sure if i can say what i'm trying to convey. maybe it's just the fact that we are doing what we can and that even though we still have areas of improvment, we can also know why we are where we are in the first place.

as most people here have done, we have all done some bit of humbling of ourselves and these situations that we are in. i was feeling that i was truly humbled. then this past weekend it occurred to me that maybe i am not humble in thinking i'm humble. does that make sense? i was starting to think in reponse to hearing programs and messages about being humble that i have been humbled in all this and so i was "okay" because i was on my way to being the person God would want me to be. i still feel that i'm on my way but now feel that God was telling me something about the whole humble issue and that i need to watch out for myself.

again, i'm not sure what i'm trying to say. but that this is a long rough road and even though we have set backs, even though we may have surges forward, there is always room for improvment and that if we continue to follow our words w/actions and "recognize" things more quickly then Lord willing, things will pay off in the end w/our marriages. we are all pulling for you WOE, you've covered lots of ground, and hope you will continue to come here for you and to help others, like me. God bless and prayers to you, RR

RR, I'm not sure I completely understand what you are trying to say. But my take is that yes this forces us to look in the mirror and come to terms with the fact that we did contribute to being in this place we're in. That can be humbling. But to wallow in the agony and become a professional victim is not being humble. I do wrestle with that from time to time. I would love to get it all out on the table with W. Let her know that I don't think less of her for this. But I also look in the mirror when I see her. We were both flying way to high in an almost arrogant self assuredness. So this was a wakeup call for both. God does work in mysterious ways. But in the end we have to do whats right for us and us alone. If our S gets on board with the program great but if not we're still doing our best. Someone once told me recently that I can't dictate W's behavior I can only influence it. And I think by walking an especially straight line these days I am influencing her. We will all come out of this for the better and I wish for you what I wish for myself. Stay strong.