About a year ago, I discovered my H was having an A. We went to counseling consistently and truly became closer than we had been in years - on all fronts..communication, sexually,etc.. Recently I noticed a change in his behavior and confronted him w/ the assumptions that he had strayed. He admitted that he had met someone new about a month early and wasn't sure why he strayed (it was another A). He's incredibly insecure w/himself and I'm sure a divorcee w/ nothing to lose sees him as an easy target. Certainly, he's receptive to it.

There is no question that he loves me. He can't tell me enough...but I know he's missing something. Personally, after 15 years...it's self worth. He's self employeed and business has been slow which leaves me as the primary bread winner. I can't help that. He's also acknowledged that he feels like he has nothing if he leaves. Right now he could not survive on his own. I don't want him here cause he's trapped...and he knows that.

Are recurring affairs common in the recovery stages? Interestingly when I asked if it was the same person, there was clearly no emotional attachments to #1A.

He has stopped seeing her for now by his own choice. I've told him I realize I can't make him love me/our family (2 kids). He has to decide he wants to keep our family unit in tack. I've done everything to keep tabs on communication levels, emotional needs ,etc. He's also scheduled time w/our counselor alone at my suggestion.

I'm at a loss and feel like I'm extremely vulnerable at this point. Thoughts are welcome.

NY-ER,

welcome to MB, although i am sorry to see you have the need to be here.

i cannot really answer your question as you can see i am on the opposite side of the fence. I saw your response to my thread. i hear what you are saying and i have said similar things as well. i guess it just got to me more this time. probably because i want to be able to be home with them so bad too.

your topic will be bumped back up to top, hopefully others will come and reply to your specific questions.

however i do want to say, you sound like one strong and loving woman!!!

Thanks for the reply. I pride myself on the ability to be as objective as possibly--though sometimes I want to kick myself in the butt. I listen to my H talk and my instinct is to help him....he's really a good person, just weak (and clearly stupid at times).

Loss of trust is huge!!! The folks on the cheating side have no idea how deep that goes - regardless of whether or not you recognize the driver and/or intent was not malicious.

Again...thinks for kicking my message up...I was getting bummed to think I couldn't even get a discussion forum to help!

Don't worry if your message goes to the bottom of the page. When it is real busy, sometimes that happens. Just post to your own thread. I talk to myself a lot here.

Sounds like your WH's behavior has more to do with his self-esteem than you. If his business is too slow, can he get a job? That might help.

He actually had a company approach him that he's pursuing. The question now will be....if he can stand on his own two feet....will he still want/need me. That's out of my hands which is the vulnerability piece!

He's at a point where he's convinced it's within him. But men tend to think asking for help is weak. I don't know if he's strong enough to stick w/ drilling into why.

Back to my original question...does anyone know if spouses in recovery having an new A is common?

I don't think it is common, person to ask would be Pepperband. Put her name in the subject line and ask her. Or just put need help from veterans, they will come eventually. Believer is right I talk to myself a lot also. Doesn't really matter as long as I get it out I guess.

HINY

Thanks for responding hopeful. I gave it a shot. Just curious...what are your thoughts on my situation?

It's probably more common for the WS to re-initiate contact with the OP, but sometimes an affair is a kind of self-medication. That feeling of "newness" & excitement gives a temporary lift, so the WS may go to a second or third OP, or porn or get into something like alcohol or gambling.

The second OW means that he has underlying issues that he's going to have to work on. So, individual counseling for him is a good idea.

Dr. Harley speaks to the subject that sometimes before marital issues can be effectively resolved, personal problems have to be addressed. Depending on the severity, sometimes marital & individual therapy can co-exist, sometimes the individual (like with alcoholism/addictions, depression) has to come first.

I wouldn't say it's normal or common for a WS to become involved in a second A during recovery from the first, no. It clearly shows some unresolved issues and an inability or unwillingness to recognize and/or address those issues in a productive manner.

Regarding the new job prospect, that is excellent news! While it's possible your H might not "need" you when he has a better income, it's also possible that his self esteem will improve and he'll feel less need to have his worth validated by other external sources. There's no way to predict whether he'll get the job nor how it will affect his behavior, and there's nothing you can do to control it, so no point in expending energy in that direction.

What you CAN do is explore with your H why he strayed. What did he think he was getting from the As that made them so attractive? An excellent way to get at this would be to read Harley's "Surviving an Affair" - it's available at many bookstores, you can order it here (click Bookstore link just beneath the Marriage Builders logo at the top of the page) or you can order it thru amazon.com. If your H will read it with you, that's great. If he won't, read it on your own.

For now you can read up on Love Busters and eliminate them from your behavioral repertoire.

<small>[ June 18, 2004, 10:19 AM: Message edited by: turtlehead ]</small>

Thanks to those posting...it just re-affirms my belief that there is a deeper self worth/self esteem issue as the primary driver.

It's hard to explain, we have a really good relationship/bond on so many levels...but it's certainly not enough for him.

Trust/lies are a huge issue for me....yet I still come back to wanting to make him (not to sound melodramatic)-complete. He's grasping at happiness but hasn't been able to look inside to see what's driving it.

I also think the "prize" of attracting someone young and prettier than me helps him feel better about himself. I'm convinced divorced women hunt these targets out!

Anything can heppen in recovery to set it back. That is one of the reasons why it takes longer to recovery than the length of the A.

A w/ new OP? Can happen, but it usually is not as often.

A w/former OP? More likely. Some sort of crazy need to find out if the OP still considers the WS desireable. If the OP is not available and the WS seeks validation in anyone except the BS, then a new OP may be in he making.

Many factors both logical and illogical come into play. It is not a fixed science and predicting is next to impossible. What is predicatable is the Bs and family's pain. Another d/d can be more painful than the 1st. Recovery from that 2nd or 3rd d/d gets quicker for the BS and family.

Eventually the WS starts to lose his family. OP starts to not look as inviting and doesn't meet all the needs of the WS. Both the OP and WS want the BS to pick up the slack so they can continue in their game.

The sooner a BS learns NOT to be a pawn (execute plan B), the sooner reality hits the WS. This makes recovery easier to obtain.

NOTE: There are 2 different types of recovery.
1. Personal
2. Marital

Hope this helps.
L.

You've all been very helpful. It's such a rollercoaster of high/lows.

I've worked very hard to get him to talk...which he does, but still think he's guarded cause he views as weak.

Bump

NY ER, my W had a "failed" affair attempt the first time with my best friend. He had some "fun" with her one night than ran for cover. While I was busy picking myself off the floor she was already planting the seeds for the second A. Also a ONS where the guy had some fun but basically made it clear he isn't interested. She continues in an EA with this guy though it is clearly one sided EA. So it seems like it may have some similarities to your H. My W was getting kicked from all directions by friends and family prior to the A's. So I feel the self esteem thing was the motivation. She clearly needed a fix in the self worth department. It has been a long slow battle for me but I think you see the good in your H as I see the good in my W. That makes it worth the effort. As a former compulsive gambler I can sympathize with the addiction side of this. Hang in there.

The tough part of this is that I feel as though I'm tip toeing around not to further impact his self esteem. And as genuine as I focus on that, I can't help but feel my self worth dropping by the minute.

He went to individual counseling this week and felt much better....until we talked. He reluctanctly told me his view of how he sees our situation. I was careful to try to keep a perspective that "that's how he feels"....he doesn't like that I disagee with how he interprets stuff. Shouldn't it be ok to disagree? It doesn't bother me!

The tough part of this is that I feel as though I'm tip toeing around not to further impact his self esteem. And as genuine as I focus on that, I can't help but feel my self worth dropping by the minute.

He went to individual counseling this week and felt much better....until we talked. He reluctanctly told me his view of how he sees our situation. I was careful to try to keep a perspective that "that's how he feels"....he doesn't like that I disagee with how he interprets stuff. Shouldn't it be ok to disagree? It doesn't bother me!

The tough part of this is that I feel as though I'm tip toeing around not to further impact his self esteem. And as genuine as I focus on that, I can't help but feel my self worth dropping by the minute.

He went to individual counseling this week and felt much better....until we talked. He reluctanctly told me his view of how he sees our situation. I was careful to try to keep a perspective that "that's how he feels"....he doesn't like that I disagee with how he interprets stuff. Shouldn't it be ok to disagree? It doesn't bother me!

Comforting to hear others in a similar situation. Thanks "walkingoneggs". I've actually used that phrase repeatedly. I'm so focused on further damaging my H self esteem...that sometimes I wonder is anyone watching whats happened to my self worth in the process?

I'm away on business tonight and we had a long talk about his. Still, I know it hurts him everytime he feels like he's being challenged.

FYI....I'm 44 (W) he's 39 (H) ...we've talked about whether or not age is a factor.

He said tonight - he's trying to find him again. I asked him to think about a time that he was truly happy with his life and who he was. I'm convinced it has to do w/how he measures "success".

To answer the original question: yes it is common. Please read the "Double Life Man" Chapter in "The State of Affairs" by Mulliken.