My H has agreed to the visitation schedule and wants joint custody. In order to have the visitation in place we have to file before the baby is born. I want him to file. He seems apprehensive about filing as we were going to wait until after the baby was born. I changed my mind based on visitation. I have to know the schedule for my sanity. I don't want to worry about that with caring for a newborn.
My question is why is he apprehensive? He has stated many times that we are done. He doesn't love me. We didn't work out. He just wants to see his son.
I don't know if he is just a coward and feels bad about what he is putting me through or if he has any doubt about his choices?? Please Help.

He may be unsure now, who knows? You can't make him file, maybe you will have to file. If you nurse the baby, I don't see how he can have joint custody.

With joint custody, can the visitation schedule be changed from week to week by mutual agreement? Wouldn't joint custody mean that H would have unlimited privilegs to phone and E-mail and visit you? Wouldn't H start working to persuade you to change visitation times each week to optimize his time with OW? Isn't joint custody for when the couple can agree on everything about the child? What does your attorney say about vistation and joint custody? Do you plan to nurse your baby in front of H? Is OW going to accompany H on his visits?

Are you reluctant to file Divorce Papers? As long as no divorce papers are filed, can't H just do whatever he wants to? H never wanted to move out in the first place, did he? Didn't he just want to eat cake, full contact with OW and live with you?

Blessings

<small>[ June 18, 2004, 07:44 PM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>

Joint custody? yikes! So who's going to take care of the infant while he works? Are you okay with the other woman doing that?

Dear Durham,

You have not answered anumber of questions that have been raised about your plans for a Plan B during your son's birth. Is it possible that Plan B will be difficult to maintain during the birth process?

My wife had my son and my daughter by natural birthing, with no epidural, with me as the breathing coach. Even though everything went fairly normally, it was a fast moving, exciting time. I had seen movies and videos of child birth, but the expereience of being in the delivery room with the birth of my son and 3 years later my daughter, was full of surpises and high emotions.

If you want to achieve a maximum bonding between your son and his father, I don't see how Plan B is going to work, during tha time.

The first thing you want to prepare yourself for is the decision on a cesarian. If there are any complications, it is important not to delay a cesarian, as seconds can mean increased brain damage for your son.

Doctors are going to be giving you information, and during Labor, it would be nice to have a partner to try to be sure what the Doctors are saying,and what decisions you have to make.

Can you return to plan A until your son is born? It seems you have no indication that H is planning to take your son out of state. So legal action at this time for custody is therefor of no consequence. It seems you have demonstrated an ability to carry out a Plan B, and after your son is a couple weeks old, you can decide about switching back to Plan B.

You can still raise objections about OW in Plan A. You can practice some polite confrontations. Cloud calls it Loving Confrontation.

Maybe other posters can let you know how to work a Plan B during Delivery, and still maximize bonding, and handle all the other emotional issues that will be arising.

Congratulations on doing a Plan B so far, to where you are now. I really believe you have made a statement to H. I see no reason for you not to feel fully confident of your ability to re-start Plan B after you get settled with your son.

Blessings

<small>[ June 19, 2004, 12:19 AM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>

durham,

First of all (((hugs!))) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Anyway, I see some contradictory stuff in your posts.

You say you don't know if you want WS back or if you can forgive him, however, you seem to want to see him have guilt and maybe drive ow crazy with future events.

What do you want durham? I have followed your posts. It seems that you didn't do much of a plan A, which is understandable considering your condition, before you went to plan B. Please correct me if I am wrong about this.

Do you know what EN's you were not fulfilling prior to the A? Did you ever try to fulfill those EN's before you went to plan B?

I don't know what to tell you. It seems to me that your miscarriage first time around scared your WS. I could be wrong, but I think this may be one of the problems.

MVHO is that joint custody is not an option. How will WS care for the baby when he is not there? When he is working and has your child? You have stated that ow gave up custody of her own child to start a new life with WS. Do you really think you want her around your child when she doesn't even want her own? Just trying to be objective.

I know you have heard a lot from everyone. I really think that if you have the thought that your marriage might be saved, that you would please contact the Harley's and get an opinion from them, him, whatever, on what to do. Does your IC have an opinion? Does your IC follow any marriage builders rules?

I think you could get custody based on WS behavior. He has hurt you enough and wants to take your child too. Not a good idea. You need to bond with the baby. I don't know what else to tell you.

All I know is, if you don't know what EN's you weren't meeting of WS's, how can you do this? Also, it seems sooo typical that WS didn't love you anymore (so he says) after he met ow.

Do you think you are stable enough to go to Plan A before the birth? I worry about that, as I know from first hand experience that too much stress can lead to premature birth. My third child was 5 weeks premature due to stress. No need to go into that. My water broke 6 weeks early.

I know you love your baby. I think your visitation schedule is fine for now. You need to protect yourself and baby first right now. Joint custody can be settled at another time. I wouldn't trust WS or ow as far as I could throw them right now. You are doing okay. It is great that you aare trying to protect your baby. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> But is WS? I would say no to that since he has put you thru this at this time. BAD.

My vote is don't do joint custody. Do what is best for you and baby.

Hope you might answer my questions. You are doing great, you are WORTHY. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> This A is not about you, this is about WS.

Love in Christ,
Miss M

I would say that Plan B is no longer an option as I have to have some contact with him. I did a good plan A for a month after I knew and he chose OW and moved out. I am not sure what EN I was not meeting. He has just told me he didn't have feelings for me anymore after my miscarriage. I know that he was terrified afterward and didn't want to start trying for another baby because of fear. He never told me this and hence we continued to try and got pregnant. He confided his extreme upset and feelings about the miscarriage to OW. Now he loves her and not me.
I am only talking with him about our son and upcoming visitation. Everytime I have talked to him he states he is sorry and didn't want his life to go this way he just doesn't love me anymore. I told him to stop saying it and he has agreed to talk only about black and white issues.I asked him how he thought it would be after the baby is born and he stated it is going to be the hardest thing he has ever had to do because he won't get to be with his son.
How do I work plan A? He wants to help with things around the house and baby things. My IC stated if I need his help to just take it. I shouldn't try to punish him or worry about that. I should worry about getting what I need done. What do you think???

Does H want to be in the waiting room during delivery? Has H taken enough classes to be in the delivery room with you?

If you evaluate things from the standpoint of your son, then, at this stage it would probably be best to have the highest level of cooperation from H during the Labor and delivery period.

Congratualtions for telling H that you don't want to hear about how he does not love you anymore. There is a committed, Biblical, long term mature love, then there is puppy love which is based on the infatuation of the moment.

It may be unkind to be pleasant to H for the period of the delivery, knowing that you are probably going to be shutting off communication once you are recovered from the delivery. But that unkindness is not your responsibility, as H created the affair.

When do you plan to go back to work? How do you plan to handle daycare for your 3 or 4 month old son?

Blessings

<small>[ June 19, 2004, 04:31 PM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>

Whaler, You might want to go back and read Durham's other thread about H during delivery, etc. -- and about the breaks other WHs took from the delivery room to telephone/meet with the OWs. These instances greatly added to the stress of mother and baby, who need to be considered first.

It's not a party, after all, but a traumatic (and marvelous) physical event for mother and baby. The baby is not housed in a tupperware container, but in a woman, who in this case is a betrayed wife. In my opinion, if he wants to participate fully -- he should dump the mistress.

It's not at all clear that the WH is any help in this process. It's not clear at all what WH's role in the baby's future could be.

This was all discussed in the other thread, and we recommended Durham call the Harley's to discuss.

durham - Don't have WH in the delivery room with you. He has lost that right. When you have a baby, it should be a wonderful experience. I can't imagine having a WH who "loves" someone else with me. Yuck. Makes me want to puke.

My best friend is going to take prenatal classes with me and will help with delivery along with my mother. The only time WH may be able to be in the room is at the end if all is going well and who even knows if I will remember to have him in then. I have nine weeks to think about it but mostly I think I will see how I feel when the time comes.
Any advice on how to plan A considering everything. I don't want him to help with baby things like putting things together because that is cake eating but I don't know if it will make him realize what he is going to miss. I think he is struggling with that right now. He knows he will be missing a lot.

durham - Wow. Only 9 weeks left. Have your friend there and mom, but forget WH. You can have him waiting in the waiting room to see baby. But that is it.

I would stay in Plan B if I were you.

A reminder, Durham: You are in Plan B. Plan B is not about manipulating the WS so that they will feel a certain way. It's not about making them feel guilty, or whatever. It's about protecting yourself. It's about cutting the cord (figuratively speaking). If the silence makes him come back -- great. But if not, it gives you a head start on the rest of your life.

Hard, I know. But think of yourself and the baby first. If he wants a piece of the action, he knows what he has to do. The longer he waits, the more he loses the option. Let your lawyer deal with all this. Stay dark.

For my money, I wouldn't even want him in the waiting room.

Having delivered my daughter just 6 weeks ago, my WH had already moved out by that time. He was there in labor and delivery, but I tell you, it was mighty uncomfortable for both of us. We had agreed he was going to stay with me the entire time, but he didn't. DON'T EXPECT TOO MUCH. That's what I can tell you now looking back. Having a baby doesn't mean as much to him in the fog as you, so make sure you get yourself some support. Try to arrange for family/friends to stay overnight with you, that helped me immensely. My WH split even before the baby was weighed (what a f*** pr***). He barely visited, it was so depressing and disappointing. He is slowly waking up now, but progress is painfully slow.

I would ask your doctor or midwife to put you on some antidepressants NOW. I had trouble finding the right meds, and had panic attacks after delivery that were very scary! You are a huge risk for postpartum depression. I didn't eat either, so get some protein drinks and blend with fruit. Please rest and take good care of yourself, OK?

I hate to keep beating this horse, but Durham has done very well in Plan B. It has restored her peace of mind, to some degree. If she stays in it, she may not need ADs -- which are probably not a good thing for a pregnant/nursing mother. She needs calm, and WH won't give it.

Durham -

I went through what you are going through when I was pregnant. I let my x take me to the hospital and help with delivery. It was tough on me that he was there (he even started flirting with one of the nurses) The doctor asked me if I wanted him to leave but I said no. And now I am glad I didn't because he was first to hold and bathe baby girl, and he fell in love with her at that moment. Him and I were able to put our issues aside for the most part after that. He had a newfound respect for me seeing what I went through during the birthing. In a wierd way we bonded again, but in a different way.

We now have joint custody (four months with each parent and every other weekend ). This didn't happen until last year. Prior to that I had full custody and he liberal visitation.

We drew up our own visitation and the judge approved it. When she was a baby, she needed to be with me and he respected that, because he loved the her so much.

If you breast feed he cannot get joint custody until baby is weaned. You can breastfeed until you are comfortable enough to let him take baby overnight and on weekends.

It's very important that your baby have both parents and that you have a good workable relationship with babies dad. For all your sakes, but especially for baby.

One word of advise that my parents gave me...NEVER badmouth babies father. This is babies father and you must respect that. It will only hurt baby if you do. (not saying that you would, but I had a hard time with this at first)

Weaver,

What are your feelings about sole custody. I am really torn about it. I know my H will fight it. He has been very cooperative about everything and states the ball is in my court. He knows he is in the wrong. I think we could agree on everything but am scared how another person (OW) may influence his decision making. He is still currently with the OW whom just got divorced and sees her own five year old son every other weekend. Her H has primary custody.
I know going for sole will be a fight and cause a great deal of problems with H. If I didn't have to deal with him and visitation I think it would be easier to seek sole. Any thoughts??
BTW is your H still with OW?

Durham,

I'm not sure what you mean by sole custody. He takes baby every other weekend?

I think that now is not the time to decide this. You have no idea how your husband will change when baby arrives. In my sitch, my x changed dramatically. He became more responsible and he became more caring about me. I wanted very much for my baby to have a dad, but I didn't want my baby around his girlfriends. (we talked in length about this, but after the baby came) We both agreed to keep our baby away from people we were dating.

Is your H living with OW. You can bet that she will try to influence him. But things will change after the baby comes for him. Let him bond with baby and be responsible for baby as much as possible, so that his decisions will be based on what is best for baby.

I think you should breastfeed so you have sole custody at first. You will be protected and you won't have to worry about OW being with your baby.
Don't tell him that is why you are breastfeeding.

I was told by my atty that this was the only way to assure that I would get sole custody at first. It is very important that you have control over your newborn baby and who is around him. For your own sanity and for baby.

You will have the time during breastfeeding (my girlfriend dragged it out for two years) to see what kind of man your husband becomes and how you want custody arranged.

I did not agree on joint custody for 8 years, and then I was happy with it, because my daughter wanted it and her Dad is so close to her. He wanted to avoid court so didn't push it until I was ready.

He is married now and I like his wife. If it had been with OW, I would have had a very hard time accepting her around my daughter.

Are you going to breastfeed? Can you?

Durham,

I forgot to add that I was not married to my daughters Dad, we were living together until right after I got pregnant. He played in a band and thought it would cramp his style I guess so he started seeing someone else then moved out.

Because we weren't married, I legally would have full custody at birth, but his mother was threatening to sue me for custody and it became a huge dramatic mess. I then went to see an atty to see how I could prevent them from anything other than visitation. Hence the breastfeeding.

My heart aches for you, but when baby comes your world is going to be a very happy one. Please hang in there and do what ever is best for you and baby.

Durham,

I have been dealing with custody issues for many years now. With my own daughter and my WH's children. I think I may be able to help you a bit. A couple of questions though if you dont mind:

1. What state do you live in? I know you have been to an attorney but with all due respect I am not sure I understand everything he has told you.

2. I believe some of the terms being used here are not being used correcting by definition. I guess I am asking you if these terms have been adequately explained to you by the attorney.

I believe you need to fully understand these terms as defined by law to comfortably be able to make a decision.

Like I have said I have been dealing with these types of issues for about 8 years and would be more than willing to try to help and share some of my experiences if you would like. I can either post here or if you would like to e-mail me that would also be fine. E-mail address is Lisaboo97@aol.com.


Also Durham Hugz and prayers to you.


Lisa