Well everyone, I am still going through the same thing I have been going through for 16 months. I have been in Plan B (mostly) since September.

WH and I have been through the NC with OW again and again. He is still with her. The last contact I had with him was when he brought roses to my home, which I took over to OW's house (along with his letter), which he then returned to me. So that was 15 days ago.

Today my sister-in-law called me and said her brother (my WH) wants to get together with her and me to discuss reconciliation. I told sis that WH needs to have NC with OW, that is my bottom line. She agrees.

So what do you all think? Should I meet with them? To me, it is so easy, just have NC with OW, and agree to a plan for rebuilding. And I am really tired of this. I am worn out.

I think meeting with a third party, especially someone from his "camp," would be in your favor.

She can hear what he has to say, if it is still BS, and the M cannot survive, she can take that info back to the family.

If he makes promises, perhaps she can be another level of accountability for him.

I agree with NC and rebuilding plan not being Rocket Surgery - to quote 2oak. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Geez. Your H better start Crackin' soon!

I know you will make a good decision. You rock.

SS

[edited to add, Believer, would you check out my latest thread in Recovery, please? I value your input. If nothing else, just a quick few words of wisdom. Thank you!]

<small>[ June 23, 2004, 05:07 PM: Message edited by: Spider Slayer ]</small>

Promises of no contact have not had results. What you need are conditions for no contact.

What are the "extraordinary precautions" which he believes will guarantee no contact with OW?

If he wants to talk and it willing to put actions behind his words, that's great.

spiderslayer - I will keep on keeping on. I don't know what the point would be talking to his sister. He knows he needs to have NC. I guess I can do it if I have to, but I am tired of the whole thing.

Cherished - He has never had NC with OW ( for 16 months). I am tired of his lies. This is not rocket science. This is the same old same old. I am tired, beat up and done with the whole scene.

Ask SIL that she encourage him to bring a written plan for NC and what he is willing to do to work on the M. You should have your ideas too, but let him take the lead. I think this is very good!

believer, its really so easy but he continues to look for ways to get around NC. Isn't that the only thing standing between you both? So what is the point then of bringing in his sister? Surely he doesn't think you are going to waver on that boundary?

Please stick to your guns. This is a PERFECT opportunity for him to end contact and I would use the extra influence of your SIL to encourage him to end contact. Tell her that you would love to meet with him to discuss reconcilation. As soon as he demonstrably ends contact. Don't back down, girl. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Melody -

Thanks for the input. If it wasn't for you, WH would be living here, still seeing OW. I am just tired of the whole thing. He knows what he needs to do, but does not want to do it.

I am just to the point that I don't want him anymore. I am done. I will talk to his sis and tell her AGAIN (for the 20th time) that he needs to get rid of OW. But I guess at this point, I really don't care.

I feel like I deserve someone that wants to be with me, and someone who is not so messed up, or no one at all.

Beleiver, I give you GREAT credit for holding your ground on this. My gosh, what a nightmare that would be to live with him while he carried on the affair. At least this way, you have SOME leverage. He just never gives up, does he?

And yes, you do very much deserve better. Hopefully, some day it can be with him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ June 23, 2004, 06:32 PM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

Here is my ugly two cents!

I say go for it!
first off, bring a contract.. a written contract.. there will be verbal conversation.. mediation stuff.. conditions.. and if he agrees,
Then you pull our a tape recorder, and make him repeat after you.. "I (name) WH of Beleiver, recognized that I had an affair and was continuing to have an affair, from this day on (date including month and year), I (name) shall have no contact with (name of OW). I will respect my wife(beleiver)and in respect I shall keep my wedding vows and the promise not to see (name of OW) again.
I will also go to counseling and try my best to have a better marriage with my dearest wife (beleiver).

lol I am dead serious girl.. and he needs to sign it. Then your sister in law will sign it as a witness. If he doesn't sign it...then well.. you know the rest. This man is so confused.. see him and the OW isn't stable.. they are messed up... why would he keep crawling back all the time? And Beleiver, make this the last time you take him back...

BIG kiss!

believer, i've been following your posts for some time, and i must say you've become one heck of a strong woman!

i like the idea of a tape recorder. but i'd take it a step farther. when you get there, pull out that recorder. then tell him that you plan to tape the conversation so there can be no misunderstanding of the terms. THEN tell him that you also think a copy of the tape should be sent to the ow along with the no contact letter. that should be a pretty good gauge of where he stands.

if he's lying to her about how he's leaving you, maybe the thought that she'll hear him begging you to let him come back will keep him from making any promises now that he won't be keeping. it may force him to either jump in or get out...

Believer, I actually envy you that your WH said he wants to reconcile, even it is not a real one. I am very heart broken today. Wh said again infront of the Dr. that there is no chance for that, he made up his mind.

But I will say ignore him. Be a strong Believer.

Believer, I don't have anything worthwhile to add here. Just want to tell you how you've helped me over these horrible months. You've kept the faith in spite of your very, very foggy H. My wish for you is that YOU do get what you so richly deserve. If your H can't finally step up to the plate I hope you get the clarity you need to move on. Only you know how much you can tolerate. If your H does really want to reconcile and do NC, I would make him jump through whatever hoop you feel he needs to jump through. That's my 2 cents. Wishing you the best! CV

Hi Believer. You were there the very first day I posted on these boards, and I truly respect your words of wisdom and support to so many here. I am sending my prayers to you that you get what you truly deserve...happiness and peace.

I'm so sorry that your WH has disappointed you so many times. Maybe he will come to his senses and realize what an awesome woman we all know you are. We believe in you.

Believer,

I think everyone has already said what I'd say, and more too. Those tape recorder ideas were creative and good.

Your WH and mine sound somewhat similar sometimes. They neither one seem to want to lose us, they aren't threatening D, and they keep making promises and saying they're "working on it" or whatever, but neither seems strong enough or willing to give up that darned OW!

And I now feel like you have for some time--that I'm not sure I want him back anymore. But I do still care about him and I know you love your WH, too.

Not sure what the advice is except to follow all the BE CAREFUL advice you've been given. It's so easy to want to believe them when they start acting nice and saying the things we've wanted to hear, but remember they're still seeing their OW and they're still in a fog. I will believe nothing until and unless I see actions to back it up.

But you are the true believer, and I think you have so much going for you. You are open and honest and optimistic and caring and your OW would be nuts to not see that. I'm sure he does see it.

Just keep being you. Keep trusting God. He will bless you.

LL

Believer,

I'm not in a position to give you any worthwhile advice. Treading water here, and barely keeping my head above the surface.

You've helped me tremendously, with your offers of advice and encouragement. The only thing I have to offer you are my prayers. I will be thinking of you today.

As far as the meeting goes, I think maybe a condition of NC with OP should be adhered too. I know we are in different places, but in my own situation each time WW speaks I end up hurting. I hope something else will happen when she opens her mouth - but it always hurts.

God Bless you.

I speak from a VERY prejudiced point of view here... so take that into consideration:

I learned THIS about myself after D-day.... I cannot have green lime jello for a spouse. I began to know myself better after D day. I learned this ---> MY NEED ---> respect FOR my spouse

That is my bottom line.

My H strayed into an affair ~because~ of his weakness.

If my H came back to the marriage ~because~ of his ~weakness~ I'd have another big problem!

Married to a man I do not respect .... not me.... I know myself.... NOT going to work.

Just my recovery memories.

I had made a list of things I absolutely required ... not "topics " like NC, etc.... those are good to have ...

But I also made a list of qualities I HAD to see .... and that canot be "promised" but needed to be demonstrated.

One can say "Yes, NC, for sure" ..... and until that is ~demonstrated~ as a ~desire~ BY the WS -----> taking him back is risky business.... in my opinion.

Again, I am prejudiced by my own point of view here.

If ya don't ~respect him~ .... question your motives for taking him back.

Pep

Not againnnnn... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I dont need to advice you...there is already so many given here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Thanks for all of the advice. Well sister in law was supposed to call me last night with the details. Did not hear from her. So I guess WH was too busy (though he is retired now) to get back to her.

I am not sure what I will do next. WH has made it obvious by his actions where he stands.

On the other hand, he used to be a good man. He raised his kids by himself. He has always put others before himself.

But the bad thing is (like pep says) I have lost all of my respect for him. And that is one of my biggest EN's. I need to respect my man. But that is gone now.

And, I am running out of energy, time, etc.

Believer...put a deadline then stick to it.

This way you do not need to have the feeling that you are waiting forever.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

zizzy - I think I will just stay in Plan B. Sooner or later, he will become the man I used to know, or I will just be recovered on my own.