Well here is a update on my whole ordeal. I called my WS friend that he was suppose to be helping move. I left a message on his answering machine. Seems that he got the machine and called WS mom and left a message saying where are you ... Your wife is looking for you. So I knew then he was with her.

I left the house. I packed my kids clothes and my stuff we were headed for the beach. I stopped by his sisters house because she is going through a similar situation and she helped me so much just by listening and giving good advice. I was 2 hours into my driving trip when WS finally calls my cellphone it was 630pm. He first acted like nothing was wrong.

Then I said I know everything. I know I probably shouldn't have but I called the OW's cellphone twice and left messages. I told her I was going to contact the dean of her college and parents if she continued what she was doing. I am sure this helped nothing but it made me feel so much stronger and more in control. Of course now I feel silly and think I just reacted to fast.

I asked him to be honest with me and told him I was so hurt. He said he met her because there was some things he had to tell her in person. I said then why did you lie and he said that I wouldn't have understood. He said he told her they had to end contact and that he wanted to see if our marriage can work. He said he owed it to himself to try. I have been telling him if he just gets her out of the picture eventually he will see she was alot of the problem.

I still don't agree with what he did. He still says he did not have sex with her. Feels he could not do that to her and just leave out of her life. But I know he did stay at her dorm and probably sleep in her bed. I am sure they kissed and he held her in bed. That is what kills me. If he wanted to say goodbye he could have met her for dinner or something. He did not have to stay with her and spend the whole weekend.

I told him I was leaving and left my rings behind. He sounded sad. He said I wanted to give it a try like you said. I said well that means you cannot have contact with her at all even if she emails with a problem. I said that involves us working together on the problems in our marriage to make things better. I said I cannot be a doormat any longer. I want respect and I deserve respect. He said yes you do.

He won't be here till around 1am. I really don't know how I will react. I am not going to be angry anymore. I do want to work it out if he is finally ready to. I just don't know how I can forgive him doing this a second time especially since he swore to me he wasn't meeting her. And he always promised his mom and sisters he wasn't. He didn't even care enough to call all weekend.

This time it will not be so easy to forgive. This time I need to see him trying to change or I cannot stay. I cannot go through another weekend like this especially pregnant.

What he is fighting now is the fact that all the times he met her and even this weekend he does not feel remorse or guilt. He feels that since that is the case that he doesn't love me. Is it normal not to feel guilt if you know you are doing something wrong? I told him with everything he is saying is wrong with our marriage he is trying to justify himself and make it seem ok and if it feels good to be with her maybe the guilt does not come right away. I am not sure since I haven't been in his shoes. I did tell him with no contact and working on our marriage that one day he will realize what he has done to me and will feel pain and remorse.

I am sitting her really hoping this is a small step towards recovery. He has never said goodbye to her or told me he was ending contact so I hope he really means it. Thanks for the prayers and support this weekend it helped me so much.

<small>[ June 27, 2004, 10:31 PM: Message edited by: SadMarylandLady ]</small>

He is behaving like they all do. None of them feel guilty - they somehow rationalize it in their mind. He needs to have NC with her, or you will not be in recovery.

Ask him to send a NC letter.

I'm not familiar with your situation but does your H work at her college? I had a similar thing happen with my H except that the OW was actually not a woman at all. From what I've heard she is 15 going on 16 and a student of his. I've met her before and she knew who I was so she knew he was married all along. As far as I know there was no sex. It was just kissing and emotional attachment. He now refers to her as the girl who has a crush on him.

After I found out and when he told me that we were going to try to work things out I told him that she could no longer be in the picture. It upset him that I told him that she could no longer even be a student but he agreed.

About 2 weeks later I found out that she started going back to his classes. He never mentioned this to me. At the time he had already told me that I should move out of the house. I walked in on her showing up to her class over an hour early when he didn't have a class going on and I found them talking in the hallway. He told me in front of her that he told me that she would still be coming which was a complete lie that I'm sure he only said because she was there. After she left he told me that she had called him and asked if she could continue her classes because her parents were asking why she had stopped because she seemed to be enjoying them so much (I'm sure she was). I could see why he didn't want to make her upset because he could lose his job even if there was no sex going on. Still, he said he had no idea she was going to show up early.

About a week later after I moved to Texas I finally couldn't help myself from checking his phone records and found that he was talking to her every day and night and talking for long periods of time. I was so upset that I threatened both him and her that if they ever were in contact again I would notify his bosses and her parents about the inapproriate relationship they were having. That only made things worse.

He says that was a LB but in other words and that he had already come to the conclusion that the contact he was having with her was not appropriate so he now says he's told her that there will be no contact outside of class and that she would be treated like any other student and she could only attend the classes she signed up for and come only during the time those classes were in session. I've heard this all before. I can't say I trust him at all right now but I'm not bringing that up to him because it wouldn't do anything but harm the chance of him ever wanting to try things with me.

I feel for you in this situation. When I walked in and saw them talking in the hallway I just wanted to grab a metal object and pound her with it. Of course I would never do that. Besides I know our problems stem from much more than that and that she was just the thing that brought things out in the open that there were problems. Still it makes it hard when he still is able to see her and doesn't even want me to be in the same state as he's in.

This probably didn't help much. It turned more into a post of my own problems. Just know that I've felt the same way as you about telling his bosses and her parents but threatening does nothing mut make things worse. I know it's horrible when you feel like you really have something on him that you feel you can use against him but you really have to try not to because it is a big LB. My case, since the girl is so young makes it even harder because I don't want to sit back and let him do something that could get him put in jail but he says they have NC outside of class now. Of course he's changed all of his passwords so I can't check if that's true or not and I'm not going to ask about it because it will only push him farther away.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> What he is fighting now is the fact that all the times he met her and even this weekend he does not feel remorse or guilt. He feels that since that is the case that he doesn't love me. Is it normal not to feel guilt if you know you are doing something wrong? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Oh, my Sad Maryland Lady! I fear your WH is deep in the fog, in the throes of his addiction to the OW. Please, do not contact OW again. It is useless. She now knows, and she will continue to choose her behavior.

Honestly, I do not think it is possible that they have not had PA. When the EA gets to a certain stage, the PA is inevitable when contact is made, IMHO. I am not trying to hurt you. I am trying to prepare you. I so desperately wanted to believe my FWH when he told me he was not sleeping with my supposed "best friend." Part of me didn't, but it is my nature to believe someone I think has honor and morals and beliefs.

But, alas, WS are not who you remember them to be. They change. Completely, drastically, and very quickly. I am concerned because of the things he is saying to you. My H thought he couldn't love me, if he was capable of cheating on me - since he wasn't the "type" of person to do that, he convinced himself that it was "true love" between him and OW. More like true lust, but . . .

The entire A is a head trip the WS must pull on themselves to justify the unjustifiable - their actions! By the time my H had moved from "I'm not sure who I love" to "I love her and not you," they had started the PA.

This is such a pattern, a cycle. It is so well documented on this site, the books by Dr. Harley. "Torn Asunder," "NOT Just Friends," "After the Affair," just to name a few.

Also, take some deep breaths, and try not to predict how you will feel or what you will do if you find out certain information. If you have truly looked deep into the depths of your soul, and KNOW you cannot forgive your H a PA, then you can say you won't stay in the M. However, just by saying that doesn't mean he won't or hasn't had the PA. I almost see you as holding that thought as a talisman to not being hurt in that way.

And I know you are pregnant, too, and that just sucks. It does seem that so many A's begin in times of major change or crisis. Your H is probably for all intents and purposes, what you could clasify as insane. Of course, if you tell him that you will probably receive anger and denial, but they truly are not themselves.

And given time, the A will die its natural death. These A relationships cannot thrive, because they are built upon a rotting foundation. She is probably his escape right now, and if he has bought into the fantasy, it will be a process for him to come out.

Stick with us, girl. You WILL make it. You WILL come out stronger on the other side, with or without him. Keep posting. Keep talking to the support system you have going over there. And follow the advice of the vets on these boards. I did, and my H and I are in recovery. My H is himself again. And he was TOTALLY gone. Pep rocks. She knows of what she speaks.

I am sorry to be the voice of doom. But it makes me angry that he lied to you. You know he lied about seeing her. He lied about other stuff, too. He probably won't confess until he thinks you already know anyway. That's what most of them do.

You are right. He didn't go to say goodbye. That is the biggest WS trick in the book. Under no circumstances should a goodbye be said in person - AND, he didn't even say goodbye to her, did he???

Denial is powerful. Use your head. Use your intuition. If it looks like a duck . . . If it smells like poo . . .

Lots of love and support and HUGS to you.

SS

After his 6 hour drive home my husband has since changed his mind about trying. He now says he don't want to be married anymore. Says that he feels like trying would be no use. I asked him to atleast try without her in the picture to see if things could be different. I really don't know what to do... I assume it's still fog talk. He says he will go live with his parents and work and send me all the money to keep the house and pay the bills. He is being very silly right now. In my head I really don't think he will leave. He says I deserve better someone who truly loves me. I think he feels like he is in love with OW. I do believe he did end it with her.

I shouldn't have called her I said some things that normally I wouldn't say. I was just so upset knowing he was with her. I think that is why he is so upset with me. Why he decided to not try. He said when did you turn into this harassing woman. Said he never believed I would say the stuff I did. I could tell he is bothered by this. I told him after I did it and calmed down I realized I should not have done it.

How could he be so willing to try one minute the next say I thought about it some more and don't want this? What do I do? Do I just let him go? Do I try to reason with him? I love him and need him and I really don't know what I would do without him beside me.

<small>[ June 28, 2004, 08:05 AM: Message edited by: SadMarylandLady ]</small>

Also he feels like I have made his whole family mad at him and this bothers him. They pretty much figured out a lot of things on their own but I did talk with his sisters.

I really really feel for you. My H is acting the same way right now. He said yes to working on things and then that he didn't feel like he had anything to contribute a few days later. He also told me I was harassing the girl when I called her. I hope your situation gets better because I want to believe that mine can too.

Sad,
I'm trying to remain positive, but your situation is reminding me of something that happened to me, and makes me so damn angry I could puke, go into the bathroom and just punch my H in the face.

However,
let's get back to basics here. Your H isn't doing anything or saying anything we all haven't heard before. Believe it or not, he's trying to manipulate the situation a little further. Basically what he is feeling IS guilt, HOWEVER... this is what he's trying to do (trust me) ... he knows he screwed up. BIG TIME. He openly lied about his intentions this past weekend. He knew, it was an arranged meeting, he lied, he's caught, and he hates it.

Now because he's so caught into his early feelings for WD, he's going to try to turn the tables on you, hoping you'll see his concern for YOU finding someone better to spin around on you.

If you go running to him, and wrap your arms around him, tell him you FORGIVE him for his indiscretion this weekend, and want to just START fresh, you'd see the little light go on over his head, than he gets away without having to burden his own guilt.

I think he's wallowing in his own pity and wants you to help him with that by going easy on him. Time for tough love. He wants to go, let him, stay in Plan A until you no longer can stand it. If you see no changes, go to Plan B, and let him know when he's ready to pull his head out of his disgustingly deep FOG and really work on the M instead of trying to get his own needs met, you'll be open to the possiblity.

Don't fret sweetie. Take care of you. Don't beat yourself up about calling her either. I hate the fact that OW somehow concoct a reason to play victim.

We're here for you.

<small>[ June 28, 2004, 08:28 AM: Message edited by: betrayedinjersey ]</small>

SM, you haven't done anything wrong. By exposing his affair, you are simply making it difficult and embarrassing for him. He SHOULD BE embarrassed. It's ok if he's mad, he will get over it. However, your marriage might not get over the lack of exposure. Don't help him keep it a secret!

I would also recommend contacting her employer and telling them about the affair. Expose, expose, expose.

In the meantime, smile sweetly at him and say "yes dear" when he says he wants to end the marriage. No begging, crying pleading, DJ's, name calling, etc. No lovebusters! Tell him you don't want a divorce but if he wants to move to his mommy's you will help him pack. That will take the wind out of his sails.

In the meantime, expose, expose, expose. The affair can't survive if you remove the secrecy.

ML,
I am afraid I did just that I asked him not to go and cried and pleaded... Now I feel stupid. He said fine I will try but you know how I feel. So now what? Do I just do Plan A and let him decide if he still wants to go then let him?

SML...

For now, approximately 90% of what comes out of WH's mouth is fabricated.

He did have sex with her. He's lying. This is the WS script. He thinks "I won't hurt her by telling her the truth. It's kinder to lie."

He's lost. You suffer. Your health declines.

I think this should be your #1 concern ---> YOUR health!

He's angry. He's apologizing. He's aloof. He's conciliatory.

Whatever..... he's doing .... consider how it effects your HEALTH.

Make your priority YOUR HEALTH. Call your OB-GYN and tell her about your tremendous stress..... REALLY, do this NOW.

Pep

Looks like there is no hope that he will stay and work it out then <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I go in a few days to my next doc appointment. I will talk to them about this. I have been eating and getting enough sleep. Just cry a lot.

SadMarylandLady! Do not despair! These boards are full of M that have survived A's. In fact, most do! Surprisingly. . . and those same M's are better and stronger than before.

I always found it comforting that my H was following the WS "script." In fact, when I was reading your story to him last night when I posted, he laughed and is so embarassed, because he did and said all those same things to me under the guise of "protection."

MY idea of protection is to not have an A, not to hide the A! And H sees that NOW, but THEN, he really thought his feelings and actions and words were so unique to him - that nobody else could understand, that nobody else had been "in love" and torn and blah blah blah. And now that he has defogged and we are in recovery, he sees how much the same it all is.

But, he says what scares him, is that when he was living all that stuff, and now sees all the nutty things he did and said, he knows that at the time, he meant it all!

I could tell you right now what you need to do to begin turning your H back to you as soon as possible - because it will take time, it is a process, he will not just "snap out of it."

BUT, you are not ready to do all of that right now. What you will go through is a process, too. And I promise you, PROMISE YOU, when you get through your process, you will be different than you are now - you will be so much more.

So, first things first, do as Pep said. Get the doc updated on your stressful sitch. I don't know how much reading you have done, but going through this as a BS, you can have post-traumatic-stress-disorder symptoms. Seriously. And you have a baby to protect, not to mention other kid(s) to take care of. You are their balance right now. You are the only thing they can count on. I am so glad you have your mother around to support you, and your other friends and relatives.

Your WH is going to protect OW, not you. He will see everything you do to expose or end or anything as a personal attack on him, that he didn't "know you were capable" of. Things will be used against you that you wouldn't dream he would do or say!

My H left to stay at his parents'. Then got his own apartment. Went from saying he would always be around to support us and help in any way, to saying he was going to take the house and kids away from me (because I wouldn't stop exposing the A!). They truly are not themselves.

You are going to have to take care of you. Do not count on him to help. AND, because he agreed to stay during crying, don't expect it to stick. I got my H to stay 2 times before D-day. Then he was gone. Luckily, the OW dumped him after D-day, but they kept up the communication through phone and email, and occassionally Scouts (OW S is in H's Scout Patrol), and that's all it took for H to keep his fantasy alive for almost 4 months.

But the A will die a death. Too much energy is expended in maintaining the chaos. Follow the plans here, keep posting, let the wise vets guide you, and you will be fine no matter what. Trust me.

My first advise I will give you - You do not NEED anybody in your life besides you. Everything you need, you should be able to find inside of you first, middle, and last. You may WANT your WH, because you love him and he is the father of your children, but you do not NEED him. When I finally got that through my head (and it took awhile, that is a BIG concept), my H noticed and began turning back to me. My needing of him drove him further from me. My wanting of him brought him back to me. Does that make sense? So, think on that and post back.

I hope your doc visit went well. How far along are you? Do you know if it is a boy or girl? Have you picked out names yet? Enquiring minds want to know! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

SS

Just caught up on your thread....oh, I have heard this before...and I hate that you are hearing it! (before I forget--thanks for the clarification/correction from StillHereMakingIt about the "right duration" of plan A!)

My WH told me the same thing..that he never slept with her (to this day, he still won't admit it, so he too is somewhat foggy...all he says now is that they were "close")..told me he would move out, pay all the bills, but that I could "easily" support myself and the two little ones on my salary (I'm a community college professor...and we don't make that much!)...so I went out and got my own bank account. My own credit card....and WH saw that I could mean business too. (Note--some might see that action as an LB...at the time, I was really panicked that I would need to establish my own financial credit, and that's why I did it.) And now WH is in the painfully slow process...of ending the A. Turnarounds can happen--although I don't quite know what will happen to us.

Your husband is deep in the fog...you need all the support you can get. I'm glad you're going to talk to your doctor about the stress, and hopefully your family who knows will help suppport you. Keep posting here....this site is a godsend. The advice you are getting is wonderful...and it does help you find your own footing through a very foggy landscape.

SS,
I go see the doc next tuesday. I am five months pregnant. Silly me got pregnant after DDay. Not the greatest timing but I don't regret it. I really don't know what I am having but I had dreams many times before I got pregnant that I delivered a baby girl. Which I am hoping for. We have 2 sons right now. I love the name Emma but my spouse wants Isis. Someone goddess of something. hehe.. I said noway but maybe as a middle name. He is also cambodian so I would like to have a cambodian name in the middle. I think after this next doc appointment they said it will be time to do a sonogram. I can't wait.

I talked to my spouse earlier about everything. At first he was saying he is still sure about leaving and stuff. But we truly talked and he really opened up to many things I never knew he felt. I asked him what he has to lose if he trys now that he told OW goodbye? He says he told OW he wanted to see if things did change if he did not talk anymore that he needed to do this for himself. I have been talking to him about this site many weeks before and talking about no contact and how many people say they had his same feelings but when they ended it they realized things they couldn't see before. So I think that he wants to see. He says he can't make promises but he did say he will go to MC with me to see if that will make any difference. I also asked him to read with me some books and he said fine. I am just going to take it one day at a time. I realize so much now of how I could have done a better job at being a better wife. I really have turned into a nagging, motherlike witch to him. I wouldn't want to be married to me. I also know he needs to change also. So who knows what will happen. I know I don't need him but I do want him. And I let him know that earlier.

Grab ahold of his offer for MC, jump on it, and make the appointment soon! My H agreed to that, as well, and even when we didn't talk at all, we continued with MC once a week. We each had IC, too. Eventually, we decided H's IC would become our MC, and it has been wonderful. I believe recovery is possible without MC, but I believe it moves faster with it.

Your WH needs to come to the decision of NC on his own. Or I don't think it will stick. My H did NC before D-day (I had caught emails and new it was an EA) because I told him that is what was needed, and found out once he came back home that he told her to expect the letter and disregard it. That is when he opened up the secret email account just for her. Nice . . .

Don't believe everything you hear from him right now. Keep your guard up. Move on the MC. Keep your eyes and ears open. Do not be lulled into belief of what he said. Just reading what he said, was comforting to me. I'm sure it was comforting to you. I had several of those comforting talks with my H before D-day. I bought into it. That much harder to accept when you discover the lies.

And there have been lies, I guarantee it. That is the nature of what you are dealing with. Again, I am not trying to be the voice of doom, but these things follow such well-traveled paths, very obvious patterns. I just do not believe your WH is being honest with you. I do not believe he has any intention of NC. And I believe he is still very much entertaining thoughts of leaving you.

Stay strong. I love your baby names. Keep taking care of you. Still tell your doc what is going on, even if you feel more secure. Continue to rally forces around yourself, and make yourself stronger.

Have you read any of the affair books recommended on this site? Dr. Harley's books, "Torn Asunder," "NOT Just Friends." Those books have been immensely helpful to me. I can give you author names if you need them, too.

Good job telling him you don't need him. You don't. You need you. And your babies (mine are 11 and 12, and they are still my babies!). If he takes off, you need to realize you are coming from the place of power. You have everything of value in the M. You have yourself (he is lost), you have your kids, you have the house, the friends, the family - did I mention your own self? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Stick with us. Keep posting. You are doing wonderful. It is very important to realize and own your responsibility for the condition of the M before the A - what made your M succeptible to an A. You are NOT in any way responsible FOR the A. Just the state of the M in general. And that is not easy to do.

SS

ps, how much did you tell him of MB? Did you tell him your handle? It can be counter-productive for a WS to read the BS stratagies and thoughts and feelings. This is a place for you to vent, get support, ask questions.

SML - If you are 5 months pregnant your doctor can send you for a sonogram now to determine the sex, they can tell at 20 weeks. My doctor said I could go anytime between July 20 and July 30th, so I made an appointment for July 20th at 8:00 a.m., as you can see I can't wait! Do you have names picked out yet? I always liked names with a family connection. If it's a boy I am going to name it after my father who passed away when I was 6 years old.

SS,
Sorry I just felt so overwelmed with everything. I told my husband I hate the feeling of not knowing. He asked what I am talking about then I said not knowing everyday if your actually going to stay or work it out. He said you know how I feel. Of course one time it's I don't want this the next minute it's fine I will give it a try.

I really want to ask him again what he wants but I am thinking I should just keep quiet. That if he really wants to leave he will do so. My plan right now is to work on myself. Change the things I know I don't like about myself and the things he doesn't like. I am hoping that if he sees me trying that it will make him want to try also.

I have been trying to find a MC but it's hard. I called 3 places so far. There are not many options in our city. Two places nobody picked up and the third place I left a message but so far nobody has called back. My husband works early and comes home not till 6 or so. I don't know if counselors do weekend appointments or not. He brought up the MC last week. I didn't. So I think this is a little start. How do you know if you are getting a good MC? I told my husband the only thing we could do would be to go and see if they make us feel comfortable and we feel it is helping.

I am also looking for a job. I have been a stay at home mom for about 3 years. I really feel my WH is stressed because he feels like our money situation is all on him. I think if I get a job and help out atleast part-time that he will feel a little less stress. He also has changed since he started this new job almost 2 years ago. He hates it the guys at his work are not nice to him at all. Usually my husband is the kind of guy that can talk to anyone and get along with anyone but these guys are really giving him a tough time. So I am also helping him find another job.

Last night we went to a movie together and dinner. I had my mom watch the boys so we could be alone. We had a good time and talked some but I still feel sad. What I miss the most is him telling me he loves me. I haven't heard that for awhile. Unless I say I love you and he says I love you to. He says he wants to work on connecting spirtually with me. How do you do this?

I think I really need help with Plan A. In plan A do you not talk about the OW?? Do you just talk about non relate things? Do you talk about your marriage ending or not? I really want to do this right. If he goes I know I can make it but right now I don't want him to go. I want to see if we can be happier.

Kloe,
I haven't really discussed names to much with my husband. My first son we named Kyle Andrew. When we found out he was a boy that was the only name we could agree on. So this time if it's a boy again I know we will have a really hard time with a name. The girl names I like are Emma, Brianna, and Katelyn. But my husband is stuck on Isis. I think my sonogram will be sometime in July I will find out next week the date. I can't wait either. I don't really need to buy much but if it's a girl I just need mainly clothes.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is something st*rfish has written about plan A:

quote:
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Unfortunately, the misconceptions about Plan A abound on MB as widely as they are being described on this one. So please don't think I'm jumping on you guys....the folks over there interpret it the same way...with disastrous results. I am somewhat of a Plan A expert....in the sense that I have been mentoring folks in that plan for some time. With 10,000+ posts on mb...I have some extensive knowledge of Plan A and the misconceptions about it. You all are interpreting it the exact same way that most folks who misunderstand it MB do.

It is NOT about being the best you can be.
It is not about being a doormat.
Kissing Butt
being nice
not complaining
ignoring boundaries
sucking it up
pretending you're happy
etc
etc.

It's not about any of those things....which is why it fails to help often enough. It has one purpose...and one alone. It is a strategy to end affairs by doing several things simultaneously: 1) addressing ways you as a spouse may have contributed to the incompatibility and vulnerability of the marriage...whether that means hurting the other person, letting yourself go, withdrawing, or witholding whatever....you make an effort and show an interest in correcting those things. (that may sound similar to being the best you can be...but it's NOT the same thing. This about what your spouse needs...not you. 2) You use radical honesty to describe how the affair feels by confronting the spouse with what you know and how you know it. 3)You expose the affair to the light of day. Most affairs require secrecy, exposure can create great conflict within the affair.

So all of that is plan A....anything else...or just part of it...is not Plan A. In short, it is an effort to make the marriage an attractive alternative to the affair, let the WS know that their actions are hurtful, and shed light on the affair.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

and plan b:
quote:
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When an affair goes on long enough...two things are likely to happen to the BS....a) The pain becomes so great that it is unbearable. The BS doesn't like who they are or how they feel in the midst of that pain. They find it impossible not to lash out and try and hurt the other person. They can't sleep or eat. Stuff like that. b)The BS finds it more and more impossible to continue loving their spouse when they remain too long in an environment where their feelings and needs are ignored. They are on the brink of just walking away from the marriage and dismantling their family...divorcing.

Plan B addresses either of those dynamics...so it essentially does two things....either protects what little love is left so that reconciliation has any hope of occurring, or protecting a BS from the daily painful interaction that often occurs. No contact accomplishes that. It also sets good boundaries for what recovery would look like before considering reconciliation. It further creates an environment where the affair partner must then fulfill ALL the WS's needs....and that is often a challenge that puts great pressure on the affair. Most WS's get something from both their marriage AND their affair...if they didn't, what would be the point. When the marriage gets taken out of the equation....very often, it's possible for the WS to see more clearly what that something was.
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</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">SadMarylandLady -

I copied this off of another thread on GQII. I believe you are already doing a great Plan A with your statement of:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> My plan right now is to work on myself. Change the things I know I don't like about myself and the things he doesn't like. I am hoping that if he sees me trying that it will make him want to try also. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I do not think you should bring up OW. I don't think you should talk about his "feelings." Because, he feelings right now are not really real, but he truly believes they are. And he will go to great lengths and much hurt to convince you they are. Just focus on your family. That is what I did. I made everything all about fun family things. Having the boys around kept H relaxed about me prying into his "feelings," and also reminded him of many reasons he would want to stay in the M.

MC is hit and miss. Our first MC is the best in our state. She has the highest credentials, that few can achieve. And she was not a good fit with H and I. We are very passionate people with voices that carry. Our second, and current MC, is perfect for us. He encourages us to communicate in our natural way, and his only stipulation is that we cannot harm his plants. Of course, we do not get out of control, it is just a joke. Well, sometimes we get emotionally out of control, but that is just our natures.

Just be aware that the first might not be "the one." And then you can move on to the next. And so on. You will find one that works. When you seek, you will find. I truly believe that. You will know within the first 3 sessions, I would think. We sure did.

If you are unclear about anything regarding Plan A or B, please ask! I am not an expert as others here are, so if you want very expert opinions, start a new thread with a specific question regarding Plan A. Perhaps even call out Pepperband, Orchid, star*fish (she's not on these boards much, but I think she answers call-outs). MelodyLane is another great resource. And tons of others I am neglecting to mention.

Also, have you read any of those books I mentioned? I think you can also get them on cassette tape of CD, if you are not a big reader. I found it so helpful to educate myself on the nature of affairs. There are such patterns. When H said or did something that would have hurt me badly in the beginning, after I read about it, I realized he was just doing the normal stuff for where he was at (in fogland).

Keep posting. Keep asking questions, and getting opinions. Knowledge is power. You are the strong one right now. You have to be the lighthouse. Have you read that? I'll post it next. I don't want to chance losing this long post. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

SS