This is a thread I started to recieve answers to a question I posted on the Moving Forward thread.

From the Moving Forward thread:

To the WWs,

I am struggling mightily right now and I have a question for you all. From the posts that RAP has shared with me, I have gleaned two trends her. The general comment you make about starting your affair goes something like this:

I can now understand how it happened…
It was wrong, but this is how it happened…
I never thought I would do this, but this is how it happened…

So you all seem to feel that what you did was wrong, but you understand how you got there. Then there are a lot of comments about becoming the W your H deserves and they typically go:

I want to, but can’t seem to…
I’m not there yet…
I can’t do this…
I’m not over the OM…

My question to you is if you claim to understand how you GOT in the affair, how come you can’t see how to get BACK to your husband? It is the SAME WAY.

Which one of you met the OM and was committing adultery 15 minutes after meeting him? If you had a ONS, the emotional attachment would not be there and you wouldn’t be in this predicament. You ALL say it started out with emotional needs and emotional affair FIRST. Did you have immediate emotional attachment with the OM when you first met him? Probably not.

It is a process.

You met and interacted with him and it was positive, in a friendly comforting way. The OM was a nice guy.

You looked forward to your next meeting, after all it was platonic. You let the emotions go a little further this time.

This process iterated, emotions getting more attached each time. How far did you go each time? Probably until you were uncomfortable with the strength of the feelings. But each time, the “boundary” moved a little bit. You just stretched your “comfort boundary” a little more.

Eventually, the boundary moved so far that you could “allow” yourself to break your marriage vows and commit adultery. And you couldn’t come back easily. It is like the “comfort boundary” would SNAP you back from the recoil if you stopped.

The point is, it took this INTERACTION with the OM to move your boundary. If you saw him once and just daydreamed about him WITHOUT interacting, would it have led to the affair? No.

And now you are all posting here telling us how hurt you are by all this. Telling us how much you have to get over. Telling us how you want to be a wife your husband deserves. We (the BS) get it. We read on this board and we are not ignorant of our contributions. All of your BS seem to be understanding and forgiving of you. Occasionally there are some LBs going both ways, but I don’t get the sense that any of you have a H that does not want this to work.

Then you say the infamous “I can’t see how to get these feelings back for my husband.”

HYPOCRITES! You do it the SAME WAY.

There is pain and hardship between the two of you now, it will be tough. There was no pain between you and the OM so it was easier, but the process is still the same.

Choose to interact with you husband in a small POSITIVE way. Do this until you are uncomfortable with how you are feeling then stop and take a break. I don’t think any of us (BS) would resent these baby steps, frankly I think we are all desperate for them.

Do it again, the boundary between you and your H will move.

Do it again and again and again, each time moving the boundary. Then one day you will wake up and be there.

I would like one of you to give me a good reason why this will not work. It is the way we are all made – no exceptions. It is why we say things like “practice makes perfect.”

I have a 4 yr old who is learning to swim. I have been mentoring him in this process of struggling until he is uncomfortable, taking a break, and getting back to it. Know what? He is making GREAT STRIDES in swimming. 2 weeks ago he wouldn’t go in the water without swimmies on and would not go in the pool where he could not stand. Yesterday, he swam to the bottom of the pool and picked something off the bottom. I have worked with him and kept the lessons positive. I have accomplished this in 4 lessons over 2 weeks.

My 4 yr old also plays video games. He likes to play the games his older brothers do, but they are too hard for him. He follows the same process, but has no one by his side to keep it positive. He doesn’t stop until his frustration mounts – very negative results. He is getting better, but the process is painful and slower. He pushes beyond where he is comfortable.

In both cased, he is making PROGRESS. Have a final goal in mind – the other side of the river. Set you mind on the first stepping stone to get to that goal, AND STEP ON IT. This works in every situation I have EVER encountered. It is just the learning process that God has wired in to all of us.

When you say things like “I just can’t” or “I don’t think I can” you are CURSING yourselves for failure. If in your mind, you don’t think you can step all the way to the other side of the river, stop worrying about the other side and look to the first stepping stone. If there is not one there PICK ONE UP ON THE SIDE OF THE RIVER YOU ARE ON AND TOSS IT IN THE WATER. Take steps you are comfortable with and be pleased with that. You have loving Hs on the other side who will help you find the stones. We don’t want you to fall in, we want you to come across this thing so we can continue on our journey together.

If you are saying that the feelings for the OM must go away first, I think that is a load of bunk. BEFORE your affair, you had stronger feelings for your family. Maybe not for your Hs, but for your family. The OM was a small piece that grew and pushed the larger pieces away, you family, your husband, your reputation, your relationship with God. You put your attention on the small piece, the OM, and it grew bigger than the others. But the other pieces were still there. And how easy it became to lose yourself to the OM. Why wouldn’t it? That is where your effort was going.

The ONLY difference is the bad feelings. There were no BAD feelings between you and the OM so it was easier to till that soil. There are now BAD feelings between you and your H. Some were there already before the A from your marital history based on things both of you did. Some big ones are there now because of the A. That just means that it will be harder to cross back to the right side of the river than it was to get to the wrong side. But guess what, on the return trip you have someone who loves you, and wants you to succeed. This person doesn’t want you to get your feet wet and will help you find the stones. On the trip to the OM, he didn’t really care if you fell in and were washed away. He would just start calling another woman across. It may feel harder to cross back, but with someone looking out for you on the other side, it is truly LESS RISKY to you. In truth, your H will probably step out into the river and meet you half way. Did the OM do that? No. He let you journey alone to his side. And when you were emotionally safely across, he made his move.

So your self-esteem and self-worth isn’t there. Well, your worth to God is a gift of grace and it IS there. You choose to accept it or not. Your self-worth, you have to earn that for yourself. Cross the river then tell me you don’t feel good about yourself. Even make progress across the river and feel your self worth increase. Win a spiritual battle, and bask in your victory and cultivate your self-worth. Have you ever talked to a fat woman losing weight? They are still really fat, but very happy with themselves because they are losing weight. There can be a 265 lb woman who starts losing weight and drops to 255 lbs. A 10 lb difference you can’t even see on her, why should she be so happy? She’s not different in any noticeable way, but she is MAKING PROGRESS.

If you need help finding some stepping stones, here are a few:
- A longing thought pops in to your head about the OM. Occupy your mind with something else, do a chore, read, veg-out with the TV.
- Sit by your H and hold his hand.
- Start to develop cascade thoughts: You see the OM vehicle and think “I miss what we had”. DON’T STOP THERE. Then think “But it was wrong and a lie of the enemy.” Soon, you will see his car and skip the middle thought.
- Let your H know you appreciate what he is doing for you. I don’t know about the rest of you, but RAP tells you in posts how much she appreciates me much more than she actually tells me. My guess is you do the same. “I am really blessed because of what you are doing for me” would work WONDERS for us, the BS. Is that really that hard to say?

Soon you will find that the shameful side of the river you were on is a distant memory.

I’m not saying it will be easy. It is hard for us, the BS, also. Don’t believe me? The evidence is right there when WE LB. The difference is we did not compromise our self worth in the affair. I think because of that, we have an easier time looking at the positive side. I think most of you WW are thinking how can that (our positive outlook) be real after what I have done. It also seems like most of you “knew” the A wasn’t real, and you did that. It just takes faith, belief that good WILL come of it. Do you want to know where your reassurance will come from? It will come from the reaction we have when you start moving towards us again.

If you are saying you just can’t face the pain, I would say that we can face whatever pain we HAVE to face. I cannot imagine childbirth, you faced that pain. You also had to. Are we (the BS) enabling you by being so forgiving? Is it making you think you DON’T have to face the pain you caused in our M? I would really like that question answered.

If you are still saying “I just can’t” you might as well say “I quit.” If you really think you “can’t,” you need to ask yourself is that REALLY it, or is it hard and you just don’t want to?

NCWalker

PS – This is a source of tension between me and RAP. I would appreciate any response to this of where I might not have this right.

<small>[ July 02, 2004, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: ncwalker ]</small>

I replied to you on the Moving Forward thread.
Pam

RAP,

Given the recent tensions between us, I am not sure your answer can be received very well by me.

NCWalker

Edited out by NCWalker

You guys are right. She responded to me on the Moving Forward thread. I wanted to respond back here. I am still to hurt from yesterday to be posting.

<small>[ July 02, 2004, 03:31 PM: Message edited by: ncwalker ]</small>

RAP/NCW: Please try to slow down. Take the time to think about what the other is saying. Try not to think of your reply while the other is talking. You two have so much to work through. Take your time, there is no rush. Try to do something small to the other, then acknowledge it when your spouse does something small for you.

Also, try to remember the boys. They are very impressionable now and they still need you immensely. And try to do something fun this weekend, whether it is at home or in Florida.

Love, Your friend,
RH

To the WWs,

I still have the question.

Is it REALLY that you CAN'T take a step, however small, or that you WON'T?

I have seen CAN'T in your posts on the Moving On thread.

NCWalker

ncwalker.

I'm not too familiar with your story or what is going on here...this post is a bit confusing...it looks to be a convo between you and your fww? If so, I must say you are LB'ing terribly bad here, and doing it in 'public'. Radical honesty (something I'm not really into) is something in the privacy of you and your spouse. I know sometimes we have to share some things that are said to develop the 'puzzle picture', but, this is just apparently a public argument.

Your initial post in this thread was great, imo. Really nailed down the foundations of the MB principal, time together and trusting to get further down the road.

After that though, you just self justified. I may be way off base, but, I don't think so. I have no doubt where this is coming from, I'm a betrayed husband. I know what you are going through...I experience that same pain, those same emotions... seeing a guy look attractively at your wife and cursing at yourself because you start to feel a tiny bit jealous, as you say to yourself...I let some other guy F my wife and did nothing, what am I gonna do to this guy for just looking at her!

What I feel is going on here is confusion amongst radical honesty and properly discussing it. Remember, even in RH, you have boundaries, you guys need to set the 'secret word' and start using it, and respect it. It doesn't mean get one last shot in, it doesn't mean walk away angry...it means, I'm hurting and this is the limit to this pain right now, let me digest what has just happened.

Try to slow down, how would Christ love back a spouse? Slowly, consistently, uncompromisingly even against hostility. If she isn't moving fast enough for you, then slow YOUR stride. When you walk through the mall...do you lengthen your step to make her run beside you, or shorten it and walk beside your wife? You slow down to her pace. We, men, are the 'kings', we set the rules, the laws, but no king is worth his salt if his queen isn't sitting there in complete agreement with his decisions, and if he is advising her on things, he had better heed her advice or he will surely falter. She knows the pace your relationship should progress at, much much much better than you (men) can, let them gauge the tempo. Adjust to it. A short while ago, having your wife back was a simple heavenly thought, with only one condition, NC. Are you there?

If so, enjoy and thank for the moment. RAP. He is hurting so, and expressing your love and thankfulness here, well, it's what a woman would tend to want (public affirmation), men, we just need to be told. Even amongst all the lies and garbage of before, a simple thank you for being here for me, when I needed you most. Man, it does wonders. Smile at your husband, and show him you love him with a smile. You don't have to have sex with him for him to know you love him. The sex helps (we are stupid, I know, and think sex = love)...so, give him his fill there too (I can't but try to help a brother out on the SF department <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) You don't have to run at his pace, but, you should be mindful of his needs and desires. Why do you think he wants you to love him soooo badly right now? Really, why? Because he loves you so much, and wants his pain to go away, and he needs his wife to share in that pain for a moment, and acknowledge that he can feel it, and that you love him even when he is so weak from the pain that it's rolling over onto you. I would never want my wife to experience things I have experienced in the past year, even my encounter with God, where He was on me and told me exactly what to do. That moment, oh...too much pain in my life that brought God to the forefront. But, I would love for my wife to turn to me and say, I'm so sorry for what I've done to you. Not include our family, not include any vows to God, just that she loves ME, and that she hurts sooo deeply for the pain she caused me. I know I did that for my wife, while I was accepting responsiblity for letting my marriage go to hell (while she was in her affair), and I made myself sick...ran to the bathroom and vommitted. But, I showed her, I was repentant, and that the pain I took part in causing for her was washing back on me, and I could feel it.

I don't know, I'm rambling. Would each of you just stop for a moment and write a quick note to the other and tell them something nice, that they are thankful for, that is ABOUT THEM, not the kids, not being a mother, but something that reflects that individual and or the two of YOU. Mark your marriage by more than the existence of your family, mark it by the joining of the two of you, as someday, that will be how it is again, just you two.

Hang in there. Sorry if I pissed you guys off.

NCW,

By our very human nature, we are all tempted to take the road of least resistance. I know that I should have worked on my marriage before the A happened but I didn't because it was easier to ignore the problems and go on with the normal routine of life.

It's hard for me to say whether it's "can't" or "won't". We want to see things get better, but the road sometimes seems so long we just don't know how we can possibly get there. Rationally, I say it's "won't", but our hearts feel like it's "can't".

Also keep in mind that your W is probably in a deep depression. Depression in my experience is a state of mind that almost prevents you from seeing the possibilities of the future. It has this power over you and keeps you in its grasp relentlessly. When her depression subsides, she will hopefully see the possibilities for your M and see that she "can" take the steps.

Hang in there.

Boss

NC,

I think everything you said is exactly right. The problem is we have habitual ways of dealing with problems, and dumb as it sounds, it's like we keep trying to get through the wall by beating our heads against it. I've been guilty of that myself, but eventually ( and it usually takes quite a while) I am able to say to myself, "Hey, whatever you're doing isn't working....try something else."

I think RookKev has some very good points as well. Actually, he's the one who put things to me in such a way that I was able to let go of a lot of my selfishness and reach out more to recovering H. (THANKS ROOKKEV!)

Listen, your wife knows, on some level, what you are saying. But she isn't ready to really hear it yet. This stuff is EXTREMELY overwhelming. It does sound like you both need to step back for a while.
Try to take it one day at a time. All we have is RIGHT NOW anyway.

Our MC didn't let us talk a whole lot about the A. He made sure we understood why it happened, but we weren't allowed to dwell there. He was right....action is required. But he also told us it was ok to take a break from it.

NC, you have quite a way with words. I really like a lot of the analogies you come up with...very creative! Maybe someday, soon, someone will put things in such a way that the light comes on for RAP. I'm really pulling for the two of you!

Julie

When my H and I were really struggling with exactly this our MC said to my H.

Can you just let go of the feelings of anger, betrayal and hurt? Because you are asking Jenny to just let go of all her feelings because they hurt you.

He said, no, I can't just let those feelings go.

She said, Jenny has to work through her feelings as well. She can't just drop them any more than you can.

And then, wonderful woman that she was, gave us all sorts of good and helpful ways to increase our feelings towards each other and let go of the negative feelings that were holding us back.

Just my 2c worth.

Jenny

Boss,

Thank you for the reply. I can handle the explanation of it is probably "won't" that feels like "can't" and have been there myself.

My next question is: Then why do you keep SAYING "can't"? Isn't that a little destructive?

The WWs will post something like

"I feel so bad that I can't hug him."

Why not say

"I feel so bad that I can't hug him. But I am not going to let this beat me and tomorrow I WILL hug him."

THEN DO IT.

RookKev,

I am pissed at you. STOP BRINGING SF IN TO IT. YOU ARE NOT HELPING. I can't convince my WW that a small show of affection would be appreciated. She keeps saying if she does that, I will want more and I DON'T. I WANT to take BABY STEPS. YOU ARE NOT HELPING!!!!!

Other than that, right on brother. Got your message. I strive to be Christlike in my love, but I AM NOT and make mistakes. I'm just being honest about them here.

<small>[ July 02, 2004, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: ncwalker ]</small>

Sorry NC, part of this board is that own own pain or problems flow through into our posts. I'm sorry that my sex drive is spilling over and causing you more pain.

As for your feelings. Feel free to posts feelings. That is very good. It's good to express your feelings healthily, which writing them down is. What I would ask yourself is why do you feel the need to have anyone other than God know your feelings? He is the one who is gonna get you through this, and you and I both know, one way or another He will get you through this.

Thanks for your post. It was very therapeutic for me. I get maybe a small glimpse of what my wife may be saying inwardly. My only defense is that this whole twisted mess arose this sex drive of mine...I was never like this before. Go figure.

In no way do I intend to shut you down. You DO need to express those feelings. Perhaps journaling your anger may be a good step for you? I don't know. I have those times where I'm angry like you seem to be right now. I find myself spiraling downward when I dwell in those things that are of the past, and which I can't change. I know I can't change hurts I've done to her in the past, but I can make changes towards the future. When I dwell, I tend to seek a simple means of telling myself I'm doing it. Usually, that is enough to start the ending of the process. I just say look, thinking on that crap Rook, where is it gonna take you? You've gone down that road...you've been consumed by your anger over what happened, and then you chose to forgive her. When you (I) dwell here on these thoughts, I tell myself I don't forgive her. All emotions can be corrupted, and having the initial emotion is not sin, exploring it negatively is where we sin. (That is what I think God tells us about with the adultery in the heart passage)... acknowledge you still have pain over the event, but, try to really shut down the exploration of that area (if you have already gone down it, and forgiven her/him/whatever).

Once again, I'm sorry, and thank you for showing me how bad I really am about the whole sex bit.

I hope you have a decent weekend.

NCWalker,

You are really hurting me here. I am not willing to air this out here.

I have said" I am sorry." I have not railed and yelled every time it is hard. You are being unfair.

I don't want to have to defend myself here. I am hurt that you don't see when I sa "I'm sorry."

I am hurt that you are acting like I yell all the time.

Until two days ago, I was completely shut down. That made you angry.

Now I have gotten a angry with you in arguments, and you are more angry.

I AM SORRY I HAVE HURT YOU> REALLY **** I AM. I don't want you to hurt, really.

Pam

<small>[ July 02, 2004, 04:43 PM: Message edited by: runawaypot ]</small>

NCW,

"My next question is: Then why do you keep SAYING "can't"? Isn't that a little destructive?

The WWs will post something like

"I feel so bad that I can't hug him."

Why not say

"I feel so bad that I can't hug him. But I am not going to let this beat me and tomorrow I WILL hug him."

THEN DO IT."

You're right it is destructive. But everything we have done up to this point is destructive so why stop now? (lol)

I think we say "can't" because we don't know how to override the feelings yet.

You mention crossing the river. I think a lot of us feel like we don't have the strength to keep ourselves from getting swept away in the current. With time comes healing and with healing comes strength.

Boss

I agree with Bosstenor

"I think we say "can't" because we don't know how to override the feelings yet. "

"You mention crossing the river. I think a lot of us feel like we don't have the strength to keep ourselves from getting swept away in the current. With time comes healing and with healing comes strength."

I know me & RAP want to get there and we are trying. It is a slow and painful process for all of us WW's.

I want to meet up with RAP for our 60th birthdays and compare notes on that Proverbs 31 lady....!!

Please please hang in there. You must be frustrated with us and especially me for keep saying I want feelings before action.

I agree this is the wrong way round and feelings will come on an action. I am trying. I want to try.

Please go and hug RAP and if you are LB at home please don't.....

I know she is hurting. I know you are. I know my H is... I know I am.

I really do care for you guys.

I guess RAP is having a good cry out. Tell her we all care for you both and I am sitting here on the otherside of the world praying for you now...

Loads and loads and loads of love,

Will cu (post )tomorrow

Kas <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

NCW,

I just want to say how much I admire you for your strength, dedication, and endless love for your W.

It's been a month since my d-day, and I am trying everything to get my H to be closer to me. See for me, my A made me realize how much i love my H.

He hasn't been able to tell me he loves me and he hasn't worn his wedding ring for a month.

I would give anything to have my H feel as you do about your M.

I know he is angry but unlike you I don't think he is able to see that we can have a future. Right now he is just getting through each day as it comes and i am accepting any morsel of affection he gives me.

Hang on. One day your W will realize how lucky she is.

Boss

ncwalker - I think it is best that you have your thread and your wife has her thread, and you don't look at each others. It is too hurtful for you right now.

believer,

Thanks for the concern. I do stay of the Moving Forward thread. I just posted my questions and got off it. That's why I made this one to get the answers. I really want her to be free to express. My recent "trip to the bottom of the roller coaster" was from a conversation(s) we had that took place Wed and Thu, not from reading her thread. Basically, I was "full" of bad emotions and she piled a few more in. I have done the same to her. In this case, neither one of us could exercise the maturity to back down. Just happens that way. I post because the writing helps me. I have written before this, to help me straighten my feelings. Wrote a lot to the wife while overseas. I started writing here, more as a place to write, than anything. I guess I feel I should share the bad with the good. Though sometimes later I feel bad about it and have this annoying habit of erasing my vents.

Boss and BV,

Thank YOU for responding to my actual question. It speaks volumes for the strength of both of you to be at the point where you are saying that realize it is a decision. That you see the difference between a "can't" and a "won't". I liked your explanations of the response.

I agree. The issue is a tough one to deal with, when the "won't" feels like a "can't". I wrestled with this from my youth do to yucchy family stuff and learned this lesson young. Not saying I always put it in to practice, but I did learn it.

Here is how I deal with it, and I think this works as it is bearing fruit in my sons. Hopefully it will help you to.

1) First, the emotions. We tend to attribute the source of our feelings to others. This is, frankly, a lazy attitude. If I admit that another person can MAKE me FEEL a certain way, I am yielding too much power to that person. Essentially, I am declaring them my master. It is not a self-image thing as much as a self-mastery thing. The energy that drives you to do the mundane (brush teeth, clean, etc.) is the energy that is used to hold your feelings in check. Once you declare, and it is almost a declaration, that you are the master of your feelings, you can become the master of your feelings.

There are times you will fail, case in point, my recent vent LOL. But being tired, or continually buffeted, makes it harder. The WORST thing is the "initial break." The pinhole leak that lets it flow.

2) Second, the mastery. If only it were as simple as saying "Oh yeah, that makes sense." Then just do it. Here is how I "did" it and developed this skill, and a skill it actually is.

I got in a situation that normally annoys me greatly, but had no people I was really attached to, either positively or negatively, involved. And I made the choice to NOT allow it to annoy me. For example: go to the grocery store to pick up a few things. Go when the store is really crowded. Only get a few things, but do not get in the express lane. Pick the lane with the chatty senior citizens. Works best if there is something you gotta do fun after. You will feel the impatience and irritation build (if this kind of thing bothers you) and when you get to the check out, you will be terse, surly, and irritated. CHOOSE at that point to be friendly and pleasant to the checkout person. Easier to do with them, no ATTACHMENT remember? You will be amazed at what that choice not only does for you, but for them. The "pleasantness" feeds on itself, especially because the situation is unexpected.

Choose to be a BLESSING (my favorite part of that Bruce Almighty movie).

Now ask yourself, if it works there (and it WILL) why not anywhere? Slowly build up and choose to be the emotional blessing to your spouse. Start small or you will come accross fake. Practice. It is a retraining of your outlook.

You will fail. I do. Plenty of times. But in general, I have found the process to get easier and easier.

Walk out the actions of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness (you know, the fruits) and the feelings will follow.

Broken Vessel, you especially I have been following because I am amazed at how you mirror RAP and say the things she is afraid to. She shares your posts frequently. I admire your courage to post your feelings and bare yourself to the world.

I would ask you this - you have DEMONSTRATED that courage repeatedly, now be courageous and take a step to that wonderful husband. You already HAVE the courage, you have the desire to be his wife, and you have the realization that it is a choice. Fly, baby bird, FLY. The GOOD feelings feed off each other just the same as the BAD.

Onlywords,

Thank you for the concern. It means a lot to hear that you care. I am saddened that you only know my wife and I through our posts. She and I both probably post too much of our guts. I am glad you take up for us. We are actually doing quite well. My vent today really allowed me to blow off steam. I came home and sat on the porch alone, and RAP did not pester. We ate dinner with the 3DS and RAP and I had a wonderful, loving conversation on the porch after. (It's all the drugs I tell yah, it ain't me...ROFL).

We just were "out of whack" as it were. She and I are a little too tough to let that bust us apart now.

NCWalker

PS - I get the feeling after this that I should NOT post angry.

Waiting for the 2x4....

Waiting for the 2x4....

Waiting for the 2x4....

ncwalker,

I don't think you should avoid posting when you're angry. You get a lot of your frustrations out in writing instead of taking it out on RAP.

I agree with believer, you should both avoid each other's posts for right now.

I truly believe you'll both get through this.
It's tough, through all the words and struggles you have, all this really boils down to is the one thing ALL BS have in common. The fact that WE are the ones betrayed, had our hearts ripped out, made the decision through all this agony to forgive and rebuild the marriage, and it's kind of like a hurry up and wait deal.

The WS doesn't understand that part.

During the A, plenty of decisions to make, lies to create, illusions of lust to fulfill. All that energy to make that happen, it's no easy task. We deserve the same energy and determination to begin recovery of our marriage don't we ? When we don't see it we feel like we're just spinning our wheels. It's frustrating, painful, and exhausting, but all part of the process we chose to begin.

I've told several people here, and I'll tell you the same thing, ride the wave, because this is just a blip in the radar when you stand back and look at the lifetime ahead of you.

I'm glad you guys had a great evening, you deserved it. Hang in there !

Dear NC walker,

This is kind of strange but good I think, to post to RAP on Moving On thread and you on this one.

It keeps it in perspective, and I hope it will give an insight as to ‘the real me’ here,
I think it is very good actually on reflection that you will keep posting on this thread, because it gives you a chance to vent your feelings out, in the same way as RAP and I do on the Moving on Thread.

I guess we should all realise you BS ‘s are trying to come through and know how to cope with us, (I have just posted to RWS as he was having a vent), and I hope he isn’t mad at me, but I tried to share things with him as to how a FWW mind (like mine) is working at the moment.)

We women (FWW) need our own thread to keep venting too and trying to come to understand and put into action things which will bring the BEST out of our marriage. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

You said:

I would ask you this - you have DEMONSTRATED that courage repeatedly, now be courageous and take a step to that wonderful husband. You already HAVE the courage, you have the desire to be his wife, and you have the realization that it is a choice. Fly, baby bird, FLY. The GOOD feelings feed off each other just the same as the BAD.

I am going to post to RAP about my first ‘little’ step forward last night. No massive breakthrough in my feelings for OM still, BUT a step forward to me in putting ACTIONS FOR H before FEELINGS.

I will post it on my other thread later where JL and pep have been coucelling me in this ‘intimate’ area.

I really don’t want RAP to get disheartend though and worry why she hasn’t maybe done something yet about phys side. I care for her and don’t want her to go away.

Will talk to her later on the moving on thread

Thanks for your posts and illustrations.

I like that thought about the supermarket. That is my WORST AREA of frustration. I heard Joyce Meyer talk about that too as it is something she had to overcome!!

Have to dash now. Decorating boys room with H. (At least we have to talk whilst doing that)

Have a good weekend, and please give my love,thoughts and prayers to RAP and tell her to get her walking stick ready for our lunch one day when we are older and wiser in this!!

Kas
<img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> (teary but trying my best)

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> RAP I believe in God we can get there

bij,

Thanks for the reminder. I like the wave analogy. It's like I know that there are peaks and troughs, highs and lows. When you are in the low trough, you can't see a thing but the trough. If you don't remember the peaks in the trough, you forget they are there and just think about the trough.

Then when you are on the peak, you just look at the land on the horizon in the distance. And you wish you were there now. And you don't prepare yourself for the next trough that is coming.

I almost want to say that hope without wisdom can lead to disappointment. I'd have to think on that before I would really agree.

BV,

You and my wife need to go to the same school of "Why worry what others think." (Small 2x4 here for you, really just a little 1x2, maybe even a popsicle stick).

Mantra Suggestion for BV #1: I am BV and I will be who I am. I will have joy about who I am because I know I am moving to be the Christlike woman God wants me to be.

Don't worry about what we think. Post how you feel. I haven't seen anyone blast you. RAP hasn't come to me saying "Wow, someone hammered BV." Be who you are and if someone is mad at you for that, then they are mad at honesty. And THAT is wrong, not you.

That is WONDERFUL about your H. If it turned out awkward, do not be discouraged. Consider yourselves in a learning stage and be forgiving. Ben Franklin said "Energy and persistence conquer all things."

You are in my prayers this week,

NCWalker

<small>[ July 03, 2004, 07:23 AM: Message edited by: ncwalker ]</small>