Okay guys I need some serious help…

I had an EA. OM and I use to work together years ago, were friends then but that’s it. I knew he had the hots for me but nothing ever happened. I thought he was attractive and all but wasn’t interested in going down that road and he never made a move or anything like that. We left the company for different reasons and go our separate ways, not talking because, well you just move on. We did not have that good of a friendship to keep communicating.

Fast forward five years and low and behold I get an e-mail from him. Apparently he did a search on the internet for me and found out where I worked. He sent me the first e-mail back in July or August of last year. Nothing major, just a “Hi, how are you?” type e-mail. We e-mail each other sporadically throughout the summer, nothing heavy at all, just jokes and catch up stuff.

In late December it came out that he had the hots for me, I told him that I already knew that. BTW, he’s married as well. He starts telling me about issues he has had with his marriage, how he’s always liked me, yadda yadda yadda. I admitted to him that I always found him attractive, told him that I felt like I was going through a mid-life crisis at the age of 33, etc and low and behold we are knee deep into an EA. We would e-mail each other CONSTANTLY throughout the day, fantasies, romantic thoughts, etc… I felt horrible because I was betraying my husband all along but it was all so exciting, addicting. Husband suspected something was up in March because I had changed so much and I told him that I was attracted to another man. He was heart broken naturally and he asked that I stop contact with him. Well I did not – the affair continued then in late March we met for lunch and at that meeting we kissed. That’s when I really knew I was an adulterer and in some serious trouble. I wanted out of the affair but I had gotten in so deep that I couldn’t break it off on my own.

I tried to lead the double life but you know what, I talk in my sleep! Kind of hard to keep secrets when you let them out in your sleep!!! LOL! Anyway, D-day was April 13th and NC was established on April 14th. I have not spoken with OM since. I was glad to be out of the mess I had gotten myself into, I thank my husband every day for rescuing me.

Hubby and I then found marriage builders and we went into MC. I should say I was also in IC while the affair was going on. Counseling has gone extremely well, husband has forgiven me, I have forgiven myself. It’s been a rough road, for the both of us but we are committed to our marriage. I feel absolutely horrible for what has happened but I am trying not to dwell on the mistake that I made. I am trying to make my marriage the best damned marriage there is.

The past few weeks have been difficult. I have wanted to break NC but I have not. OM has not made an attempt to contact me and I know he will not.

But it’s not about the OM – it’s about me. Though everything is going good between my husband and I, I still feel like something is missing. I can’t figure out what it is. Some of it has to do with the way I was raised (abused by my dad physically and emotionally) but there is more I am sure.

So after this long explanation to how I got here; I now need your help. Pep, JL, ark, WAT, ncwalker, kiwi, or anyone else… You all are very good at asking the probing questions, to get people to think, to figure things out. Can you please help me out with this one? Do you see anything going on in my explanation that I can do better? I would really appreciate the advice. How do I find out what I am missing in myself or my marriage? I love my husband more than ever before and I want to be the best wife I can possibly be but that means fixing me to some degree, don’t ya think???

Your help is appreciated. Please know though that I can’t post much from work and I try to limit my time on the computer at home so if I don’t get back to you right away it’s nothing personal.

God bless!!!

chackler..

you don't get off that easy...

you can't say that you don't know what it is you are seeking...
you gotta really reflect on that and answer it...
even if the scariest answer is that nothing is missing and it is YOU and YOU alone who stand as the biggest obstacle to your inner contentment and happiness...
no one wants to hear that.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />
human nature and such...much more fun to blame others and external things....

so you need to reflect and you need to answer...
cause the problem with when you go out there searching and you aren't really sure what you are searching for..
you end up using other people and yourself...just to fill up and grab on to something...
and yet it never really fixes whats broken inside...

lots of ways to go on this one..
but no until you tell us what you believe is missing....

lot of times its a simple but difficult shift in attitude...

some times it's changing your ability to be joyful and thankful for what you do have...and you find yourself not so focused on what you don't have....

sometimes eating icecream and sitting by a lake can solve all the problems in the world....

you gotta anwer this one first chackler...then lots of people can help you...

ark

But it’s not about the OM – it’s about me.

Yup, I agree.

What do you think is the most wonderful thing about you?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Tell us.... what about you is THE most wonderful thing you can say out loud?

Pep

I bet you weren't expecting THAT particular question! ~LOL~

Hi Ark and Pep

Thank you for your responses. Man, tough questions off the bat too! I will start with Ark’s question first. I would have to say that I am my biggest obstacle.

I have never been good at relationships, if that makes any sense. I have looked back on my life and I always seem to sabotage everything good that comes my way. That’s how it always has been, as far back as I can remember. Thing is though, I want to change that – I don’t want to be the one that destroys my marriage. I am tired of this cycle that I put myself through.

I have always had some sort of self-destructive behavior throughout my life. Currently that is smoking, before it was the affair, before that it was pot and alcohol. Though I was never addicted to the drugs I was definitely addicted in the affair and am now addicted again through cigarettes.

I notice while I was in the affair I felt so special even though I was not. I have a thing where I need to be liked, appreciated, admired and instead of being comfortable with myself I look elsewhere. My friend who is the same way as I said people like us will never be happy; never satisfied with what we have. That can’t be can it? I don’t want it to be like that. Frankly, I am tired of the selfishness that I see in myself. Others don’t see it as much as I do and I am disgusted by it.

So getting back to your question, it’s me – you are right, nothing is “missing”. I am never content with myself and with what I have, which is a whole heck of a lot. I am married to a wonderful, sexy, compassionate, man. I have a roof over my head, two dogs and a cat. I have a family that’s dysfunctional but a family none the less. God has blessed me in many ways and I am grateful for all these things yes, but I want to be content and that I don’t have.

I hope that I am making sense.

So you are saying that eating ice cream and sitting by a lake won’t help? LOL!

Okay Pep,

The most wonderful thing about me. I would have to say my sense of humor. I make myself laugh, I make others laugh, and I make my hubby laugh, I even think I make my dogs laugh. I really like that about myself, my wicked sense of humor.

Yep Pep, wasn't expecting that one!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

The exploration of an affair will leave these issues inside of you for quite some time I believe.... some may exist from childhood 'stuff', but others arise simply from that 'excitement'. Can that be generated in a marriage that has been 'around the block a couple of times'? I sure hope so, and I think so. Here's the deal, it's up to each of you to spark the other, you can't spark yourself. You can take heart in ways you spark your husband, and hopefully, you two can talk openly about fantasies you have left unfulfilled, or things that inspire you, ways for him to surprise you...trips, times together, presents, whatever. You have to look at those as those exictement sparks...not 'oh, how sweet...', but, think about how he believes you are so special to him, that he went through extra effort or thought or whatever to do that special thing for you.

You know it's not the specific OM that excites you, it's any OM, and I think that is an enormous step to realizing that key component you seek out. I wish I could help you, but I can't really, other than the few words I have said. I hope you find a way to allow your husbands efforts to win you over... how would you feel if he were to all of a sudden plan b you? Just out of curiousity, might that 'wake/shake' you up? Is it simply that you are too comfortable with what you have in front of you? I think realizing that in the next few minutes, you could get that call saying he was in that wreck you heard on the radio traffic report...that is often enough to realize what we take for granted.

Hang in there.

Dear CHackler,

You have been one of my favorite posters and now I am quite shocked. I guess everyone needs some help now and again. So I will do my best to make you think.

Problem is, I now have a reputation for NOT pulling any punches. And fish. Everyone thinks I have fish. No 2x4 from NCWalker. I’m gonna lambaste you with a mackerel.

But first, a quick quiz for CHackler. Are you a Christian woman? You must promise on your honor to take this quiz for me. Don’t skip this. DO this.

Here we go. Do you remember the “Fruits of the Spirit?” Do you know what they are? Depending on the translation you read, they can be a little different. So I will list them for you. The “Fruits of the Spirit” are:

Love
Joy
Peace
Patience
Kindness
Self-Control
Goodness
Gentleness
Faithfulness

Here is the quiz. Please do this. Stop reading and get a scrap of paper. On this paper I want you to write two columns. One titled “feelings” and the other titled “virtues” and I want you to write down the Fruits from the above list in the appropriate columns.

That wasn’t so hard, was it?

OK CH. Story time. A short look into the sordid past of NCWalker.

I have posted on here before that my darling RAP led me to the Lord. I received my salvation about 2 years after we were married. About 5 years after knowing her. She took a lot of flak about marrying a non-Christian. I still will never be able to re-pay that debt to her. But how about “noble, articulate” NCWalker BEFORE RAP came along?

You wouldn’t have liked him. NCWalker was trouble. Big trouble. NCWalker is on the clever side, you see. And mischievous. NCWalker grew up in a town known for partying. As an older teen, once I was driving and “free” of the influences of my parents I sort of blossomed into this person. I mean I partied, but never really severely. I never liked numbing my brain. Did on occasion, but never liked it because I was always wanting my mental faculties ready to go. In case I needed them. I was trouble.

Because I grew up in a town of prevalent partying, the ole teen routine of going out and getting hammered quickly became blasé to me. It was the same old, same old. I needed an outlet for my creativity. I needed to rebel. My home life was one of ORDER. Not abusive, STRICT. When I was in basic training, I was very happy. Everyone thought that was odd that I could be so happy. Felt like home to me. I REALLY rebelled.

My idea of “fun” cannot really be described here due to the statute of limitations and such. My “fun” never really HURT anyone. I mean I never physically hurt anyone to the extent that a hospital stay was required. I was mischievous. REALLY mischievous. Staying one step ahead of local law enforcement mischievous. Think practical joke on steroids. Evil practical joke on steroids. Sometimes harmless. Most times chaos. Think like the end of the movie “Animal House.”

I have great fun reminiscing over those times. Some great memories.

But now I am a dad. And my oldest is asking me, “Hey dad, what did you used to do for fun?” Interesting question for old NCWalker. Do I tell the truth? I can’t give my children any inkling that my behavior as an older teen/young man was acceptable. It was not. But it was FUN! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So yes, I do lie. I tell DS#1 I went to the library, or fished, or worked on cars. Or something like that. What do you tell the DS? He CAN’T follow in my footsteps.

And do you know what else? I was SINNING. Broke a COMMANDMENT for goodness sake. You know the one – Honor Thy Father and Mother.

Didn’t know I was doing it. No. Not true. Didn’t ACKNOWLEDGE I was doing it. But I was. And I remember what I did.

And it makes me smile. I was HAPPY doing that, even though it was wrong. I can’t get rid of the memories. Now that I am “noble and articulate,” wise and gray-headed, the memories are tainted. I still feel happy and have fond memories, but I feel bad for the innocent bystanders nearly harmed or minimally injured. I really do. So it is a melancholy feeling. Kind of sad while happy. Weird. Not proud of who I was. Proud of who I BECAME.

OK. So I am beginning to ramble. You don’t need to here all this. I am tired and rambling and I don’t like to get like this. So I will summarize.

NCWalker did something in his past that made him feel happy at the expense of others. It was a sin and he knows this, but part of him feels happy when he remembers it and part of him feels sad, like the knowledge of what he did stole a piece of a good memory.

Wow. I CAN be concise. That is ALMOST as short as a Pepperband post!.

On to YOUR business, my dear CHackler. Let’s review your first post.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Okay guys I need some serious help…

I had an EA. OM and I use to work …

blah blah blah blah


… but there is more I am sure.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Now let me try this new concise slant again. Hmm…

CHackler did something in her past that made her feel happy at the expense of others. It was a sin and she knows this, but part of her feels happy when she remembers it and part of her feels sad, like the knowledge of what she did stole a piece of a good memory.

Looks like you and I could start a club. The Half Dozen Fishketeers. Or maybe Hackler’s Cacklers, given your humor bent. Better get a big clubhouse though, because EVERYONE is already in it.

CH – Why are you beating yourself up over a happy memory? You realize the wrongness. It has changed you. Made you a better wife. And you beat yourself up over a happy thought. Sure, the wrong reasons were there. But the fact is, there were ASPECTS of your BAD CHOICE you DID enjoy. It was an experience in your life. It’s OK to have some happy thoughts about it. I NEVER would go back to the person I was. I am GLAD that part of my life is over, or I would surely be serving time today. I KNOW it was wrong, but I have some good memories from it. Our experiences DEFINE us. Our CHOICES define us. You made a bad one. And now because you have learned from it, you are making good ones. Don’t be so hard on yourself for having some happy memories over the experience. I mean I wouldn’t reminisce with your husband over them, just as my sons will never hear about my “dark” days. But that doesn’t mean a happy memory is WRONG. It is just a feeling. The right or wrong comes from the action that follows the feeling, not the feeling itself.

Feelings. I WAS rambling about feelings wasn’t I? Oh yeah! The quiz. Do you have your piece of paper? How did you divide them? If you did not put ALL of them under “virtues” you are wrong. Go back to Sunday School. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Most people would have a few of them under feelings. Mostly it would be love, joy and peace. Wrong. Love does not equal “in love,” or “horny” because that is pretty much it when you are in love. Joy does not equal happiness – and that is the one I want to discuss.

So you are down now. You feel sad. Strange as this sounds, you can still BE JOYFUL even though you FEEL SAD. See the difference? You ARE a virtue. You FEEL a feeling. Consider the Fruit of the Spirit analogy. The fruits TELL who you are. They are virtues you HAVE. You are like a tree and these nine fruits grow on you. Feelings are like the weather. It may be hot, or rainy, or cold, or windy. Doesn’t change the fruit that is on the tree of CHackler.

The virtues run DEEP. They define your core spirit. They require tending and God’s grace to grow. You have to PRACTICE them and sometimes you fail. They CANNOT be taken away from you, though you CAN give them up. The feelings are fleeting. Also a choice, but much more susceptible to outside influences.

I guarantee your “missing piece” is a virtue. A Fruit of the Spirit. Till this soil. Grow them. It will make you whole.

Don’t give much thought to the feelings. If you have a happy thought or memory, don’t feel bad about it. You are going to have them. How many times do people say on this board “Don’t let the bad memories of your A get you down?” What is the converse of that? “Don’t let your happy memories pick you up?” That’s just silly. Don’t let things get you down because it is unhealthy to be depressed. The only wrong thing about a happy though would be to start the A back up. Enjoy the feeling and let it pass. I know the regret is attached to the happy thought, I hear it in your posts and your recommitment to your husband. They are forever linked because you realized you have sinned. As long as that is in place, what is wrong with a happy memory?

So something is missing. Till the soil of the FRUITS. Find your JOY. I tell my kids they can find JOY in any situation. And you can. I have seen people whose daily lives are WORSE than your WORST DAY EVER. And they smile. They find JOY. It IS there. Feelings are relative. Fleeting. Not something to base a state of mind on. Feelings are hocus-pocus, smoke and mirrors. Virtues can feed and sustain you.

Take your feelings as they come. No regrets. No worries. No significance. They just are. WORK on those virtues. DON’T let go of them. FIGHT for them. Then you will be whole.

If it is still unclear, ask me about cats one day.

NCWalker

Ba-da-bing, ba-da-bump.

FanTASTIC post, ncw. It applies to anyone, WS, BS, neither, all. Wonderful. This will be the first post I've printed out.

Michele

NCWalker,
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

ya ya ya Mackrel Man, I see your bump. I'm here at work and I can't respond but I can compose and respond tonight! Your post was awesome, all the responses have been truly awesome!!!

God Bless

Chackrel.

eeek - double post!

<small>[ July 17, 2004, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: chackler ]</small>

Wow, great posts everyone, you are making me think! Dang, where is the Excedrin? Actually it's 3:00 am and I have another headache so please bare with me if I don't make sense or have spelling errors.

I'll start with Rook's post...

Rook you mentioned something about the spark that was between OM and I. I recognize that spark for what it was - infatuation. It was nothing more though at the time I thought it was.

The love for my hubby runs very deep, beyond sparks and fluttery stomach. We ARE soulmates. I could not live without this man. If he were to Plan B me or suddenly get into a car crash, I would not be able to function.

I look into his eyes and I see love, love in it's purest form. I look into his eyes and I know, just know, that everything will be okay. The world could fall apart but as long as he's there I will be okay.

To my shame I never really saw that until the night of d-day. When all was out, all the crying was done (for the night) you know what he did? We went to bed and he held me like never before - it is that love that keeps me going.

So I think what's getting to me is one of two things: What Ark said about it being me sabotaging myself or what Mackrel Man said about the virtues and lack there of...


Which of course leads me to responding to Mackrel Man, or would you prefer Fish Face, Trustworthy Tuna, or the Courageous Cod??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Yeppers, I'm a Christian. Oh sure, about four months ago when I was in the affair you wouldn't think so but I am... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You are so right about peace, love and joy. I listed them as feelings. I would have to say Joy and Peace are the two virtues that need a bit of tilling.

If my hubby had to pick out one thing about me that he would change in an instant it's the way I berate myself. I'm trying to change that but it's very difficult given childhood demons and then the whole affair thing. I can take a wonderful thing that happened to me and turn it into a huge downer. Not to everyone else mind you but just myself. I can dress up and look smokin hot and yet there will be something wrong. I can never be satisfied with myself if that makes any sense.

I don't want to blame my past for what I did but I am exploring all of that in IC and MC. It pisses me off to a certain degree that I didn't have a somewhat decent childhood. Then maybe I would be more at peace, and then maybe, just maybe I wouldn't have gotten myself into this mess.

Then again, maybe if I had played the lottery last week I would be a millionare...

Who knows, I am also very cinical about psychological mumbo jumbo stuff. Don't even get me started on Freud!!!

So what was I saying fish man? Oh yah, tilling the fruit in me. I see I need work in this area so where do I get started? Do you have any bible verses you can suggest?? It's more than reading the bible though, thoughts and actions as well. What says you???

Hey!

I'm getting in on this one with Chackler....things she said sound a lot like me. I much prefer fruit to fish!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Love,
Julie

CH,

I hear you. I will have to think on this a bit about getting started tilling for the fruits. I am more of a "concepts guy" with the Bible and am continually amazed at how people can rattle off scriptures. I generally know what it says, but not where it says it.

I can tell you how I do it, and believe me I am NOT perfect at it. Ask RAP. Kind of the "shoemaker's children always have the worst shoes" kind of syndrome. We tend to hold our external gifts back from our families.

But yeah. This is a challenge and I love challenges so look for something by the end of the weekend.

NCWalker

Wow. This is a good thread!

NC: (guess I have not read enough of your posts to get the whole fish thing...so I won't go there...yet), that was an awesome post. You go wit cho bad self! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Chackler: I read a book, which on first glance is going to seem totally unrelated to your challenge, that really brought a lot of this home for me, called "Seeing the Unseen," by Joe Beam. It is about (now don't think I am getting "weird Christian" on you), the influence that the bad guy downstairs has on people, especially Christians. I highly recommend the book because it details how we are influenced, by who or what, why these influences can tend to be so powerful and so dead on to pushing our buttons, and how to knock them out of the ball park so we can be more successful at hearing the really important influence, God.

And guess what the number one thing is that evil you know who uses to influence Christians, or anyone else for that matter???

EMOTIONS

Emotions. A fleeting thought. An insensitive remark from a friend. A bad dream. A trigger that brings back a terrible memory. And all this stuff starts flushing into our soul. Shame. Discontentment. Frustration. Anger. Loneliness.

And we don't like it. We don't like it one single bit. And, so, since most human beings will do pretty much anything to avoid pain, we will do something. And that is usually when we get in trouble.

When we make decisions based on our emotions, not on the will, which is detailed in the word, of God, we will most likely be sinning. And you know who be laaaaaaaughing.

It says in John 10:10 that "The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy"

A woman has heart disease and knows
she must manage her diet wisely, but she feels deprived and angry that she can't have that chocolate.

A man knows his financial situation is tight, but he feels like getting this new credit line, and purchasing that new piece of electronics equipment that "is on sale for only a limited time."

A woman knows in the bible that she is a valued, cherished work of God, but due to her past, she feels like she is a worthless, dirtied person.

A man knows his marriage is sacred, but he feels some spark, some fire when he talks to this other woman, that he has never felt before.

Do you see a pattern. There is something you KNOW and there is something you FEEL.

And I can share this little nugget of truth only because I make this mistake over and over and over and over again. I am the biggest FEELER there is. I feel BIG! Love big. Hate big. Feel accepted BIG. Get rejected BIG. And so I will go make decisions (because, I am a person who makes decisions based on my intuition, BAD IDEA, and will later say, YIKES...WHAT THE HECK WAS I THINKIN???)

Go on what you know God wants you to do, not on what you feel, your emotions tell you to do. This is a simplistic way of saying we must die to the flesh. Die to ourselves. NOT DO WHAT WE FEEL LIKE, BUT WHAT GOD HAS CALLED US TO DO.

And the only way you know what you ought to do, the only way to broaden what you KNOW is by reading the bible.

I used to be like NC where I did not know any specific verses just underlying themes, because, well, the language of the bible confused me. I would read and read and read a verse and think, WHAT THE HECK DID THAT JUST SAY??? It was blah blah blah blah, blah blah, blah blah blah. It never seemed to SINK into me, where I needed it to be. Never seemed to permeate my soul, like so many other things that don't matter do (like a song or a movie or a book).

I did two things and this changed for me.

Firstly, I prayed earnestly for the Holy Spirit to live in me. That way, He could be my decoder ring, and help me decipher what it was that God wanted me to see and learn. Secondly, I got a new bible translation.

I am a lover of language. I love words, love writing (thus my overly long, verbose post today...sorry <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ), love reading. And the King James, NIV, those translations are not written in natural flowing format for me. I guess if I really really concentrated, like when I was in college and would be reading some especially difficult work of literature, like Chaucer, or Shakespeare or something, I could have deciphered it, but I wanted it just to flow into me. So, I bought The Message translation. It read like plain English to me, and it just clicked for me. I actually came to enjoy reading it (which, for me, I must admit, I always chalked up to be something that would never happen). There is also the amplified version, and a lot of others that could help you improve the KNOW.

As far as the FEEL, well, I think there are two points there. Firstly, it goes back to the fruits discussion that NC was having. Secondly, it gets to where there will sometimes be moments where you have to say to yourself, "Self, I DON'T CARE WHAT I FEEL RIGHT NOW, I KNOW WHAT GOD WANTS ME TO DO, AND I WILL DO IT." And then, do it. And then the destroyer (aka satan) will leave, because he hates victory in Christ, and voila, I would wager you will start feeling different.

Now on the fruits discussion, I think there is one resource that is TREMENDOUS!! Have you ever heard of Joyce Meyer? Her website is www.joycemeyer.org. She is a Christian speaker, who is dead on right, not car salesman-ey, like some of these creepy TV Christians are, and I like her best because she is an A1A smart alec and FUNNY (and I share your comment Chackler about my humor being the best I got thing going, and so I respect the fact that this Christian lady is tight with the big man upstairs, but she also makes me LAUGH OUT LOUD HARD with the things she says). She lived a hard life, was sexually abused by her father, and went through some serious heck with her marriage, and God so totally healed her. So totally wanted to use her, which she never ceases to be amazed at, she is like "Um God, let's see, I am not an educated person, with a good background, or even remotely equipped with a track record of good decisions in my past, how can You possibly use me to heal and help others?" And I like to think that God told her, "Well, Joyce, exactly. Then they will know it was Me, God, who chose you, because they will be able to see the MIRACLE in it." She has this teaching series on the fruits of the spirit, on finding contentment and satisfaction, and something I want, this HUGE package with teaching CDs, books, etc. that is called Emotional Healing. I would be willing to go halves on some of these things with you if you are interested (God KNOWS I need them), and we could share them. If you are interested, email me at serenedipiT@yahoo.com.

You were created for good. Period. It says so in Ephesians 2:10, which I shared below in the NIV, Message, and Amplified translations <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> NIV: For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
Msg: No, we neither make nor save ourselves. God does both the making and saving. He creates each of us by Christ Jesus to join him in the work he does, the good work he has gotten ready for us to do, work we had better be doing.
AMP: For we are God's [own] handiwork (His workmanship), recreated in Christ Jesus, [born anew] that we may do those good works which God predestined (planned beforehand) for us [taking paths which He prepared ahead of time], that we should walk in them [living the good life which He prearranged and made ready for us to live]. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So, moral of this long thread. We all need to get better at knowing what God wants us to know (and by the way, He has some very specific thoughts on what we should be FEELING too), applying that knowledge, and then sit back and let the blessing flow.

I will follow this thread and your story closely. I am in a place where I have just about as far to go as anyone else here...so I could use all the insights and perspective I could get...so I hope you don't mind if I borrow from you and the responses you get! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ July 17, 2004, 10:26 AM: Message edited by: SerendipiT ]</small>

Holy Cow DipiT, you are a study in self-examination. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

DipiT,

Oh my goodness! That was incredible.

You said so much that really spoke to me.

Joyce Meyer has been my favorite since 1994. You would think I would be much farther along, but I am just now getting what she says. Slooooow learner or maybe just hard headed. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Chackler,

I am going to jump in here too because like you and onlywords, I have a lot of the same thoughts and questions.

I wonder if I can listen to my H in this? HMMMMM.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Anyway, this is an excellent thread.

God help me get this from the head to the heart!

Pam

RAP - This is a great thread. I put the fruit of the spirit list on my refrigerator. Got a lot of work to do in that area.

It was nice to hear about you leading NC to the Lord. What a great story!

believer,

You have no idea! I will NEVER be able to thank RAP enough for what she did. I have an amazing testimony (actually a few) about how God began walking in my life.

I have been pondering and praying about CHackler's question. I have been praying in the Spirit stongly. I can really feel this one coming.

I read what you wrote and had to post back quick. I am actually getting excited and worked up over this and I am just going to let fly in a bit.

God is absolutely amazing. Truly.

Much Love To You,

NCWalker

NC.....LETTTT 'EERRRRRR RIPPPPPP BROTHER!!! WHEN THE SPIRIT LEADS YOU....YOU KNOWWWWWWW IT IS GONNNNNNAAAAA BE GREAT!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Can't wait to hear what He's giving you.

;-)