I am very comforted by the support I've found here. I realize this sight may be one of the only things that keeps me sane. Good positive responses is what we all need, and I seem to be getting it here.

No disrespect to anyone else, but melodylady, some things you tell me really give me the will to keep going. Everyone else is great too, so please don't stop talking with me, I need you guys.

We talk of plan B. I suppose it's already been put into effect. I mean she told me she was in love with OM and was going to be with him. We know that. First time she left was different. She said she was confused, needed time and space, you know the usual stuff. It really is sort of textbook isn't it? After coming back and trying to work on us for 2 months, I feel she caved in to her desire (addiction) to be with OM too soon. She made it clear this is what she wanted and this was it. I hugged her and watched her leave. That hurt, again.

I forgot about the letter. I had written her a very long letter before she came to drop the hammer on me. A very loving and caring letter stating everything from how much I loved her, to I wish we tried a little harder, and finally that if she really wanted this that I would not interfere or pursue her anymore. Her happiness is what is important. A real show of love I guess. It was a very long letter, I can't remember everything but she did take it and it's got to have some effect on her whether she reads it now or in the future.

That's where I am now. I guess that was a plan B letter of sorts, and I didn't even know I was doing it. I just came home from work after her phone call with the heartwrenching " I think we need to talk", and I began writing.

Now she is out visiting him in AZ. for a few days. When she gets back she'll eventually call about our plans to split everything up and deal with the house. Remember, we're not married but we do own the house together. This will really put closure on us. Or so it seems.

I don't want to answer the phone when she calls. I don't know if that's the right thing to do or how long I should resist her attempts to contact me. I just get the feeling that if I automatically pick up the phone every time she calls, and give in to her every wish, that she'll see me as just waiting for her to come back again. And that is not the feeling we want to convey here. We want our cheating partners to eventually feel withdrawal from us, right?

It's such a game, with so many losers. It's sad, and hard to keep faith. I have much less hope of this working out than I did when she first left the house. And that was about 2 weeks after I discovered the A. She didn't waste any time moving to her sisters, and I didn't waste any time starting to beg her to come home. I know now how stupid begging was, and when I finally stopped is when she called and wanted to get together to talk. All textbook.

How do you get to this point and still remain hopeful. It seems she has tried and this time made up her mind for good. But like you guys keep saying, she doesn't really know the OM and this time they are getting now could be beneficial to my struggle. As crazy as it is, as much as it hurts, you just got to sit and let it unravel. I hope it turns in my favor, and statistics say I've got a good chance, right? Help me here....right???

So no more letters , no more calls. Just move on with me, and watch. I hope I can do this. Do you all really think I have a chance. She said she loved me still, but her feelings for him were nawing at her. I know she loves me or she wouldn't have attempted to try. From what I see she's got to get this out of her system before she can think clearly. Then maybe I have a chance. Feed back please.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">After coming back and trying to work on us for 2 months, I feel she caved in to her desire (addiction) to be with OM too soon. She made it clear this is what she wanted and this was it. I hugged her and watched her leave. That hurt, again.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Joe, what you don't understand is that her behavior is pretty TYPICAL of a WS in withdrawal. They often do go back and forth because they are CONfUSED. We see this ALOT and that is why I know this is not necessarily the sign of doom that you see. It is all part of the PROCESS. Two steps forward, three steps backward.

And one of the reasons I think you may get her back is because you executed a flawless Plan A. I don't think the OM is a good man at all and she will discover that soon enough. I mean, here is a man who has abandoned a wife and a baby. That relationship will interfere in her little romance.

A true plan B letter tells the WS that you love her and not to contact you until she has ended contact with the OM. It gives a PATH BACK. I like this post written by the furnitureman - see if your letter met all this criteria:

Here is the suggested setup for a PBL. (Straight from Chris -CA123)

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 - You love her.
2 - You want to stay married.
3 - You are sorry for your part in bringng the marriage to the state it is. Also that you are learning (ala MB) how to make a relationship better and take into account the other persons feelings with all your actions.
4 - You have to cut off all contact because of the pain of her continued affair.
5 - You will agree to contact again when she gives up the affair and agrees to discuss what is needed for reconciliation.
6 - You love her.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here is my Plan B letter experience. You can see my original and the reasoning behind the changes I made.

In the event that you have neither the desire nor stamina to read the thread, here is the final version of my PBL.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*************
Dearest WW,
It is with the heaviest of hearts that I write you this letter. I am saddened by what has become of us, our friendship, our marriage. This letter is written to you as a necessity. Allow me to explain.

The eight years that we have been together were filled with an endless number of hugs, smiles, tears and laughs. I have loved you every minute of every day that we have spent together.

I realize that I have not been a perfect husband to you. I see now that both my attitude and financial irresponsibility drove a wedge into our marriage. I apologize to you. You must know that I never intended to hurt you or push you away from me.

The pain that your relationship with OM3 and the relationships that you have had during our marriage has been unimaginable. Continued contact with you has the potential of destroying my love for you and I don't want that to happen.

It is because of this that I must insist that we no longer contact each other, until you are no longer involved with OM3 or anyone else. I ask that you respect my decision. In the event of an emergency, or any necessary financial matters, please contact your mom, and she will contact me. Once you have ended your relationship with OM3 completely, please contact me, and I will be willing to discuss restoring our friendship and marriage.

I am committed to our marriage. I believe that we can build a marriage that is stronger and more beautiful than we have experienced. Beginning today, I walk forward in life, and I want you to walk with me. I love you with all of my heart.

Your loving husband,
Ethan
******************

And Joe, I hope you pursue this opportunity with the OMW. There are no guarantees but this could be a huge help. Along with any other exposure opportunities you see. Exposure shines the light of day on an affair that survives on secrecy.

I'm a bit hesitant with contacting OMW. My girl kind of makes me think that at this point she made up her mind and doesn't care who knows. She has a small family, 2 really close cousins. They already knew about the A and now they know about her new decision to leave again. They called me and are devestated too. Things were going so good, we had started to hang out as a couple with everyone again. They all made fun of how in love we seemed. Now this. They say move on. We here at MB don't give up that easily.

Joe, your W only knows what she has been told by a LIAR and it is usually a LIE. You may discover that the OM and his wife are very much together and trying to work things out. Often when exposed to the OMW, the OM will DUMP the OP because he doesn't want to lose his wife. Often they have no intention of ending their marriages and are just getting some on the side. This may very well be the case. That is why you cannot afford to miss this great opportunity.

Thanks. I know I'm being stupid and reluctant. So much reassurance is neede in times so confusing. That's why I'm here, and I'm thankful for your support. I did a background check and as of 3-1-04 OM and OMW still show up on record at same address. I have to do this now while the cheaters are together. I don't know what I'll say, but Im sure it will come to me.
I read some posts on this and they say it would be good to have someone else make the call, but I have no one in mind. It's all me. A bit scared of LB'ing.

Joe, I think its always best for the BS to call. Who better to relate to than another BS? You know all the facts.

And there is no reason that your WS could legitimately object. I mean, she has told you that OMW knows all about it so what is the problem? It's ok if she gets mad, they often do, but you can't let that stop you from using this VALUABLE tool.

Joe,
Take ML's advice. It's valuable.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Often when exposed to the OMW, the OM will DUMP the OP because he doesn't want to lose his wife </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Doing this now, while she is out there may be the perfect time.

Thanks again for the help.
I found out that the OM was trying to use his BS's drinking problem as a reason for divorce. Claiming that's why their relationship fell apart. No matter. Got to do what I got to do. Actually just dialed the # but got no answer. I'm going to send a letter and keep trying. Wish me luck.


3

Joe, how did you find out about this? Who told you?

P.S. please keep trying to call her, ok? Today would be ideal since you know where her H is. She might not know. Letters can be intercepted.

Apparently my WS has confided in one of her close cousins and divulged this information to her earlier on in this. D'day was 1-7-04. She moved out only 4 days later. After 17 years her cousins think of me as family too, but wouldn't betray WS by telling me too much.

I always knew they had more info than they would admit. Getting it out was the problem. They were there to console me. Can't blame them for being more loyal to her.

Here's some more scoop. OM is 33, OMW I think is 43, I'm 39 and WS is 36. Supposedly this divorce was going to take a long time because they were married in a different state, and something about custody rights for the 6 month old child. OM trying to dis credit OMW with alcoholism. OM and WS haven't really discussed plans to really be together yet. My WS had just started talking about children last summer. Maybe she wants to raise someone elses too.

Their situation doesn't sound appealing but she still chose it over me. That really hurts.
We have a very stable home and perfect timing for a family, financially anyway. WS says she needs someone in her life that's more her equal. I guess she means because they both work in the same field, same company but different locations. And I'm a carpenter. And supposedly I have no confidence.

You see, I work for a builder and make 100,000 a year. But she wants me to start my own company so I could have freedom to meet her when she travels and stuff. She thinks that's exciting and I really don't like to travel alone or have the freedom to. And when we go out to eat she usually steps up and gets us a table. She needs a man to take charge in those situations. Good enough reasons to leave me right?

But it didn't all start there. We weren't getting along much last year and we did a lot of drinking ourselves. I got caught up in whiskey a little, but have stopped cold turkey since xmas. There was arguing when we came home after a night out. That's it though. I think their email relations were going on for a long time and she initiated a lot of the tension.

Anyway that's where we stand for now. I will try to get more info.

H

Joe, you do realize that all this info about the OM and his W came FROM the OM, right? He is a liar and often they will tell the WS whatever they need to tell them to get them into the sack. It may be true, but I sure wouldn't count on it.

And she still hasn't chosen the OM over you. She may very well change her mind again. She has done it before. They always go back and forth, Joe.

Please keep trying to call the OMW, ok?

I'm hearing all you say. Thank you for helping me see clearly. I feel selfish... how are you doing? Sorry, I've been wrapped up in my own mess.

Oh yeah, I forgot. I didn't really have the whole plan B letter format down when I wrote the other day. My writing was scattered at best, but many, many words. Is it wise to write a letter under a strict format now? Or will that be too muc?

Joe - ditto Mel.

Yes, compose a new Plan B letter following the guidance you've received here and also see the example in Surviving An Affair.

In a nutshell, here's the Plan B punch line: You (WS) decided to separate from me and now I'm decided to STAY separated until you recommit to our marriage.

This puts you in control, even though it may not feel like it. YOU now decide when she can interact with you. You insulate yourself from the ususal WS antics and avoid a lot of hurt. In essence, it's an affair time out for you and you get to decide when the clock starts again. As time expires - no matter who's with who - you win.

Trust me on this.

Hi Joe

Can you post the letter here and we can take a look at it?

Please listen to MelodyLane about telling the OMW... have you talked to her yet?

I haven't started the letter yet. I am still trying to get an answer on the other end. I will continue my efforts.

I actually went out with friends and had a decent time last night. I have to start my letter tonight. Today just make it through the day at work.

Afriend called last night and said they spoke with WS yesterday and OM was there. Obviously, their together in Az., sort of like a romantic vacation. I want to puke. Anyway, this friend said you could hear the guilt in WS voice and feel the despair. I don't know if it's true. But this friend is pretty straight forward and very close to WS, throughout this whole thing. Friend said that just 2 weeks ago Ws told her everything was great between me and her. Just another dip in the road. 2 steps forward, 3 steps back.

Friend asked me how I could want someone back after they could hurt you so much. Hahaha! I ask myself that every day. But when you love somebody, really love somebody, you feel you can't let go and will never turn your back when they need help. And help is what they need to get out of the fog.

You gotta wonder though. How much love could they have for us to repeatedly rip our hearts out? And that's the question they ask themselves, or tell themselves. " I guess I don't love you as much as I thought, or I wouldn't hurt you like this". Ever heard that one? Talk to everyone tonight I hope.

Well, I didn't put in a full day at the job. Almost made it, but no motivation. Been there, done that. I'll get better. I heard that my WS is actually suppose to meet the OM mother while she's with him in Az. Not a good sign , but I remain hopeful.

Obviously I haven't heard from her since she told me it was over last thursday. I'm still going to work on that Plan B letter, and I'm still trying to contact OMW. I'm trying by phone, and just sent a letter to back it up. I know letters can be intercepted, but it doesn't hurt to try.
Anyone I spoke to today just said give it up, move on, she clearly made her mind up. I can't believe that, or listen to them. I really believe my WS is in the fog.
Last 2 months she said she was not contacting OM at all while working on us. You know how far I thought we were getting? I mean, we were looking at property to build a new home for our new start, just last sunday. And we both took off work this week to start getting our house ready to sell. I found out that OM was emailing her, and probably text messaging too. That's how I really found out you know?
Woke up to go to bathroom in the mid of the night and heard her phone buzzing on the counter. I saw that it was a message. I don't even want to remember the words that appeared. I mean pet names and everything. That was a tough night confronting her. I held her and told her everything was going to be alright. I was comforting rather than outraged. Don't know how or why, I just was.

Anyway, she swore to a friend of ours that she wasn't responding to OM at all. Too bad I bet she was reading the emails. And that's just as damaging . No contact means no contact, right? I wish she had talked to me about it, but during our brief attempt at recovery I was the one being open and honest. I was just waiting for her to open up to me. So many intimate moments, what happened? How did she give up like that? I only pray that she misses me again and I get another chance.

Melodylady says it's common for the WS to go back and forth like this. I hope your right, and it only happens one more time, coming back.

Is it common for the WS to turn on a dime like that. There were so many nice things she said to me just nights before she decided to leave. So much love making all weekend. So many plans being made. And we were starting to go out with friends and family again. Most everyone in her family said welcome back to me. Everyone is so hurt again.

WS sister called me. Says I don't deserve this treatment and thatWS spouse doesn't deserve such a wonderful guy like me. She says there's no way I should take her back. Ther's no telling when she'll just do it again. Maybe she's right, but when you love somebody, even a BS is in the fog. Peace!