The past week on MB has been a major downer. We've got a whole mess of miserable BSs (here!), we've got WWs who don't pay attention to advice that isn't what they want to hear, blah.

At least Juke's wife seems to have her finger in front of the defogger button...

How about a few quick rundowns from people in recovery? How hopeless did it get, and how long did it take?

GC

I would consider myself a MB success even though I didn't practice it's principles very well at the first sign of the affair. I have since implemented them and have a wonderful marriage!

Graycloud,
Good post, it has been a bad week, hasn't it?

I found this site after D-day, looking for anything to offer me some hope of recovery!

My H's affair was over so I did not use Plan A or Plan B to end it but at the beginning, I would have held little hope that we would remain married.

After almost 3 years, our marriage is on relatively good ground. I have read so much here and learned how to cope with the aftermath of a spouse's affair, it most likely saved my marriage.

I'm gonna bump this thing until we get some satisfaction...

Orchid, H4F, KiwiJ, can I get a holla? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

GC

I consider myself an MB success even though my 1st marriage wasn't. I found this place in December 1999. My divorce was final in September 2000.

I am now remarried and have a great marriage!!! Thanks to everything I learned at MB!!!

I became a much stronger person. Learned that I can make myself happy and can be independent!

Mitzi <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Oh ok, here I am <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I'm really trying to cut down on my time here. Work has been taking up all my time.

I guess my success can be measured by what's happened to me and H in the last week. I've gone on and on here about work and this is what I've found this week.

My H has been my rock, my support, my soft place to fall, my friend...I said to him this morning "I need you right now because I'm really struggling with this part of my life (work)." He said "I know and I'm here."

BTW he was rewarded the other morning for being so cool. We laughed about it, it wasn't manipulation on my part, it was a very nice joke about how he met my needs so I was going to meet his No 1 need.

I said to him as I left for work "we're never going to go to that place we were at in our marriage again." (meaning pre A when I watched him get deeply depressed because of grief and Idid nothing about it because I didn't know how to - ie ask if there was anything he needed from me to make him better).

Next month is our 30th wedding anniversary and we're going to celebrate it in style - not sure how yet. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Jenny

Graycloud,

Cheer up.

A few days ago I was in despair. I cried my heart out, prayed my guts out...

My husband showed up here last night (straight from the arms of OW presumably) in a very loving frame of mind.

He has just left. We had a great time.

I don't know what happened to bring this about, and I didn't ask any questions, but I did some good plan A-ing and he is talking about coming back in a few days.

He just now texted me saying he loves me.

Graycloud, don't give up.

Shul

Thanks, KiwiJ. Now get the hell back to work! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Shul, I'm so glad to see you here, and yours is the best news I could have gotten today. I remember your rough patch, and I'm sure it seemed permanent to you at the time.

Sorry if I'm a downer. My friends are all unavailable and I spent the weekend all alone. I shopped today for an anniversary gift I probably won't even give my WW, and my new bed is too big with a mattress like a slab of granite (violins should come in right about here).

I miss my crazy little sparrow so much. I have a date this week, but it's not for an anniversary dinner with my W, it's for a big pity party OMW and I are going to throw ourselves over a few plates of sushi.

GC

GC, ok, ok - I'm getting back to work. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Have you got the pup yet?

I still hold out quite a lot of hope for you and the sparrow. You think right. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Jen

Thank you KiwiJ. I haven't got the pup yet. I have to call the breeder. I have sticker shock, but I'm still going to get him. She knows I'm freaked about the cost, but she won't sell him out from under me. I'll manage a way. Maybe I'll throw a kegger and turn it into a fundraiser.

I'm so thankful I have all the MBers and a great family and great friends, even though the stupid friends hung me out to dry this weekend!

GC

I think my W and I would qualify as a success. It has been an unpleasant trip, but the things we have learned from it have made our M stronger than it has ever been before.

I was the WS. I had a six month EA with a longtime friend, which progressed to a 2 week PA. For some reason I always like to point out that while we did get somewhat physical, we never slept together. I think that's important; others here think it's a useless factoid.

I went through all of the classic stages. At first I didn't want to hurt anyone any more than they had already been hurt, and that included OW, as well as her family. It took me 3-4 months to figure out that OW was not my concern any more, and that I needed to let her go...to trust that God would protect her and see her through HER journey. MY first priority was to MY marriage and MY W, not someone else's W. It was a hard thing to accept, because I wanted to accept ALL the blame...to be the martyr, the protector, probably just to try and redeem myself, if only in my own eyes. But with time, I realized that I needed to take responsibility for MY actions, and make OW take responsibility for HER actions.

I didn't believe other posters when they told me I didn't LOVE OW; that I couldn't because I didn't really KNOW her, etc., etc., etc.

The reason my W and I have had a great recovery? That's simple.

My Wife.

She has never read any MB literature, but she could have written it all. She, as far as I'm concerned, handled the entire situation about as perfectly as anyone could. She never ranted, never threatened. She listened calmly, and was, and still is, ready to listen at any time. Without judgement or hysterical reaction. She is also willing to trust me again, even though I've hurt her worse than anyone else ever has. She is willing to believe me when I tell her that I am truly sorry for it happening, and that it will never happen again. She is willing to go away with my children for a weekend trip, and leave me home alone, and trust me to keep my promises.

When she found out, she cried...a lot. We talked...a lot. I asked for her forgiveness and she gave it. But she also laid down the law...there was only going to be ONE chance at forgiveness. If the A ever recurred, or another one occurred, then she would be out of here in a minute. And I believe her. It wasn't a threat...it was a condition of her forgiveness, and her way of establishing limits.

As I said, I've been through all the stages. We just went through our first anniversary of D-Day in June. It weighed heavily on BOTH our minds; but we talked about it, rather than try and pretend there wasn't that elephant in the room. We shared our anxieties, and we listened to each other.

We both regret that the A happened. But we both are mature enough to see that it has forced us to improve the condition of our marriage to a state where it never was before. Our recovery has only worked because BOTH of us are willing to work, as partners, on our marriage. Neither feels they are OWED anything, or is any better or worse than the other. Our marriage today is closer to 1Corinthians 13, than the day of our wedding when it was read to us by the Pastor.

Here's something I wrote early on here at MB...and I still feel it is true.....


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Here's my take on it....

The couples that make it work, and have a less difficult time rebuilding are the couples where BOTH members start thinking that the "WE" is more important than "ME".

Neither member focuses on what wrongs were done them, or how they are going to "get even". They don't worry about who did what to whom first, or last. They understand that for a WS to do what they did, something had to be missing from the marriage. They also understand that pointing fingers, assigning blame, and keeping a record of wrongs accomplishes nothing.

They see themselves as part of a COUPLE. Not just one of two individuals who happen to share the same house, bed, children, etc. They are willing to look beyond their own hurt for the good of the marriage. They are willing to accept that they screwed up somewhere along the line, whether they are the BS, WS, or whatever other little acronymn you want to attach to them.

They commit to the other person. They believe in the other person, and the marriage.

They Love each other as much as themselves. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sorry this is so long. But you asked for success stories...

clay

Grey,

I'm what I would describe an MB success. D-day was 1 1/2 years ago. I found MB about 6 weeks after d-day and learned everything I could.

My husband and I counseled with Steve Harley for several months and he helped us make a life-plan for rebuilding our marriage.

I don't think we could have avoided the counter-intuitive emotional landmines if we hadn't had the personal coaching with SH. I know for sure we avoided many painful mistakes. With SH as a coach my husband and I weren't in the position to educate each other, and actually supported each other through the painful parts of coaching.

Recovery is going well, although our marriage still takes effort on our part to keep from getting lazy and falling back into old habits.

Where we are is so rewarding and fulfilling. I'm glad I didn't just do what I and others in my positon always said we would do which was "walk" if we found our husbands ever had an affair.

Instead like all of you, I took the harder road, and stayed to work on my marriage. Find out what my lessons were on this particular journey and learn what the affair had to teach me.

You see it's easy as a BS to want to be the victim, angry, resentful, hurt etc. I did it too; it's just that the longer I stayed in that negative mentality, the longer it took for me to figure out what my responsibilities were for the state of our marriage.

I do NOT accept any responsibility that my husband had an affair; however I did take responsibility for my LBs and learned what my husband's ENs were. I also like who I am more as a result of this journey.

I've learned that I have strength and courage far beyond what I thought before; and I know I will survive/thrive as a result!!

The journey is worth it, especially in my case.

I was babysteps #22221 D-Day was April 2002. Went to marriage counselling after about 2 of the most horrible weeks of my life. In an article the MC gave us was the MB address. I believe that the address alone was worth the cost of MC. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

My ROLLERCOASTER Chronologically:

1st 6 months : total train wreck. H continued to evade and not recognise the impact of his A or didn't want to take responsibility. The A was "unique" it did not happen to anyone else, OW was "good friend" Fog was thicker than pea soup.
OW helped (GAD! never thought I would ever ever type this!!!) by becoming totally whacko and turning up at my workplace with daughter. A slight crack of light at the end of the tunnel.
Many many nights of shouting recriminations and "Sorry it was a mistake". Nowhere near "Forgive me I was a prize [censored]". I dropped 25lbs and started to be aware of my own fog -- I have always been too independant...learning to work as a team. Learning to live as a family.

2nd 6 months : H is Beginning to read S. Harley's book and MB. H slowly realising a lot had to do with depression. Less "rewriting" of marriage history. Y'know how I was the most negative bad mother in the world turning into we did have good times and did I say that???
Starting to get back to "normalcy". Son is happier without too much screaming and tears. He was only 3. Good days Bad Days Trigger Days. Grieving for loss of marriage "ideals". Taking steps to build new one.

2year: Better days outnumber bad days. Triggers fewer more affection and understanding all around. Was on MB lurking posting leaning on the good people here who knows what it is really like. It was especially sanity saving for me because I told none of my friends or family. THANK YOU ALL!
Still at the end of 2003, I was close to a breakdown when the breakthrough happened. Was feeling "why the heck am I still in this when it could happen again?" Son was at my mom's when we had a blazing row one where I finally learnt to spell out what I needed to hear. The VERY SPECIFIC words of remorse that I needed in order to start to heal. I made promises that night too. H started voicing his needs more specifically. We came closer together than we have been in our 9 years.
Have a few bad days. These are fewer and fewer. We are conciously trying to spend more time together. Still taking babysteps forward.

Thanks graycloud for this opportunity to see for myself how far we have come. Hope you get your silver linining soon.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Well, I don't know if this is success, or even recovery GC, But....

It's been a sucess at making me a better person.

Clay, I very much enjoyed your post.

Any success stories where the WS was the wife? Seems like lots of men return.

I would definatly call us a success story - but not necessarily a MB success story. How I WISH we'd had Marriage Builders when we were going through our insanity!

Total time of dissention was about 2 years. We were seperated for a year of that. I was back and forth several times in that 2 years. We dated while seperated for a month or so. I never lived with the OM - it was mostly phone conversations and emailing/chatting. But we had a whole future planned out. I really struggled with divorcing, however. But since my H never pressured me - I didn't move forth with it very fast. As a matter of fact I didn't even file until H asked me to - about 6 months prior to us reconciling. I think him making me do the dirty work of the divorce made all the difference.

All my friends believed my fog - even my counselor believed it. But in the end I realized that none of them had to live with the consequences. I was lucky that my H was willing to put his head on the chopping block one last time. He did insist on actions instead of just more of the same words he'd heard so many times before. He was pretty much through with it all and ready to move on - he even had a 'lady friend' who was ready to take a place in his life. I know there was little love left for me when we got back together - I think he was working more on hope and his moral convictions (hates divorce, wanted to remain a family).

Thanks, H4F. In the last few months I haven't seen a whole lot in the way of real textbook MB successes. Successes in terms of marriages saved, I mean. Maybe I should have put it differently, because nobody that gets personal growth out of this experience is a failure, even if his marriage ultimately ends.

I did not know your H started to see someone during your separation. I also don't see how I can wait for a D to be final then sit around for another year before getting back out there.

GC

Another MB success story checking in as requested!

[H] and I are a MB success. 3+ years for us!!

Just this weekend I was reading the latest Oprah magazine and my hubby saw Dr. Phil. He does NOT like him, but praised MB. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

We're going through a rough spot with our newest edition to our family being in the hospital, but without MB we wouldn't be able to go through this and survive.

Read the links in my signatue. Before you do, go to the restroom and get something to drink. They are novels!!

It does get better, just keep the faith and follow MB. Hang in there!

K

4+ years in recovery.

How bad did it get?
-H's 18 month PA with a co-worker, EA longer
-7 separations 14 months out of 21
-My 18 month Plan A (some times better than others) thru first 6 seps.
-7th separation the longest at 5 months, I served D papers
-I began dating (bad idea, brought in a 4th person to the mess)

The good things?
-strengthened faith in God
-great Christian counselor on our 3rd try, would spend almost 2 years in counseling (IC, MC,
the C's couple's bible study)
-MB (me 5 1/2 years & counting)
-great friends who stuck with us

So, 2+ very bad years out of 21 years of marriage really isn't that much of the whole. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

And now H is/will be deployed for over a year, but the emails are love letters and I believe we're steady enough to get through it.

We are two years past d-day. We are madly in love and really happy. Thoughts of the A fade away more and more.

MB and the wonderful people on the JFO and recovery boards have helped us so much.

How bad did it get?
I wanted to leave H on d-day and many times after. Lowest point: violent fight where he hit me with his fist after 6 months of "recovery". That night he admitted the A had been for two months and not just two weeks.

H put a lot of effort into repairing our M. I stalled, I was angry (furious is the better word), I withdrew. The wonderful people here put me back on track, when I wanted to throw the towel (eg. date "Dr. Luca", or do stupid things with old BF). I am so glad they did.

Now life is good again!

How bad did it get? Here is an excerpt from our last "fallout" that I posted on the pg board:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> D'ya know what got to him? The last time we had a fallout and his "flight" response kicked in, I told him if he was gonna leave, then leave. BUT TAKE EVERYTHING WITH HIM THAT HE WANTED. I had him pack it all, clothes, photos, and everything that reminded me of him (sans the kids of course). All the baby toys, the bottles, everything - even the highchair (giggle that was funny him trying to elbow that thing in the van). Once he got it all in the van (because I was making him take the van, instead of his truck - I reasoned that HE was gonna be the one with 6 kids, I don't need the POS), he came in and was dallying around. I told him flat out I didn't want to see him or hear from him for at least two weeks. I also told him that he should seriously consider only minimal contact with the kids because he IS NOT A GOOD PERSON when he is with OW (I know that's where he'd have ended up) and I WILL NOT HAVE HIM showing my kids that this is "normal". Told him also that SHE is not a good person no matter what he says, and he KNOWS she is a shoddy mother at best - I WILL NOT HAVE HER CORRUPTING MY CHILDREN. I didn't want them at her house (which we know is infested) or around her family (who, if truth be told, are "from the other side of the tracks," not that that's bad, but they def. have a warped view of the moral code that the rest of us try to live up to).

He sat down at the table and was quiet for a very long time. He KNEW I spoke the cold, hard, plain truth - and it had been something in the past that I tiptoed around in order NOT to hurt his already wounded feelings. He then said, c'mon, we're going to dinner. I looked at him and told him I am not going anywhere anymore playacting as a family. It's all or none. He simply said that he was staying. And he has. Neither one of us has the "d" word slip out again. Neither one of us even contimplates it. We look forward and in the here and now...when we glance back it's only to see how far we've come.

I pray those of you still in the PA and PB areas of the path find the peace that God and MB has brought us.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">For those of you that don't know my story: Dh and I have TWO OC - Mija was born 12/5/02, and Mijo was born 4/18/04. I was told about mija's (and the a's) existance Jan/03. Dh quit the a, but we had visitation, so there was more than enough contact with OW to re-kindle the a - especially since I was major LBing and dh was in his own horrid depression. Dday #2 was 11/03....and we're still here, and NOW we have help and God has our backs. We are at our happiest since his mom passed in 01!

- Kimmy