I felt the need to respond--without threadjacking and "disturbing the peace"--to the thread currently rolling.

I'm glad to see there is a thread (and a place in general) where you guys can vent, have empathy (not just sympathy) for each other, support, etc. It's a pain I wouldn't wish on anybody and admire you for your attempts to really, really trying to save your M and your dedication. (NOT sarcastic.)

However, reading the thread, I became resentful, angry, hurt, frustrated by some of the posts, and narrow-minded comments(IMHO) and the separation of "them vs. us." I think it was K who simply asked, "And the meaning of this thread?"

For all who don't know, we are trying to rebuild our M and am recovering from an EA I had (which was just the latest of situations in our M that we both have dug ourselves in real deep.) Once me and the OW realized *CONSCIOUSTLY* what we were doing, we stopped.

I'm not in the "fog" about the OW--I'm in the fog about my M. (I know these words are going to be thrown in my face.) *BIG* f'ing difference.

And I *am* a "good guy"; I am capable of being "loyal"--at one time I was. And yeah, I'm hurting just like every one else on this board.

I'm trying now, at this very moment, to deal with a W (more words to be thrown back in my face, just like all of the other words in the past 11 years--Hmmm...could *this* be a contributing factor to why I stuff? Hmm.....(More words!))--that jumped to, what is defined as Plan A and Plan B, somewhere in between, that is more or less pointing the finger and saying, "You did this. Everything wrong (mostly) is your fault." I *know* accountability is something I need to work on. (Not repeating the story.) But at the same time, how did it get this far? Oh, but then again, the responses to that will be, "Oh, LINY, you're still in the fog." And let's set the record straight--I am *NOT* justifying the EA--I'm just trying to "justify" my M.

Once conscioustly I realized how I was behaving (and not just with the EA,) I have also made a conscious decision to work on the M. And I feel like I'm being trampled--let me answer the responses to this quote: "Guilt, maybe, LINY?"-- and like I told the Mrs. last night, living with Jekyl & Hyde.

So....to answer K's question, if asked, "What's the reason for this thread?" Twofold: I cannot and *will* not speak for other WS out there, but *I* *AM* a good guy. (The insinuation on the other thread, IMHO, was that I was just a "scumbag"-pardon the expression. *I* took offense. Second, I guess it's just part of my own healing process that I would even care. Anybody who is on this board gives a damn.

Whatever.

Bring it on--I know the "fog" responses are coming, along with probably a few 2X4's.

LINY,


Well, I'll jump in here as a FWW...you brought something up I hadn't quite put the way you did....about being in a "fog" about your M!!! That is true! Yeah, i was in a "fog" about OM, but what I didn't realize was that part of that fog was also about my M!

I believe that most of us WS's are good people. Those that don't want to believe it are just protecting themselves.

If you take a 2x4, I'll take one with you!

Onlywords

Hmm I guess what is so frusting to BS's is that by involving another you have substantially diluted your ability to get through the Fog of M.

I would but nearly 75% of all marriages are in a fog. The difference is that an affair saps the ability of the M to make any clarity.

Sad

OW: One thing I didn't mention and it's sort of a contradiction in my own personal recovery (my goodness, I have a lot of work on me!), but...I will be standing stiff as a board awaiting my 2x4's--I deserve them. ("Please sir. Can I have another!") Thanks for standing with me! Gotta go now...will be expecting that I could probably build a house tonight with the amount of lumber that's here by the time I get to read again.

No 2x4's or fog statements here.

I'm a loyal husband. You define yourself, I will not do it. You are a "good guy" ... OK

In fact glad you are here, and consciously made a decision to work on your M. The key word being "work". Sometimes its not pleasant, that's why it's called work.

The Work is needed on both sides. Your LW and you both have to contribute. I imagine it is frustrating. I hope that I get the opportunity sometime in my future to experience it. You and your wife know she contributed to your vulnerability. But she didn't make you do anything. She didn't make you wayward, and she didn't make you come back. It is great to have a choice, and it is great to be chosen.

I feel a lot of defensiveness in your response. And if you have experienced alot of things being revisited and thrown in your face, that my be why you react this way.

I too have been defensive, and still am sometimes. I look for hidden meanings that sometimes, (hell most times) are not there.

Wishing you a healthy recovery.

RS: Absolutely. And once that was realized, as I say, "conscioustly", I stopped.

LINY,
I'm not jumping anywhere, no 2X4, no fog talk.
I'm trying to figure out why this thread bothered you.

Did anyone personally attacking you, criticize you, or hold you down in your own recovery, except your W maybe?

Sometimes I read through the threads and SOMETHING will touch a nerve somewhere. And something in that thread touched one of yours.
What is it ?


Maybe you've answered a lot of my questions in your post.

Guilt, I would agree, my H is MOST guilty of this. His guilt becomes so intense, that he twists things around to ease his own pain. This was not something as a result of the A, but of who HE is, and probably always will be.

For example, if I did something, that caused pain or conflict in our M, it was far easier for my H to forgive me, as opposed to forgiving himself.

He's quite hard on himself, most of this stems from his upbringing.

There's more you want to say.

Hi Liny - don't recall responding to you previously.

I believe you are a good guy - now. I wish for you to find everything you need to stay that way.

But you were pond scum when you were participating in a marital betrayal.

And by the way - it IS we vs them when the "them" is an alien abductee, i.e., a WS in the act.

It's "them" because rationality and logic go completely out the window. There is nothing in common between the two competing thought processes. It's like trying to comunicate with a Tickle Me Elmo.

Are all WSs in the act of equal pond scum density? No, of course not. Some are WAY worse than others. Sorta like being raped can have degrees of worseness.

WAT

LINY,

I found your message interesting because it could have been my H writing this message. He had the exact same EA like you did, only his lasted for 8 (eight!!!) years off and on. Both parties have now consciously broken off the EA.

I'm completely aware that I have contributed at least 50% of what led to the problems/issues and breakdown in our marriage and I take full responsibility. However, I have also realized my mistakes and errors and I have taken steps to correct behavior/problems, so that I will never have to deal with any of this in ANY relationship ever again, whether it be this relationship or any other one.

I'm glad that you are here and that you are working on your M and trying to make things better. It is hard to get over the pain and I hope that your wife will eventually be able to let go of the anger and hurt. I have forgiven my husband and I have let go. I no longer mention the EA or OW. I hope that your wife will be able to do the same.

I'm sure that you are a good guy; so is my husband. He's a terrific guy because I believe in my ability to pick a nice person for myself as a partner. I'm a good person, too and we both made some bad choices.

I hope your recovery will progress and that you will lead a happy life with your wife and children.

K.

LINY,

I went back and re-read the whole thread and I don't see it. There is one post on the first or second page where believer says that "we (the FHs) are the good guys" but I don't get the tone at all that that thread is saying the WS is "bad".

Sounds like you are reading too much between the lines.

Murder is on the list of the 10 commandments just like adultery.

Obiously a serial killer is a "bad" guy, just like a serial cheater.

If there was an individual in my neighborhood that was tearing through the place drunk, threatening the wives, driving fast, reckless with fire-arms. Everyone in the neighborhood "just knows" someone is eventually going to accidentally die by this mans actions, probably a kid. Local law enforcement won't do anything about it, since he hasn't really "done" anything yet, but it is (or extremely likely) going to happen. So I perform a pre-emptive strike and shoot him down. I comitted murder and WILL face the consequences for that. Am I a "bad" guy? A case EXACTLY like this happened (I think in CA) and the whole neighborhood came out and said don't send the shooter to jail, the reckless guy deserved it. He still went to jail. For murder.

Or how about an overweight person who has a medical condition that does not allow them to lose weight? A certain portion of the population will picture that individual as a slob with no self-respect for themself regardless of the reason behind the excess weight.

Most of us mature people realize it is CHOICES that are good or bad, not people. Some do not. If you chose adultery as a lifestyle, I would say you are a bad guy. If you made a mistake, I would say not DEPENDING on what you did to atone, or how remorseful you were (sounds like you are). Sadly, however, your choice is going to carry the stigma that you are a bad guy for some.

But it was your choice.

Know what LINY? I did not even notice the refered to thread until I read this one!

I cannot speak for Believer... but I notice this about her...

She tends to be a facilitator attempting to join people together whom she thinks may be benificial to each other.

I see nothing sinister in her efforts. It's what she does.

How it can be useful remains to be seen ...

Hearing the BH's voices filled with pain and anger ... and processing what that might mean to your recovery will not be easy LINY. But, easy is not a term that applies to recovery.

What you read is always useful to you in one way or another. Try and find a way to use your feelings to propell yourself in a forward motion. Perhaps just speaking up here the way you did is in part useful to your recovery .... think so?

Is speaking your mind one of your lessons learned?

Take care...

Pep

uhmm going back to Dabda again... Hi Liny!
Denial, Anger, Bargaining, depression, then acceptance.... after we've been through acceptance, that is just THEN you can began to recover!

And we all go through DABDA everyday in our lives, but my point is with all that you have to accept things as they are. First telling yourself, you are a bad husband....because a good husband do not cheat on their wives. They do not end up going with other women, and they face their problems with their wife instead of finding an escape!

Another thing is that, you don't have to be a bad person! Difference between the two is crucial. You are not a bad person, but you are not a good husband for cheating on your wife and you are trying to be a good one!

Of course the reason for your affair wasn't just YOU, there were external things, or things with your wife that trigger the affair, but still your wife remained faithful and you didn't! You must accept that..

Then you can work on recovery... blaming, or getting angry over things is not going to help you with recovery.

Another thing, Beleiver just made the board to gather everyone together, maybe just to help each other out, not to hurt anyone. The title before was "Betrayed Husbands" then I noticed she changed it to "Loyal husbands" Not good or bad, but she labeled "LOYAL" and if in your book "loyal is good" and anything other than that is bad.. then you figured out half the puzzle.

I wish you luck with your wife and try to keep an open mind to what others have to say in the board. I think most people here care about each other and wants to help each other out. When someone is hurting in the middle of the night and needs company and they post on the board.. they are very glad to have someone to spill out their guts to and Beleiver is ONE of them....

I hope you find your happiness and your center.. and I think we are all in the process of discovering ourselves and figuring how to manage our emotional well being and real life!

Hi LINY.
My husband was like you: a loyal faithful husband for 35 YEARS....and then he got 'smitten' by a single lady that was 10 years younger...She admired him and adored him and wanted to give him her love and affection, and before you know it...he didn't resist and fell for her advances...(Maybe LEAPED is more of what he did, than fell!)

Does it make him scum of the earth? NO
Were you scum of the earth during your affair? NO

You are both human beings with shortcomings that led you to sin...Can you be forgiven and your marriage be restored and wonderful again? ABSOLUTELY.

Sincere repentence and forgiveness towards others, are beautiful qualities that true Christians must have.
Sincerely, Julie <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Liny, my good cyber friend how the heck are yah? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
Not so good I take it. This mini-brain dump you just had is fantastic! I'm glad you posted it. It gives you an opportunity to turn a mental corner regarding your issues and self-perception also to finally come to grips with the reality of your own actions. LINY, the fact you so detest being depicted as a bad guy (regardless if that's ONLY your perception) shows you value how you see yourself and how you are seen. What I get from your post is that you want to be a good person, and please realize this: Some people do not! I know its hard to fathom, but everyone doesn't embody that core belief! Some people actually could careless about how their actions affected others or how others view their actions.

I agree with Harudah, there is a notable distinctions between being a good husband and a good man. One of my W's most favorite guilt-ridden mumbles is she's a good mother but a terrible failure as a W. I had trouble distinguishing the two myself for quite sometime and thought how could you care so much for my children and then inflict so much pain on the person who co-created those children?

Back to you LINY, I will be the first to admit that my W's A is 100% my responsibility, not my fault because fault implies intention, but, BUT BUT her A is also 100% her responsibility as well. IMHO, the bottom-line is we al need to fix our M's. We cannot fix our M's while an A is going on, it's impossible sort of like trying to extinguish a fire by throwing water on it. It just aint gonna work buddy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Accept responsibility for your actions, within that comes strength. What sources is your W utilizing to aid her in dealing with her own emotions, and is she seeking any guidance or plans in how to restore, recover and re-design your M so that this type of pain will not be revisited? Liny, she needs help as well as you! Liny, she's hurt right now, NO everything is not YOUR fault, NO you shouldn't have it thrown in your face every ten seconds, NO you're not a BAD GUY, why would your W want to be married to a BAD GUY! Liny, you're a good guy who made a bad decision.

When your W commits these LB's unravel them for what they really are, her cries of anguish from being hurt by YOU, whether intentional or unintentional pain is pain and you are the driver of that car that smacked into her emotions. You may have taken your eyes off the road for a minute to scrounge for a cd that slipped under the front-passenger seat, but the truth remains; you were driving big fella. Your W will have to accept her responsibility as far as how her actions creating an atmosphere which aided in this accident, actually once again in my humble opinion if a BS refuses to accept at least their share of the responsibility for their S's A.....
RECOVERY IS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE, at least not full recovery because there will be too much resentment.

You're a good guy LINY. It seems like you just took your eyes off the road an before you knew it BAM!!!!...but remember some WS's ride with no hands smashing into a BS's emotions like their at friggin Coney Island on the bumper car rides and they've got their eyes on that stuffed pink elephant over there on the top shelf! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Be a good guy and buy your W one of those books on surviving an affair, she could use the insight and next time buy a cd changer. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Later

Hi LINY,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> However, reading the thread, I became resentful, angry, hurt, frustrated by some of the posts, and narrow-minded comments(IMHO) and the separation of "them vs. us." I think it was K who simply asked, "And the meaning of this thread?"
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm sorry that the other thread upset you... I for one, have no hard feelings against ANY WS that posts here.

My sole purpose for coming here is to let others that are hurting from the pain of adultery know that it IS possible to rebuild your M.

I truly believe Romans 8:28... and hope that in some small way, my posting here and sharing some of the pain and trials that I've been through, will help others -- whether they are a WS or a BS ....

Semper Fi,
RIF90

I just read this thread today. Have not read all of the loyal husbands thread...but most of it.

I think both threads are great when it comes to airing out these feelings.

OW, like you, I honestly think part of the fog had to do with my feelings on my marriage. That in NO WAY means I should have had an A. In fact, the "lack" ,if there really was any, should have been dealt with. It was wrong to run away and fill whatever needs by having an A.

But I just agree with you on the fog feelings applying to the marriage as much as the OP.
RAP

LINY, I think the H's mean they are the good guy in their marriage but, let's face it, they are the good guys because they've always made the choice to BE good guys.

I was a loyal w for 27 years till I made the choice to enter into an A. At the time I had no idea about consequences or what a "good guy" really is. (my H). Now that I'm not an alien abductee any more and am truly a loyal wife again I can see what I've lost. I'll never be able to join a thread called "loyal wives" and that's just something I have to live with. I know that now I am a loyal wife but there's always going to be the time when I wasn't. Three years ago I never thought I'd be posting on an infidelity thread - not in my wildest dreams.

Our 30th wedding anniversary is in two weeks and when I tell people (who don't know about the A) that they say "how wonderful, not many people make it to 30 years any more" and in my heart something just freezes up with guilt. Three years ago I would have joyously and proudly told everyone that we had got this far without any infidelity or any hurt.

I was pond scum during the A and I admit it. But, I've redeemed myself and I'm proud of me and my H.

Jen

First, I apologize beforehand the length of this reply. Second, thanks for the lack of usage of 2X4's! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Third, I want to make it very clear that in no way did I think believer was being mean, vindictive, etc. I've read believer's responses and I know it wasn't meant to be that way. And fourth, thank you all for responding. A word my W likes to use: validate. It validates my own pain, guilt, frustration, etc. and any post I read--whether I agree or not--makes me think. (That's a good thing! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Pep:
"She [believer] tends to be a facilitator attempting to join people together whom she thinks may be benificial to each other...I see nothing sinister in her efforts. It's what she does."
Absolutely! I'm sorry if I gave the wrong impression. Believer, I am sorry--it wasn't my intent!

"Is speaking your mind one of your lessons learned?"
Oh my goodness, Pep, you do know me! I consider myself a "stuffer" (and many times a turkey <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ) It's something that I need to completely admit which was a big part of my marital dysfunction, which ultimtely led to the EA.

TJ:
"I feel a lot of defensiveness in your response. And if you have experienced alot of things being revisited and thrown in your face, that my be why you react this way."
Yes, that is certainly part of it. But only 'part' of it. Read my response to FM and maybe I can shed some light.


"I'm trying to figure out why this thread bothered you...Did anyone personally attacking you, criticize you, or hold you down in your own recovery, except your W maybe?"

AND

BIJ:
"Sometimes I read through the threads and SOMETHING will touch a nerve somewhere. And something in that thread touched one of yours.
What is it ?...Guilt"

When I wrote this thread, I honestly and now apologetically have to say I was not thinking in the sense that the majority of BS's on MB are *currently* going through what they are going through. They are in pain. Period. And I don't want to diminsh that so I will not respond any other way than what I just said.

wat:
"I believe you are a good guy - now. I wish for you to find everything you need to stay that way.
"But you were pond scum when you were participating in a marital betrayal."

I have read many of your responses and respect the support you give to the MB'ers--all of us. However, I disagree, somewhat. If when I realized what I was doing and still didn't stop? Pond scum would be tame. I'll leave it at that. And...

"Are all WSs in the act of equal pond scum density? No, of course not. Some are WAY worse than others. Sorta like being raped can have degrees of worseness."
I hope you were referring to "sorta like being raped" as "sorta like being violated." If so, don't read the next two sentences. Again, I *do* respect you (through your posts.) However, you are way out of line using the word "rape" in this context.

Kati:
"He's a terrific guy because I believe in my ability to pick a nice person for myself as a partner."
You got some serious kudos from my wife when she read this!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />


ncw:
"I went back and re-read the whole thread and I don't see it. There is one post on the first or second page where believer says that "we (the FHs) are the good guys" but I don't get the tone at all that that thread is saying the WS is "bad".

"Sounds like you are reading too much between the lines.

"Or how about an overweight person who has a medical condition that does not allow them to lose weight? A certain portion of the population will picture that individual as a slob with no self-respect for themself regardless of the reason behind the excess weight."

It's all in perception--you summed it up (I think without even trying) with your overweight analogy.

Harudah:
"...but my point is with all that you have to accept things as they are."
I completely disagree.
Lord, help me accept the things that I cannot change; the courage to change the things I can; and the wisdom to know the difference.
OK...follow me on this one...I can't change my wife. However, I can change my *perception* she has of me by changing me! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

"I wish you luck with your wife and try to keep an open mind to what others have to say in the board. I think most people here care about each other and wants to help each other out. When someone is hurting in the middle of the night and needs company and they post on the board.. they are very glad to have someone to spill out their guts to and Beleiver is ONE of them...."
Thank you...thank you...thank you!!!

"I hope you find your happiness and your center.. and I think we are all in the process of discovering ourselves and figuring how to manage our emotional well being and real life!"
Wow! How true! Sadly, if we can't do that on an individual basis, we certainly can't do that with another human being in a marriage. And, thank *you*! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

rap:
"OW, like you, I honestly think part of the fog had to do with my feelings on my marriage. That in NO WAY means I should have had an A. In fact, the "lack" ,if there really was any, should have been dealt with."
That, my friends, was my ultimate downfall.

runawaypot
OW, like you, I honestly think part of the fog had to do with my feelings on my marriage. That in NO WAY means I should have had an A. In fact, the "lack" ,if there really was any, should have been dealt with."
That, my friends, was my ultimate downfall.


And FM:
First, I didn't think it was appropriate of me to post on your thread the other night. But, I am sooo dorry about what happened. Not pity, my friend, for FM has really really been blessed. Just sorry it's not working so easliy for you.

"This mini-brain dump you just had is fantastic! I'm glad you posted it. It gives you an opportunity to turn a mental corner regarding your issues and self-perception also to finally come to grips with the reality of your own actions. LINY, the fact you so detest being depicted as a bad guy (regardless if that's ONLY your perception) shows you value how you see yourself and how you are seen. What I get from your post is that you want to be a good person, and please realize this: Some people do not!"
Don't *ever* stop with your analogies, metaphors, similies, etc.! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> And. yeah you did a Three Stooges and hit me with a 2X4 without realizing it: "self-perception." I really don't like some things about me. And I certainly don't like a lot of things I have done.

"Accept responsibility for your actions, within that comes strength."
Somehting my W keeps drilling into my head and the switch is on, but it's one of those fluorescent bulbs in the middle of summer and very humid out where it just takes forever to come on?
"What sources is your W utilizing to aid her in dealing with her own emotions, and is she seeking any guidance or plans in how to restore, recover and re-design your M so that this type of pain will not be revisited? Liny, she needs help as well as you! Liny, she's hurt right now."
That's where I keep beating *myself* with a 2X4. (And one of my 'problems' in life--don't know when to stop swinging at myself.)
She has been going religiously (pun intended) to her counselor and on A-D's (until recently-HUGE step for her!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ) since her NB. And the biggest factor: as painstaking as it is, it also just a basic human need (one I know you're not getting) is communication. I admire you, but certainly don't envy you.

"...but remember some WS's ride with no hands smashing into a BS's emotions like their at friggin Coney Island on the bumper car rides and they've got their eyes on that stuffed pink elephant over there on the top shelf!"
I say, "Down with the F'ing pink elephants!" (Thanks--got a craving for Nathan's now!)

"Whether intentional or unintentional pain is pain and you are the driver of that car that smacked into her emotions." Again, I know I have to be accountable. I'm getting there. Reminds me of a magnet my Mom had/has on her fridge for, well, as long as I can remember; It's a caterpillar, saying, "Please be patient with me. God isn't finished with me yet."


I have a history of novelettes (sp) as posts, but...
I'm not tryin to weird you, FM, or freak you out, but even though we are on the opposite side of the proverbial fence, we have a lot of similarities (at least I think so) and have found a connection somehow (again, at least I think so.) (Then you posted you live in MD--we lived in Balt. Cty. for a year (White marsh)--I've posted this before, but when I give the wisdom, of "Don't ever pray for patience!" It's in MD that we did--and boy, were we tested! More stories for a different time.) Anyway, I was trying to explain this to my W and she tended to agree. Then she said something that shocked me--I thought about it--and to a big extent (without some shmuck bonin' my W), I *was* a BS--when my W had the NB and completely shut down. The OM for me was depression. I did so many of the things youo did--with the same f'ing responses. You are on a completely different level of pain--and I in *no* way mean to diminsh *your* situation, but I truly understand and empathize with you. Just an observation.

Anyway, I hope and pray things work out for you, my friend. For *you*, and of course your two little ones.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong>wat:
"I believe you are a good guy - now. I wish for you to find everything you need to stay that way.
"But you were pond scum when you were participating in a marital betrayal."

I have read many of your responses and respect the support you give to the MB'ers--all of us. However, I disagree, somewhat. If when I realized what I was doing and still didn't stop? Pond scum would be tame. I'll leave it at that.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So if you were a bank robber and stopped after your first heist, realizing it was wrong, you were not a bank robber during the act??

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong>"Are all WSs in the act of equal pond scum density? No, of course not. Some are WAY worse than others. Sorta like being raped can have degrees of worseness."
I hope you were referring to "sorta like being raped" as "sorta like being violated." If so, don't read the next two sentences. Again, I *do* respect you (through your posts.) However, you are way out of line using the word "rape" in this context.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I made a reasonable analogy, in my view. I feel like I was emotionally raped. The impact on me personally, my son, and the remainder of my extended family are comparable to being physically raped, based on an acquaintence's experience with being a rape victim.

I really respect and admire your participation on this forum. But because you take offense at my use of this analogy, you may not yet realize the impact that marital rape in the form of infidelity has.

And, by the way, I failed to state an obvious point in my first response that just because a guy is faithful to his wife doesn't make him a "good guy."

WAT