My husband told me yesterday that he's been in contact with OW's fiancee (and probably OW as well) because the fiancee has asked for assistance with a job search. I was surprised that he told me about the contact since there has been NC since about four months now and I thought that our recovery has been going well. My husband does not act foggy or say foggy things and he seems committed to our marriage and relationship. He is loving, helping around the home and attentive. I would have never thought that he'd once again been in contact.

I'm confused as h*ll right now. What should I say or do? To tell you the truth, I have a feeling that this woman and her guy will be forever in our lives. I feel like I only have two choices - either ignore it/put up with it or get out of the marriage. The reason that I feel that this will probably never ever stop is because it is such a long-term friendship that once was an EA. My husband never had any physical contact/sex with this woman and therefore he does not believe that he betrayed me.

I had exposed the EA/friendship to family and friends, but I have never talked to OW. I could call her and try to talk to her, but I honestly do not think that it would do any good and honestly I really do not feel like talking to her.

So, where do I go from here?

Kati

Hi Kati,

Has it really been 4 months of NC? It doesn't seem that long since I was posting to you about your WH.

Anyway,what to do.That's a toughie because I know you have been waiting a long time for the "friendship" to end and here it is again,like a bad penny.The fiance of the OW still doesn't know about your WH and his soon to be wife right? I still think that should have been exposed.This poor man is going into marriage blind and with deceit if he hasn't been told about this friendship.You know,he could be like one of the guys here whose W gets involved with his friend.It could get ugly if this OW ever decideds to get more emotionally involved.But it's anyone's guess at this stage.I still don't think he should be talking to her,EA or PA.

I wonder if he really has ever kept a true NC.How do you know? Did you see any withdrawal? If not I would be a bit skeptical.

Anyway,I don't have an answer for you but I do think you should question WH about contact with the OW and the OMF.Did he say that he talked with OW or are you guessing? Why not just ask? You should know.

O

<small>[ August 12, 2004, 10:19 AM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

Octobergirl,

The last contact that I saw on his cell phone was in April. Afterwards her number never showed up on his cell again. Of course, he could have been talking to her from a work phone etc. I have no idea of of knowing. I did ask my husband if he spoke to OW on the phone as well and he admitted that he did speak to her as well.

I don't know how I can contact OWF. I do not know his name (only first name) and I don't know where he lives. The only contact info that I have is OW's cell phone number. I could call her.

You asked if my H ever went through withdrawal. This made me think. During the time that he was (or at least seemed to be having the EA with her), he was very distant to me, not very loving and he often came home late or had excuses for absences. That's how I found out when I just felt something was right between us and I ask him. After I found out, he went through a time when he didn't know what he wanted, where to go with his life etc. I'm not sure if this was withdrawal, but he was definitely not very interested in me. This was very hard on me and to keep me from getting hurt even more, I withdrew from our relationship. Basically, prepared for the worst and lived the best way that I knew how. The didn't ask him about OW anymore, contact, anything. I stopped looking for stuff; the only thing that I see every month is the cell phone bill. He has also stopped hiding his phone in the car. It is now in the house and he no longer hides the cell phone bills. He told me yesterday out of the blue that OW and fiancee had contacted him. I then looked through the latest cell phone bill and I saw that it is true.

This entire situation has been going on for eight years now and I'm really starting to wonder if there will ever really be true NC.

Kati

Well you have a right to wonder.Like you mentioned,you have to ask yourself if you can live with this situation or Plan B or D.You can drive yourself nuts thinking about it all: is he really in NC,is he hiding something from me,is he e-mailing her(OW) or does he have a calling card,etc etc?

My WH got upset with me one day when I told him I could find out if he was in contact(this is during his first attempt at NC).He said there is absolutely no way for you to be sure that I am not in contact.And he proceeded to tell me all the ways in which he could deceive me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> It hurt but it was very true.If someone wants to deceive they can.

I don't envy you Kati.You are not dealing with a full blown A.You have a WH that is being attentive,loving and wants a baby with you but there is still that darned occasional contact with OW and the possibility of a long term "friendship" with those people.Maybe he needs a reminder about NC and that every time he contacts OW that it hurts you and puts you back in your recovery.We wouldn't want your WH to get the idea it's all ok now again just because the OW is getting married.

On the upside,you do have the upper hand in that you can tell the OW to back off(if she advances on your WH) or you will tell her fiance/H about their past.I would keep that little piece of info handy just in case. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

O

<small>[ August 12, 2004, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

You are so right. Of course, one will never be able to be 100% sure of there really is NC. And honestly, I am done with the snooping and checking stuff. It doesn't feel good to do that. I understand that sometimes it is necessary, but I found it exhausting and I found myself constantly upset. I have felt much better since I stopped the snooping around.

I told him this morning that every contact sets me back one step and a little bit of my love for him dies with each step. I have told him that many of times that he is free to go if he wishes to. I am not going to fight over him. I just won't because I have too much pride in myself. In a twisted kind of way though, I almost think that he enjoys that I get upset when he contacts her or her fiancee.

There is one part of our conversation this morning that I found really interesting though. He kept saying that he feels that he needs a baby because he needs something to focus on, somebody who needs him so that he can get his head straight. I know that one of the main reasons that this EA had started up in the first place is becaue OW was needy and admired him. I had done a poor job with the admiration EN, but when I realized this, I have made great effort to change and I think that it has made a difference. One thing though is that I am not needy. Being a military wife who was often alone, I was forced to become self-sufficient and self-reliant. Most often, I had nobody, but myself to depend on and that is okay, but the fact is that I rarely ever asked for any help or assistance and I think that this bothers him. OW is so different in this regard. She always has a crisis, is always in need etc.

How can I learn not to be needy, but to appeal to the 'taking care' side of my husband? I'm really at a loss here... I know that being needed is very important to him. I love my husband and I need him in many ways that he may not see, but it is so difficult for me to let go of this wall that I've built around me. I think that you know what I mean, Octobergirl, about the safety zone that brings you tranquility and a sense of peace.

Kati

Sorry for all the TYPOS. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> I really need to get into the habit of previewing my posts first.Ugh.

My WH has a need for admiration too,a big one.I too am self sufficient and have no trouble being alone or on my own.I was in many ways since I was a teen.So,when I wasn't fawning all over my WH he felt that I didn't need him either and he has a somewhat big ego.Practically every night he used to tell me he was dreaming of some celebrity or celebrities.He loves attention and needs a lot of it not to mention affection.He needs and always had a somewhat inappropriate need for women's attention in particular.I didn't think much of it before because I am not a jealous person but now,looking back,I can see where it could lead to where I am now.

Maybe you can show your H you need him in ways that he can really contribute like landscaping,condtruction,painting,household jobs,etc.Maybe the guys here can offer some better clues.Maybe he has a touch of (KISAS) "Knight in shining armor syndrome"? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

If I were you though Kati,I still would hold off on a baby for a while.Too much is still a bit shaky when it comes to your marriage.I honestly do not know when would be a good time.I would have to think about that.

O

<small>[ August 12, 2004, 12:54 PM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

OG,

He definitely has the KISAS. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Sometimes, this syndrome gets in the way of getting stuff done at home or he gets so into other people's business that he feels overwhelmed etc. It can be a vicious cycle.

As far as the baby goes, it is a tricky situation. We both want to have a child, but of course I feel reluctant because I do not yet feel that our marriage is very stable, but then we really cannot wait much longer. I'm 35 and he's 45. Time is definitely not on our side.

I'm very affectionate and I love SF. I don't think that he is looking for affection or SF in another relationship. It is definitely all about admiration, attention and the need to feel "needed".

Just like your H, but H always seemed to have a need for other women's attention etc. I was very naive about this for a long time, until everything came crashing down.

Kati

Hi again,

Well,it's kind of unorthodox but.....

Have you thought about having a child with the idea that if worse comes to worse,you could raise your child alone and be ok with that? In other words,if you go ahead and decide to try and you do get pregnant,can you be strong enough to survive without your WH's support in bringing up baby?

I think I just said the same thing.LOL. Sorry,my brain is fried right now and I am so tired. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I was very glad to have my girls at a relatively young age.But,overall,I have raised them by myself for the most part.My WH was and is(worse now) a part time dad.He was always working so it was up to me to do it all.I never minded,I LOVED doing it and I still do.I am also very good at it and prefer my ways over anyone elses.

So,a baby could be a good thing in the best of circumstances but if things with your WH deteriorate,it could be very difficult.

Just something to ponder. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

O

Octobergirl,

Under ideal circumstances, I would always want my future child/ren to have a mom and a dad. Of course, we never know what kind of surprises life holds out for us, but I am definitely capable of raising a child by myself if I needed to. I have a career and I actually have many girlfriends who are single moms and they are doing a fine job raising their children. I think you are doing a great job with your girls as well, protecting them from as much of the chaos as possible. It is very hard, but I admire you for holding up so strong and doing what's best for your girls. My parents separated when I was a little girl and I was exposed to ALL the chaos and all the OW. I still remember to this day...

I think my husband would be an excellent father. Probably a better father than a husband. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I also know that he would always take care of his child, no matter what would happen between us. I know that he really wants to have children and maybe it would be a good thing. Really there is never a perfect time, isn't it?

Well, we'll wait and see...

Kati