I suggested that he post here, but would he be beaten up by too many 2 x 4's? He wants to help me, but doesn't know how.

WS 52
BS 48
DD 24
DS 22

H had several A's over 10 yrs
Working at staying together forever.

EO I can only speak as a newbie, but I must say that FWS like kyellow4 have been a source of inspiration to me, helping me gain insight as to the workings of my WW's fog.

As long as your WH isn't going to ramble fog talk thereby deserving 4x2s , AND it didn't hurt you I think it might be a good idea 'pur encourager les autres'.

Only you know if you think it will be properly helpful however.

Unrepentant adulterers are never going to have an easy ride on here of ALL places are they ?

Eyesopened, BS’s, WS’s and OP’s who wants to work on their MARRIAGES & are in favour of MARRIAGE BUILDING are ALL are welcome to post here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> BS’S and WS’s are helping each other to gain understanding and insight from each other's individual feelings & struggles as wayward and betrayed spouses. If your WH still struggle with withdrawal, he can get support and understanding from other recovered WS’s who can guide & support him through this recovery process. It also helps to share your pain with other WS’s who know and understand what you’re going through. Of course there will always be the risk of receiving 2 x 4’s if you share your feelings brutally honest and openly (especially from new & hurting people posting here), but this is all part of the learning and growing process on this board. However, if your WH is truly repentant and remorseful, the risk of receiving unnecessary 2 x 4’s will be much less… As Bob Pure have said, unrepentant adulterers are never going to have an easy ride on here of all places.

Blessings,
Suzet

<small>[ August 13, 2004, 04:37 AM: Message edited by: Suzet* ]</small>

I actually came to this site b/c my H came here 1st to seek advice. I think he was confused at what to do about our M and his A. Yes, he has gotten *alot* of 2x4's (I really think they have been mostly from himself). I think this has been good for him to come here and see both sides of this.

I read his threads and find answers and changes in him that he may not be able to say to me (communication isn't one our strongest attributes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ).

He (your H) will have to open and as your name says it will be "eye opening" to the both of you.

God bless you both and *WE* pray for you, your H, and your M.

Thankyou PureBob, Suzet & Brown
I hope that my H will come to this site. I have learnt so much from it. I have told my story under "9 months today". H is not in any withdrawal that I can see. He has had NC with OW (he was actually having 2 A's at the same time. One was a W he had met OS & he only saw her twice a year, the other my G/F. He didn't actually think that he was cheating on them both "BIG FOG" until I pointed it out to him, it just didn't occur to him) This confuses me as well b/c H is a very clever man. He feels ashamed of himself. I struggle about the amount of A's he had & often ask him Why? but of course he doesn't know?????? This is confusing to me but that's how it is I believe. He says he just doesn't know how to help me, so I suggested coming here. Fingers crossed

WS 52
BS 48
DD 24
DS 22
H had several A's over 10yrs
Working at staying together forever

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by eyesopened:
<strong>This confuses me as well b/c H is a very clever man. He feels ashamed of himself. I struggle about the amount of A's he had & often ask him Why? but of course he doesn't know?????? This is confusing to me but that's how it is I believe. He says he just doesn't know how to help me, so I suggested coming here. Fingers crossed

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">eyesopened, how is he helping HIMSELF? He is the one with the problem. What is he doing to understand why he has all these affairs? Because if the problem is not addressed and corrected what will stop him from doing it in the future?

Is he in counseling?

eyes, does your H think that adultery is wrong? You had mentioned that he has had 7 affairs, that you know of, and that his father had affairs. Perhaps they don't view adultery as wrong?

Would he have stopped his affairs if you hadn't caught him?

eyes, I can only speak from my own experience! When my WH started posting here, I was very pleased...he seemed open to suggestions at first but later on he was very arrogant and didn't take anyones advice. I later found out he was still in the affair...

Most people use this forum as a haven, therapeutic venting if you will. After I showed my H the forum, it was no longer safe for me to vent and let it all out here..feelings I shared with people here are things I didn't necessarily want him to see.

I went into Plan B and I couldn't post here anymore cuz my H would read it.

I would suggest that you are very sure you want your spouse to see everything you put out on this forum. Your spouse will not be 2 x 4'd as a WS, heck BS get 2x4'd plents as well...We all have to be strong.
Once your spouse starts posting here, you will both be able to see it and sometimes it huirts.

Eyes: just responded to your other post as well! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> !!!!STOP THE PRESSES: ML AND I AGREE ON SOMETHING!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

ML nailed it on the head, eyes. And in answer to your question about the 2X4's: It depends on what "position" he's in. This *is* marriage builders...if he doesn't want to rebuild, et al his marriage, yeah, he may be subject to a few 2X4's that other MB'ers have from their own construction projects.

Just like with any "tool": you get out of it what you put into it. This is a great place for people to help you to put those tools into effect. There's a lot of good people here who have memorized some of these "instruction booklets!" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I am very concerned about "non-chalant" he is about the choices he's made.

Best wishes!

eyes...
if he really wants help...and maybe chew on some information that thoughts that go through his head...this is a great place to be.
Many times a WS feels alone in their struggle, their pain....but they can connect with other FWS there to gain courage to continue on the long journey back to recovery.
My FWS posted once, and I think he'll pop in if someone needs help, and he thinks he can offer something.
He agrees with the MB principles. He's able to throw a 2X4 himself.
Best of luck to you both !

I am a newbie here, and I too am a WS. NO, I "WAS" a WS!!!
As for the 2X4's, my personal feelings are that it's all in the way you recieve them. If they smack you up side the head and hurt, well then maybe they should. On the other hand if you have a "lightbulb moment" (for lack of a better expression) and use the beating to better yourself, well then there you go...
Just my 2¢

Just yesterday my H and I briefly diccussed this very subject. I told him how much MB has helped me, and how much I appreciate the FWS point of view. He said he doesn't have anyone to talk to. I told him he could post here. He then said support groups just don't work for him. He posted here after d-day, but didn't last long. I think he mentioned how he didn't feel understood here, or something to that effect. I told him, "Maybe you got 2x4ed because you were still heavy into the fog at the time. So you couldn't hear what people were saying to you." He acknowledged this probably was true.

In my case, and some may disagree, I never wanted H to read my posts. Maybe one day it will be fine. I needed and still need MB to be a safe place for me to vent and talk about H and OW. That has been incredibly healing for me. If I thought H was reading my posts I could never write what I write. I also wanted H to have that same freedom.

What mom said is also true. If your H can't be trusted and isn't out of the A, you don't want him reading your posts. CV

Thankyou so much for all you help.
ML: H says he doesn't need counselling. He knows where he went wrong & will NEVER do IT again. I have asked him the same Q, how do you know if he would keep going. Said that when he was with my G/F, that he realized how low he had got, could see me & that I was always trying. He also felt very quilty about G/F H.
Momto3boys: Yes I have thought about that aspect as well, but I'm not sure that I can get him to go to IC, maybe MC for me. H is not in any A's now.
Liny: H says he just wants to be with me now & has been the model H since disclosure. I'm concerned that he doesn't want to talk about his past. He says we should "Build the bridge & get over it. Let's look forward to the future." I think we should work out where we went wrong & fix the problem first. I do keep talking about the A's, & he is usually very good, but I'm sure he needs to talk to someone other than me, as I tend to cry which doesn't help him. He hates to see me hurting. We are very good at not LB very often now. Have both read HN/HN & it has been very benificial to us.
BIJ: Quote "if he really wants help". H says he doesn't need to talk to anyone about it. He knows he did wrong & he won't do it again, says that he feels terrible about it all, can see how stupid he was & knows he will never do it again. He says that he knows it will take time for me & he will give me all the time I need & if it takes the rest of my (H) life then that's what it will take. Not talking about it is not really good, surely? Can you just get over things like he says????
Sakari: This is what I'm hoping for. He also might open up more when he sees that there are others in the same boat.
CV55 I tell H some of the stories I have read here, & how much I have learnt. When I have found some positive stories or ones that relate to us, then I get him to read them. He never says no, & when he has read them, he says "that was good", but usually won't discuss any of them further. I understand about H not reading your posts & have thought the same. I just feel that he needs help & he doesn't even know it yet. Am I pushing him too quickly & he may arrive at the same conclusion eventually??? I'm not sure. I'm just clutching at straws here. H does not like conflict. Would rather walk away & just get on with it. I think that this could be alot of his problems & that he should resolve them & put then them to bed & then move on (IMO). I have spoken to H about all the above overe the years. I obviously need another approach. Any suggestions? I always feel so much better when I come to MB. Thankyou all so much.


WS 52
BS 48
DD 24
DS 22


H had several A's over 10 yrs
Working at staying together forever.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by eyesopened:
H says he doesn't need counselling. He knows where he went wrong & will NEVER do IT again. #####wrong answer: *YOU* need reassurance he will never do it again. As people say here, 'if the lips are moving, he's probably lying.' Eyes, you need actions, not words, right?
He says we should "Build the bridge & get over it. " I think we should work out where we went wrong & fix the problem first.
#####Easy for him to just 'get over it!' <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> And, yes, eyes, you're on the right track about trying to 'fix' it.
H says he doesn't need to talk to anyone about it. He knows he did wrong & he won't do it again, says that he feels terrible about it all, can see how stupid he was & knows he will never do it again.
#####What I refer to as the 'manly-man' response. He can take on the world, right? Wrong! (Used to be the same way--I know first hand. He *can't* do it alone and it's *OK* to ask for help!
He says that he knows it will take time for me & he will give me all the time I need & if it takes the rest of my (H) life then that's what it will take.
#####How quaint. I'm sorry for the sarcasm, but he's not the one in the position to 'lay down the law' so to speak.
He also might open up more when he sees that there are others in the same boat.
#####Absolutely, but he needs to take his blindfold off so he can see what reality he's been putting you through.
...when he has read them, he says "that was good", but usually won't discuss any of them further.
#####Communication!
H does not like conflict. Would rather walk away & just get on with it. I think that this could be alot of his problems & that he should resolve them & put then them to bed & then move on (IMO).</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So, WH is a "stuffer" like me. Ask me about my views on conflict and the conflict of the "manly-man" disease and I'll tell you that it's a contradictory disease all by itself: "I can do do this on my own. I don't need help. [sticking out tongue.] Oh, wait...Conflict! Let me run the other way. Let me escape into the throes of my gambling. Let me turn my back on my wife and go have an A with another woman! All, while not solving a damn thing!" And the awakening happens and I go into my Erkle voice: "Did I do that?"

Eyes, I'm glad your here. It *could* benefit your husband or anybody--if they want to be benefitted!

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!

(Sorry it's a little confusing--the post itself--wouldn;t let me post with the quotes for whatever reason.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> Eyes: just responded to your other post as well! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> !!!!STOP THE PRESSES: ML AND I AGREE ON SOMETHING!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">bwhahahaaaaa! you brat! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Eyes, this is just my humble little question here. So why does your H get to decide whether he needs to go to IC, or whether the 2 of you will be in MC? Remember you do have choices here. What do you need to heal? What do you need to feel safe again?

Concerning the why of the A. Steve Harley told H and I something. He said the reason people have As is that it is a failure to protect your weaknesses. In my H's case that was so true. He didn't even know what they were. He is learning now. For a serial WS I'm not sure if that explanation is the same. Anyway, just remember to get clear about what you want and need for you and the M to recover. CV

Liny, I'm smiling & crying at the same time. (Only women can do two things at once Ha Ha)Thankyou for being here. Now I know I'm not crazy (don't tell my kids that). I'm going to show H your response - will have to wait until next week until he had finished this important project he has to get out. I'm not going to interrupt him until then. He needs to concentrate & I repsect that. Thankyou & a big hug to you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
CV55 You are right. I KNOW that I need MC. H has even suggested it to me. It's just that we cann't afford it at this point in time (see my story: 9 months today) In the meantime, I am reading books on this subject & I'm on this site daily, which has been invaluabe to me, even when I wasn't online (for 4 mths). I am working hard at being a better person (not that I was a bad person either) but there is always room for improvement & I have seen that in HN/HN book. I am not being so hard on myself. So what if the washing & ironing aren't done everyday, or if there is dust, bed not made, etc. (On saying all that, today I started spring cleaning -- I know, I know it's not spring yet, but so what?) CV, I think for me to heal, I need total truth & honesty, something that has been missing in our M from H for soooo long, This is what I struggle with the most. To feel safe again......I'm too scared to even think about that right now (sorry for the tears <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> ) Even when I see H just talking to other women now, I have panic attacks. Oh know this is stupid..... & I logically know this, but try telling me that at the moment. Self pity here. Sorry again. I'm allowing myself more of these moments though. My DD always says "Mum you need to open up more & not keep things closed up" She is so wise for her age. Hence the tears now.
Thankyou for you help & guidance. I can still smile.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

WS 52
BS 48
DD 24
DS 22

H had several A's over 10 yrs
Working at staying together forever

Eyes: glad I could help...after today's events, I need some positive reinforcement, so to speak. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Regarding what you wrote to CV: it *is* very important for MC. (IC, too!) I don't want to pry, but if you have insurance (or I just missed it in your posts), most do consider that necessary treatment. Other ideas...Don't know who your H is employed for, but *many* employers have counselours on site or available (alot of the time for free.) There is always a pastor/priest/clergyman. (The only conflict I see with that is that he/she *knows* the both of you. (Pros and cons.)

Anyway, keep with us. At the very least, you can practice your womanly trait of being biemotional. It's in Webster, you know! Biemotional: "The miraculous act of a woman to express two or more (usually opposite) feelings simultaneously, usually provoked by a male." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Eyes, you are not being stupid for having panic attacks. Your H betrayed you, and more that once. I am in the mental health field and I was shocked when I read and my C told me that BSs having PTSD(Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome) after these As are revealed. We were traumatized, just like someone who was raped or survives a natural disaster. One of the symptoms of PTSD is having the past triggered. You see your H talking to a woman and what he did to you is suddenly in front of you, with all of the pain that brought. This is a real trauma and we and our Ms need to heal from it.

I am a volunteer therapist where I live at a Free Clinic. It is an amazing place where people are getting free therapy. Maybe your city has a free clinic. Look into it. CV

Hi Liny, As we are self employed, there are no "on site" councillors, but we do have medical insurance, so will check up on that on Monday. I have not been to our local Dr as I have known her & her family for 25 yrs & feel uncomfortable about it for same reasons as the minister. I hope that you can find a new councillor for you. Have a great weekend .....eyes

CV55 Have read about PTSD & I have associated it with me, especially in the earlier days. I don't have that dreadful pain all day anymore, only sometimes. As for the free clinic, maybe I should ring the hospitals in my area & see what is available. Boy, why didn't I think of this on my own??? Fog maybe ... or is it just cloudy??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Liny & CV55 I feel really bad as I don't know anything about you & your stories, but I hope that things are working out for you both. One day I also hope that I can help people the way you have helped me. Thanks just doesn't seem enough, but it's all I've got. I'm going to bed now as it is 2.20am here & I'm abit tired. Went out to a 21st tonight. It's nice to get away & party sometimes eh? Take care .....eyes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

WH 52
BS 48
DD 24
DS 22

H had several A's over 10 yrs
Working at staying together forever