I don't mean to be a rabble-rouser, I just wanted a catchy subject.

Here's the point. Plan A is for fence sitters, to build up their feelings for the BS. Plan B is to suck them down off the fence onto the BS side once those feelings have some weight to them.

Men tend to fence sit, and women tend to choose sides quickly.

So... I feel uneasy about the plans in e.g. my situation. My WW could not go on with mixed loyalties. She chose OM, got out of here, and hasn't looked back. There are other men around here with similar problems. So what to do when you're blindsided by a spouse who has chosen sides before you've had a chance to do a good "textbook" plan A?

Roughroad is a woman in such a situation as this. So it's not so much a difference in what happens to BHs vs. BWs, but more one of a common set of circumstances where the application of the plans seems tortured. Does anybody else feel this way?

GC

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Written by Graycloud:
"My WW could not go on with mixed loyalties. She chose OM, got out of here, and hasn't looked back."</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Of course every situation is a bit unique GC, but if you read Lostva's success story you'll read that her WH also left very quickly and seemed to never look back. She had to Plan A her WH via snail-mail.

I'll bump up her story for you to read.

I'm not sure there is that much difference or gender-dependence regarding application of Plan A/B on a WS, regardless if they are male or female. I could be wrong tho.

Perhaps K or JL will drop by and offer some pearls.

Jo

Graycloud:

Bottom line: Dr. Harley knows of what he speaks! He studied A's and their ins and outs for a lot of years before declaring himself an "expert" on repairing M's.

What I'm trying to say is most A's follow a standard operating procedure.....MOST A's "die a natural death" due to the deceitful nature of their beginnings, etc.

Even with the "differences" in your situation compared to most........there are elements of it which still fit "Affair status." Keep that in mind.

My situation is the closest to what you are experiencing, although in my case it was my H who left. But he left in the same way your W left. NEver looked back.......never (seemed to) question his decision once he left. The day he left I found the divorce papers in the mail! He had already been to an atty, and had papers drawn up.......

As you can read in Recovery, and my sig line, we are now engaged (again)! It IS possible. Just stick with these concepts, and BELIEVE Harley knows what he's talking about.

Yes, it's true my H's A had a strange and bizarre "ending" - but I still believe my long-distance Plan A was having an effect. I followed Lostva's advice and snail-mailed letters/cards, etc. to him during his absence. He has admitted to me now that he kept them ALL! I never knew. But go figure, eh?

Also, he now sees my changes. Admits that has had an effect on him, too. The time I spent ALONE and working on ME (as many of my MB friends hounded me to do) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> was NOT wasted time.

Anyway, remember, too, it doesn't happen quickly, and it must all play out. There are no short cuts.

We're all here with ya, my friend.

God Bless.

Thanks, LL. I'm having a hope deficit this week. And I didn't mean to whine about my particular situation. I was thinking about the discussions in SAA, and that the book actually disappointed me some. Got to the end of the plan A/B stuff and thought, is that all?

There seem to be a few common variations of the textbook version, and none of Dr. H's writings address them. Guess that's for reading between the lines.

Being reminded of you and lostva has helped me a little today. Thanks for that.

GC

Hi Graycloud,

You already know that there are no sure things in this, but after reading here for 2 1/2 years I still think your best bet would be to run the plans. Remember (as has been said) Dr Harley did lots of research before he put this together, and has fine tuned it since. He didn't come up with it off the top of his head, but only after much research and after having counciled marriages for years first.

I still believe that if you are not in plan B, then you ought to meet needs as well as you can. The sparrow will need to know you are there waiting, improving, and still loving her, and she won't if there is no good plan A first. When the A implodes she needs to have that good impression of you in her mind.

Now, this sounds too much like a lecture, and I didn't intend that.

Are you happy with YOU since you got home?

SS

<small>[ August 29, 2004, 01:09 AM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

SS, I put a bunch of stuff on my other thread yesterday.

I feel okay about me, but I've been pretty sad. I've been more emotional than before the trip. Think I'm getting my bearings back.

You are absolutely right, I need to try to do something. I need to take some time to be still and quiet and think about getting in touch with her, how to do it. I know what you're thinking, and I will ask.

Okay, must go to sleep. I like the idea of sending another card, maybe one that has nothing to do with money. I need just a little more time before I try to speak with her. The thought of it is ominous, but I won't be afraid. Fear is my enemy.

GC

I read the other stuff, I feel so sad for her family. It is a sickness that is engulfing the world at a rapid pace.

Remember what I said about you. I want you to heal, I want you to be the best Graycloud you can possibly be. I want you to be OK emotionally. You will need to know you did all you could.

And remember - it still isn't over. For all the bad stuff that has happened, it still isn't over.

I suppose I should get some sleep too, I think the garden is through watering now. I can go out and send the water on down the ditch to the next person, and go to sleep. See you later, and God be with you. You will feel it if he is.

SS

<small>[ August 29, 2004, 01:49 AM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

GC I am sorry that you are sad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Interesting insight. I am new to this and my studies of A dynamics are just beginning but it seems logical that gender will affect the way WS will respond to the exposure of an A.

However I am yet to read a case where plan A DYNAMICALLY and RADICALLY affected the dissolution of an A. It is a passive strategy that is more about making the BS behaviours appropriate to the natural end of the A rather than direcly affecting the A, isn't it ?

My WWs A is falling apart naturally (but bizarrely) and plan A only REALLY helped by giving me confidence through a proven template to use the small tools available to me ( exposure, en meeting, no LBs etc etc).

I also find it interesting that several success stories had HUGE fights during plan A which the FWS always said were painful but really useful.

Maybe WH need more direct and personal intervention on THEM as well as passive plan A? Obviously coflict is NOT a plan A tenet, but as Dave Carder says in Torn Asunder, sometimes more direct intervention is required to help break the grip of the fantasy on BS (such as the 'analogy story' intervention.)

Interesting. I will read roughroads story and pray.

Where can I find Lostva's story?

Plan A shows you are willing to change and can make changes. It also shows your spouse you can be forgiving. I believe the key to a plan A is a timeline, followed up by a good plan b. The key, is timetables...your life is about to change, you have a choice. Ok, this is what your life will be like, enjoy. During plan a, the BS is preparing themselves mentally for the life apart. It is really simplified to that, imo.