What if it came out that your spouse participated in orgies with 3 or 4 people of the oposite sex and it happend 20 or 30 times. They would go on 2 or 3 day drinking benders and have sex with anyone that came around and multiple partners at the same time. Would it matter? I'd say if you were totally truthful, you would lose it with your spouse!!!!

I'D BE SHOCKED!!!!!!!!
SHOCKED SHOCKED SHOCKED...

and then I'd be amazed and intrigued..because the spouse I am with today...doesn't even resemble anyone capable of such a thing....

so do I punish the person who is in front of me and would never do these things ..
or do I say.
wow. who were you back then....


billh..if I believe in one thing here...it's the ability of humans to change...to grow to become someone who they were not...

Thank God i am not the same person I was in my early twenties...I wouldn't be here if I was that's for sure...

ARK

<small>[ September 09, 2004, 05:50 AM: Message edited by: ark^^ ]</small>

If your spouse had one partner before you or 20, or was a prostitute, what difference would it make now? You love someone, all of them and who they are is shaped by who they were, with all of their experiences and flaws.

If they had to lie about it, or omit it, it would be because they did not feel safe in your love. And that is a tragedy worse than anything they could have done, in my opinion.

There are countries where they kill women for lying about being virgins at the time of marriage, and countries where they mutilate females so they cannot enjoy sex, and countries where they kill baby girls,just because they are not boys.

Would having sex with others before you make your spouse anyless an angel, or any less pure?
Only by your own flawed perception.

This is not directed at anyone, just my feelings this morning. Must have gotten up on the wrong side of the bed.

<small>[ September 09, 2004, 06:30 AM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

I applaude thoes of you who are being honest. I think it would be very difficult to deal with and almost a betrail of sorts.

It's difficult to think of your spouse that way. Fortunately I only have to deal with it in a "what if" situation.

The point I was trying to make is that I think everyones tolerance (if you can call it that) is different. Littleman is dealing with his wife being intamate but non sexual, I've delt with my wife being with only one partner, and I've seen post that spouses are dealing with 2, 3 , 4, etc.......

It's what are you comfortable with your spouse doing in the past.

Someone posted somethig about morals here. That word almost implicates you putting yourself on a higher plane than your spouse. I'm not sure that is the case here. I would more attribute it to what Familymatters said. "you tend to put your spouse on a pedistal". I think that is the case. I hold my wife to an ANGELIC status. She is so beautiful in my eyes. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So, when I think of her with someone else in that way, even though it's been a long time ago, it just crushes me. I'm so much better than I use to be.

I guess the old saying time heals all wounds. I just hope this one never opens back up again.

I applaude thoes of you who are being honest. I think it would be very difficult to deal with and almost a betrail of sorts.

It's difficult to think of your spouse that way. Fortunately I only have to deal with it in a "what if" situation.

The point I was trying to make is that I think everyones tolerance (if you can call it that) is different. Littleman is dealing with his wife being intamate but non sexual, I've delt with my wife being with only one partner, and I've seen post that spouses are dealing with 2, 3 , 4, etc.......

It's what are you comfortable with your spouse doing in the past.

Someone posted somethig about morals here. That word almost implicates you putting yourself on a higher plane than your spouse. I'm not sure that is the case here. I would more attribute it to what Familymatters said. "you tend to put your spouse on a pedistal". I think that is the case. I hold my wife to an ANGELIC status. She is so beautiful in my eyes. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So, when I think of her with someone else in that way, even though it's been a long time ago, it just crushes me. I'm so much better than I use to be.

I guess the old saying time heals all wounds. I just hope this one never opens back up again.

Wow to all,

I did not expect to have so many responses.I am presently a little overwhelmed but I will reply slowly dont mean to leave anyone out, I appreciate that all are concerned for my feelings as well as others:

TO Billh:

I guess we both share a common interest here,thanks for sharing your feelings.It sad to say but in some way Im happy that I am not the only one who feels this way.If only I knew what has triggered these feelings of my wifes past.
In the past days I have felt a little better,been trying to let the mind rest and try to keep it very busy so that I dont wander and wonder what happened. Maybe I shouldnt have asked her about her past. But I got to a point where I felt if I ask and get some answers then I wont wonder. Well I was wrong the more you ask the more the mind wants to know. You good feel good about a situation and then in three days the same thing would come back but in a different form like ( did they or didnt they? did she lie to me to make feel good ? ok maybe they didnt have intercourse but did they have oral?) Just on question wasnt enough my mind is always thinking it like you stated before hunger pains do you eat or not. The mind is funny you think its over but its not.I wish I knew how to just eliminate the thoughts.
Maybe it hurts us because we shared something intimate with another. Whats really stupid in my situation is that my wife sincerly and truthfully said to me over and over again that I was the first and only person she had intercourse with,the others were kissing and petting what ever petting means (can you define petting for me please).. Bill you said your had one partner before you. Is partner defined as intecourse partner or can a guy she kissed and petted be a partner ???//

To ark:

I am very happpy that you have taken the time and effort to try and help me with my problem.You seem to make alot of sense in your response.I am heeding your warnings about my thought processes which could become consuming and overwelming.There was no affair before or after marriage, She has always been the best wife and mother in the world for me.She really hasnt given me any reason to feel this way.I sm not cheating on her and never had.

So why in the world am I now troubled by the past,maybe its because before we became exclusive we would see other people not like went with half the world. But I must be honest my wife did play some head games with me just before we started to be exclusive.She said things to get me jealous like he touched me there a different way or he tried to put it there but i pulled away. All these things she says now are not true and never happened.She said and I quote" I said them because I was young and inexperienced and wanted you to feel jealous". But now that opened other doors for me because if she said she lied to me then and is telling the truth now, which one is it get my picture.

To Curiosity:
Maybe you hit the nail on head when you said , Not bearing the thought of somebody using your wife as cheap and worhtless. Because no other would treat her like yourself.Maybe I feel that my wife was taken advantage of and she didnt know how to react. I know she said she said she didnt sleep with the guy but he must have done stuff and being young as she was and inexperienced she didnt know how to say no or thought thats what you do on a date Who knows thats just my mind??

To all others :

Thanks for filling in and responding to Billh and my issues I will reply further its just that i was a little overwelmed and my fingers hurt from the typing Thanks

Littleman1

Hello Weaver

I wish I knew what the root of the problem was,but somehow out of the blue my mind started to pick on the past and like a fly on sh@t it wont go away.Yes me and Billh probably should really get a grip and forget but it is easier said than done. I do believe that our relantionship is going to be stronger after this
I see that I kiss my wife more and hold hands something we havent done really since the kids

Littleman1

Hello

Where has everyone gone. I need some input to keep going guys please.

Littleman1

Littleman

I thought you gave up on me. I'll get back to you after lunch.

Give me some more insite. How old are you? I think you said you've been married 14 or 15 years? 2 kids? Other thoughts, "SF is it fulfulling or is it just service". Does your wife initiate much? Last Q: since you were a virgin, do you feel like you may have missed out?

Sorry to be so personal, these are all thoughts that have poped into my head.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by littleman1:
I see that I kiss my wife more and hold hands something we havent done really since the kids
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Billh is probably more "qualified" to help work things out as he is in a similar sit and to some extent, I admittedly *don't* understand. Didn't mean to leave ya hangin'!

However, what you posted is *SO* important! My W and I find ourselves these days stealing 10 minutes for a quickie and it really sucks. I mean, the sex is great, but that's all it has been lately--sex. The intimacy (and foreplay) is so much better than the physical act of intercourse. The emotional connection you are creating by doing the "simple things" as you mentioned leads to bigger and better things. Keep doing them! They are invaluable to your intimacy, communication, and sex life. And, doing these things will probably erase those "ideas" you have in your mind about your W and others. Replace those ideas with reality, my friend!

Hope I didn't go too far of course--fingers having a hard time keeping up with my mind these days.

Hello Billh

Thanks for responding to my cry for help on this issue.
I am 36 years old married for 14 years dated for 6 years before I was my wifes first and she was mine. And it is fulfiling yes she initiates quite often. I do not feel that I have missed out on having sex with others.

Im also going for lunch hopefully I'll hear from you soon

Littleman1

Little

I've spun so many reasons around in my head on this issue, it hurts sometimes. From, Is it that I feel inferior to her, have I missed out, ...to does she really care. Oh here's a biggie that makes not logical sence..... What if she got pregnant from that guy, where whould my life be now. Then I sit back and think, "Huh"! How stupid am I!!!! She didn't know me then.

I can tell you this. I've sat down with her and asked for some details. I'm kinda the opposite of you, the more details I get the more I realize it was just teenage love, trying to find out who she was. The more she tells me the better I feel. I try not to ask, becasue I know it hurts her to talk about it. She has a view of herself that this just conflicts too much with. Anyway, So what that I'm not the 1st. I here now and have been for quite a long time.

I can tell you, I'm pretty much over the pain. But there was a time when this cut pretty deep. It almost felt like a physical rathar than an emotional pain in my chest. As a result I think it will take along time for it to completly fade. It hurt so bad that I still have my guard up to protect against it coming back. I don't want that any more.

LINY said something that makes a tremendous amount of sence. "communication"!!! Talk with your wife, let here know how you feel. Let her know when the pain is realy intense. If she has compasion for what you are going through, she can hold you and help you heal.

The best band-aid a wife can put on her husbands heart,is, "Her love".

Bill

Billh

Hey guy thanks for the trying to help me with these issue. I appreciate you sharing the pain and walking the walk.I am starting to realize that I really should get over this stupid mania that Im in. It ridiculous I know but there are times when it feels so real like if it were yesterday she was with him.I do thank her for have waited for me to have sexaual intercourse.Sometimes the notion of just her kissing a guy makes me crazy but i must cure my madness and get over it Im 36 years old.
And as you said it before they were young and didnt have feelings for us as they do now, so buddy I will do as perscribed and forget and love again.

Thanks for all the help I will continue to post my situation if your interested in responding please do so ok

Littleman1
(To all my pals on MB thanks for the help I really appreciate it)

Hello all

Looks like a little bit of help is going a long way. Working through the thoughts and images and trying to make them go away . I will always wonder but now I must be happy and not foolish as I was before .

Littleman1

little

Good to hear that things are going better.

For me the big change in feelings from complete hurt and inability to function was when I sat down with my wife and said, “I need answers”. This is going to hurt you and me, but I need answers. I said, I’ll try to make this the last time but I’m sure it won’t be. I asked her the basics. In kid terms How many 1st base, 2nd, 3rd, home runs, Oral etc….. Got all my answers.

I’ve asked again. And again. It gets easier for her to answer and easier for me to ask. I don’t ask all the time but when I can feel the pain I and or talk to her. She can make the pain go away quickly by just holding me and talking to me.

I one problem I had for quite along time, was that she kept this from me for a long time. I always knew I wasn’t first. I’d ask in the past and she would give me pathetic answers. If I asked more than a question or two, I would get the standard answer, “it’s none of your business”. Even today when I look back and think of the pain I went through, (essentially by myself) I get mad at her for holding info from me or not telling me the truth. To date, I don’t feel like I’ve gotten all the answers with complete truth.

Here’s where you are probably at. You are wondering if you’ve gotten the complete truth. In your relationship with your wife you have built up the fact that you being her first and only is very important to you. She knows this. So if you aren’t she would have a hard time telling you the truth. Subconsciously you know this. So it eats at you if she is telling you the truth.

The easy thing to tell you is, “Let it go man” nothing good can come out of it. But being through what your going through, I’d say. Does it really matter? Let me ask again, “DOES IT REALLY MATTER”? Would you divorce her if you weren’t her 1st. Is that a boundary that for you that she couldn’t have crossed? I ask this because I was there with you. Slowly I’ve gotten the truth, and my boundary has moved quite a bit. To me I’ve figured out it doesn’t matter. What matters is who she is now, and that we have truth and honesty in our relationship. I’ve told her that if she can’t tell me the truth about this, how can I trust her about anything else.

Sorry for the ramblings. I’m not really good about putting my thoughts on paper. There is one person here that I’d love to get insight from. It’s “Just Learning” I read his posts and he makes so much sense. I wish he would respond to this post and give me his thoughts on this subject. He has such depth to his answers, I swear he is Harley himself.

Billh

Hey nice to hear from you. You hit the nail on the head thats exactly the point in time where I am right now. Do you know how many times i would ask her the same question over and over again,two days would go by and I would ask the same things are you sure ! no selective memory! stuff like that. I never thought there were others out there like me but i was wrong. Yes Im at a point now of "is she really telling the truth or is she protecting me or herself" and it kills me to think of it. But I guess you are right when you said " DOES IT REALLY MATTER" well I guess it really doesnt matter but still the feelings and thoughts are there. I feel better writing here and getting some feed back.

How long till I go a 24 hour period without thinking if there was more or not?

Billh I would like to know if you had or have any triggers like me. When ever I hear the two names of whom my wife was with like on a show or in conversation with someone it makes me think and if I'm with my wife I look towards here to see her reaction (trying not to be noticed of course).

Does this happen to you ???

Hopefully the person that you mentioned at the end of your post will comment on our topic.

Littleman1

Hey havent heard from you guys in awhile where is everyone.

Littleman1