A lot of you know my situation so I won't go into details. Last night was my husbands first IC appointment. It seemed to go really well. I was very angry with him though because he got out at about 9:15 and called the OW and talked till around 11 on his cell. I just kept praying that it went well and he called her to tell her that he wanted to work on his marriage.

He came in the house. The look on his face was so different. He looked relieved and happy. He said he told the lady everything. About his past. His cheating wife, his dad leaving, and many other issues he had. She told him he needs to do things to make himself happy in his current situation. He said she never told him it was a good idea to leave. I don't think he told me everything she said but I think he realized a lot of things last night.

He now wants me to go to IC. Then after my session he wants to go to MC together. The counselor suggested that he go, I go and then we both go. To keep rotating like that for awhile. Before he went there he didn't want to do MC now he does. I told him well if you are not going to try and don't want it to work there is no use for me to go. He said you never know. Same things I said before that he always said he knew it wouldn't. I am afraid to take this as a good sign. I always get my hopes up then have them dashed again.

Also we got on the subject of the OW. I told him posting here and reading the books on affairs I know that we cannot work on our marriage if he is still in the picture. He said that is true. So now he agrees with me there. I asked if he was going to do NC. He said he didn't want to lie and make promises. I think he is afraid that if he did then he will mess up and be back where we are now.

He said he feels he needs to work on himself. That he knows that a lot of the problem is he hasn't met his own personal goals and that makes the marriage seem like the problem. He told the counselor that some of the reason he went to see OW was to make me angry at him. That she is more of a outlet right now. He wanted to make me angry so I would give up on him. He feels I don't deserve any of this. And he admits he was wrong.

So what do you think about what he is saying? Does it sound like there is some hope that things may start to turn around? Also I was thinking last night. I didn't do a good plan A at all. The OW has been my focus day and night since DDAy which was Dec. I was constantly on his case about her and breaking contact. Sometimes I think that made him do it more. Because he didn't want to be told what to do. I am thinking with his different thinking that maybe I should try to do a good plan A for a couple more weeks then go from there. What are your thoughts?

<small>[ September 09, 2004, 03:48 PM: Message edited by: SadMarylandLady ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
<strong> Also I was thinking last night. I didn't do a good plan A at all. The OW has been my focus day and night since DDAy which was Dec. I was constantly on his case about her and breaking contact. Sometimes I think that made him do it more. Because he didn't want to be told what to do. I am thinking with his different thinking that maybe I should try to do a good plan A for a couple more weeks then go from there. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think this is very insightful for you. By all means, turn your Plan A around and DO NOT focus on OW. She is just a symptom. Have you ever asked your H to fill out the EN questionaire? Have you?

Also, enthusiastically welcome the counseling suggestion? BOTH IC and MC.

Be cautious about getting optomistic about him - maybe the counselor got to him a little. Hard to say. But the simple fact that he wasn't totally turned off is good - assuming he's being truthful. The big downer obviously was him reporting first to OW. Just remember, he's still under the control of the Mothership and NOTHING from him should be considered as rational thought.

WAT

Wat,
About a month ago I printed the questionaires out. He didn't feel them out but we did one weekend on 6 hour drive to North Carolina discuss them. We both know what each others needs are. Just that he doesn't seem to want to meet mine right now. But I am working on his.

I will call tomorrow to make my IC appointment. I think it will help me also. I feel that he was truthful about it helping him understand some things. He said it felt good to talk to her.

I asked him earlier today. So you still planning on leaving me. He says I am thinking about it. Usually he says yes. But I am not going to say anymore. No more LB's right now. I am going to focus on making my changes that I know I need to make. I am just going to take one day at a time. I look at this as a small baby step towards the right direction.

Progress! He wants to go to MC. That is big. And he's giving you a chance to do a great Plan A. Take it!

I know what you mean about getting your hopes up, but that is what makes this path so hard. It truly is a rollercoaster, but you need that little bit of hope to continue Plan A.

Yes! Focus on yourself for now. It's time to figure out what SML wants. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

The last few days I have felt stonger than before. I just keep thinking it may be a waste of time and money if we go to IC and MC if he won't give up the phone contact with the OW.

I was talking with my mom and she said to go to the sessions, start working on myself and show him the kind of woman I can be. Then she said maybe he will finally want to end it with her. If not then she said it's his loss. And I can leave the marriage knowing I did everything I could to save it.

Ibc,
I think we posted at the same time <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Yes it's time to think about myself. This whole pregnancy should have been a happy time in my life. But it feels like it has been ruined. I am now focusing more on the new baby coming, my 3 year old son, and also my stepson.

I am trying to think of new ideas everyday of things I would like to do in the future. Dreams, goals and such. My whole marriage I basically focused on raising my kids and my husband. Now it's me time. I really would like to start some sort of business, take some craft classes and start to redecorate the house. Also trying to think of some ideas of how to make some extra money.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
<strong>I was talking with my mom and she said to go to the sessions, start working on myself and show him the kind of woman I can be. Then she said maybe he will finally want to end it with her. If not then she said it's his loss. And I can leave the marriage knowing I did everything I could to save it. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your Mom is a wise lady. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I asked him earlier today. So you still planning on leaving me. He says I am thinking about it. Usually he says yes. But I am not going to say anymore. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, please do not ask him this again. Back off and be a little aloof. Make him wonder that maybe you are beginning to feel less vulnerable and more independent. You have to lure him back, you cannot force him back.

WAT

Hi SML

I've been following your story... here's some nuggets I've gotten from my sessions with Steve Harley that I think you can use now that WH is getting better eyesight.

Realize that romantic love is NOT unconditional. You must create an atmosphere for your WH in which he will find you irrestible and will fall in love with you again. You must read up on his emotional needs. Can you get him to rate them, or at least the top three? On that same note, he will be expected to create a love environment for you as well. Otherwise you will lose your love for him and will need to go to Plan B.

Protect him from yourself. This means do not hurt him AT ALL, it will just push him away and back to her. You are definitely talking way too much about the OW and what he needs to do. Believe me, he knows what he needs to do by now, but he doesn't want to, and won't if you keep bugging him about it. Try not talking about her for a week and see what happens... Plus, no arguments, just stop, change the subject, whatever. Don't ask him if he's going to leave, that definitely won't make him feel welcome.

When I started to behave differently as per SH, I FEEL MUCH BETTER. My situation hasn't really changed yet, but it's only been a few weeks, and I only see WH on weekends, so you will have different results. Not getting sucked up in the drama and what I think he should do, makes him stew in his own juices. SH told him I was trying this, so when I screwed up (at first) WH would tell me so. I am functioning much better with less painful converstions, too.

I really didn't think I could do this, SML, but it is so easy once you get it right. Critical to a good Plan A IMHO. I'm not arguing, so Fogman can rant all he wants to, by himself! It's comical in a way, flusters him that I'm not getting upset, too.

Who knows what will become of the Fogman and I. I was preggo when he met OW. There is a LOT for me to forgive if he ever gets his head extracted from his buttocks area.

My SIL called me earlier. She told me she had lunch with my husband today. I asked her if she noticed anything different. Because he is very honest with her about everything. Wanting to leave and all. She said yes. That during lunch he told her today he wants to work things out. She had to go but told me she would tell me more later. I hope she is not just telling me this to make me feel less stressed but I don't think she would. So I hope this is another small step.

WAID,
What you said makes sense. I start out saying to myself that I won't talk about OW or leaving. Then I get upset when I know he calls her. Then I end up on his case and LBing. I know what I need to do. Just need to do it. As far as my husbands needs. His top one is conversation. Another one is admiration. I think the conversation one is hard for me because I am not that good at it. But I know I can be if I try.

Also I wanted to let you know that I will be keeping you in my prayers.

SML - I'm so happy to hear things are going well today. One thing that really helped me was when I realized I needed to change, not just for my M, but for myself. I think there is a big difference. I think WS's can see when we are making changes just to bring them back vs. making life long changes in order to be a better person for ourselves. And no matter what happens with the M we can be proud of the type of person we have become.

So hang in there and take it one day at a time, but be greatful for the good days!

Thanks SML for your prayers, that really just made my day!

I have been thinking of and praying too for you, kloe and durham. Especially since our pregnancies were pretty much ruined by those pesky WH's and OW's. Totally not fair! Harrruuummmpppphhh!

I know what you mean kloe, about just waking up ourselves. There is a fog we BW's have too! Nasty icky stuff to crawl out of. Try to stay as strong as possible, and you'll be okay.

Fogman even says sometimes that he bears a grudge against our 4 month-old beautiful D because I had such a horrid pregnancy and went ballistic on him (or maybe it was the positive drug test and losing his job twice in 6 months that upset me?) Silly silly Fogman!!!! He really is quite comical! PUKE!

Hello everyone.. Last night went ok. My husband watched the game. I wanted to play a game with him or something but I ended up falling asleep on the floor next to him. I am not sure how because he is a very vocal football watcher. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I guess all the sleepless nights are catching up with me.

We went to be of course he didn't want anything else but to cuddle. I am hoping no SF is just a part of withdrawl. It's been 2 weeks and he is always telling me sorry. That it's not me it's him. He just laid there for awhile then came letting out these frustrating sighs. I asked him what was wrong. He said just frustrated. I asked him why. Then he said you know. Well there are many things he could be frustrated about but I didn't push. He kept taking my hand and hitting himself on the forehead saying he deserved it. Then he was off to snore land. I am just hoping this is all a part of withdrawl.

SML, just wanted to chime in and say something about the effect of my plan A as described by SH. Because of my plan A i was not giving my H any reason to continue what he is doing or a justification for D. now that's not to say that he won't file, he's told me as much and i expect any day now to be served w/papers. but it's the fact that all this time has gone by and my plan A and he is just now initiating the D process. i may not have been making any LB deposits but I sure the heck wasn't making any withdrawals either. my plan A comforted me in making me realize that i was doing all i could in dealing w/a person who i couldn't control and who is involved w/someone else. it made me feel good about what i was doing, especially dealing w/all the guilt i had about my behavior in our M (i was faithful but REALLY did not meet any of my H's needs but it was out of ignorance). it also left a good picture of me in my H's mind and not the bitter, vindictive W i think he was expecting.

prayers to you, RR

Arghhhh men.... My husband talks to me on the phone while I was coming home from work. He seems depressed again. I told him I was happy that he wanted to try. He just sat there and then said I never said that. Said that misunderstood him the other night. And also said his sister must have misunderstood him. Seems awful strange that we both did.

He says I should just call like he suggested and talk to our MC. That she will explain things. I told him I do not want to go if all she is going to say is he wants to leave and lets work on a plan for him to do so. He said just go talk to her.

So I call her and setup a appointment. I asked her straight out did he say he wants to leave. She said she feels he is confused. And is not sure about it himself. Said that with her session with him she felt she has a new understanding of him and what he needs from me at this time. That we can work it out that way. I told her I got the impression from him today that he still wants to go. Just wants to work out the details with me. She tells me she didn't get that at all from him.

So I call him back and told him I setup the appointment and what she said. I am more confused now about everything. He said I didn't listen to him the other night when he came home and didn't understand him. Although after the session he called OW and talked to her for 2 hours. No wonder she can understand him and listen to him. He is putting in time and effort with her. When he came home to me he talked about 15 minutes at the most and I am suppose to read him mind and know exactly what he meant.

Guess I am just going to have to go to the session and see what happens from there.

I am just to the point now where I feel like whatever. If he wants her so bad let him have her. They will both see that it's not the fantasy they thought. She will finally see the baggage he comes with. Yeah it may not be truly about her but in a way it is. He cannot break his addiction to her and is justifying it.

I know I can be better but it's like he doesn't even want to try to be the husband I deserve. He keeps saying work on myself stop worrying about him. I worry about OUR marriage. I worry about OUR kids. He says sometimes the best way to work on ourselves is to leave the marriage. Back to the old fog talk again.

<small>[ September 10, 2004, 05:07 PM: Message edited by: SadMarylandLady ]</small>

I sit here fighting myself. I sat down and thought about things and realize that I am creating a lot of the problems today. My husband is very stressed at work. He called me about something and I was talking about trying and stuff. I think that he feels he already spoke to me about this the other night and now I am doubting or questioning what he is saying. Like I didn't listen the first time.

I want to apologize to him about this. I didn't even realize this till now. I get on his case about it then he just feels like whats the use. Then says things just to get me off his back. Even if it's things he doesn't mean or it hurts me. I know he wants to try. I heard it and saw it in him the other night. But I also know that WS's do change from day to day.

The only thing right now that is bugging me is the fact that he keeps calling OW on his cell and running up the minutes really high. Last month we were stuck with a 350 cell bill and this month I have a feeling it's going to be the same. What do you do in this case? I asked him to please stop using the cell because he is over. I asked him to please stop calling the OW. I don't know what else to do with this area.

SML - I don't think there is anything else you can do. He is a grown man who is going to do what he wants. You have made your position clear, it is now up to him to make the right decision. I think you should try to just enjoy the weekend with him and not have any type of R talk what so ever. Stick with more pleasant topics and show him how nice it can be between you two.

Kloe,
I agree with you about this weekend. I am going to enjoy myself. I am going to show him I am a fun person to be around. Lately all he sees is a depressed stressed lady. I know I also create a lot of my own problems. Nobody wants to be around someone who is sad, clingy, talks about OW, questions him constantly, and other things. I want him to see the woman I want and can be.

This weekend we are having a birthday party for my stepson at my SIL's house in D.C. That should be fun for the kids. I will not bring anymore R talk up with him. Unless he wants to talk about it. I think the more I talk about it the less it makes him feel like wanting to put a effort into trying.

Tuesday I go to my first IC session. I am hoping I get some help with my issues and also get some insight into how I can be there better for my husband. She told me she has a lot to discuss with me that she feels we can work on and take our marriage in a new direction. So I am keeping my fingers crossed. I do see hope in my situation. He is still here you pointed that out before. And I need to take advantage of that and show him what kind of woman I really can be.

SML,

Here's a deal you can strike up with the WS. For every $ he spends on the OW (talking on the phone, gifts, meals, hotels, etc.) he spends double more..... once for you and once for the family. Sounds fair eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

L.

SML - Even if he wants to have a R talk this weekend, I wouldn't. Tell him you just don't have the energy to talk about that right now and ask if you can hold off on that discussion. Right now you guys might be better off waiting on all R talks until you go see the MC and have the talks there. Use the rest of your time together to reconnect and really enjoy each other.