OK, comic relief time...

JL, could you have made that list of questions just a little bit longer????

my first thought when i saw that you had posted to this topic was OH NO!!! she has JL's attention now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> watch out!!!

JL, you know i say that with the fondest of thoughts for you.

i was going to post this in a new topic but since i am posting to you here anyway... i know i got pretty sensitive a little while ago when you mentioned my name. for the record... i really don't mind you using me as an example. (you could throw in there a positive while mentioning me though, that would help!!) but the point is.. if my story can help others, i am all for it.

ok, back to you Dreamcatcher...

i wish i could give you a big hug. i know how hard it is to spit out those words. for me, it happened on a sunday, shortly after church. the sermon that day was on the story of the son who took his father's money, spent it all, came back with the hope of just being a servant and was welcomed back. i wanted to come home. i wanted to come home more than anything else. i think my H understands this and i think, i hope, that gives him some comfort.

my prayers are with you.

P.S. ya, IC might be of some help for you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

JL...Wow...thanks soo much for taking the time to post all of that...hard questions, but ones that I suspect I may learn a lot from while answering...here goes...

How long has your affair been over?
The A has been over for a little more than a year...last contact with OM was probably 6 months ago

How long as your H been sober?
Hmmm...I'd say for about 4 days at this point, but the weekend's coming. Seriously...He never has quit drinking, just quit getting icky sloppy drunk on every one of his days off. Of course he recently started a job that has him at work basically Mon - Fri. He drinks on the weekends, but like I mentioned..not to the extent as he has been for the last 3 - 4 years. He's been trying/cutting back for about 1 1/2 years.

Did your H do a 12 step plan of sorts?
No, see above

Did he apologize to you for his behavior while drinking, and for drinking?
He used to apologize all the time...after the fact...and we have talked about how his drinking takes/took? it's toll on our marriage and there were times that we came real close to separating because of it and his behavior when drunk.

If so, what did he say to you?
He knew that he was and [censored] when he was drunk, and after all of our talks, he would recognize that he didn't want to lose his family over the booze. Of course this usually only lasted until the next drunk. He asked me to help him, but refused to get treatment.

Does he have a counselor that he is close to or someone he trusts?
No, he would never consider IC and doesn't have any family close or friends that he confides in.

Do you have someone you are close to that you trust?
I do. I have a couple of very close friends that will be/are there for me whenever I need them. Only one of them knows about the A though, and even she doesn't know the extent or details of it all.

Has your H's behavior in the marriage changed in the last few years and if so how?
The years leading up to and during the first 3 years or so of the A were bad, sometimes real bad. There were many drunken fights (I'll own up to drinking right along with him at first....after a while I quit the drinking to the extent I was and the fights were more one sided). Before the A I had gotten to the point where I couldn't stand for him to even touch me because most of the time when he 'wanted' to, he would be drunk. After the A started things got worse of course, for obvious reasons.... I wanted him around me even less. Even if he was being on his best behavior, I would find something to get mad at him for....breathing for example.

As I mentioned earlier, about two years ago a light went off for him and he began to cut back on the drinking and started his own version of plan A. At that point, I started to see the man I fell in love with peeking through and that was a big part of what brought me out of the 'fog'. He was finally showing me clearly how important I was to him, how much he loved me, and reminded me of what had kept us together for so long. Been married for 22 years this year btw.

Has your behavior in the marriage changed? Before, during and after the A?
I think I may have answered this mostly under the last question. Before the A, I mostly fed into the alcohol created drama, during the A, I withdrew from him so much that I didn't even have the heart to fight or deal with the drunken scenes, I would just avoid or leave the area all together. When we did get 'into it', I would be so very disrespectful and disgusted with him. I'm sure even through his drunken haze he would recognize this.

After the A ended, I joined him in trying to get this all back to good....we've been mostly successful I think. Of course, my fear is that when I do confess to him, we will be right back at the beginning...scary thought.

Does your H exude confidence or does he fear things such as his own weakness, especially where alcohol is concerned? things such as his own weakness, especially where alcohol is concerned?
He is basically a very confident person, he doesn't really think of his drinking as a weakness I don't think. More like a habit that he can break if he wants to. He does recognize that he is an alcoholic though...albeit a 'functional' alcoholic.

Do you feel you are withholding from him for fear he will get too close and the pain for you too great, knowing what you know?
No, I don't think so. But that's something I will have to look closer at.

Do you fear that he would think less of you once he knew?
Oh definately! I'm pretty sure this is a given, and deservedly so.

Does or did he lean on you while recoverying from alcoholism and subsequent withdrawal?
Since he never really 'quit' I can't say he's had any major withdrawal, but yes, now that you have me thinking about it, he did/does depend on me to help keep him 'in line'

Do you provide him strength?
I think I do...I hope I do.

Does he provide you strength?
Yes he does, I could have never broken away from my A without his (unknowing) help. Even with him plan A'ing his butt off, I had a terribly hard time letting go of the addiction to the OM.
In other areas of life though..., I can't really say that he is very good at offering strength. We've recently (the last year) been dealing with some problems with my 16 year old D. Many times scenes with her would end up with him walking out of the house and threatening to leave us all because of the stress/drama the situation caused. I've learned to just keep certain things from him to keep him from getting upset...then drinking...then walking, etc...

Is he depressed about the loss of his father?
I think he still is even though he says no. It's been almost 4 years, if he isn't depressed over it, he is still angry...

How old is he?
H is 43...me 42....

Back when I was 20 something, I thought by this age, I'd have it all figured out...surprise!..


Whew, you have given me a lot of things to look at/think about JL. Thanks so much again for your time and help...

FL, Thanks for your prayers, I can use them...although I feel a bit more calm today, I have realized that even though he may 'not want to know', If I want the marriage we both need..and if I want the relationship with God that I really really need in this life....this is going to have to come out. One way or another. Thanks for sticking with me.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ September 16, 2004, 06:11 AM: Message edited by: dreamcatcher ]</small>

i'm absolutely here with you dreamcatcher. i'm glad you are feeling calmer today.

looking at some of your answers, you do have a lot of stuff going on here. I'm going to let JL do most of the commenting on your answers, he is so good at cutting thru the muck to the most helpful stuff. but i do want to comment on one thing you said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Of course, my fear is that when I do confess to him, we will be right back at the beginning...scary thought.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">i understand this scare but i'll tell you what, you will NOT be right back at the same beginning, you will be in a VERY different beginning.

i'm just a post away dreamcatcher, i'll keep watching for your posts.

DC,

Thank you for answering the questions. Since you are 6 months out from no contact, I think your feelings of guilt and the need to tell your H are very normal. I think you should be encouraged to tell your H. Further, I think you will NEED to tell him if you are to recover from the A and the damage it did to you.

I asked you all of those other questions because even Harley states that they won't counsel someone if there is another addiction involved. It needs to be addressed before real progress can be made. However, your H is functioning well enough to plan A you. I suspect he senses he almost lost you and I would bet he feels it was his drinking...it would seem it was. That does not excuse your choices, but it puts together the links doesn't it?

BC, let me offer for you consideration and discussion on this board several approaches ALL leading to you telling him.

One is that you sit down with him and simply tell him or write him. You could use your answers to my questions as the guideline for what to tell him and why things occured as they did. I do think that is clear as far as the marriage goes HE pulled you out of the A and that is something he can be proud of, very proud. He cannot be very proud of his drinking and what it did to the marriage, any more than you can of your A.

If you were to take this approach, I would strongly recommend counseling for the both of you, but with his drinking the underlying issues still remain. This is apart from what the knowledge of your A will do. I am guessing however, that he knows or strongly suspects.

Another approach is for you to start counseling and see if you can get your H to join you. If you find a counselor you like and think is helping you, I would then confide in the counselor that you had an A, and that you want to divulge this information to your H. Solicit his/her guidance in how to approach your H and then address the drinking, and the A.

DC, your H is strong enough to realize he was losing you and change. That is very impressive. You were strong enough to respond to his efforts and end your affair. You BOTH know how hard it is to kick an addiction and I think this knowledge is a building block for you helping him quit the drinking and for the both of you to rebuild this marriage. It is clear you must love one another very much, although I suspect there have been times when each doubted it.

Now do you see why I asked all of those question? Go back and reread your answers and you will see the progression of things and the work yet to be done. I am guessing that your H will see the advantages of stopping the drinking as he realizes what he has and what he almost lost.

So I invite your thoughts and those of others concerning this. I do think that you need to tell him, but frankly while it will hurt him terribly it should be an OPPORTUNITY for the both of you to grow in your marriage, your love, and within yourselves. It needs to be handled carefully because of your H's addiction to alcohol, but I think he is strong enough to handle it.

God Bless,

JL

Thank you all for your guidance on this...JL, answering your questions really did put it all in sync for me, I know that avoiding conflict isn't going to do either of us (or our marriage) any good...

it's time for me to come clean and be the person that I know I am...that person who cheated and lied and wasted years of life on a lie needs to be put to rest for good, I truly can't imagine living the rest of my life with this lie in my heart.

hi dreamcatcher, i am feeling anxious tonight but it sounds like you have more reason than i do. it's a big step you are making here, deciding to confess. how are you doing?? remember to keep breathing. do you have thoughts on how you are going to do it?? need to bounce any ideas? i'm here.

DC,

Do you have a plan for this big step? You need one.
So think about it, reread your answers, and decide on how to do this. It may not go exactly as you would like, but having a plan gives you a basis for assessing how to respond to your H in different situations.

I do think you need to tell him and what I hope is that it is a catalyst for him to look deep within himself and change. It will be rough hence the suggestion of seeking out a counselor to help. I think one of the Harleys could really help you with a plan. Something to consider.

God Bless,

JL

FL & JL ....
I'm working on a plan, I also think I may tell my best friend my torrid tale before I tell H, I have a feeling I'm going to have to have a safe place to land when this s&it hits the fan...Just in case....
That's pretty much where my planning ends at this point..lol..I'd welcome any suggestions/hints... H is only home on the weekends, so I don't have a lot of time to work with, not sure if this weekend will be the 'one'...I'd like to see what kind of mindset he comes home with first...if he's stressing over work, in a good/bad mood, etc...

JL..I can't afford the Harley's although I am considering contacting my EPA at work and see if I can get an IC appointment. I had my daughter go to a IC for a time, he seemed pretty nice (even though according to her, he was a 'dork')...

I keep trying to imagine the conversation with H and what I will/should say...trying to imagine what his reaction will be...the only thing I can come up with right now is the hurt i'm going to see in his eyes....and of course I am still hearing...'I'd rather not know'....ugh....Oh well, I created this mess, time to make it right...

Thanks to you all for caring...I'll keep ya posted...

PS: FL...hope you're feeling better today, right there with ya on the anxious feeling...you doing ok?

<small>[ September 17, 2004, 05:47 AM: Message edited by: dreamcatcher ]</small>

Hi dreamcatcher,

Yes, i am feeling fine this morning. i calmed down last night shortly after posting thanks to the responses from dipti, jl and brown.

how about you? how are you doing?? i still vividly remember the time leading up to confessing, my heart goes out to you and my prayers.

what helped me was to try to keep remembering why i was doing this. for me it was to bring peace back into the house. i knew the turmoil in me was impacting everything. and he had no idea as to the real reason. i wanted to be his wife again. things were better at home than when i was in the middle of the A but the peace would never stay for more than a week or two. and i knew that had everything to do with me being unable to deal with the fact that that i cheated on him.

the week before i confessed, he told me at one point after we had just been struggling about something that he thinks i just don't want to be married to him anymore. i couldn't let him think that anymore because at that point, nothing was farther from the truth.

when i confessed i made sure i told him these things, although i'm not sure he understood them or even heard them. i have repeated it to him since then on occasion. i think he know hears what i am saying and i think that has brought him some comfort but the bottomline is still the same, and he will still need time to process it all and (hopefully) heal.

if i cheated on him as a symbol of deciding the marriage needed to end (which is what i told myself when i first decided to meet the OM and i do still believe that is the truth), then confessing was my action to symbolize that i wanted to come home.

how about you? maybe spending some time reflecting on what your reasons are would help you. post your thoughts here if you feel comfortable. i find posting here strenghtens me.

i think it is a very good idea that you have someone close to you that knows exactly what is going on so you can lean on them without having to start from scratch explaining what is up. of course you can always come here too. I will be able to check in over the weekend this weekend because, as we all know, my H won't be around much <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> normally i'm not around a computer on the weekends because we go away to a vactaion home we have nearby.

one other comment for you... you mentioned H is gone all week, do you mean literally all week?? like he leaves monday morning and does not come home until friday? that must be VERY stressful, it's like you are a single mom. and that must be lonley to go to bed alone so many nights. is that setup hard on you? is there no ohter options?

hang in there dreamcatcher, you are doing good.

sheesh..another double post...

<small>[ September 17, 2004, 05:39 PM: Message edited by: dreamcatcher ]</small>

Hi FL..glad you're feeling better. Today was a kind of anxious one for me, maybe it's the weather..probably it's the thought that I've decided to confess, I know that I probably won't be doing anything this weekend..I do need time to think, I'd like to be able to tell him 'why' when he asks...and I know he will. I think i'll read over my answers to JL's questions a few more times...maybe add some stuff I left out, and figure out for myself 'why' before I have to explain it to him.

Oh, and yes, I mean he is literally gone mon-fri..it's a pretty new situation as he decided to change careers a few months ago and has only been at it full time for a little over a month. So far it's worked out pretty well..so far. My kids are 16 and 19 so it's not too bad being a 'single parent'..aside from the daily fights over who gets the car, I think the kids are trying to be easy on me..lol

Have a great weekend, and thanks again... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ September 17, 2004, 05:40 PM: Message edited by: dreamcatcher ]</small>

DC,
I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans here, but, given light of the new info about your livign conditions, I thin some serious planning needs to go into this. You have waited a long time here...a little more shouldn't hurt, it should help. SH discussed relationships where the two couples live apart, and steps to try and bump up the time together, that 15 hrs thingy. I just 'feel' wrong about you confessing this while your husband is gone all day and night, throughout a work week. I think too many negative aspects exist, and too many emotions are gonna surface. He's in a new job, and his work ability is about to go down the shi**er if you know what I mean...if unsure, just check the post frequency for BS's on this board... obviously very unproductive during work! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I think you need to have a plan to close the distance between you and your husband during the week before you disclose the affair. That is my opinion, but, you are both about to embark on quite a journey. Anyone else think this new info is significant?

Rook...I've been concerned about that too, he is only here one full day and two..maybe sometimes three nights. It's friday evening here at 7:22 and he's just now on his way home. I feel like I'd have to bomb him with the news so soon after he got home, just to have a full day (maybe two) to talk it through and stuff. Then again, he may leave the minute I tell him and give me no time to try to explain (if there is such a thing).

The situation isn't likely to stop anytime soon, he's just starting this and from some of the things he tells me, he's thinking of taking a job that keeps him away even longer... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Thanks for bringing that up, definately something I consider in my plan...this is gonna suck...

just wanted to send you a HI dreamcatcher.

i also think having him gone mon-fri is going to make things harder. when i first confessed, H had a string of business trips he had to take, in fact i think he had to leave the next morning. in some ways i think the time away helped him, but for us, the time apart was short lived.

How far away is his job exactly? is there anyway you can commute to him? where does he stay, in a hotel?

i know this time is stressful for you, but do try to relax a bit this weekend, enjoy each others company as much as possible. you will both need to draw on some happier memories.

just saying hi and bumping this up so it's easy for you to find <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi FL...Hope you had a wonderful weekend...I don't get a chance to get online much over the weekend obviously coz H is home and the weekends are busy 'catching up'... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

To answer your question about seeing him during the week...it's not really possible because he drives a truck all over the east coast...couldn't leave the kids alone long either...yeah, I love em, but don't trust em home alone...lol

I spent some time just watching H this weekend..enjoying the little things we share, how we are so 'in tune'...and wondering how much of that we will lose...

Anyway, I'm off to work now..thanks for thinking of me...

hi dreamcatcher,

my weekend was good although i have not been sleeping great lately. lots of vivid and disturbing dreams happening again.

normally i am not on much over the weekend either because we usually leave town, no access to a computer then and i like it that way!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> and wondering how much of that we will lose </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">i understand, i truely do. and i doubt there is much i can say to really help you because confessing IS going to change so much but here is one thing to consider...

how much you could ultimately gain.

sometimes i feel very skiddish about my words having impact on anohter person's decision to confess. there are no garuntees about how your marriage will be impacted by this. but there is one thing that i do wholeheartedly believe, confessing is the BEST thing for your soul. i'm betting you will find you feel much better about yourself after confessing. it will be hard to accept feeling better because you will also be seeing your H's pain (at least it is for me) but the fact of the matter remains, it will have been a good thing that you have done.

and if your marriage does survive, i bet it will end up being stronger than ever.

seems odd, doesn't it? but that is what is happening for me.

hi dreamcatcher. just wanted to send you a hi. let you know i am thinking of you and you are not alone.

how you doing?