Okay.....

My earlier post "Hello bb, I'm doing okay" tells of how my Plan B has been "blown out of the water".

What I need to know is this...should I just tell WH when he calls in the morning, "have you ended contact with OW, sent NC letter, and had someone else return her cell phones?"

If he wavers, then say "I explained to you before that these are my boundaries. I would love to have you back home, but cannot keep on this way until you have done these things. Please call me when you have done these things."

Is this too "in your face"? Or should I go talk to him about this? I have to go to the town where his apartment is on Friday anyway.

I know I sound stupid (I'm really NOT - , but I almost think I need someone to write it for me...I want to be firm, and not sound wishy-washy.

I guess it's like I was told by all of you - that he will pull out all the stops just so he can have contact with

Could you please give me some pointers?

Hi k,

I was really getting worried about you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Your husband really sounds "mixed up" and I think he's really worried of loosing you.

He for sure reacts when "You" back off.........
(feels good doesn't it? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

Anyways, have you had the opputunity to speak with SH again???

I'm honestly not sure what to advise you.
You know your husband better than anyone.

You don't sound "stupid" at all and I understand your confusion completely. This is not something that we have to deal with all the time, so how can we just "know" what to do. It's so darn "mixed-up".

I'm really not sure what others will tell you but I know what I'd do.
This is only my opinion and it would fit in my relationship.

Your husband "knows" what you have asked from him. He's probably testing his waters and he's probably waiting for you to "fall back into old behaviour pattern". (well Plan B did break again)
This probably isn't happening conciously but from what I have read, he does it "over and over again".

Write him a "serious" Plan B letter, place it in a "beautiful, lovingly packed picnic basket" and
get it over to his appartment on Friday. (without talking face to face) Let him know that this is hurting you to the core and that you love him from the bottom of your heart.
Let him know that he's going "scuba-diving" on his own and has all the time in the world to make a decision.

Pack the basket with things that will get him thinking. You might even consider making a "little" album with pics of the life you have shared. Just make it "little".
Don't forget the napkin with your favorite smell.
I hope you get what I mean.

Then "back off" and "turn off" your cell phone so that you don't make the same mistake as before.
Have you gotten your answering machine message changed yet?????

Then get "BUSY"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

hugs
bb

Hi bb....

Thanks for your concern. I had a busy weekend.

I spoke to Steve Harley on Thursday.

Went to a barbecue with an old friend, then went to a "fair" next day with her.

WH called a zillion times. I didn't answer. Left a zillion messages. Then, he showed up at the house. He asked if I had met "someone" at the barbecue. I asked him if that's what he wanted me to do, and he said no.

He was very down when he got here, but I treated him normally...and didn't have any R talk. He started acting like his "old self" again.

Now, he is calling me every morning, and every evening. I am not calling him at all.

BTW, I have changed the message on my cell phone. And I do need to change the other one.

I guess I feel like WH is manipulating me in several ways, and I need to just not let myself be manipulated! Easier said than done. Guess that's why this makes me feel stupid (I'm NOT stupid, just FEEL that way!)

But I DO like your suggestion of the picnic basket.

THANKS!!!! ((((bb))))

k,

what did SH say????

bb

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by k72172:
<strong>

What I need to know is this...should I just tell WH when he calls in the morning, "have you ended contact with OW, sent NC letter, and had someone else return her cell phones?"

If he wavers, then say "I explained to you before that these are my boundaries. I would love to have you back home, but cannot keep on this way until you have done these things. Please call me when you have done these things."

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is not in your face at all. I wouldn't demand that he write the letter now,[you want to write the letter together] but he must end contact and return the phones. I would expect if he is really sincere that he would be willing to send the no contact letter. That is his demonstration that he is serious and you do need a demontration because talk is cheap with a WS.

<small>[ September 16, 2004, 07:22 AM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

Thanks Mel & bb...

bb...Steve Harley said Plan B. But like I said, that was kind of blown out of the water.

Mel, I also agree with you. I have told him what my boundaries are. And I do NEED some action on this matter.

Without further action on his part right now I can see that we are right back where we were. I think WH would like to never have anything talked about or mentioned again. He seems to act pretty well when nothing is said.

But when I say anything about the NC letter, or returning her phones, he always says "You've already told me your demands. Now I'm right back in that hole I've been trying to get out of" and he acts all depressed.

Does that sound manipulative?

I need to screw up my courage, and just DO it! Since I'm a non-confrontational kind of person, it really takes me a little to get moving on something like this!

Thanks.....K

OH! BTW bb...

I changed my greeting on the home phone.

It now says (very upbeat) "Hi! You've reached K's house! Leave me a message."

I need to come up with something a little better, but that's good for a start.

Our old message was DD saying "you've reached ###-####. Please leave a message" Very business like.

K

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by k72172:
<strong>

But when I say anything about the NC letter, or returning her phones, he always says "You've already told me your demands. Now I'm right back in that hole I've been trying to get out of" and he acts all depressed.

Does that sound manipulative?
K </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It sounds like he doesn't want to give up his honey! It sounds just like a typical WS and it is this "hole" that Plan B is supposed to resolve. Plan B can't work, tho, if you won't work it.

K, every time you blow Plan B, you hurt your position because he doesn't believe you are serious. See, he now thinks that you will relax your boundaries for him because you can't stand to be away from him for more than a week. He is testing your resolve and so far you haven't held out. You will now have to work double time to prove that you mean what you say.

Just consider this: every time you break Plan B only prolongs the affair and works in the OW's favor. You are helping the OW when you do that.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by k72172:
<strong>

But when I say anything about the NC letter, or returning her phones, he always says "You've already told me your demands. Now I'm right back in that hole I've been trying to get out of" and he acts all depressed.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I should also point out that this statement tells me he is

a) not even close to ready

b) trying to have his cake and eat it too

"Trying to get out of...." means that he is really "trying" to hold on to his TWO women.

See, K, he wants 2 women. He is getting his needs met in TWO places. Now, the OW can't possibly meet all of his needs. You can see the proof of this when he starts calling you frantically after about a week for his K fix.

Once he is allowed to realize this, the affair will die and he will come home [ideally]. But, he will NEVER realize this as long as you keep meeting his needs because everytime he starts getting anxious about not having you, you calm him down by giving him a fix.

He can go on FOREVER like that if you keep giving him the necessary fix to continue his affair.

See what I mean?

Thanks Mel...

I've just "considered" what you said. I "see" where you're coming from.

I DO NOT want to help OW's position in any way.

Guess it's up to me to do this right.

What's your take on WH just showing up at the house?

I was doing GOOD until he showed up!

Just say, "Have you met my conditions? No? Then please leave. Call me when you have met them."

??????????????????????????????? K

If he is showing up at your house, I would get the locks changed. He MUST know that you are serious about this. Give him some motivation to end his affair, K.

Listen to Melody. She tried and tried to get me to stick to a firmer Plan B. My WH was just like yours.

I kept breaking Plan B, and all it did was allow WH time to cement his relationship with OW. It has now been 20 months and they are still living together. My advice is stay dark. When he comes over, don't answer the door. Be gone a lot. Don't talk relationship at all. He is trying to manipulate you.

Of course, if you prefer to keep letting him do this, there is a good side also. You will completely lose any love or respect you have for him. You will have no feelings left for him, not even hate.

When he contacts you again, you can say something like:

"I am sorry I have given you the false impression that I would see you before you ended contact with OW and returned the phones. I won't make that mistake again. I would ask that you respect my wishes and not contact me until you have finally ended all contact with the OW as I have stipulated in my letter. Please refer to my letter."

CLICK

No argument, no negotiating, no discussion.

Mel and Believer...

Okay, my courage is coming back up to where I need it to be.

Have to go to work early today. I will check in later.

Thanks sooooooooo much for your replies!

K

Hi k,

you're getting "stronger & stronger" ............. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Even if you don't believe it at times, always repeat it to yourself!

"I'm getting stronger & stronger!" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I think you are getting real good advise from the others.

How about a: "Please don't Disturb" sign for your door. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

K, even if your situation is difficult and very confusing, please don't give up. This is not going to last forever. Have trust in yourself.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">t now says (very upbeat) "Hi! You've reached K's house! Leave me a message."
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sounds good! How about: Hi! You've reached K's house. I'm out right now but feel free to leave me a message and I'll call back.

If he does call again, it will give him the message that you are "busy" and that you are "going on with your life". He might start to feel "left out" and this will give him a "dash of reality". It will for sure get him "thinking & wondering" what the heck you are up to??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

So take care of yourself, k. You're gonna make it.

hugs
bb

Hi bb.....

Just want to thank you and Mel and Believer and all who have given support.

I am trying to play myself up right now. WH calls every a.m. and p.m. I'm being nice, and talkative with him. Thinking this is a modified Plan A right now - a very short one.

WH has NO idea what is coming!

But my plan is to ask him tomorrow (won't get a chance until then) if he has met any of my conditions of reconciliation. If he has not, I plan to tell him just what Mel said, "I don't want to give you any false impressions. These things are very important to me. If you want to be with me, then you should SHOW me by your actions that you do. If you will not do them, then please refer to the letter I sent...the one you didn't open. Please don't contact me until you have done these things."

Like you said, I know WH and his ways well. And everyone's situation is different. This is the way that I think I can best get thru to him.

Then, my phones are going to be turned OFF! And I'm going to be too busy to be at home.

AND I WILL NOT BREAK PLAN B UNTIL HE HAS MET MY CONDITIONS! THAT'S IT! I DON'T CARE WHAT HE PULLS TO GET ME TO BREAK PLAN B---

I WILL NOT!!!!!

I WILL NOT BACK DOWN ON THIS! (thanks to you guys)

Wish me luck.... don't think I need luck. I've never felt this strong and resolved on ANYTHING I've done before (thanks to you guys).

K

K, why are you waiting a minute to do this? Every time you talk to him you simply further erode your credibility and prolong the affair. You are giving him a mixed message that does nothing but harm your chances and leave him confused. It is absolutely imperative that you show some consistency here or he will not believe you mean anything!

You don't have the luxury of being afraid of confrontations right now, you have to save your marriage.

Tell him NOW what you need to tell him and go dark. Please don't play games with him anymore.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by k72172:
<strong>

But my plan is to ask him tomorrow (won't get a chance until then) if he has met any of my conditions of reconciliation. If he has not, I plan to tell him just what Mel said, "I don't want to give you any false impressions. These things are very important to me. If you want to be with me, then you should SHOW me by your actions that you do. If you will not do them, then please refer to the letter I sent...the one you didn't open. Please don't contact me until you have done these things."

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Please be clear as a bell, K. Say "have you ended your affair with the OW? Don't contact me until that has happened and you have met the conditions in my letter, and THEN we can discuss possible reconcilation."

Thanks, Mel

I cannot do this right this minute... no opportunity. WH is away working, and I will have not contact with him.

I will be VERY CLEAR - and I am taking into account all of your suggestions. You seem to know what you are talking about, and I KNOW someone with experience when I see it - talking about YOU.

I have always been able to learn from the experiences of others - this IS one of my strengths.

My plan for today - more cleaning, re-organizing, and then I'm off to town to shop til I drop!

There really comes a lot of freedom when you have a plan. If it was not for you, Believer, Pep, and bb (and EVERYONE here), and all the support you have given me, I don't think I would have a plan....or much inner strength to carry it out.

Sooooo...... keep it coming! I'm listening AND learning! YEAAA!!!

K

That sounds great, K! Hang in there, you are doing wonderful. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />