A little background, WW is in an EA (there was also a kiss), she is leaving the state in 1 month with my D for a trial separation (she needs time and space). OM lives near where she will be. She can't commit to not seeing him when gone. Now there are daily emails, phone calls, etc. Plan Aing for 1 week. I sent her a letter yesterday saying that I know about the continued emails and phone calls and that she is killing me. She almost went off the deep end last night. She now wants to leave next week. Promises to come back by Oct. 30. Obviously, this is not acceptable to me especially with my D. She told her Mom and sister last night about our problems. Not sure if she told them about the EA. I have a good relationship with my IL's and am thinking of calling them and asking for help and to also find out if they know about the EA.

The plan now is for my W and I to sit down tomorrow night and write out a separation plan (dates, parenting plan, financial). I also plan to negotiate with her no contact with OM. Not sure how this will go over. She told me yesterday that she told OM to not call her right now, she needs time and space. I guess this is good and I can monitor their emails to see if it is the truth.

I have talked to two lawyers about my rights. There is something I can do to prevent her from leaving. However, this would be the final straw and right now I am focused on saving my marriage. If it goes bad and Oct. 30 comes and goes, I can have a legal separation filed and ready to go along with a court order to bring my D back. We are both residents of this state, so my W can't do anything legal in the other state unless stays for at least 60 days to gain residency. That date will be in my mind and I will not let it slip by without legal action.

The bottom line is that I am trying not to LB, but she says I am pushing her further away. I am not reminding her of the guy she married even though she now doubts we ever should have married or were ever in love. After a 10 year relationship and 8 year marriage, I find this hard to believe. Maybe I should back off with my talk of the OM. Its hard to meet her ENs when I can't show her affection or tell her I love her, I can only talk with her about her day, her plans for tomorrow, etc.

As with many of you, in 3-4 weeks, I went from a typical marriage that I admit wasn't great, but I was happy, to my W saying she has feelings for OM and may want a divorce. These two extremes in a short period of time have caused me to lose 10 pounds, sleep at best 5 hours each night and take medication for depression. She says she needs to decide what she wants to do. She even said that I am putting her in a tough spot to decide. I came back and said no, no, no, no,...you have put yourself in this position. Even though I have admitted to her that with my taking her for granted after our D, I may have pushed her away. Any thoughts or ideas on my next move would be much appreciated.

There is something I can do to prevent her from leaving. However, this would be the final straw and right now I am focused on saving my marriage.

regardless of your wifes feelings of unhappiness and the FACT that there is a OM...none of that OK's the belittling and disregard of your ROLE as a child's father....

you should not for one second allow you wife to remove your child from you for such an extended period...

the lessons and the message to children that go through this is..
1. DADS HOLD LITTLE REAL MEANING ON A DAY TO DAY BASIS IN A CHILD'S LIFE.

2. Grownups who in a child's eyes are are powerful can make mommy sad or upset...and they can be GOTTEN rid of...which translate in to if that can happen to a grown up...then surely a child with no power...who makes mommy or daddy upset can also be replaced....
this will haunt your child at night..that if she displeases grownups then she will be sent away ..just as daddy was....

3. grownups having an affair have no right to invlove their children in their insane running away from issues...

4. saving your marriage and being a are dad are two different and seperate issue...if you condone this seperation you will be consenting to abandoning your child to a woman who is not thinking in the best interest of her child but in her own selfish needs..
and if you send wife and child to HER family they will cirlce the wagons around them both...and you will be replacable...

you need to to what is right for your child inspite of your wives actions or desires...
wife can go where she wants...
child stays in same home and routine...children more than anything need stability....
not chaos
not replacable grownups...
not pawns in an affair...

you need to be the man
you need to do right by your child first..
the marriage issues can wait or be addressed differently...

your fear of losing your wife..can not cloud or distort what is right in your role as a dad....

you brought this child in to this world...and it is full of chaos and stress on it's own....your wife has no right to bring this chaos to her daughter...and you must now do what you must do to protect this child....

fear of losing your wife....
is nothing compared to what damage is going to be done setting the precadent that when the going gets rough...people can just run to false place of safety...
your wife is running from herself...
let her go.
but not with your daughter.

ARK

jmash:

It makes sense 2 protect yourself legally, particularly if your W plans 2 take your D 2 another state.

Is the OM M'd? What do you know about him? They meet at work? Have you exposed 2 people close 2 him? You should. Also, DO expose 2 your in-laws. Don't just find out what they know, tell them what you know. Through it all, be sure 2 reaffirm that you love your W and want 2 repair what's wrong with your M, but you can't do that with the separation and with the distraction of the OM's influence on your W.

I'd back off a bit about asking for NC now. Your W isn't ready for that.

Also, realize that you exposing the A 2 people will make her VERY angry. But Penny Tupy has said many times that, if the WS is angry about something you're doing, then it usually means you're doing something right. FOR your M.

-ol' 2long

jm, I'm not going to say anything differently than ark and ol2, just change the words. And, what a "choice" your WS left you in. Your back is againsst the wall. I'm truly sorry for this.

It's very apparent she is choosing the A over her own child. You need to protect your child. There really is no choice about it, IMHO: you need to go along with what your lawyers are saying. You have not been given a choice (at this time) to immdeiately work on saving your M. (That "may" come in time.) You need to save your child from this madness.

Best wishes.

Thanks for your advice. My D is 2.5, but I can tell she is being affected. She is in a very Mommy mode right now which I think is her way of dealing with what is going on. I'm worried about my IL's taking what I say the wrong way and taking her side completely. I am thinking about a letter/email. Then I can control the words. I will probably post for your review.

The OM has never been married, no kids and has never given my W up in 15+ years. He is waiting with open arms. No emails today, they may be taking a break from one another. Today, and our separation negotiation tomorrow will tell alot. I may have to take legal action next week. Thanks,

Jmash

WW is in an EA (there was also a kiss), she is leaving the state in 1 month with my D for a trial separation (she needs time and space). OM lives near where she will be. She can't commit to not seeing him when gone
She cannot commit to this because it is the reason she is going. She is no toging to make na effort to stay away.
She will probably move in immediatley with him.

I still suggest you do not let her take your daughter out of state, especially since she is going to be with om.

Actually, my WW and D will be staying with my IL's. But I get your point, she may move in with him at some point. I am just torn between trying to salvage my M and protect my D. If I protect my D by keeping her in the state for the time being, a divorce will still result my W getting primary custody. So am I really proteting her in the long run? I feel that I am not quite ready to throw in the towel on my M, but I may have no choice. Thanks, Jmash.

So do you condone the mother taking the daughter physically closer in proximity to the OM...

your wife will definitely want to use this time to have OM bond with your daughter....

you can't control a thing your wife does...

but the fear of divorce should never impede your duty to protect your daughter....

what if she takes daughter out there for a month..
she daughter and OM have a grand old time..
that's the other thing..create this faiery tale adventure for your daughter...so this is all one big wonderful experience out there with OM....
then
she divorces you...

you suddenly cry fowl saying you don't want your daughter around OM...
and they counter with...but you let her go out there for a month before....

you stake your claim that your wife will do what she chooses...and there is nothing you can do about that...

and that while you want nothing more than an even better marriage than before...you can not stand by and let you daughter be moved around while mom finds herself..
if moms so lost she needs to go closer to OM to find herself..she's probably not to focused on what's the best interest to daughter...

think of the flip of this..
imagine tbe outrage if a woman was here saying husband is going closer to his OW for a month and taking daughter with him....

people would be outraged...
men/dad/fathers are so pegged as replacable and not important it's sickening...
I am offended that we woman treat men this way..
while at the same time ...thank God I am not a man as to be seen as having so little value in a childs life...

and what's scariest is the number of men that have bought this bull and believe it...

If I even mentioned to mr. ark that I needed to find myself and my plan to do this was to take the children away for a month...

he'd pack my bags..
kiss me on the forehead
probably open the car door for me...
and send me alone on my way..
with not one kid in tow...

even the act of going away for a month
for time alone
and to find oneself...shouldn't be sugarcoated as anything other than it is..

abandonement of the marriage.
anbandonement of the child...

In the end of this mess...you need to be standing tall that you did right by your daughter...which does right by you...your wife and the marriage...

can you even for a second trust your wife NOT to expose your daughter to him
can you even for a second right now trust her judgement
her decision making...

she's fleeing to people who will not "judge" her...will support her to be happy no matter what...

a divorce will still result my W getting primary custody.

there's laws about moving children out of state from parents...
there's clauses to no overnights with strangers etc...

do the right thing now in setting the precedent that THIS ,,,this moving the child as if you don't matter is NOT acceptable....
and follow that path all the way through....

ARK

If I protect my D by keeping her in the state for the time being, a divorce will still result my W getting primary custody
Why would she get primary custody?
YOU can have it in the divorce decree that the parent who has primary custody cannot move out of state/more than xx miles without the others permission or permission from the court.

jmash:

Stop worrying about how 2 approach the ILs about this and just DO IT. Do it right, though. Go 2 Penny Tupy's website http://www.saveyourmarriagecentral.com go 2 the discussion forums and read the thread about exposure letters and the like. Use one of THOSE letters 2 send 2 the ILs AND 2 the OM and anybody close 2 him (relatives and coworkers).

MAKE A FIRM STAND NOW. You won't regret it later.

DON'T let your W take your D ANYWHERE. Ark and Chris have already said it, but it can't be underscored enough times. Your home and your FAMILY is the core of your D's existence. Don't even give the slightest impression that you're condoning or contributing 2 this "separation so I can think" nonsense.

-ol' 2long

<small>[ September 16, 2004, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

All this makes alot of sense. It has taken me two weeks of similar advice for me to realize I must take a stand. I'll start with the temp separtion plan stating my D stays here, no exceptions. This won't fly with my W. She will be angry and may leave very soon with my D. As a backup, I'm meeting my lawyer on Tuesday to get the legal separation and court order paperwork rolling. Of course I have to get a judge to accept my request of D staying in state or coming back if she already left. W can stay away and "think" or come home and work on the marriage. Her choice but I'll ask her to come home. At least my D will be with me and be protected. Yes Mommy may not be here, but Mommy chooses not to be here. Thanks for all your advice.