A thread was started a while back regarding the noticeability ( <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ) of the generalization of the "young" years of when most of the M's started on MB. Just an observation.

I have made another observation and just curious about the responses.

I have noticed that most BS's here seem to have a higher intellect and emotional foundation. This is regardless of when someone became a member of MB. (I don't want to use examples--I will probably unintentionally leave many people out.)

Is it because of MB? Is it because the WS doesn't feel they themselves can not be at the same level as the BS? Is this because the WS thinks it is a challenge? Or is it just "coincidence?" (Or am I way off on my observation!)

Can you repeat the question please? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Now weaver, I'm not sure how I should take that...from you... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ...so I may seem very silly repeating it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

IMHO, I believe that the BS's have a higher intellect than the "average Joe." I was just curious as to if anyone else thinks this, and if so, why is this: that they find themselves on the "receiving end" of an A?

You mean, are some of the BS so brilliant and emotionally mature that their less intelligent and less mature WS do not measure up and can't help but destroy their relationships?

Or something like that?

Not sure. I had a part in screwing up my M, and I'm trying, not always successfully, but one day at a time, to change my bad habits.

My WW probably doesn't think you should have to change. She probably thinks that if it's right, it will work naturally, and if you have to make an effort there is something wrong.

I disagree completely. I think she's absolutely mistaken, and that she has a childish, romantic view of how marriage should be. But listen to how condescending I can be! See, I might be more thoughtful about relationships than my WW is, but that doesn't change the fact that I can be a stubborn know-it-all who tries to control everything.

GC

Well Liny it was a little attempt at humour, and I have to say you have more guts than I for posting this question.

And as a betrayed former OP, I am pleading the 5th on this one.


I think I'll just sit back and watch the intellectual cyber fists fly.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Edited for poor sentence structure only.

<small>[ September 21, 2004, 12:20 PM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

So you're saying BS's are smart and WS's are dumb. Yep I'll go along with that one...

(before someone wants to hit me over the head with a bat...I'm kidding!)

<small>[ September 21, 2004, 12:25 PM: Message edited by: jph ]</small>

I'll take a stab at it. This is merely my opinion, and should be taken with a grain of salt.

I think all relationships counteract or compliment each other accordingly. For example, I may be more grounded, more apt to think logically, foresee consequences, but I may really suck at home repairs, auto maintenance, yard work, cooking, cleaning, "home maintenance, including marriage maintenance".

I think infidelity runs rampant in our culture, some people, non gender specific resist the temptation, because they think through the situation, example of logical thinking. Accepting all behaviors have consequences. Realizing chaos begets chaos. Who needs that ?

Well the WS who falls prey to the A, isn't the logical thinker, they don't grasp consequence, they live in the moment and let the future take care of itself, with no tending.

Now you have spouse A who sucks at marriage maintenance, and spouse B who doesn't tend to the marriage either... recipe for disaster in the making.

I would venture to say that MANY BS, maybe as many as 90%, have had, experienced, a situation that an A, affection, attention, and tending from someone other than their spouse was right in their face.

Also, many logic based, analytical thinkers, are not risk takers.

That's all babble....just thought I'd take a stab at it.

LOL, this is not a SIMPLE question, silly LINY!!

Before I answer, I'd like a clarification..

Do you mean do we feel the BS is of higher intelligence with a better emotional foundation than our WSs? Or do you mean of the general populace?

it makes a difference...grin..and need to know before I answer.

IMHO, I believe that the BS's have a higher intellect than the "average Joe." I was just curious as to if anyone else thinks this, and if so, why is this: that they find themselves on the "receiving end" of an A?

Liny: Interesting question that I have a theory about! The big unknown here has to be the number of BS's who will never look at MB, or refuse to look at MB, or whatever. Bottom line is there are several more BS's that we will never hear from, than those we do hear from and I assume that most of the former will end in D!

Of those who care enough to read and interact on this site; I would suspect that they are of "higher intellect" so to speak than WS's. You see, WS's have chosen to do the things they do w/o forethought or consideration. Imagine a potential WS who comes onboard, reads several posts and participates for a month or more. I feel it unlikely that they would go through with A after learning what is spoken of here. The mere fact that they can be lured "into the fog" probably says much about their intellect. I mean let's face it; some of the things that OP will say to WS's to consumate the A are juvenile or at best "high schoolish"! And since WS's bought into the OP "lingo" so easily; it just doesn't seem to say much about intellect! JMHO.

I sure hope all of that made sense because if not; I need to go to "intellect" school!!! LOL

FR

Betrayed -

What you said makes perfect sense to me. Maybe you are on to something.


Weaver

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> IMHO, I believe that the BS's have a higher intellect than the "average Joe." I was just curious as to if anyone else thinks this, and if so, why is this: that they find themselves on the "receiving end" of an A? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There is a difference between intellectual intelligence and emotional intelligence. I don't know that I agree that BS are "smarter" then WS in an intellectual sense. From the stand point of intelligence in emotions and relationships, then yes, I would agree that BS far outstrip their wandering spouses in that regard.

In my personal case, I have a string of degrees and work in a complex field; I think I'm reasonably intelligent. I was, however, obviously emotionally well...STUPID..8 years ago.

<small>[ September 21, 2004, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: Sadfww ]</small>

LINY,

What r u tying 2 say ?. Why BS fails to protect M ? or WS is too dumb to have A ?

A is a product of failing to put up our guard by allowing OP to fillin our ENs. We are all capable of it.

Probably WS beats BS came across OP that is willing ...

-rh-

There is a difference between intellectual intelligence and emotional intelligence.

Gotta go along with my friend Sad on this one...

emotional intelligence may be a factor ... (or maybe dumb luck?)

Pep

Fish said - </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The mere fact that they can be lured "into the fog" probably says much about their intellect. I mean let's face it; some of the things that OP will say to WS's to consumate the A are juvenile or at best "high schoolish"! And since WS's bought into the OP "lingo" so easily; it just doesn't seem to say much about intellect! JMHO.
--------------------------------------------------
How about if we restate this as the OP was naive enough to be lured into the fog by the WS, and what the WS will say to the OP is high schoolish, and doesn't say much about the intelligence of the OP.

Or how about the fact that the BS would have entered into a lifetime commitment with a person who would ultimately betray them doesn't say much about the intellect of the BS.

I guess my point is that the very nature of infidelity and the very nature of growth links them together, as in what comes from infedility for the BS is incredible intellectual, spiritual and emotional growth by reason of necessity for survival. If the WS is ever lucky enough to experience this amount of pain through remorse ,than they two will experience growth, just through a different path.

Just my ramblings too.

<small>[ September 21, 2004, 12:57 PM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

I think Fish did a good job of saying what my opinion is. People who operate on a "higher" level are more willing to do the research necessary to overcome this strife. I found Marriage Builders within days of d-day. My world had been torn apart and I needed information, so I hopped on the Google express, went to the library, etc. (Unfortunately, my self esteem took such a blow that it took me almost 7 months to actually register a user name and say hello.)


But in my case in particular, yes I do think I am more intune with my emotions than my FWH. He grew up without talking about them, no one in his family talked about them (bet you can guess why his mom and dad aren't married anymore ...). But he is very intelligent, puts me to shame actually and I am not dumb by any means. He just swallowed his emotions for so long, I think he forgot how to "feel" them. Now he is learning all over again!

May I tell you something that I find infinitly sad? It's something that I found out this past weekend while talking to my dwh.

Just to give you a little background, I'm from mid-upper mid class family. Nearly everyone in my family has either gone to college some or graduated from college. All are well spoken (if I do say so myself) and most have some self knowledge that enables us to cope better than the average smart a$$ at the twists and divots in our life's paths.

My dwh is from a low-middle class to middle class hispanic family. I throw in the hispanic part, b/c it's made a HUGE dif in how some of his familia have/have not accepted me. Dwh is college educated, but not a graduate. He is moderately well spoken, and in my eyes better than the average Joe (obviously - I cannot stand ignorance that some people insist upon wallowing in).

Together - I've always felt he made me a better human being and WANT to, STRIVE to be a better human being. I thought he felt the same...he told me he did.

I found out this weekend that he's always felt that I am a better person than he is. He told me that he always felt that he had to do better, make more money, give me whatever my heart desired. Now, having my middle class upbringing I was taught and totally believe that you can WANT anything you like, but that doesn't necessarily mean you're gonna get it...and I totally accept that about life....but see? Dwh thought if I "wanted" something he had to give it to me no matter what.

Now this brings me to the total ironic and sad part: All thru our marriage, I wanted to be the best wife I could be. One night in particular springs to mind. You know those Reynolds baking dishes that are plastic, but you can actually bake casseroles or cakes in them? I'd made a wonderful dinner in one of those, but I'd set the oven too high and the dam* thing melted. I was so upset. I remember Nio taking me in his arms and asking me why the heck I was so upset about one little melty dinner. Why was this so important to me? He was so kind about it...I was crying....I just wanted him to have a nice dinner b/c I knew he was working so hard....it didn't matter to me that I had worked a full day, too...I just wanted it to be good for him.

So the irony wasn't lost on me Sunday when he told me he never felt good enough for me....specially when I was so heLL bent on being good for him.

And the OW - where did she fit in? She was content with having her "nothing". He didn't have to go out of his way to do anything for her...."content" is the word he used....is complacancy and no urges to better oneself really so appealing to people? I still shake my head about that one.

So, to answer your ?, LINY, I really think one's ability to sit back and be logical is the MAIN driving force behind a BS being able to find their way here. Unfortunately for WSs that are still WS and not FWS, the ability to BE a logical person is tied and gagged most of the time, and is probably pretty atrophied from disuse.

Just my .02.

- Kimmy

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> IMHO, I believe that the BS's have a higher intellect than the "average Joe." I was just curious as to if anyone else thinks this, and if so, why is this: that they find themselves on the "receiving end" of an A? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because the WS is an IDIOT!!!!

Please forgive me all you intellectuals as I try my best to put my ABC's together and produce something you all can add, I mean dissect, I mean read.

My H is very intelligent, one of those bright people who have no common sense (all in love ST) to me he is obviously smarter, where it counts.

Although he can't tell you who is married to Jennifer Anniston, or that peanut butter will take gum out of hair. I have dibs on those. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

So Liny let me give this a shot. Are you wanting to know if the WS feels intellectually incompetent and therefore maybe this led to an A???

For me I was definitely strutting my stuff, (ooh, bad analogy coming from a FWW, sorry) I was testing my wings on all levels, I was searching for independence, showing him who was boss, making decisions, having secrets, he wasn't so smart, I fooled him for 4 months.

HA, I won, I'm the smarter one, NOT.

I agree LINY, it seems most of the BS are of very high intelligence. I'm guessing they are very stimulated, not easily bored, adventurous, confident, because with intelligence comes confidence, doesn't it?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Who knows, I'm an Idiot, and a FWW, coincidence?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> KY

LINY I think your generalizatoin misses the point that the folks on here are mebbe not representative of the BS populace.

For a BS to study SAA, or MB's website, to comprehend enough of it in the darkest days of their life to adhere to an entirely counter-intuite program for the rscue of a M that the BS only intsinctively wants to rescue at that point proably means he BS in here have gone through some significant filtering.

Most WS on here are here by dint of their BS signing up it seems, though I know there are independents.

In truth I truly pity BS 'out there' who don't have the support of this wondrous community and the proven tenets of MB to help them.

In IQ I might be 'smart' but in reality I am not smarter than my FWW, other that I have decided to keep my knickers up these 22 years while she didn't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

U smart LINY. U know that, so do brown. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi LINY,

I've thought several times in my life that people who have been through tough times seem 'deeper' to me. My early childhood friends were painfully shy, or chubby; one had a scar on her face... they always seems more interesting, smarter, or more aware. Always better to talk to than the rest of the students (sheep).

They seem to have given real thought to different subjects in life, maybe they're just more introspective? I didnt realize it at the time, but it's so glaring, now.

I'd bet most B/WS's have spent alot more time in their heads than the general populous. Made us wise beyond our years (and IQ)? Just a guess - Dru

LINYYYYYYYYYYY
Hmmm, this question puts me in a precarious sitch because I've been both a FWS and now hopefully a FBS. Smarter? I don't think it has to do with intellect. When I had an A I was naive maybe, but not stupid. OW was alot more savvy about getting a man than my W ever was, OW was smoooooooooth. OW said all the right things, did all the right things, but I was an idiot because of FOG and getting involved to begin with. Brains have nothing to do with emotions. Once you make the mistake of getting involved in anyway with OP that compromises your R with your spouse = IDIOT.

I am smarter now when it comes to R. As a hopeful former BS, I have GROWN, but I'm still the same person. It's amazing! Recently during some troubles with my D and her girlfriends, I have took cautions to establish respectable boundaries with their mothers. I now realize, I'm susceptible to praise, as is anyone I imagine. My W STILL doesn't show me appreciation the way I need her to. When you have single mothers and wives looking at you saying things like "What a positive man you ARE, THANK YOU..it's all innocent, but it does conjure up those feelings like WHY doesn't my W give me those types of compliments? My W says she understands she needs to work on this, as it's part of the reason I strayed so many years ago. Getting back to your question, I am SMARTER now because instead of interacting, talking to, developing any type of friendships with these women, I've stepped back and ONLY have my W talk to them if they call regarding concerns with our D's. I NOW know, my how big a need this is for me, and eventhough my W doesn't meet it, I cannot allow anyone else to meet it, years ago I would have sucked up the praises and compliments without a thought thus creating an improper emotional attachment to these possible loaded compliments. I hope I make some sense as I'm still working this whole thing out in my head. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />