Husband had a baby by another woman born September 15th. He recently told me we needed to separate to Get ourselves together. That we were not working, arguing too much. I do not see it that way but he left me for two nights two weeks ago. We are still together however. Saturday he deceived me. He had asked me to print a map to go to his cousins house. However instead he went to see his baby's Mama and spent the night. I found out the truth by calling his cousin. I really beleived him that he was at his cousin's house. I talked to him last night. We had a calm talk. I asked about what happened at his baby's Mama's house. He said he walked in her place. She lives with other people, that he hugged her and then played with the baby. He said he did not touch her again till he left when he hugged her goodby. He said he then slept in the car and drove home in the morning. I asked him if I could have her number so I could call her woman to woman and see if I could work it out with her to be involved in the baby's life. He said he would call her and ask her if he could give me her number. I then asked him how he felt about me. If his love for me was monogamous. He said no. He did say he was being faithful to me. I asked could we try and see if we can stay together for two more months and see if your love for me gets better. I said we can do everything except make love because I do not feel right makeing love to you till you are in love with me. He said he would try but could make no promises. I could see though as I talked to him about how it felt to be a betrayed spouse that it touched him. It seems that my anger as a betrayed spouse caused him to lose love for me. I explained that it was because I loved him so much and it was one of the hardest things I ever had to go through. I asked if I could hold him. He said no. I said why. He said because I am watching a movie. I tried to sleep. Could not. I love him so much it is hard to let go. I just want him to love me back. I also Betrayed him over a year ago. His affair was a revenge affair. I am not sure that he has forgiven me. I am feeling physical affects from this now. Diarrea and anxiety. I am on zoloft now but it does not seem like I can go on because I love him so much. I don't want to lose him. I feel if I let him go now he will only remember my anger, but it is hard to feel happy and show him a good me when I know he does not love me enough. Part of me wants to withdraw. I am also afraid if I lose him that I will greive him to the point that I will not love him anymore. Somebody please help me. I am afraid I am getting sick physically from this.

Genia, first of all a big hug for you. You need it.

I know this question may seem superflous, but have u read HNHN?

The reason that I ask is because you seem to be punishing your husband with not making love until he is "in love". Genia, I have been reconciled with my husband for 10 months. he is still not "in love" with me. He certainly feels a lot closer to me than he did 10 months ago and his caring for me is growing slowly. Now, genia, Imagine that we had not made love during those 10 months??? Imagine his resentment at not having me fulfil what is as much a need for him as food and water.

SF is NEED for men. It is a need that you have within your power to fulfil. When we fulfil our spouses needs we make deposits in their love bank. This is a high priority for men and one of the easiest ways that we can draw close to them.

In HNHN Harley clearly explains that affection and SF are linked...you cant have one without the other. You told you husband that he was going to get no SF for teh forseeable future and then turned around and asked him for a hug? Genia , I dont think so. You basically blackmailed him by saying that if he does not fall in love with you that you will not make love with him. The simple fact that you refused to make love with him is a withdrawal from his love bank.

Recovering a relationship is hard work. We have to give up the moral high ground of being right, in order to work for the good of our relationship. Making love only when you are "in love" is a lofty ideal. You need to let this go and realise that SF is a tool that you have in your hands to help you to recover your husband's love.

Make love with your husband. Help him draw close to you by physical contact. It sounds to me like you should be doing a sturdy PlanA at the moment and SF is an important part of that. make yourself attractive to your husband in as many ways as you can so that he realises how wonderful you are and can fall in love with you again. When we make love we become "one flesh". Fulfilling this need will help your oneness in other aspects of your life.

By refusing your husband SF, you are pushing him towards teh OW , who is obviously waiting in teh wings.

Read HNHN again.Fnd out what your husband needs and go out 100% to fill them. It is this that will make him fall in love with you again, not refusing to make love with him until he is in love!

Hugs again

Debraxx

Hi Debrah,

Thanks but the problem is I fear since he said he did not have monogamous feelings for me that he may cheat on me again and I fear catching a disease. The fact that he stayed overnight at OW's house 19 days after he gave birth makes me worry. Somebody told me some women can have sex that soon although not recommended by the Doctor. Could that not also explain him not wanting to be held and not having monogamous feelings. I have been trying to plan A him for four months. He does not like to wear condoms and I want to protect myself. I could however check out what the female condoms are like. I heard of them but never saw one. He may take it as an insult but I think it is important for me to protect myself.

Hi Genia,

I have been looking for you chere, and wondering how you are....sorry I missed this post! I'm also sorry things are so difficult right now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I am very worried about your state of mind. You can't work on your marriage right now until you are emotionally and physically stronger. Have you called your IC and discussed your feelings? Your focus right now, must be first on Genia...then, when you stabilize your own emotions...then you can refocus on your marriage. Zoloft may be the wrong medication for you if you're still feeling this distraught....please explore some other options with your doctor.

You cannot control what your husband does right now. Give that up to God because it is not within your power. You CAN get control of yourself Genia and in the process be more attractive as a spouse.

Once, a long time ago....a counselor asked me a question that changed my life. It was a simple question, but a profound one. She asked:

"Who taught you that it was allright for someone to treat you this way?"

Somebody taught you too Genia...but if you could learn the "wrong" way....you can relearn the "right" way. Feed your spirit and find who Genia is and where she wants to go.

(((((((((((((Genia))))))))))))))))))))))

Hi Starfish,

Thanks so much for your help. Him seeing OW was one of my boundaries. He said we needed to split up before he pulled this on me. We had not actually split up. He was only talking about it. Sort of like a Plan B, but he still wanted to have relations with me. Of course I told him no to that. I guess to take the pressure off him so he could see OW/OC anytime he wanted without having to ask. He used the fact that he talked about splitting up to justify what he did in spending night at OW/OC and claims he slept in the car. If I cannot get this worked out which I find no support for, I definately need to Plan B no matter how much it hurts. I called his Mother and she insists that OW will not allow him to take the baby for visitation other than in her home. What I am going through is hurting me too.

Hi Starfish,

Thanks so much for your help. Him seeing OW was one of my boundaries. He said we needed to split up before he pulled this on me. We had not actually split up. He was only talking about it. Sort of like a Plan B, but he still wanted to have relations with me. Of course I told him no to that. I guess to take the pressure off him so he could see OW/OC anytime he wanted without having to ask. He used the fact that he talked about splitting up to justify what he did in spending night at OW/OC and claims he slept in the car. If I cannot get this worked out which I find no support for, I definately need to Plan B no matter how much it hurts. I called his Mother and she insists that OW will not allow him to take the baby for visitation other than in her home. What I am going through is hurting me too.

Genia,

I agree with you that Plan B would offer you some peace and a vacation from this daily assault on your emotions. Why not begin making some concrete plans to prepare financially and emotionally to take back control of this situation for you. Plan B can be very empowering especially when you feel powerless. Take your life back.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks Starfish. I very well may be headed that way unfortunately. I don't want to give him up. I am kinda obsessed with him.

Genia...does your husband have legal visitation with OC? If not then it could this be worked out? Im sure he has a right to see his daughter away from the mother's home (especially given the circumstances). I suspect the problem is that he doesnt want to.....

Hi Debra,

I have approached him about legal visitation many times and he refuses to pursue it. I told him also he cannot please both us women that he must choice one. Although he lives with me it seems he has made his choice by giving her the power to use the baby to manipulate him. He does not see this. I think he will not take it to court because he is afraid of her and the possibility of him not getting visitation. Although he lives with me that means nothing because she lives with a roommate. She does not have financial means and he is dependent on me financially. I am sure if I kick him out he will find somebody else to depend on.

Hi Everybody,

I did it. I left him a very nice letter. He has till the end of the week to get out. If he is not out by then I will have no choice but to get a restraining order. Last night as I was laying in my bed, I felt like I was nothing. He has taken everything away from me. I felt like a peice of cardboard. Like there was nothing in me and I did not matter. That was when I realized I needed to write that letter. There was no more fight left in me. Funny thing is, it still hurts and I still love him. Why I do not know. It is just that I cannot beleive he did this to me and he does not care. That is why it hurts.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Genia:
It is just that I cannot beleive he did this to me and he does not care. That is why it hurts. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did you care when you had your affair? I ask you this not to be mean but to remind you [as if you needed reminding] what a thoughtless and cold hearted act an affair really is. Still there is no excuse for your WH's so called RA [revenge affair] which brought an innocent child on to the world under such bleak circumstances.

As far as your decision to not have sex with your WH is concerned, I totally agree with it. Not only are you correct about getting a STD from him but also because of the following from What Are Plan A And Plan B:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In these negotiations for total separation, the causes of the affair should be addressed. Since one of these causes is usually unfulfilled emotional needs, the betrayed spouse should express a willingness to meet those needs after the affair has ended.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Notice I highlighted the word 'after'. So many people here seem to disregard this very important part of Plan A. If you stop to think about it, it makes perfect sense because chances are that the OP is already meeting those EN [emotional needs] during the affair, so the BS really gains nothing by meeting them as well. It is only 'after' the affair ends that meeting those unfulfilled EN becomes very important.

In your case it would seem that it is time for the Surviving An Affair's Plan B Letter to be given to your WH.

Hi TooMuchCoffeeMan,

My Affair was my fault. I have expressed sorrow to him repeatedly to no avail. Their were contributing factors that weakened me to have the affair. He had neglected me prior to going to prison. He showed me a lack of affection and expressed anger towards me. He resented the fact that I worked and he could not get a job. Also I feared him relapsing on drugs. I did not plan my affair. I went to get some gas. The guy recognized me from 23 years ago when he asked me out and I turned him down. He grabbed me and hugged me and I felt something I had been missing from my husband. I became addicted. I was lonely and craved his attention and conversation. I did not intend to go all the way and I felt badly when it happened. Dirty. I so hated myself for allowing it to happen. I ended affair before husband returned from prison and he caught me because of a cigarette. I wanted his forgiveness but it seems he could never forgive me. Mine has been over but his continues because of a child. I have since learned that I played with fire. It was a dangerous game and I got burnt. I have since learned that I was cheating before it became physical. I thought I could handle it but I was wrong. I told him all this.

<small>[ October 05, 2004, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: Genia ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Genia:
I wanted his forgiveness but it seems he could never forgive me.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes apparently that does seem to be the case here. Your WH has kept his resentment of your affair alive and now it has brought tragic consequences for all involved.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Mine has been over but his continues because of a child.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, the child is NOT responsible for your WH to continue his A, your WH continues his affair because he wants to. So many other repentant FWH's have contact with their OC but do so only with their BW's involvement. You have bent over backwards to forgive him and accept the OC into your life and yet your WH has rejected your noble offer. Have you considered going to Plan B?

Hi,

He always makes the excuse, "because of my baby", although I know better because he does not call his 15 and 16 year old sons much. One of his sons is feeling neglected. I have talked to him concerning this to no avail. His sister who keeps his children has not told them of his new baby because she feels this would hurt them. So they have a half sister that they do not know about. It is so sad. He always wanted a baby girl. Yes I am going to Plan B but I will not hold my breath. I have one already to give him when he leaves. Cris helped me write it a few weeks ago.

<small>[ October 05, 2004, 09:35 AM: Message edited by: Genia ]</small>

Update.

I just wanted to let you all know husband is moving out. I did lay in bed and held him close. I want his last memories of me to be good ones. We are managing to separate peacefully. I overheard him talking to his friends about getting a place and looking for a job. He plans to move in with his parents until then. He seems excited to try and stand on his own two feet.He said that he did not want to depend on a woman to take care of him no more. He stated our reason for splitting up is too many arguments and we don't see things the same way. ( In my defense, I do not see that we had a whole lot of arguments but husband is a serious conflict avoider. That is why OW/OC situation is such a problem. It is easier for him to walk away from me and avoid the conflict altogether then he can see his child whenever he pleases.)Oh Well, I am not giving in on him being in OW's home. That is my boundary and I am sticking to it. But he did also tell his friend on the phone that he cheated and created a baby and it was wrong but he could not take it back and now he had to try and take care of it. I told him I still love him and I knew he was doing what he felt he had to do. I said when you get finished with your little escaped I will probably still be here. I said I am not planning on getting with no men right now. He said well if you want that is your peragative. I said, I know but I am not. I am going to work on me right now.

Genia

Just wanted to stop by and tell you I'm thinking of you and that I agree with the steps you're taking. Plan B doesn't come with guarantees....afterall, by the time anyone uses it....their marriage is in deep trouble. However, it is still the most empowering and peaceful way of stopping the madness and it does help to preserve the love that is left by ending conflict and creating an environment that gives the WS time to see things more clearly.

(((((((((((genia)))))))))))))))))

Hi Starfish,

Thanks for stopping in to check on me. I appreciate MB and all I have learned here. I feel like I have come a long way from when I first started posting here on MB. I have made my mistakes but I have learned a lot too. I do not regret my painful experience because I have learned from it. But now as I feel alone in this world, I must build new confidence with the help of counseling to learn to be happy on my own.