2 days ago i went into a chat room. today i spoke with someone who i am, at this point, saying i will meet in the morning.

what is wrong with me??

This reminds me of something I read recently about kleptomania. I think I read it in Oprah's magazine, "O".

There is indeed something wrong with you and it might be chemical.

This is thrill-seeking / anxiety-reducing behavior you are doing.

When you engage in this sort of behavior you get a release from a built up anxiery , so it temporarily makes you feel better.... but afterwards, you feel worse about yourself and the anxiety about what sort of person you are builds and builds until you seek another risky "adventure" to release the pent up anxiety.

This may be a chemical imbalance. You may have a sort of OCD.

I am not qualified to make a diagnosis, but this is my guess. (I am usually a very good guesser)

Do some research on OCD... ask your therapist about it.

Take it easy... all this hand-wringing and beating yourself up actually tends to lead to another incident!!!

Pep

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 10:40 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

Funny you would mention OCD, Pep. When I read the first message in this thread a few days ago, that's what it sounded like to me. Since I'm not a trained professional, making this diagnosis doesn't help anyone... But I am an OCD sufferer. Pure-O, actually, and the obsessions have nothing to do with germs, or hand washing. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

At any rate, yes, FL, you may indeed have an anxiety disorder. If you go with the OCD bit, it sounds like your affairs are a compulsion... They relieve the anxiety you feel related to your marriage. The "disorder" part is that you get into a cycle of anxiety-affair-anxiety-affair-anxiety-affair... And so on. OCD is no respecter of logic or analysis, so the trick isn't to try to reason with the obsessions but to simply tune them out. To live with the uncertainty. To resist the compulsion that you perform to relieve the anxiety.

Some anti-anxiety medications can be helpful (generally, anti-depressants are frequently prescribed for OCD but they don't seem to be as effective, IMHO). Therapy with a TRAINED OCD THERAPIST is best. It is absolutely critical that they be experienced in dealing with OCD... It's a treatable disorder, but it's not a terribly well-understood one by the general pyschological community. However, in the last few years it's gotten a lot more attention and more and more therapists are being properly trained to help with it.

So, anyway, this is not a diagnosis, obviously. But what would definitely help you is to stop the talk-therapy and find a therapist who specializes in anxiety disorders. You may not have OCD, but GAD (Generalized Anxiety Disorder) or even clinical depression, which often carries features of anxiety disorders. The point is, get TREATMENT. Be honest about your anxiety and what triggers it. Do it for your own sake, if not for your marriage.

pep, i will look up on OCD. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> When you engage in this sort of behavior you get a release from a built up anxiery , so it temporarily makes you feel better.... but afterwards, you feel worse about yourself and the anxiety about what sort of person you are builds and builds until you seek another risky "adventure" to release the pent up anxiety.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">that is a very good description.

but i was never like this before!!! i mean i did make mistakes early in the marriage, but this feels so different. it really is like a drug reaction in my head. i can literally feel the reaction go off.

i have not made it very clear to IC how much of a struggle this is for me. "this" being the internet and the need to act out like this.

i do know it is all about hurting myself. whether it be acting out by chatting or acting out by scratching my arm or physicall hurting myself in other ways. when i do that, i feel the same reaction in my head.

jl, didn't you see what i posted? H does NOT want to help me deal with this. and it is therefore, wrong of me to force it on him. i have to be strong on my own!!! i just have to do this. i want to let him help me, i really do.

FL,

I have to say that I agree with your H. He CANNOT help you with your addiction. It is not HIS responsibility to figure out why you are a serial cheater (harsh? maybe... it seems to fit though, imho). While it is one that affects him too, there is simply nothing he can do to stop you. YOU have to stop YOU. You need help professionally and he isn't a professional.

Now, he can give support and help AFTER you discover what is causing your addictive behavior but until then, it is yours. It is much like an alcoholic. A spouse cannot HELP an alcoholic UNTIL they seek treatment of some type and are not still drinking.

You are not seeking help in dealing with that issue when you are not 100% honest with your therapist. You are continuing to troll for men on the internet and will continue to do so until you uncover what is driving you.

He is going to be of no help...unless you need him to break the pc in pieces...tie you to his side...and watch your every move. With addictions...when there is a will...there is a way and I do not think that those actions would stop you. Get to the bottom of it and then he can support you in your desire to be well.

Call me harsh...call me cruel...it's just my opinion.

committed

committed, you are not harsh or cruel.

i am however seeking treatment. i am openning up to IC. i may be as slow as a turtle and therefore just causing myself more pain in the long run but i can honestly say i AM trying my hardest.

cali~

While I agree FL's H cannot stop her behaviour, I disagree that she needs to wait until after she discovers the root of the problem, to ask for his help and support. What is a M all about, if not to be there for your spouse, through the good, the bad, and the ugly, even if the problem hasn't been figured out yet?

Yes, ultimately it's FL's responsibility to get to the bottom of it, but I believe she deserves and needs her H's help--at least his ear, or his shoulder-now, not just after the problem is figured out.

Yes, she was the WS, but she is trying not to continue to be the WS. I believe her H should and can be there for her. I understand his pain is unimaginable, and very undeserved, but I fear his pain will become much worse, if he lets it be the reason for not assisting his W.

This is just my 2 cents, and I admit, I could be all wet on this, but it's what I believe.

~ad

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> cali~

While I agree FL's H cannot stop her behaviour, I disagree that she needs to wait until after she discovers the root of the problem, to ask for his help and support. What is a M all about, if not to be there for your spouse, through the good, the bad, and the ugly, even if the problem hasn't been figured out yet? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess I *feel* that he doesn't want to be her watch dog. People continue in their destructive behavior until they unearth what is driving them. He might not want to set himself up for more hurt...he might be waiting for signs that she is determined to do whatever SHE has to do to repair the damage her behavior has caused. Usually, the WS will tell their BS that they will do WHATEVER it takes to fix and stay in the marriage. He might simply be waiting to see the "whatever".

When she comes to him with that knowledge...he might surprise her and jump right in to figure out what needs to be done to avoid the triggers...and to support her while she is battling the demons that are readily apparent now. No one likes to fight the invisible monster because they will surely lose. He might see it like that.

Again...it was JMHO.

committed

ivoryivy, i am sorry i did not say this sooner. thank you for sharing your story. it did help. this post absolutely helped me from making things worse and i thank you all.

i have not called IC, we didn't have an appt on the normal day this week due to her having a schedule problem. she could of seen me today but i told her we could just wait a week. i am having lunch with two good friends that used to work here. i think i will start by telling them i need a hug. they are both some what aware of things that have been going on with me. but then again i think i would prefer to just have a pleasant visit and pretend i am normal.

the thing is... it's such a shameful addiction, it's disgusting and pathetic. i'ld rather be addicted to drugs or alcohol.

part of me feels so terribly weak but then again, i didn't do it!! i did chat some, but i didnt cyber and i didn't meet him. and i reached out for help here, and i went jogging and i stopped myself. i am just trying to acknoweldge the good so i will stop beating myself up and step up to the challenge of getting myself sorted out.

An addiction is an addiction - and nothing to be ashamed of unless you don't get treatment.

I've had OCD for many years, since I was a child. I didn't know what it was, but had big rituals I had to go through, arranging things a certain way, counting things, and on and on.

You may just have something chemically wrong. It would be sad for you to just keep suffering.

ok, i just called IC, left a msg, told her i got online, was close to meeting someone but in the end didnt. told her i wanted to leave a message to ensure that by next tues i didn't completely avoid facing it. i'm pretty sure tues is still going to be the soonest we can get together. i am at a funeral tommorow, an uncle died earier this week (my H's uncle) the weekend does not work for either of us and monday is columbus day and her kids are off school. i'm not 100% sure this IC has had much experience helping people with addictions.

h does not know how much of a demon i am battling, he does know i am discussing stuff from my past, childhood and into HS and college. he does know i am very tortured due to having to face my own actions from the recent past.

no matter what the issue, whether it be about something from long ago, (childhood or college) or more recent, he consistently has made it clear, he is just too worn out to have any empathy about anything. even stuff like my brother or the college event, twice now he has come back at a later date and said how he forgets how much i am trying to sort things out via IC and that he does want to try to help support me, but i think the bottomline is still the case, he is just too worn out. and it is understandable. not good, but understandable

i do believe in time we have to get together and work as a team but right now he just keeps telling me to give him time and patience and let him work this out on his own. he does not want my support, he has his own way of dealing with things and i have to let him do it his way. all i can do is use the resources i have to try to get myself together which can only ultimately help the marriage too. and no matter what, i need to do this for me.

Hi FL,

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. I'm glad you have IC. I am not a trained professional, but I know addiction when I see one (read about one, hear about one), since I've been addicted before as well.

It also seems you crave attention (and probably affection), which is why you look up men on line. Your H is either unable or unwilling to give you the attention you need. Unless he is a trained mental health care professional, you can see why it would be hard for him to know what to say or do about your troubles.

A while back you posted about being sexual abused as a child (I believe by your brother?). I'm also a survivor, so again, even though I'm not a dr, I've been in counseling as a patient, and I've read and thought a lot about the subject.

When we're treated as sex objects at an age when we don't really understand what sex is, all we do understand is that we get attention (and what we might think is affection?) by being sexual. For some reason, we can begin to believe that all we are worth is how sexual we can be. So we might be inclined to use our sexuality to get attention. Does that make sense?

I know a mental hospital is a horrible place to be, and I'm sure your IC is helping you to stay out of there, but could it come to a point where that would be the safest place for you to be? Especially since you're thinking about hurting yourself? In any case, please call your IC or a suicide hotline when you feel like hurting yourself.

I would suggest that you get rid of the internet all together, but then you couldn't communicate with us, and we seem to be one of the safest ways for you to get attention and support right now.

This has been a very long road for you, and I'm sorry you're in so much turmoil and pain. Please keep hanging in there, and get help from healthy sources wherever you can.

{{{{{{{{{FinallyLearning}}}}}}}}}}

Rose

FL - Your husband probably doesn't understand, and probably is worn out. So lean on us. Keep posting here. It really helps.

FL,
So it’s already been decided by so many of the well-meaning participants around here that your problem is an OCD and / or that you suffer from sex addiction; none of which has been diagnosed by an expert mind you but what the hell, it’s as good an excuse as any right?

Sorry Pep, (and please know that I have the utmost respect for you, your opinions and very rarely disagree with you) but even folks who have problems with obsessive behavior still retain cognoscente’s and thus need to accept responsibility for their actions, in all but the most extreme cases. So please people, lets strive for a little balance on this issue.

And how about that H of hers? No sensitivity! None at all! Poor FL crying for his help with all that’s in her…all accept the truth that is!

FL, I really think that at this point you need to stop rationalizing the things you do by putting them in some “I can’t help myself category.” The fact is a person is what they do and what you do is lie and cheat. And even to your therapist?! So sorry, while others around here are sure to think that I’m being offensive or harsh and that I should use kinder language to say it, in that a lyre and cheat is essentially what you are, I don’t see why it should be sugar coated. This is not name-calling; these are legitimate adjectives that describe what you do.

You can’t summon the courage to tell your H the whole truth but have no problem meeting up with some stranger from the internet to do who knows what? Further, you claim this has nothing to do with your H or how you feel about him? Sorry, but in fact it has to have everything to do with your H! If you think not then ask him how he feels about it. I’m sure that he would be comforted by your assertion that although you may contract a STD and pass it along to him, that all of this really has nothing to do with him!

FL, admitting you have a problem with the things you do does nothing to absolve you of the responsibility from the acts of doing them. And if others around here want to make excuses for you based on some possible mental illness you may or may not have, then I for one am not embarrassed to NOT be one of them.

In fact, if anything, you’re not being a hypocrite makes you more culpable then less! For some one else, ignorance might be an excuse but not for you. You do what you do with fore thought and malice. And your acts are malicious! They are mean and hurtful. Make no mistake about that. Not telling your H the whole truth about your past experience with his best friend is just low. And then planning another outing while claiming to be in recovery? Once again lying right to his face!

If you truly can’t control yourself then at least have the courage to face your H with the truth. Tell him that it has nothing to do with him. That you just can’t help it that you slept with his best friend. Tell him that you just can’t help it that you’re planning to meet yet another OM for more of the same. Tell him that you fear that you have an addiction. If it has nothing to do with him after all, I’m sure that he won’t be upset for himself but only for you.
coach

PS. Ok, now I’ll go way so you can all flame the hell out of my insensitive butt.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Ok, now I’ll go way so you can all flame the hell out of my insensitive butt.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">~LOL~

I don't disagree with much that you wrote , so no flames from me!

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 03:33 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> PS. Ok, now I’ll go way so you can all flame the hell out of my insensitive butt. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I wouldn't say insensitive...I will say courageous. Too many times I have posted along those exact lines when something like this post comes up and I catch it from people telling me that I am not being nice and "supportive". <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I have learned to temper my posts... for the most part. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I have to agree with what you said...but I still hold to the statement that I made that something is driving her to do the things that she does...whether selfishness or foolishness (is that a word?) ..or simple immaturity. That in NO way absolves her of responsibility.

AND...I don't blame her husband for not wanting to help..we all have a point where enough is enough and we no longer care to carry the other person's load.

committed

Not tempering a post seems like “simple immaturity” to me.

Coach,

Nice vent. You seem to be craving a little attention yourself today.
(((((Coach))))

God bless,

Rose

coach,

of course your post was hard to read. but i know your story and i understand where you are coming from. the fact is, the post in which you shared your story with me on my last topic was hard to read too. but the are none-the-less posts i NEED to be reading. and so here i stay.

i did look up OCD and i do not feel that fits me, that is just my opinion. my actions are more self-destructive in nature.

for the record i am NOT looking for things that will justify or excuse my actions. i am looking to get better. i know i must look like a basket case or a malicious terrible person but i am not. and in case you didn't notice i did NOT behave in a manner like i have choosen to behave in the past. i reached out here instead. i stopped myself. yes i created a new id and yes i chatted. but i STOPPED myself and that is progress. maybe that seems rediculous to you to call that progress but for me it is.

i'll tell ya something, i never really even thought about the STD risk before, sounds very stupid but true. never entered my mind until i came here, at which point i got myself into a dr and told her what i had been doing and got tested. i did this on my own, not because my husband told me to.

and now i do conciously know about STD risks and that is the main reason i fought off the temptation this time. to open my husband up to that risk again is not something i can do, bottomline!!! of course, the guy said lets just watch each other instead. but i don't want to be the person i have become!!! and so i reached out here. it is not perfect behavior, it is not even really very acceptable behavior, but it is my current best.

i have been told by other FWWs, in particular, that i am brave. i am brave to be putting myself out there and being so honest here. the truth is i am not brave, when i came here i was extremely desperate. desperate for anything that could help.

i have come a long way, yes i still have a long way to go, i still have more to confess. i still have disipline to learn. but at least i am now working on this stuff instead of what i was doing for the 2 1/2 yrs before i ended up here.

i thank those that post to me whether it be with 2x4s or kind words. i do truely thank you all.

maybe you all think i am pathetic and maybe you are right. but i don't care what you think of me, i just want to get better. that is more important than anything else.

so fire away, anyone who wants to. i'm not running away!! i am going to continue to grow and i am going to become the person God means me to be.

one other thing... i have not lied to my IC. i think you are the second one that has said this to me. i don't know where that is coming from.

now, did i go in on day one and totally spill my guts?? no, it did take me time to open up, there was honestly too much to just blurt out all at once anyway. i have not lied to her.

oh yeah, and the comment about it has nothing to do with my husband.. by that i mean, i cannot blame my actions on my husband. i have come to accept this is all about me. i made the bad choices, therefore, it is my responsibility. i would think that is a good thing

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 09:50 PM: Message edited by: FinallyLearning ]</small>

You've recieved some great advice thus far, not a whole lot I can add,
except that I'm happy I came back to this thread and found that you did do the right thing. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Fl,

I am ready to adopt you now.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{FL}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />