Is it painful to have WS (or fws) post here? Helpful? Horrible? Do you feel that we are moral delinquents- or lost souls? Or none of the above?

Not trying to cause an argument or stir the pot- reading about- and feeling-the serious and severe pain that so many of our posters are in- caused directly by their ws- makes me wonder, though, how a ws is felt about here.

I'm fairly new- forgive me for my question.

It totally depends upon your spirit, totally. I think those couples who are more mature in their recovery can look at the ws with more objectivity, but for couples (bs) just in recovery, some ws real really rub them wrong, as much justification still exists in the fore stages of recovery...fore seems to = about 1.5 years... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

sadfww -
I love to hear from WW's. That was not true at first, but I have been going through this for 22 months. My WH is still living with OW, but I have moved on.

So blessings to anyone here who would like to save their marriage.

I personally like any insight I can get into how a W/S thinks.

Sometimes it is hard..but maybe not for the reasons you think. It is hard for me because I wish you were my husband!! I wish it were my husband here trying desperately hard to save our marriage. I wish he were reading from other WS to see how they made it through to recovery..wish he were reading from other BS to understand what I have truly gone through.

I do not even mind the justifications some WS put forward in order to not do everything they need to. Because honestly, it helps to see what is in the mind of the WS.

So really, the fact that you are here I think is great. It's wonderful to see people who are in the thick of this, but still trying to find a way out. So the only hard part is not YOUR actions..but rather, the lack of actions on my husband's part. Does that make sense?

SadFWW, I've been posting here since February, which is a long time in MB terms, and have received nothing but support and friendship.

I have learned so much and hope I have also given some help and insight to BS and WS alike.

I don't always like being categorised as an FWW. I was a totally faithful spouse for 27 years, was a WW for 18 months, and now I'm forever categorised here as a FWW. I am actually just ME and that is how my H sees me.

Foggy WS's justifying their A's and whining about the OP are not, on the whole, welcome here but what I love about MB is the two sides to the story being accepted here.

My m wouldn't have survived without MB and I make no apology EVER for being here. I have as much right to (re)build my marriage as anyone else here.

Jen

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KiwiJ:
<strong> I don't always like being categorised as an FWW. I was a totally faithful spouse for 27 years, was a WW for 18 months, and now I'm forever categorised here as a FWW. I am actually just ME and that is how my H sees me.
Jen </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I like what you said Jen, it's SO true. If you stay on MB to help out you have to identify yourself as a FWS to clarify for the newbies. I posted this once before: in REAL LIFE I don't wear a sign around my neck that labels me as a FWW. I am my husband's beloved wife and he is my beloved husband.

He is NOT enternally the betrayed spouse any more than I am the eternal betrayer. Thanks to MB it's all over and done with. Life does not revolve around affair fallout for either one of us. Pretty cool!

At this point our only link to that time in our lives is through this board. It is very difficult sometimes for me to stay, I mean life has gone on, so why do I really? I think it boils down to the fact that in the last 2 years I have seen MIRACLES.

I have seen people grow as individuals through one of the worst trials anyone can go through. I have seen people go over and above to help another hurting soul and I have met people whom I have nothing but the most jawdropping respect for. I have no idea how long I'll continue to post here (I feel sort of overdue to go) but if my experience as a FWW can help someone in need then as a matter of giving back, I will continue to post to the threads that tug at my heart. If I HAVE to wear the hated label to help out, I need to do it willingly.

This site, this forum is a Godsend to BS and FWS alike. This truly is a unique board in terms of the care level. I'm so glad I got to be a small part of it and hope that I can ALWAYS be sensitive to the BSs who read my words. KB

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KiwiJ:
I don't always like being categorised as an FWW. I was a totally faithful spouse for 27 years, was a WW for 18 months, and now I'm forever categorised here as a FWW. I am actually just ME and that is how my H sees me.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I work at a high security site and we all wear badges that show our ID #'s. In a similar way, here at MB we voluntarily wear our badges for not only the purpose of identifying ourselves as to which side of the infidelity equation we come from, but to also assist others that just arrived here that we are here to help them.

We are not defined by infidelity but by our humanity after we experience it.

<small>[ October 09, 2004, 12:53 AM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

As a BS I am glad that WS's post here. It is good to hear their perspective. The only time I can recall a WS really getting to me was one WW who married her A partner and started posting here telling us how different her situation was, how it was meant to be and how he would never cheat on her. She had no regret for her decisions in life and all the people she hurt. These are the type of WS's that do no good when they post here.

Keep in mind most of us BS's have a WS out there that we love and could only dream about them posting here looking for help. So it is encouraging when we hear from WS's who are trying to break out of the fog and do the right thing.

well..

I am neither BS or WS....

but as i have always said...if I had leaned early on in my marriage towards one or the other...
I stood at greater risk of being a WS..

NOT and
INSPITE of anything that had to do with MR. Ark..

AND
not that I ever emotionally got close to any one else....

infact I am pretty sure I could have compartmentalized the whole thing....
as it had nothing to do with my husband....
me me me and what I deserved
and how to make me happy..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

so I am pretty much triggerless...though I confess I find my patience running out more with WS in the throes of their affairs..that come to a marriage building site...and somehow things become our 'responsibility" to "convince" them to stop...

gets old
gets draining
and in a lot cases is futile...AND I sometimes find their post so very disrepectful to peoples pain here....

soooo mostly I avoid their posts...but we all never I really can't...

way too nebby as we say in these part of the woods...

ARK

I've been here awhile and I've written my view on many occasions that this forum could not possibly be as successful nor meaningful without the participation of current and former WSs.

It would be missing an essential ingredient.

Further, I personally have benefited tremendously from sincerely offered advice - and some not so sincere <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> - from numerous former and current WSs, respectively. You can learn as much from a current WS in denial as from a former WS in despair.

In this regard, a special thanks to SKM (whom I had the pleasure of meeting, along with her H), although she doesn't post here anymore. Probably too busy with her bundle of joy......

Thanks everyone for their thoughts (and I would still like to hear from anyone else who cares to add their 2 cents!) In the 2 months that I have been posting here, this site has been a blessing for me personally and for my family, thanks not only to the materials available to read and consider, but also in large part to the helpful advice I have gotten from many of the members here (including a few friendly bangs on the head.) I have to tell you that reading not only the BS perspective- but also reading and seeing a male perspective- has been so helpful to me. At the same time, I have wondered how the BS here could stand listening to the fog talk - or stories of- us wayward spouses (former and otherwise.)

My A's are a long time in the past (at least comparatively- I'm 33 and they were 8 years ago) and thanks to this site I think my H and I may be able to permanently LEAVE them there sometime in the future as our relationship gets better and better. That isn't to say that I will ever forget the lessons I have learned- but I have been able to stop (or at least am working on it) clouding my actions and reactions to my H with continued defensiveness and guilt.

Thanks everyone.

<small>[ October 09, 2004, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: Sadfww ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by maddyk:
<strong> Sometimes it is hard..but maybe not for the reasons you think. It is hard for me because I wish you were my husband!! I wish it were my husband here trying desperately hard to save our marriage. Does that make sense? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maddy- that makes a lot of sense. In fact, I've had some of the same feelings reading here- that I wished my H was gung ho about jumping into the MB program. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I have been absolutely floored by the dedication, love and committment I have seen on the part of many many BS here.

I'm not picking on my H- he just thinks therapy/self-improvment tools are a waste of time and he is entitled to his opinion. I also (now) realize that most of our problems are actually problems that I caused myself. BUT I KNOW that if he would be receptive to working through the MB program with me that we would see immediate and wonderful changes in our relationship. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I still think we're doing well- so much better then I would have ever thought on starting to post here- even with just me working on controlling myelf (thanks JL)

Anyway- a very long response, Maddy, to tell you that I do understand what you are saying.

BS or WS, makes no difference to me. Both are God's children and my brothers and sisters. If they are here in need of support to find their way back home, than that is what they will get from me.

A WS in the the throes of an affair not looking to find his/her way back home, one who has abandoned his/her children - well I don't have a lot of patience for that.

Sadfww - glad to hear your marriage is in a good place, and that you are in a good place. You are a great asset to this site, and I for one am glad you found your way here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I am both a WS and BS. I had a ONS over 25 years ago, that was "just sex", I was drunk, and the OW, who was a "friend" meant nothing to me, so far as a relationship was concerned. The ONS wore on me without mercy, so I confessed about 6 months after the fact. I wasn't smart enough to know we probably needed counseling at that point, and we couldn't have afforded it anyway, but that ONS probably "entitled" my FWW to have her two EA's and one EA/PA, in her mind.

However, the question that has never been answered by any of the FWS's here, is HOW are they able to forsake all that is good and right in their life, for the OP. Even though their M might not even be good, what allows them to pack their grey matter and move into the FOG. No one seems to understand that, and no BS or WS has articulated that so that I can understand it. Many other BS here have the same question. How do you get so caught up in "illicit feelings" that all that you do is "justifiable" in the affair, and how can you forsake your own family, children, friends, etc. so you can "have" the OP.

Sorry, this is a bit off-topic. This forum should welcome any posters that have even the slightest desire to "build" their marriage. I've never seen a "place" with so many caring individual, giving so freely of their own wisdom, most of which was gained through ghastly pain and suffering. Perhaps the categories should be re-examined at some point, because Plan A/Plan B is seldom used, and Just Found Out is not used enough, for the newbies. IMHO.

Without this site, I'd have never had the tools to save my marriage, so I thank everyone who posted to me when my mind was incapable of making any wise decisions regarding my own future with my FWW.

SD

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Sadfww:
<strong> Is it painful to have WS (or fws) post here? Helpful? Horrible? Do you feel that we are moral delinquents- or lost souls? Or none of the above?

Not trying to cause an argument or stir the pot- reading about- and feeling-the serious and severe pain that so many of our posters are in- caused directly by their ws- makes me wonder, though, how a ws is felt about here.

I'm fairly new- forgive me for my question. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I love YOU SADFWW!!! I think your posts are helpful and full of insight!

Myself, I go on an individual case-by-case basis .... I treat everyone with equal rudeness ~LOL~

To be honest, the MOST frustrating posters for me personally, are BS who are so weak they *pepper* their sentences with "I am so scared"... "I am scared that if I do this..." .... "I am scared WS will leave me".....

Nothing can change for the better if the BS is not BRAVE and ready to create some real changes in the marriage .... Plan A demands bravery .... and Plan B does as well....

The weak BS miss most opportunities to marriage build due to their own bad decisions made from a position of fear, and not the foggy decisions of their WS.

The truely "foggy" WS babble written here .... does not bother me as much as the truely weak and scared BS babble ....

I think you ROCK!

Pep

My reaction varies...

I am encouraged to see a FWS truly remorseful, working and learning. I think that they and their spouses have been truly blessed through a tragedy.

At other times I think to myself, well how is that bed you made? Not so comfortable is it? I don't remember the poster but lately there has been a guy who has been unfaithful to his wife, and how is experiencing what it feels like to have the shoe on the other foot. I am ashamed to admit but I have no sympathy for him.

What gets on my nerves is posters from TOW. The rationalizations makes me shake my head in disgust. I can't understand how someone could hurt so many people and be so cavalier about it.

I too believe we learn so much from people who have lived through the fog and made through the other side. Their insights are so helpful.

I often wish some of these people could use their experiences to help those just beginning their married lives. The media too often glamorizes adultery. The truth of the horrors need to be told. I am thankful for this web-site as it does so much to help so many people.

I like what Weaver said...we're all God's children. I'm not saying that b/c I'm a FWW either. That's how I believe.

I am glad that SadFWW asked that question, b/c I was curious about that too. When I first posted, which wasn't that long ago at all, I was surprised and pleased that I received nothing but encouragement and honest advice. Doesn't mean I've like everything I've read in reply--but that's b/c it usually hits me at a place in my life in which I need to work.

Doesn't mean that everybody who posts gets everything right about you...but that's what we need to keep in mind when taking advice and giving it. We only get the info. that's given to us when we post. And when others post in response to my posts, I have to remember that they only know what information I've given them. In other words, it's never the full picture.

I really don't know what I would've done without people giving me advice...a lot of it I've taken. I'm grateful that there are those who are gracious and willing to do so. I would've ticked my BH off so much by now b/c of not knowing how to deal with him. But, b/c I've gotten advice from so many great individuals who've been there or done that, I think we are making tiny tiny baby steps. I just struggle with patience. I want to work on things NOW and he needs time to grieve over what was lost.

Rae

Rae

Originally posted by T00MuchCoffeeMan:


****~~~~We are not defined by infidelity but by our humanity after we experience it~~~~****

THE best reply goes to

---> TMCM <---

I totally agree.

That should be our MB infidelity board motto!