I know he's made that decision, and I do know it's terribly hard on him to do it right now. It is frustrating though. I'm coming here to get it out of my head by writing rather than getting it out later by getting mad at him. We've got a LOT of work and this is no doubt going to get harder before it gets easier.

I know which part of me will win out each time. I love the man this guy is capable of being. It just simply comes down to that.

He's my guy.

Sometimes I'd just like to BEAT my guy out of him. It passes though.

I know OW is pulling very very hard at him right now also. It can't be easy. But, he's 100% here. I worry that he'll decide to stop trying and decide he is "leaning towards" her again.

But in the end, I would be SO surprised if he left. I've said that for a while and that is the big picture I have to hold onto. This day to day stuff is going to get to me if I let it.

I've got to find WAT around here too. It would seem that he's got a 5 coming to him <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I hate to tell you this FIM and I'm sure there will be many others, this is not unusual. I went through it for 2 years and about lost my mind. I plan B'd three times...not officially with a letter but refusing the answer the phone after he moved out. Ex-ow wouldn't leave him alone and continued to call 2 years after he came out of the fog. What helped me was she was the biggest loser that ever walked the face of the earth. You've got a tougher battle-biggest loser position is already taken.

It's just something that you've got to go through. Obviously, Plan A has run its course. You've got to stand your ground. I agree too that telling the kids now and getting them more involved in this drama is not wise.

It may come down to him going to SAT and being without you and the kids...maybe so, maybe not. He's got too much time on his hands and time to think. Remember it's an addiction and there is no logic in dealing with it. Just stand firm.

I remember once when my daughter was in elementary school and a huge storm was coming. All the local stations stopped normal broadcasts to warn of the danger. I stewed all day thinking of the huge old tree outside her classroom and the fear of it falling on the building. I was miserable. When I went to pick her up that afternoon and looked at the tree, it wasn't as large as I had remembered in my mind and if it had fallen, it would not have reached her classroom. The fear change my perception...now the reason for this silly story. Your husband's perception of the situation has grown larger than it really is. He's out of control just as I was out of control. Their relationship has grown out of proportion...I think on both of their parts. They're remembering it to be grander than it was/is because think of it, if it was that grand, why would he still be there with you.

Think of this with her perspective. He promised to be with her yet he's with you. She's got to be bonkers too. The whole lot of you are just feeding off each other's misery. And until this triangle is finally broken, you'll continue to be miserable.

He will play the two of you as long as he is allowed. Everyone's life is on hold and it's not fair but what in life is. You've got to be patient-I know, I know, you wrote the book.

Withdrawal is horrible. Ask any ex-addict. The same chemicals in the brain that causes an addict to use until death, is fueling this relationship. He's got to bottom out and that bottom has to be the full realization that he will lose you and his girls. He's got a taste of it in the camper but that time alone each day is making it worse. It's driving both of your crazy-him with the cell phone and you checking it every 4.5 minutes...

FIM, please hang in there and stand firm,firm,firm. You've done such a wonderful job. It's just tough.

Hey, how about asking Mom and Dad if you can go on Dr. Phil with them!

Hmmmmmm.

Disclaimer: I never got the chance to experience this phase of the abduction, so I have no direct experience to draw on to advise you.

Sounds like you did a pseudo Plan B with the camper thingy - with a little tough love thrown in. Got his attention, huh?

Not surprised he relapsed in short order. Typical of what we've read on this forum.

Based on what we've read, the waffling and withdrawal relapse are pretty textbook. The textbook response from the BS would be to validate the WS's confusion and offer support, as suggested by other posters above.

But, is it too simple minded to go back to the pseudo Plan B since he's "leaning"? How 'bout leaning out the door, Dork? It got his attention before.

Another option - or weapon to be included in ANY strategy - would be to expose to OW's CO, or hint to him you're thinking about this, that this is how serious you are about him ending all contact. We normally don't recommend such "ultimatums", but you may have the ability to deliver it in the right, coy manner, such that it doesn't come across as an ultimatum - just a consequence of not ending all contact - like moving out to the trailer.

WAT

Hi FIM...

Have been following your withdrawl thread to glean some advice for my own situation.

You are one STRONG woman!!!!

My WH finally broke up with his OW last week, and to surprise me for my BD, he was telling everyone he was moving home.

Well, he has, to some extent. He was going to move everything out of his apartment ASAP. Still hasn't done that. Yesterday, he told me he just didn't even want to go there. Yet he has gone there several times to get things.

However, he went there today, and signed the release papers, and the manager said it would be really great if he would move out soon. So, in a week, he will be out.

I don't know about the rest. He feels really bad, and is still defending OW to me. I'm trying to be really supportive, but as you know, it's really hard when your own feelings scream at you!

I'll keep reading here. Hope things go well for you. Hope they go well for me.

K

K - I'm hoping AND praying for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

WAT - This is priceless!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But, is it too simple minded to go back to the pseudo Plan B since he's "leaning"? How 'bout leaning out the door, Dork? It got his attention before. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">We may very well get to this point in protecting the boundaries!! It does seem to work with him. Dork. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Latest update? Well, I'm at work for a night committee meeting and I called him right before we went in. This is HIS plan for tomorrow.....

He's going to work harder at NC.

I am making another appointment with our priest for us.

He will go down to stop the divorce process and pull all paperwork.

He does want to tell the kids he is staying. Remember, they think he's leaving in two days.

He says this is for good. Regardless, of feeling like he might WANT to go back to OW, he says he won't and is committed to me and his family.

So - in light of that.... we will tell the kids that mom and dad are not getting a divorce. We will fix our marriage. We will, as a family, burn the divorce papers in our fireplace. Nice touch I think for all of us. I like the symbolic gesture and I know the kids will like it. The best, it's his idea. Not mine....his.

Now, what lesson have I learned?

Not counting on his NC tomorrow. Hoping, not counting on it.

Not counting on seeing our priest, withdrawing papers or burning anything.

I'm hoping and expecting him to do it. Not counting on it though.

http://www.lakecrescentcabin.com/cabin.html

I understnd you are in WA. No phone, also the last time we were there the cell service was very sketchy or non exsistant depending on who it was with.

OK, baby steps in the right direction.

I recommend you stick with the textbook BS approach until the burning takes place - strong validation of his "pain" and "sacrifice" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> for giving up OW.

I know, I know - makes you want to puke, right?

But put yourself - I know this is a stretch - in his abducted position. He is not unlike an adolescent struggling with some idealistic, but faulty, view of the world. His fantasy has been a "reality" for some time and de-programming is not easy on him. What looks like a no-brainer to us is his "tragedy" - for now. Just humor him, but come across as sincere.

Again, my disclaimer - I have never done this. Please consider all the advice you get.

WAT

Sounds like he has a good plan, but lacks the motivation or discipline to carry it out.

My suggestion? I would sit down with him and talk about his plan, what he is willing to do, write it out, and then when EACH AND EVERY item on his list is fulfill, he can move back in from the camper.

Explain to him that he needs time to work this out, and it is killing you to watch promises be broken...so to protect your love, and enable him to make clear choices (and see the consequences of not making those choices) he should stay in the camper until these actions are completed...

Sample plan? NC letter, NC for 2 weeks...month?, visit(s) with priest, retract and burn the D papers, cancel the cell phone, change home number, etc...

Just a thought.

When I was at the same point in pseudo recovery I was given very sage advice that this moment in time, when they are not living in the house, is a unique opportunity to ask for change, and a person is motivated to do it...

Just be supportive-he's like a sick person now. He's coming out of the fog, but this takes time. I know you are thinking what about me...at least I was, it will come back to you later. I am always waiting for the other shoe to drop, but my H has treated me better than he ever did before recently, and I know it is a reaction to how well I have been treating him. (Igot Dr Laura's proper care and feeding book).

Anyway, I am getting paid back in spades for my good treatment of him. They know faith. He has to grieve this death right now and then he'll be able to move on. When he wakes up he'll know who was always there for him. Remeber-hang in there for you, but most of all hang in there for your kids. They are counting on you Mom.

Oh look..I get to disagree with everyone. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I knew I had my bullseye shirt on for a reason today. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

FIM..If you meant what you said..re the conditions of him returning to the house..I would not for any amount of money go back on them.

If he has decided that he is 100% committed..require that he do all of the things necessary to begin recovery before you reward his intentions. See, right now you are allowing him to use "credit" so to speak..and he is getting into to trouble with it..because when it's time to pay the bill..he is unwilling. You are not demanding to have power of veto over his feelings .. however you have every right and possibly a responsibility to hold him accountable for his actions. Actions are reality, and while feelings may and do change..reality does not. Actions are lasting and have real consequences..it is time for him to take the consequences seriously rather than expecting mercy at every turn. Until and unless he fully commits to recovery despite his feelings for OW his affair is still on..and the title of this thread is null and void.

I have read your history....spent a good number of hours reading the latest developements...you are possibly the best plan A specimen that MB has ever seen. Regardless..plan A is a limited time offer. You need to say what you mean, and mean what you say. The only thing that has moved your H in the past [with 100% effectiveness I might add] is for you to stand your ground..you did very well in plan A..but have waffled from time to time in plan B..and every time that you do..he slides right back to his A. He seems to need you to set the bar high for him. He needs to have zero wiggle room to beat this addiction. He needs immediate consequences when he has taken the first step in the wrong direction..before he gets so far from shore he can't see his way back.

I would be consistent. He should be absolutely certain that the consequences will apply each and every time he breaches his agreement. Back to the camper..and this time his word should not be enough. He has proven that his word is meaningless. If he desires to come home..he can call off the divorce officially..he can break things off decisively with OW..and do anything necessary to make contact impossible from her end..no cell phones..change your number..whatEVER it takes to burn the bridges there he must do.

He either is or is not willing to do the work of recovery. The rest is silence.

--Noodle

Wow...just a little taste of PlanB seems to have been enough for him!

Bravo FIM and big hugs for the next few weeks while hes in withdrawl!

I haven't read all of the replies...we are off to dinner but I really wanted to give a quick update.

He stopped the divorce.

He saw the priest with me.

He burned the papers.

He told the kids that mom and dad are not going to get a divorce.

He told OW to not call again.

He is writing a NC letter with me after dinner and we are sending it tomorrow.

He is deleting naked OW pictures from computer now.

More later, but I'm still just so in shock that he actually did these things that I wanted to share. I honestly had prepared myself for NOTHING to happen.

Hmmm.


Oh....edited to add....I have the cell phone and calling card again.

<small>[ October 13, 2004, 08:29 PM: Message edited by: faithinme ]</small>

(((((((((((((((Faithinme & Dork)))))))))))))))))))

May the Lord be with the two of you. May you recover and live all of your days happily.

Oh goody!

Yay!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> I guess the guy you love is trying to take back control of his body and soul.

{{{{{{{{{{Faithinme}}}}}}}}}}

OMG! That's awesome!!!!!!!

I'm all happy and jealous at the same time. He needs you to help him through the withdrawl now, so hang in there! Be patient and loving.

I'm praying for you!

2scared

OMG is right!!!!

I weep for you FIM!!!!!

Pray for me....my road is going to be much harder.

I feel like things are stalled, and I don't know where to turn.

This is the best news I've heard in a long time!!!

K

WOOOOOOHOOOOOO!

Booyah!

((((((((FIM))))))))))

- Kimmy

*dance of joy* <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />