Sounds like you have hit the nail on the head, GC.

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck....


So what line of work are you in that someone strange would ask you to invesitagate his son's death?

far

You get what you pay for. When I went to work for a church a couple of years ago, a friend who is a pastor told me of the special tax breaks you get. He urged me to get the "pastor" title, so I could take the break. It sounded like a good idea.

The church I went to work for makes people work for their pastor titles. They learn humility, servanthood, SCRIPTURE, leadership, critical incident stress management (our senior pastors are chaplains for cops and firemen, and support them vigorously) - and much more. Only after a long intership is one considered a pastor.

It is not a frivolous thing to be a pastor. It is a serious commitment - not unlike being a monk in some respects.

I did not become a pastor, and do not get the tax break. I am not quite pastor material.

BTW - the $10 pastor cert. does not get you the tax break, either.

Just my perspective.

far

In our case, with the discussions which have been going on here, the application may be to examine our thought processess and our perception of our relationships.

I know that for me I need to do this because I am never sure if my perception is being clouded by faulty judgment, and also because I am trying to change my life. So how else could you do that if nothing you thought to be true was ever examined? I want to be happy, at peace and to have good relationships with everyone in my life, and I want to see the beauty in others and in the world.

Since "ideas leave not their source" talking, reading and exploring is the only way I know to change my mind and therefore my life.

But I'll give the subject of forgiveness a rest here, as it is Gray's thread... but for me it's something that I know I'll keep plugging away at, because I think it holds the key somehow.

Well, I certainly wouldn't equate the 2.


Then don't follow his philosophy.


Stated that way, I agree.


Well, that was certainly colorful. But your depiction here is of your take on her motivations. Can you really know what she was thinking? Do you really care?

None of this crap is easy, because it's personal, but I certainly have learned that if I want 2 feel the hurt, I can certainly replay movies of the injustice over and over again and perpe2ate the hurt. But that makes it hard for me 2 get ANYTHING done.

I believe I still have a long way 2 go before I'm not feeling hurt by events of the past 15 years. And it could certainly be argued that I wasn't hurt "as much" as most people here, yourself included. But I am now certain that, for me, the observation that cheating on one's spouse is worse than murder is no longer true for me. What changed? Only my thinking.

-ol' 2long

I haven't gotten together with one of my best pals in a while. We've drifted a little. I see him all the time 'cause he's in my band, but we haven't just hung out together recently, and we used to get together almost every weekend.

Late last week I called him. He agreed that it had been a while since we got together. We agreed to hang out over the weekend. We made a plan.

When it was time, his preference was to sit at our friends' house, about five minutes away from where we were planning to have dinner, and watch TV.

I'm sad because I think this friendship is slipping away, and I'm going to let it. Getting the big blow-off made me feel hurt.

But not quite as hurt as I felt over the things my wife did in '04-05.

Oh, I understand the principle of all hurts being equal. But nuh uh.

GC

DW, the guy I dated for three months (that you all know I was absolutely crazy about) has been legally divorced for 6 years and separated 10 years. His wife had an affair, he moved out on DD...they tried to reconcile several times during the separation but he was filled with bitterness and distrust and finally said he just couldn't live like that, so they divorced never recovering the marriage.

I asked him how he handled all of this at the time and he said he was filled with bitterness...very, very bitter for years. That should have been my first clue he was still not ready for a relationship but I was in love and overlooked it.

As we got more involved he got more wierd...anything that went wrong at all brought up terrible triggers for him, until he finally told me he was too damaged to be in a relationship. He had never healed, and had had only two R's before me in all those years lasting less than 4 months each.

I asked him if he had ever found forgiveness, both for himself and for his ex...he didn't have a clue what I was getting at of course.

His story - she cheated...destroyed his life, his finances, his chance to have kids, etc. Still, after 10 years this was his story.

I was madly in love with this guy, and since he had not done the growth work he needed to do before he got into this relationship with me, he broke my heart.

How unfair to me... (and to himself).

We must heal our relationships (even if only in our mind) or we will bring that relationship into every subsequent relationship we have, until it is healed... until WE are healed.

THAT is the point of forgiveness.

(Sorry but I just can't keep my mouth shut I guess.)

Sigh. Weaver, dang it, how do you DO that?

Fine (she said, stamping her foot and crossing her arms and looking like a cranky six-year-old), I'll think about being open to forgiving my ex.

Next week. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />








Oh my.

I've been listening to music. I dunno what was on before this. But... this just came on.


Morning has broken, like the first morning
Blackbird has spoken, like the first bird
Praise for the singing, praise for the morning
Praise for them springing fresh from the Word

Sweet the rain's new fall, sunlit from heaven
Like the first dew fall, on the first grass
Praise for the sweetness of the wet garden
Sprung in completeness where His feet pass

Mine is the sunlight, mine is the morning
Born of the one light, Eden saw play
Praise with elation, praise every morning
God's recreation of the new day

Oh.... my.

Something very odd is happening in my world these days. Some things I'm not ready to talk about. Here's one, though, that various folks will like to hear, I think.

You may have read how I occasionally ask the more religious folks to say Hi to God for me, when they're talking to Him. Sometimes people tell me I could say Hi myself. I nod. I could, it's true. God and I have a deal about that, though, I used to say. I'll leave him alone if He leaves me alone. Which was true.

And more recently I would say that I was working on it and God understood. Which was true.

The other night, HoFS was heading for Ash Wednesday services. So I said to him, as I often do, "Tell God I said 'Hi' for me." And as he always does, he said he would.

He didn't suggest that I say hi myself, though I'm sure it crosses his mind from time to time. But I was remembered of when Mortarman suggested it on that thread about religion.

And so I sat back on my couch and I closed my eyes, and I looked around.

"Uhm. [Long pause.] Hi."

Who knew... God has a sense of humor. I'm glad He didn't laugh, though. Instead, it was just a sense of vast (er, infinite?) amusement. Mixed with a great deal of affection and love.

And then God and I sat together for a long time.

Sort of like being cuddled on someone's lap, I guess I'd say.

I hear that I'm welcome anytime.

That's good to know.

Wow J! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Me I think of God as a warm light surrounding me...not as a male figure anymore, but growing up I was convinced he was my real father...and I guess he is.

Hi Weaver. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I don't think of God as a male figure most of the time, either. I guess it was the image I needed just then, though.

Hi e'ybody.

I've been fielding calls about my ex and finances, and it is a DRAG. Nothing about me either. My part is done, my money is where it's gonna be, end of story. The reasons I get these calls are all to do with her. To explain would be boring and take forever. It's just a downer.

I haven't played fingerstyle in a while and I have to learn something for this wedding next weekend (in four days, I mean) and I'm trying to make a new callus on my thumb without getting a blister and it's TORTURE! This gets any worse and I'm getting out the Super Glue.

GC

I think we need 2 settle this once and for all. Anybody wanna help me 2rn God over?

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

-ol' 2long

Hi all,

I have been away since the fall. I have some catching up to do!

All is well with us, more or less...

(We start our first counseling thing tonight.)

I have missed you all!

Shul

Hi ya, Shul!

I'll be gone for about 10 days - see you when I get back.

Wish I could say more, ran out of time.

All the best.

SS

Have fun!

EnjoyyourselfSS.

New recurring dream about my ex.

In the old one she's mean and dismissive, and I'm frustrated and furious.

In the new one she starts out snotty and confrontational, but quickly grows regretful and cries miserably. She is vivid. I'm surprised by how perfectly I remember her. Seeing her so forlorn breaks my heart. I wake up feeling nothing but compassion for her. Suddenly awake and very alert, I am cool and I am weightless. I'm empty of all the bad feelings. At least for a while, they don't exist. Whether she's sad and miserable in real life is irrelevant. I don't care about what I've endured. All that matters is wishing for her not to be in pain. I'm simultaneously full of compassion for her and unaffected by whether or not she needs it. This feeling of indifferent generosity is very, very peculiar.

GC

Sounds very healthy to me. I no longer have bad feelings for my WH. I could say hurtful things to him, but have no desire to. I think it is part of a good recovery.

Have a good time, SS. Send pictures when you get back! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

GC, I'm not surprised that you're hitting this point. I got there about a year ago when my ex married her new husband, and after the last of our financial ties were severed. (I think I'll call him her new husband forever...) It's a good place to be in all, in all.

Too cool! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> mars mission

Ummm, okay so a few days ago I posted about playing at my friends' wedding today, and how I was having trouble with the fingers of my right hand, which aren't calloused well for finger picking, 'cause I don't play that way a whole lot.

Well, I know the tune and I'm unlikely to screw up. Except for one thing. Every time I play the song I'm in total pain from start to finish. If I coat the fingers with Super Glue, it wears off before I'm halfway through the song. This situation makes it much harder to play the song well.

But really the problem is purely mental.

I'm using this thread to make a promise. I'm not going to tell anyone what's up, and I'm not going to make any excuse for playing badly, and I'm going to ignore the pain and play like a pro.

Thanks.

GC