Gray,

I hardly ever post on your thread anymore, because of personal feelings I have about what your WW and OM are doing to car4love and her baby and baby to be. But tonight I feel like coming clean.

I believe in the fog but only to a certain extent. Lets face it, we all have opportunities to have an affair, you are a good-looking musician and I know there is no lack of willing females. I too am pretty and have never had a shortage of guys wanting to go out with me, but we've got something inside of us that keeps us from cheating regardless of our needs not being met, or our lonliness.

Now I also believe very much in love and compassion enough so that I am willing to take my BF back after all of his betrayal, because I realize that he has his own demons and path to walk. And that everyone has different weaknesses.

What I can't forgive is two people who put their needs and so called love ahead of a pregnant woman. It makes me sicker than I can say. I went through it when I was pregnant with my first and only, and while I was trying to take care of my alcoholic dad. I was never able to take Paige's dad back because of what I went through during my pregnancy. Lost most of my love for him, and all of my respect. And it is a miracle that I never lost Paige. She could easily have died in my womb because of him and his sleazy affair. But I was bound and determined that she have a dad, so I humiliated myself over and over, even going so far as to go up on stage when he was playing and demand money for her care, as I was very broke back then. She now has a dad but I sacrificed so much for that. And it should not have been that way.

I now work with his ex OW, she is a customs officer and I am a customs broker. I have no hate for her, but I hope someday she gets pregnant, then she will understand what she and he did to me.

My point is Gray, I am so very fond of you. You are a great guy and I no longer wish for you to get back with sparrow. I don't like her, and I hope some day she too is pregnant with her first child and she knows the pain that has been inflicted on car4love and her babies.

Just coming clean because I feel guilty about my absence from your Plan B support and want to support you, I just can't anymore. I feel like a hypocrite between wanting you to be happy and have your WW back and thinking you deserve so much better.

In MB love and sincerety,

weaver

weaver:

"I hope some day she too is pregnant with her first child and she knows the pain that has been inflicted on car4love and her babies."

This is almost a certainty, if she doesn't wake up first.

-ol' 2long

Thanks weaver; I completely understand. My MIL and the sparrow's best friend (who had her first child early this year) are having a tough time - each feels obligated in her own way to preserving her relationship with my W, but they seem offended by her A to a greater extent than many others (though everybody I know is pretty offended by it).

I believe people can be redeemed, and that's what I hope for the sparrow. I don't know if I want her back any more. I'm not sure. It's become one of those situations where the opportunity would have to present itself for me to know.

Plan B is as much a part of my personal healing as it is a measure to save the marriage. It's helping me start to create a life as a single man.

Okay, gotta go. She's coming over, possibly, in under an hour, and I'm gonna be gone. She can't get in the house - garage only.

Thanks again weaver. I'm kind of on board with your way of thinking, you know!

GC

I know 2long, even still the damage to car4love is done.

Women betraying other women -

In my opinion has got to be the greatest tragedy there is.

Because women are the nurturers, the keepers of the flame, the mothers...

It just seems to go against all humanity and nature.

It's what I have the most trouble with and what gives me the most pain.

I am definately a girls girl <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by weaver:
<strong> Women betraying other women -

In my opinion has got to be the greatest tragedy there is.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I agree. Why is it so prevalent? Why do so many women get their alleged "self esteem" by luring men away from other women? Men they don't even want, half the time - they just want to see if they can do it.

I don't know why it is so prevalient but I do know that if my daughter or nieces ever go that route, I will be their worst nightmare!

We have a saying in our house "beauty is as beauty does" and my DD gets reminded of it quite often. Hopefully by the time she is a teen and young woman it will be part of who she is.

yep, i grew up with "pretty is as pretty does." yes, i was the one that was faithful but there were still lots of things that i could have done better so i'm really trying to adhere to the sayings of beauty/pretty is as beauty/pretty does.

weaver:

In my W's case, the biggest thing I have 2 deal with now is the apparent "rebellion" from the role as W and mother being in conflict with her ambitions as an individual. I truly believe that she believe that the OMW was some kind of monster, and that the breakup of the Meat Family (uh oh, I used the name!) had nothing 2 do with the A.

2 this day, she gets upset about discussions on the 2be about marriage and having kids - in direct contradiction 2 her daily interactions with her family - she LOVES our kids.

I keep looking for a breakthrough, and maybe with my recently-acquired "feminine in2ition", I may find one someday.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

-ol' 2long

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">they just want to see if they can do it.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't really want to TJ your thread, Gray, but Deja - THAT IS IT EXACTLY.

My dwh was told by OW that she didn't want him at that moment (she wanted him to move to SAT so she could "date" him AND her current bf), (AND THIS IS A DIRECT QUOTE), but "SHE DIDN'T WANT ME TO HAVE HIM EITHER...." Like, um....I'm the bad plague ridden, morally corrupt one??????

I think I could've liked Sparrow once upon a time. I also think that I could still like her if she allowed herself to comtemplate...and I MEAN CONTEMPLATE, the ugliness and pain she's caused, I don't think - from what you've written of her, GC - that she's done this yet. I think she begins to....then she feels *a little* bad and sad, and switches that part of her brain to off mode. Some people can do that. Some people can keep it up for lifetimes....but I'd bet a shiny red mustang that Sparrow is not one of those people. I'd bet the same mustang that once it does hit, it will debilitate her. I pray she's not burned ALL her bridges when her sparkly fairy tale world turns to bitter ashes that she chokes on.

I also pray that if it happens once your life is on an even keel again, that you'll still be the compassionate caring man we know you are.

Ever see Scrooged? Sparrow was the Claire(I conjecture) that was kind and fun loving and compassionate. GC was her Lumpy when he was funny and didn't have much - they taught each other about love and making much out of silly stuff. OM is Francis Xaiver Cross when he's at the height of his wealth, affluence and power. The ghost of Christmas Future shows Claire as she'd been if she'd stayed with Francis as the horrible rich guy. She'd have been shallow, cold and mean.

I think Sparrow is turning into cold Claire with OM being the cause of her metamorphasis.

Of course, I'm a romantic, and the analogy doesn't exactly fit.....but I hope Lumpy is still there when Bobcat Goldthwait blows the hell out of Francis (not that he does in the movie...but a girl can have a little literary license, right?).

- Kimmy

Yeah, Kimmy, the sparrow seems pretty cold and shallow to me too.

So I've been off a few days. Packed sparrow's stuff, put plastic film over my windows (old house), and now I'm starting to move my bedroom down to the 1st floor.

Got an email from car4love - she said that she'd gotten some good news last night, and that it made it hard for her to sleep. She went out of her way to not tell me what it was, so I'm sure it somehow relates to the A or her D.

Offered the sparrow a time when she could come get stuff this week, but she didn't show. What's more, SIL has not returned the email I sent to have her tell the sparrow I want my old email back. Funny... maybe sparrow's out of town.

Soooo... I've almost got my house ready for winter, and I'm starting to make changes that will make it easier for me to keep the house (without having to pay sparrow for the improvements I make). Lots of work ahead.

GC

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by graycloud:
<strong> Soooo... I've almost got my house ready for winter, and I'm starting to make changes that will make it easier for me to keep the house (without having to pay sparrow for the improvements I make). </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hey Gray,

Is it your wish to keep the house? I thought at one point it was too much work and expense and that maybe you didn't want to keep it. I started out wanting to keep our house, which I soon gave up because of the work and cost... but now that I bought myself a new house I can't tell you how much relief I feel. Our home - where, yes, I am still living for another month until my new house closes - is full of memories for me. Some good and some bad, but I'd rather not deal with them every day.

So, I encourage you to consider all your options and put your sanity and mental health at the top of the priority list.

I do read your posts from time to time, but usually don't have much to offer. Still I feel for you, and wish you the best!

Glad you're moving ahead, DV.

I've always wanted to keep my house. I love this place, and I can make it really great. It is a lot of work, but sparrow and I worked hard to finally have a house of our own. It's become my refuge, and keeping it is important to me. If I get denied for refinancing it, I'll have to live with that, but I'm gonna do everything I can to avoid losing this place.

The other thing - my house is in an excellent neighborhood, but needs much restoration. If I can hang on to it, and do lots of the work myself, it will be a huge asset after a few years.

GC

Then I hope you can keep it. Good luck!

FYI - car4love posted on SYMC today.

GC

I saw that and sent her a quick note. My heart breaks for her.

Thanks kloe. The suffering that an affair causes a pregnant BS to endure... it oughta be a crime.

GC

Funny thing, everyone says how hard it must be to go through this while I'm pregnant. I can't imagine how I would have even gotten through this without my baby. Only 4 weeks to go until I get to met her. I can't wait.

Today's new sensation - anticipation.

Three weeks ago, the sparrow stole my email. She was here on Halloween to get some stuff from the garage, but I wasn't around at the time.

Since then, there has been nothing. But I'm sure something is coming.

Today I imagined how it will feel every time I have to jump through some hoop that brings the decree a step closer. Then I read lordslady's post and imagined what it will be like when the D is final. It's going to be dreadful, I can imagine the feeling. Not anything a fella can really prepare for, I reckon.

GC

well gray, i have to tell you it can be blissful too. I think it might surprise you how well you might handle it because you've been preparing for it for awhile. that's not to say that you don't want things to turn out differently. but you will come to a place and you will feel peace.

continued prayers to you, RR

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It's going to be dreadful, I can imagine the feeling. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sorry to TJ, but I'm gettting those feelings right now in my own life.


(((GC)))

May I ask in general - what happened to kindness? I mean all of it? At the people at the $100 store that you very nicely apologize to for tapping their cart on accident and all you get is a go to he11 look, to the lady that sees you've a handful and trying to get to the elevator, but doesn't have time enough in her schedule to a)hold the door or b) if you made it, you have to ask her if she would please push floor eight....and the response is an angry jab at the button and a sigh that tells you she is very put out by your asking such a tasking favor.

Please and thank you. Please and thank you. Where did they go?

Their absence is not helping to make my ugly feelings do anything but burble to the surface.