Dimmu,

Some how you have got to get your focus off of your WW, and onto yourself.

You will go crazy thinking about her and trying to get meaning out of everything she says or does. It will drive you nuts. So stop it.

She is in the fog, nothing makes sense and don't try to make it make sense.

If you are ready for Plan B, and I think you are, then concentrate on your letter and how you are going to fill your time. It is to be a time for personal growth and change. In Plan B, you have to put her out of your mind, period. Believe that everything will happen for the best, and you have done all you can. Which you have.

Concentrate on what kind of a job you would like and how you are going to make that happen.

Plan B is a hell of a lot easier than Plan A. It removes you from the chaos and from waiting, wondering trying to make sense out of the insane.

You can do this Dimmu. You are a strong, wonderful guy. Don't you ever doubt this for a second.

weaver

weaver,

Thank you ever so much for your continued advice and patience with me. Please believe that I take your advice, as well as everyone else's advice to heart. Its just when I start feeling better, or focused...I fall apart again. I start following the advice I am given, then I find myself where I started, feeling the way that I did the very first time I posted on MB.

I can't stand what is going on with my WW...I wish it was all a crazy nightmare, and I would just wake up. I can't stand the thought of somehow not being able to "fix" this, making it better...being with her again.

Part of me feels so strongly about Plan B...but it is so soon. What if I jump the gun on this? What if God doesn't approve? I feel He directed me to MB, and I see people on here saving marriages worse than mine. I read something, a Scripture I think, I can't remember, but it went something like this: "I love my wife, even in all of her waywardness, because my God loves her..."

weaver, believe me,I know I need to stop it...I have a wise neighbor who is telling me the same thing, and I keep telling that to my self. Its just that all thoughts, projects, raising my children, hopes for the future...lead me back to thinking of her, the one who has hurt me so,but yet I still love. It is driving me crazy. The past couple of days weren't as bad as today, but today feels like the day I realized that she was going to start a R with OM...

Nothing will stop me from finding work or starting a business, or from raising my children, or from trying to focus on anything and everything but her...but I just can't shake these feelings. I seem to be in my own fog. I don't feel like a wonderful guy at all, because I was unable to meet her EN's enough for her to stay, so she is getting them met by a dirtbag. I allowed independant behaviors to form. I didn't go with her to her mom and sister's house very often. I answered her angry outbursts with my own, and gave her disrespectful judgements when she made decisions I thought were wrong, or when I felt she wasn't taking care of things I felt she should be taking care of. I took to long to forgive the first A, which is why I did these things. I married her, and failed.

Maybe I'll feel better tomorrow. I'm going to go a couple more weeks I think, and pray about it, then maybe go to Plan B. I sent her a letter about what I think our marriage should have been like, and reminded her of some good times we had, and mentioned some of the things little things that I miss about her. Also, I want to see how this weekend goes. I'm sorry everyone, I am listening to your advice, every word of it, and I thank you all dearly for your support. But sometimes the advice doesn't register, due to waves of strong emotion.

Dimmu

I found the Scripture, it was in this thread (I couldn't remember if I read it on MB or elsewhere on the net):

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=37;t=033273#000004

believer wrote:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I especially like the part where he says "Do you not see how beautiful she is? I have loved her always, even in the depth of her waywardness, because my God loved her".
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I knew I read that somewhere...I couldn't remember the line word for word, but I had the gist of it.

<small>[ October 28, 2004, 10:21 PM: Message edited by: Dimmu ]</small>

I woke up this morning, feeling rather good. I had dreams last night, but I can't remember if any of them included my WW...so I think that is part of it. Plus, my DD has a Halloween party at school today. I was real excited for her! She is dressed up like the little princess she is. My sister loaned us a princess dress, and my mother loaned me a few bucks for costume jewlrey. Dangling earings, necklace, and a little tiara. She is so happy that she could be what she wanted to be for Halloween. I wanted to take a picture of her, but there was something wrong with my mom's digital camera. I'll have to wait until later to take a picture.

I have been having fleeting thoughts about my WW, OM, and the A, but they haven't been bringing me down yet. I try to think about something else when I do get those thoughts.

Now for real serious business:

Right now, I'm trying to figure out how to break it to my WW that I'm going to do everything in my power to prevent her from taking my children down to PA with her. She can see them whenever she wants-up here in NY. I have given the thought much consideration, and its for the wellbeing of the children. I had asked her to keep them away for immoral behavior, from her abusive brother (screams in my children's faces, carries my DS by one arm, and is an all around !@#!$*%!), away from her morally depraved sister and her A, and from her degenerate friend, whose older son has bruised my son. She will threaten legal action, and I will have to remind her that:

I don't have any criminal record whatsoever, I have been Mr. Mom, and have been doing everything I need to do for my children, whereas her record as of late in that area isn't too good (I have been documenting everything).

She and her dirtbag OM got raided by the cops.

She left me for a dirtbag on probation, who is now in jail.

She has turned the house that she is still in into a flop house. People are living there (one has a R with a 15-16yo girl), and there is continued partying there.

That there are witness, and her own admission to the cops, that she willingly and willfully dumped me and the children off in NY, knowing that part of my mother's house is still being remodelled (we have been living in the two front rooms of the house for a month).

She hasn't paid up on our agreed child support.

My DD has felt physically ill when witnessing my WW kissing OM (a few days after us being dumped off, thus confusing my child about relationships), and the fact that she continues to complain of stomach aches due to the actions of my WW.

My WW has spent money on herself for trivial, material things, rather than spending that money on gas to come see the children. (plus she is getting income from her roommates, and soon from OM because of work release jailtime).

She hasn't called the kids in over two weeks.

The family and "friends" she associates with are of low morals and character, which I can easily prove.


I could probably go on, but that should be enough. My WW will view this as me trying to "punish" her, but that is ridiculous. If she can't see that I am protecting the kids, then that is her problem. I know that I am not supposed to LB, but today, I could not care less about it. Does anyone thoughts about my plan? My lawyer doesn't do family law, so I don't have any legal counsel on this matter, but my family (who has more credit and abilty to gather funds) has said that in no way will they stand idle, and let my kids go to her family, or let my WW have full custody.

bump

My DD had a great and fun day at school today! I am SO proud of her. She got candy and prizes at the school Halloween party, and she divvied them up, and shared them with my DS without anyone asking her too. Nothing like a fun day to get her mind off of what has been going on!

She did mention that she misses her mom. This is making me feel anger and spite towards my WW. She could at least call. She better show up tomorrow. I couldn't help it, but I asked her if she didn't like living here at my mother's, and she said "I like living here, but I still miss mom." I explained to my DD that I can't snap my fingers and make mom appear. I can't make her call. Mom decided she didn't want me living with her, and mom dropped us off. Its up to mom to do or change these things. I told her that I miss mom too, but I miss the old mom, not the new mom that mom is "trying" to be. Like me, my DD has a logical side. She frowned for a moment, then shrugged it off and went to play with her brother.
She knows, deep down, she is better off with me. At least her stomach aches are becoming more infrequent.

Was I wrong in telling my DD these things? I can't lie to her. I know that I would want to know why I couldn't see one of my parents, because my dad was always gone for one reason or another, until his death when I was ten years old. He was in and out of trouble, hospitals, etc. (he was an alcoholic and a drug addict, and my ignorant WW wonders why I don't allow partying and excessive drinking around the kids <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> ).

Also, does anyone have any opinions of my idea for approaching the custody situation with my WW?

Dimmu

bump
looking for insight...
also, I spoke with WW on the phone, she is coming over for sure, she'll be here around 2pm. I suggested we get some wine or beers or something (for after the kids are in bed, or if my mom watches them). She said something like, "Maybe. We'll see..." in what I would say is a normal-to-upbeat sort of tone. This weekend will be interesting for sure...

But tonight, I am treating myself to a glass or two or three of port. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I love wine and port...

<small>[ October 29, 2004, 07:25 PM: Message edited by: Dimmu ]</small>

bump

My WW is here, she showed up a few minutes ago...I'm feeling nervous. I'll update later if I can.

Dimmu,

You stay strong and confident tonight, you hear? You are a great guy and you show your WW just how good you are, and that you are not going to settle for ****, when you have so much love inside you and so much to offer.

weaver

thank you weaver for your support.

We just got back from trick-or-treating, and WW is in the kitchen seeing my new nephew for the first time, so I have a chance to make a quick post.

I haven't talked about custody yet, but we're going out for coffee in a few minutes. I almost fell apart a few times, but I'm trying my hardest to hold it together. We have talked about M, R, etc. I know I'm not supposed to, but I feel that I am reaching her to a degree...

I have to go, I'll post back later.

Ugh....

Ok. My thoughts are all out of whack, and what I am typing here isn't in any sort of order, I am just recalling some of what was talked about.

I probably, totally, blew Plan A and everything else, except that my kids are more than likely staying in NY until the crap with the false statement blows over. She didn't say yes or no, but my DS asked her to spend the night, and she said "I probably will next time." She was originally supposed to take them to PA next time. Score!!!

I did try to implement Plan A aspects I learned by reading ark's post on Plan A. I said sorry to anything accusatory, which wasn't often, because the logical side of me was strong tonight, and she couldn't argue certain points(I have a theory that logic can wade through the fog to a certain extent). I also reversed babbled a couple of things(thanks Orchid!!!), but the babble wasn't predominant like it has been. She did mention the job thing, even though she told me numerous times not to get one when we were together. I almost LB'd by telling her that I felt she didn't want me to have a job, because if I did, then that would be one less "excuse" to have an affair with a coworker. I asked her if she loved OM (I know, I know...no talk of the dirtbag OM), and she said she didn't know. FOG BABBLE! I asked her if she thought OM loved her, and she said yes. I said "Oh really? He loves you so much, that he couldn't wait a few more days for me to be gone, that he had to get it on with *local easy s1ut*" while I was still living there?" More seeds of doubt planted!!!

We went for coffee,and on the way, I may have LB'd by talking smack on OM. I brought up that maybe OM is bisexual (thanks again Orchid!!! YES!!!). She got slightly defensive and said "You won't even tell me who your sources are that claim he is bi, how can I make a proper judgement on that?" YES!!! I also have her at least half convinced that he is a spineless freak of a man. A sexual predator who cannot find a single woman, and that he preys upon vulnerable married women, or women who are easy. I mocked him about the time I confronted him (with my suspicions), and how he practically cowered, and swore he wasn't interested in in my WW, and how he said "And if I'm going to get my @ss kicked, then whatever man!"

While at the restuarant, I almost cried. She picked up on these and said "Don't start crying." So I didn't, I choked it back. I did this to myself, by bringing up things that I miss by not being with her. I explained that she shut me out and didn't allow me to meet her emotional needs. She admitted that was probably true. She said she didn't know why she did that. She admitted that she is "more than bullheaded", and that she didn't allow me to have any input in decision making. I told her that I felt that if she doesn't get over these issues, then she'll never be happy, whether its with me, or anyone else.

Earlier in the evening, I had mentioned getting restraining orders against certain degenerate friends and family members of hers. I told her it wasn't to punish her in any way, but that I WILL NOT allow my children to have thier morals corrupted, "and that is that." I reiterated at the restuarant that certain people will not be around my children.

Lets see...other things of note that I can recall...

She said at one point something like this: "...and if we don't work it out, its none of your mother's business!" and "I will always be the aunt to (my niece and nephews)!". I thought that was interesting, like deep down she thinks of a future reconciliation. If we divorce...my family already hates her...she will not be considered an aunt to my niece and nephews, and that won't be my choice. It will be thier mom's choice.

I ramble on, my apologies. The mixture of logic and emotion has my thoughts slightly scrambled. But, this is the first time she left and I didn't cry, and I feel rather empowered tonight. Seeds of doubt have been planted. She appears to be edging towards hitting rock bottom. OM is in jail, and she said that they may press all charges on him for the raid, and what they found there. I guess they only want me for "questioning". Dorks.

My DD "cried" when WW left, but did not shed one tear! It was fake! I think she is getting sick of the crap my WW is pulling. Such nonsense for a 6yo to deal with. I can see it now, when she is a teen: "Mom, I know you cheated on dad, you suck!"

So I am left wondering...do I want to save this marriage? Maybe, maybe not. Will I implement Plan B? Soon, oh yeah, very soon. Next time I see her, I may try for SF (no nooky this time <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Its been almost 2 months!), but other than that, 180 and Plan A all the way, then straight to Plan B. So I guess my time limit is approximately 2 months. I had to get things off of my chest tonight, and I did. Now I think I can handle this situation more effectively. She will see that I will move one, with or without her, and thats that.

Dimmu

edit:I forgot to mention...she knows that I do research on things, and she knows I have been researching why people have affairs (she doesn't know about MB). She asked me why she feels the way she does, because she doesn't know herself...I asked if she gave credence to what I had been saying (that was a LB, she got mad and said "DUH! I wouldn't have asked you! I hate when you answer a question with a queston, and you digress! I hate that!" She's right on that one...oops). I explained brain chemicals and emotional needs to her a little bit...sounds like progress to me!

edited (yet again), this time for spelling and clarity.

<small>[ October 31, 2004, 09:52 AM: Message edited by: Dimmu ]</small>

Hey Dimmu,

Well it sounds like the night did go well!

I am very happy to read that you have a definate time table for PlanA/PlanB. As I am sure you have been reading on here, way too many miss the point of the Plans, and won't, out of fear go into Plan B when the time is right.

So I hope you keep working the Plan, keep working on getting your self back, making the changes you need to make for yourself and move into Plan B when the time is right, without fear and knowing that it is the single most important thing you can do to save your family if Plan A hasn't ended the affair and brought about the necessary changes in her.

Keep on keeping on Dimmu, in my opinion you are doing great!

weaver,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Keep on keeping on Dimmu, in my opinion you are doing great!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks weaver! I am trying, and I think I am getting stronger everyday.

I do feel that the night went pretty well, even though certain goals weren't met, and that I talked a lot about M, R, OM, etc...but I still can't help but feel that some progress was made by doing that. I will try very hard to just stick with Plan A the next time. I have to remember that it is unrealistic to expect changes so soon, but the seeds I planted in her heart and mind will hopefully aid in speeding things along.

There are some other things I remember talking to her about. I mentioned that she moved away from her family in NY that are moral and have thier act together. That she had me convinced (in the beginning of our R)that she wasn't like the other family members she lives near, who support and enable her A.

She mentioned that she recalled sitting in the same restuarant we were in last night, with her mom four years ago, crying to her that she thought that she was going to lose me. That was due to marital problems that existed right before her first A, when she thought I was having an EA with an old friend (I was wrong about confiding marital problems to her, I'll admit that, but my W wasn't hearing me, and no one else wanted to hear about our problems...). This woman is the same age as my mom, and my WW knew that I had a teenage crush on her once. I was like "Yeah, and I didn't talk to her anymore because of your worries about that, because I love and respect you. You say you were crying, told your mom you loved me so much. You know that I ended that friendship because you were worried. So how was it that you decided to have an A? It makes absolutely zero sense..." She just looked down and said she didn't know why she did it...

So my WW may be realizing that she is the self-destructive, R/M sabotaging type. Maybe she'll recognize that she needs help. I hope so. I would hate to see her wander through life the way she currently is...destined for loneliness and despair.

Today, I am still thinking about her w/OM. I also think about the good times WW and I had, and the bad. Thinking about how she has slept with other people after we got together. It stings a little, but not nearly as bad as before. I am truly starting to get better. The biggest problem for me right now, is that those things DID happen, weren't supposed to happen, and they cannot be undone. When I think about these things, it feels like a rift has been torn in my universe. I'm not crying about it, but it does bother me, and I will have to go through the rest of my life, remembering...

Dimmu

<small>[ November 01, 2004, 07:15 AM: Message edited by: Dimmu ]</small>