Is it possible for the WW to Plan B the BS?
I know it has only be a few days since WW moved out, but feel that WW is plan B'ing me. Limiting her contact with me, which is ok just a little wierd considering i am suppose to be doing that with her. WW and I do talk but usually just about issues with our kids or finances. Have not really seen WW since she left few days ago. See her through peephole in the door as she drops my kids off for the school bus. Usually have my son give her her mail to the car.
I know WW stated night before she left that she felt maybe going dark with each other for a while was the same thing she was thinking,as well.
I also can't stand the fact that i am questioning my kids in the morning after they she drops them off about what they did during the night, or what WW did. This is wrong and i am trying to stop this, do not want to bring my kids into this sit. like this. I guess i am kind of hoping to hear from them that she misses me,or she is lonely but never get that response. Too early probably.
Yesterday was a little strange. WW called me a work out of blue and mentioned about a upcomming doctors apt. for youngest son, but appt. is nearly two weeks away. Why would she bother to call me about that now. Why not wait till next week or so? Does anyone think maybe this is a small sign that she misses me in the fact that not being able to talk with me daily?? Or am i reading way too much into this??
I miss her at times but i am making it. Started to run again as a stress reliever. Unfortuanately find myself talking out loud around house. Like to think i am talking with the dog. I keep telling myself to take it one day at a time and be patience. It is hard though. The loneliness doesn't appear to be bothering WW as much though. Maybe because she has our kids for the first week. Maybe she will exp. what i am exp. this week next week when i have the kids for the week. I am sure maybe not as bad as me, because she will have Om over her place or go out with him i am sure.
Sometimes this just sucks for the BS.
jets

Jets, it totally sucks for the BS. My FWH Plan B'd me, as well, when he moved out. He moved out to 1)have his private time with OW, and 2)to get some space and try and figure out what was going on within himself.

The BEST thing I did for my H during that time was to give him his space. I KNOW how hard it is to NOT ask the kids. BUT, you cannot continue doing that. Just another one of the hundreds of things that SUCK about A's, is that the kids are involved WAY more than either partner ever thought they would do that - when you were still committed to each other.

My H and I used to "hypothosize" about if we got a D, we would remain friends for the kids, still do stuff together, NEVER put the kids in the middle, yadda yadda. However, we didn't consider that if we did ever split up, maybe one partner wouldn't want to split - and that makes it all so HARD.

Literally, bite your tongue if you have to. I used to think it wasn't a big deal to just ask what they did, if they had fun over at Dad's. Then my friend whose brother got D'd told me that in Idaho, when people D that have kids together, they have to go to a D'd parenting class. One of the "rules" that they learn in that class is that neither can ask the kids ANYthing about their stay/visit with the other parent. Not even "Did you have fun?" Because kids can easily get the message that one parent is upset when they leave, or something. Once I learned that, I stopped. You can listen if they volunteer, but don't pry.

I would continue to let her lead the way with the level of communication, and just do your own Plan B. AND, I wouldn't read too much into the appointment call. She might have just wanted to touch base with you about it while she was thinking about it, since she won't be seeing you often. Right now, so early after moving out, I see her actions with you more as just practical. Her head is in another game right now, no offense. That is why she moved out. It's all about HER.

Take care, hang in there, and play games with your kids each night you have them. It was our rule, after H left, and we were all so down, that each night we played games until someone laughed so hard they fell off their chair. One night, we had to play for over an hour, but it was worth it!

Spidey

Thanks for the reply Spidey,
Your husband excuses for moving out, sound identical to my WW.
Can i ask where you are at now with your WH,is he still seeing OW and how long have you two been separated?
Your right in the fact that WW is probably not thinking too much about us and more so about herself. Your right she is in the " It's all about me" phase.
Never saw this part of WW after knowing her for 20years. Never imagined that she would be the one to do this. Kind of always hypothesisized that if anyone was was to cheat in our M, it would have been me. Makes me wonder how much i thought i really new WW over last 20years.
I guess the part that makes this hard for me is that fact that she is so damn nice. This is her personality though she has never been a mean, vindictive easily angered person. She has always been sweet and friendly in her personality. So it is hard to tell for me what she is really thinking or saying. Sound wierd i know.
I had asked her the other day how it was going for her while living on her own. And even though it has been a few days. She did state that it kind of felt wierd, but that is as far as her comments went. I didn't edge it on anymore than that. When she left she thought separation would do us good "Absences make heart grow fonder" but I sometimes fear that maybe this separation will actually pull us further apart.
I am not going to question my kids no more. Just if they had a good time and leave it at that. I do have some ideas for us next week to do for fun. Like to see a movie with them and maybe plays some games or go someplace with them. I am not going to have them sit around nightly and watch boobtube.
jets

Oh Jets, where to start. Hmmmm. Well, FWH and I were separated for 3 months. We ended up paying off the last 3 months of his 6 month lease on his apartment when he moved back home.

You said you have known her for 20 years. I don't know how old you are. My H and I have been together since I was 16 and he was 18. When he moved out, it was the first time he had lived on his own. I think (as does he) that this was good for him. He said it felt weird, but also good - at first.

After a couple of months, he began missing the family unit, our partnership, our friendship. Once I could detach from him emotionally, and wrapped my head around actually living my life without him, is when he finally came back around. Strangest thing, these WS!

Every sitch is different. With your kids, I think the number 1 priority is to show them that even if this split is for good, there are good times to be had. Life goes on, and they will be happy.

Spidey

Spidey,
Man o Man, can't get over how similar our sit. are. I just turn 40 ,WW 36 -37 in Dec. We met about the same age you and your H did. We where HS sweethearts. Dated long distance after we got into college. Thought back then man if we can date this long and be true to each other this far apart, then nothing will ever happen in our marriage, guess i was way off with that thinking back then.
I still find it hard to beleive that i am at this point in my life. Find it hard to believe that i never saw this part of my WW personality all these years. To be so self centered and to only be looking out for her. She still nice and all but u still see her with this selfcenter attituded. Seem to materialize over this last year. WW states of course that we had been drifting for a few years, just i couldn't see it. She right i didn't see it. I see her drifting but not me.
I wonder if my sit will end up like yours did?
I have a feeling that i will start to get used to living on my own and that is when she will come out of her fog and realize what she did and i honestly won't know what my feelings are for her when this happens. I will not really know if i want to put myself back through this again with all the work it will require on both are parts to not have any gaurantees that A will not happen again 3-4yrs. down the line.
WW was always upset because i wasn't stroking her self esteem. I admit i should have done this more, but being married for 14 years i didn't expect to have to treat her like i was in my honeymoon phase. Once in a while yes but all the time like she is getting with OM...no way, just doesn't happen that way. WW admitted she has some selfesteem issues and swears she will get IC once settled in, but i somehow see her putting this off. Main reason move out was to see what materializes with Om, although she adamently denies this, as well as her setting me up as the safty net.
I am just going to take it one day at a time and try to focus on my kids and me. This is hard, as your H i have never really been out on my own. Went from parents house right into a marriage. Although i comfort my self by telling myself that over last year i have had a dress rehearsal of being on my own. WW was around at times but not really around.
jets

Is it possible for the WW to Plan B the BS?
Only if the bs is having an affair.

My FWH Plan B'd me
No, you're husband ignored you or cut off/minimized contact with you. That is not Plan B.

Jets,
Any thought of contacting Steve or Jennifer @ MB for counseling? (see below for number)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> My FWH Plan B'd me
No, you're husband ignored you or cut off/minimized contact with you. That is not Plan B. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Once again, Chris, you are correct. Please excuse my lack of respect for the definitions of the MB terms. Sometimes, I equate "ignore, cut off/minimize contact" with Plan B.

Jets, I have read from MANY people here at MB who have done MC with the Harleys, or marriage coaching with Penny, and it has helped them as individuals greatly. I was lucky in that my H and I started MC about 5 or 6 weeks after he moved out. Even though he only professed to go to "make the D smoother," whatever the heck that means.

It makes a HUGE difference to have a clear plan to stick to in these times of stress and confusion and frustration. Like I said, each sitch is so different. We have many similarities, but many differences, I am sure. What worked for me may or may not work for you.

My story began about this time last year, when I could tell H was becoming distant to me. And I caught some very inappropriate emails between him and my very close friend. H was confused, and told me that he thought he was in love with both of us. Ugh. Broke my heart. So like an IDIOT, I told this friend, thinking she would shut him down and send him packing. WRONG!

It got worse, culiminating in the PA in December. H had a mental breakdown on 12/31/03, I took him to the ER in a blizzard, and he confessed all to me in the waiting room of the hospital - with his mother there. He had told her the night before. You see, he chose the OW.

Well, I called up OW when I got home, and she of course felt "betrayed" by my H. From that day on, she basically dumped him. She still took his calls, but asked him not to go to her home anymore (out of respect for me, but those are just her WORDS). Of course, H was her and our boys' Assistant Scout Master, so they saw each other once a week at Scouts, and went on one camping trip together with Scouts in February.

History on OW: D'd mother of 2, 2 different dads, promiscuous, and already had a boyfriend in December, along with my H. Another reason I felt "safe."

Because we were in MC, I didn't really do a Plan B. I respected H's wishes for limited contact, and I guess in that way did a Plan A. I was meeting the emotional need he had at he time for distance and space. It was all I could do for him, all he asked for.

Because of the MC, I was advised here on MB to primarily follow the plan that the MC had us on. Which turned out to be good and bad. Good in that at the time, the MC we had encouraged me to give H his space, which helped me detach from him and get myself in order and straightened out and in control of my life again. Bad in that that particular MC didn't work out, and H walked out on the 3rd or 4th session.

Which was GOOD, because then H's IC invited me to sit in on one of their sessions, and H agreed. H's IC became our MC, and after about 4 sessions, H came home. THIS MC said we needed MORE time together, hash out our differences, until there were no more differences. And we sure did! Without the kids around, of course.

By the time H moved back in, he very much knew my requirements for NC and continuing MC. And that was at the beginning of April. Because H moved back in by his own choice, of his own will, because he WANTED to, the NC really stuck. In fact, we just "fired" (or he fired us) our MC yesterday. We are now flying on our own. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

There is hope. Finding a solid plan, and finding your center again, is of infinite help. Chris knows of what he speaks.

Spidey

Chris and Spidey
I have thought about the Harleys when we first where around DD back in July, but d/t expense and finances this was hard to do as still is.
I am still going to our MC who i guess now has become my IC since WW is no longer going. WW participated from mid July to 1st part of sept. before she ended it after i discovered she broke NC. I often wonder even when we in counseling together, how much of her was really there, or rather she was just going through the motions with no intent on truly giving up OM, rather than just giving them a break.
IC i go to is aware of Harleys method and agrees with it, but does not totally counsel on there methods, but similar. I have introduced ideas to him from what i have read with SAA. He seems familiar with them and in most part is agreement with them.
I doubt i could get WW to go back to MC now anyways. Again she will not totally give up OM.
I think she is still trying to find out what materializes between him and her, now that she is ofc. out of house at legal separation. There are doubts that she has voiced to me but she persist in not giving him up in order for us to have a chance at least not yet. I stress that i am not going to be used as a saftey net or second choice. She states that she wouldn't want this either, and if things didn't work our with her and OM she would not come running back. States she needs the time to figure herself out. She knows she has issues and states she will get counseling for herself when she is settled in,but this remains to be seen.
She pretty much told me before she moved out that because she was doing this didn't mean that we will cont. to have relationship talks while she is moved out. Told her no way, will not be doing this. I LB and told her her choice to leave, my choice to let her back in, but it is the truth.
I am going to kind of ride this out through next week and then try to check on how she is feeling about this in a non subtle way. I know she will not have kids next week and will place her by herself during the week, but have feeling she will feel this void with OM. So the answer i may get next week maybe that everything is fine.
jets.

Chris and Spidey
I have thought about the Harleys when we first where around DD back in July, but d/t expense and finances this was hard to do as still is.
I am still going to our MC who i guess now has become my IC since WW is no longer going. WW participated from mid July to 1st part of sept. before she ended it after i discovered she broke NC. I often wonder even when we in counseling together, how much of her was really there, or rather she was just going through the motions with no intent on truly giving up OM, rather than just giving them a break.
IC i go to is aware of Harleys method and agrees with it, but does not totally counsel on there methods, but similar. I have introduced ideas to him from what i have read with SAA. He seems familiar with them and in most part is agreement with them.
I doubt i could get WW to go back to MC now anyways. Again she will not totally give up OM.
I think she is still trying to find out what materializes between him and her, now that she is ofc. out of house at legal separation. There are doubts that she has voiced to me but she persist in not giving him up in order for us to have a chance at least not yet. I stress that i am not going to be used as a saftey net or second choice. She states that she wouldn't want this either, and if things didn't work our with her and OM she would not come running back. States she needs the time to figure herself out. She knows she has issues and states she will get counseling for herself when she is settled in,but this remains to be seen.
She pretty much told me before she moved out that because she was doing this didn't mean that we will cont. to have relationship talks while she is moved out. Told her no way, will not be doing this. I LB and told her her choice to leave, my choice to let her back in, but it is the truth.
I am going to kind of ride this out through next week and then try to check on how she is feeling about this in a non subtle way. I know she will not have kids next week and will place her by herself during the week, but have feeling she will probably fill this void with OM. So the answer i may get next week maybe that everything is fine.
jets.

Chris and Spidey
I have thought about the Harleys when we first where around DD back in July, but d/t expense and finances this was hard to do as still is.
I am still going to our MC who i guess now has become my IC since WW is no longer going. WW participated from mid July to 1st part of sept. before she ended it after i discovered she broke NC. I often wonder even when we in counseling together, how much of her was really there, or rather she was just going through the motions with no intent on truly giving up OM, rather than just giving them a break.
IC i go to is aware of Harleys method and agrees with it, but does not totally counsel on there methods, but similar. I have introduced ideas to him from what i have read with SAA. He seems familiar with them and in most part is agreement with them.
I doubt i could get WW to go back to MC now anyways. Again she will not totally give up OM.
I think she is still trying to find out what materializes between him and her, now that she is ofc. out of house at legal separation. There are doubts that she has voiced to me but she persist in not giving him up in order for us to have a chance at least not yet. I stress that i am not going to be used as a saftey net or second choice. She states that she wouldn't want this either, and if things didn't work our with her and OM she would not come running back. States she needs the time to figure herself out. She knows she has issues and states she will get counseling for herself when she is settled in,but this remains to be seen.
She pretty much told me before she moved out that because she was doing this didn't mean that we will cont. to have relationship talks while she is moved out. Told her no way, will not be doing this. I LB and told her her choice to leave, my choice to let her back in, but it is the truth.
I am going to kind of ride this out through next week and then try to check on how she is feeling about this in a non subtle way. I know she will not have kids next week and will place her by herself during the week, but have feeling she will probably fill this void with OM. So the answer i may get next week maybe that everything is fine. So i will have to cont. to wait but for how long i don't know. perhaps officially plan b then.
jets.

Chris and Spidey
I have thought about the Harleys when we first where around DD back in July, but d/t expense and finances this was hard to do as still is.
I am still going to our MC who i guess now has become my IC since WW is no longer going. WW participated from mid July to 1st part of sept. before she ended it after i discovered she broke NC. I often wonder even when we in counseling together, how much of her was really there, or rather she was just going through the motions with no intent on truly giving up OM, rather than just giving them a break.
IC i go to is aware of Harleys method and agrees with it, but does not totally counsel on there methods, but similar. I have introduced ideas to him from what i have read with SAA. He seems familiar with them and in most part is agreement with them.
I doubt i could get WW to go back to MC now anyways. Again she will not totally give up OM.
I think she is still trying to find out what materializes between him and her, now that she is ofc. out of house at legal separation. There are doubts that she has voiced to me but she persist in not giving him up in order for us to have a chance at least not yet. I stress that i am not going to be used as a saftey net or second choice. She states that she wouldn't want this either, and if things didn't work our with her and OM she would not come running back. States she needs the time to figure herself out. She knows she has issues and states she will get counseling for herself when she is settled in,but this remains to be seen.
She pretty much told me before she moved out that because she was doing this didn't mean that we will cont. to have relationship talks while she is moved out. Told her no way, will not be doing this. I LB and told her her choice to leave, my choice to let her back in, but it is the truth.
I am going to kind of ride this out through next week and then try to check on how she is feeling about this in a non subtle way. I know she will not have kids next week and will place her by herself during the week, but have feeling she will probably fill this void with OM. So the answer i may get next week maybe that everything is fine. So i will have to cont. to wait but for how long i don't know.
jets.

Chris and Spidey
I have thought about the Harleys when we first where around DD back in July, but d/t expense and finances this was hard to do as still is.
I am still going to our MC who i guess now has become my IC since WW is no longer going. WW participated from mid July to 1st part of sept. before she ended it after i discovered she broke NC. I often wonder even when we in counseling together, how much of her was really there, or rather she was just going through the motions with no intent on truly giving up OM, rather than just giving them a break.
IC i go to is aware of Harleys method and agrees with it, but does not totally counsel on there methods, but similar. I have introduced ideas to him from what i have read with SAA. He seems familiar with them and in most part is agreement with them.
I doubt i could get WW to go back to MC now anyways. Again she will not totally give up OM.
I think she is still trying to find out what materializes between him and her, now that she is ofc. out of house at legal separation. There are doubts that she has voiced to me but she persist in not giving him up in order for us to have a chance at least not yet. I stress that i am not going to be used as a saftey net or second choice. She states that she wouldn't want this either, and if things didn't work our with her and OM she would not come running back. States she needs the time to figure herself out. She knows she has issues and states she will get counseling for herself when she is settled in,but this remains to be seen.
She pretty much told me before she moved out that because she was doing this didn't mean that we will cont. to have relationship talks while she is moved out. Told her no way, will not be doing this. I LB and told her her choice to leave, my choice to let her back in, but it is the truth.
I am going to kind of ride this out through next week and then try to check on how she is feeling about this in a non subtle way. I know she will not have kids next week and will place her by herself during the week, but have feeling she will probably fill this void with OM. So the answer i may get next week maybe that everything is fine. So i will have to cont. to wait but for how long i don't know. perhaps plan b then.
jets.

OOPS,
GUESS I HIT THE ADD REPLY BUTTON TOO MANY TIMES.

Yeah, that double, triple, quadruple, posting does happen sometimes. You can go back and edit your posts, so that they just say OOPS, and take up less space, if you want.

I know what you mean about the money, believe me. At one point, we were paying $50 a week for my IC, $80 a week for his IC, and $180 a weeek for our MC. PLUS an extra $605 for a tiny little apartment for him to live in, not to mention extra utilities and such. Last year we paid for X-mas in cash, this year we have DEBT.

BUT, we have our M, and our family is in tact. Whenever I get down about where we were financially vs. where we are now, I ask myself what price I put on what I have now. And that is priceless.

I understand.

I understand what you mean about not knowing your spouse anymore, too. I had no idea my H had it in himself to be that self-centered. But, I also realized from reading and posting here, that we are ALL capable of that behavior. Capable. As my H told me, I have seen the WORST in him. I have seen it all. The best, the worst, and everything in between. Nobody else besides himself has seen that. And . . . I am still here with him. I do truly love him. It is the hardest thing I have ever done, learning to love with no expectation of anything in return. Very hard.

Hang in there. Keep posting.

Spidey

Jets, I don't have time to read your thread right now, so sorry if this is a repetition of something already said...

Even if you think doing your own plan B will not change the circumstances, the day-to-day stuff, it makes a huge difference if the silence is mandated by you instead of your foggy spouse. It feels different too. Your desire to have contact with them has some importance to them, and when you say I no longer want to see you or talk to you, it spins them for a loop, even if they've already indicated they don't want to see you or talk to you.

Make sense? Sorry, in a rush.

GC

Thanks for reponse Spidey and GC,
It does feel kind of weird, and i maybe expecting too much too soon with going dark, after all it has only been a few days since WW moved out. Again i want to see how things pan out next week when WW is by herself most of the week, without the kids. I won't know for sure if she is not meeting up with Om couple times a week, but will have to assume that she will be doing this. WW has informed me though that she will be picking up later hours at her work now that she is moved out, to make up for the one check. So how much time this will allow her with OM i will never know. I am sure she could always meet him for dinner after work and all that, but his shcedule will dictate that.
I guess i should just try and not think about it, d/t there is nothing i can do if it happens or not. Will try to just keep focused on my kids and i next week and try not to think too much about what WW is doing.
Will also cont. to pray evernight that God will steer her back to me her light house.
Patience is sometimes a pain.
jets.

Once again, Chris, you are correct. Please excuse my lack of respect for the definitions of the MB terms. Sometimes, I equate "ignore, cut off/minimize contact" with Plan B.
I was pointing it out becuase I want to make sure that everyone who reads will know that Plan B is not simply cutting of contact. Cutting off contact by a bs will (very likely) make the situation so much worse IF a Plan B letter is not used.

I guess from the standpoint of the ws wanting to not be in the marriage, it is a Plan B of sorts. They end all contact because it is easier fo rthem to continue the affair without the ws getting in the way.