well, we made it past the first 24hrs. my IC asked me yesterday how i felt and all i could come up with is numb. except for a few short episodes, i am not crying much. part of me wonders if it is the meds or if i have internally just shut down due to overload.

H is golfing now, the second child just left for school so i am home alone now. i do intend to go to work today after this post and a hot shower.

i was really glad H went golfing, i hope it does him some good.

TMCM, you said something about not falling into self-pity mode. i don't think that is what i'm doing. i am not feeling sorry for myself.

but i don't know what i am feeling.

so, am i thinking H would be better off without me? i don't know. of course if he could go back in time the answer is obvious, he could of done a lot better than me, but you can't go back and besides, the kids would not exist if we were not married. so no, i dont think i am thinking that.

all we have is the now and i don't think he would be better off without me right now. it is in the now that i am finally becoming capable of being a healthy life partner.

i still really don't know what i am thinking or feeling right now.

i just don't know how to be right now guys. i don't know if that makes any sense. it's like i'm having a non-stop out of body experience.

i want to be here for him, i've been answering his questions.

maybe it just so humbling to see him hurt so bad but still fighting for our marriage to survive. i know he is still fighting for that because he is not packing my bags. he even told me straight out yesterday that he does hope we can get past this. but he is so hurt.

so many times my only answer to his question is: "i was not thinking about you then, no, i was not thinking about the kids and the impact all this has on them."

he is very worried about the kids, i don't know if that means he envisions that one day they will know all this or not.

i don't feel dead inside. i don't feel like i am rotten to my core, a feeling i have had for most of my life.

i can tell you how i don't feel, i just can't really figure out how i do feel. just numb.

maybe someone can relate? help me figure out what i am feeling so i can get my mind back in my body and enter life again??

<small>[ October 29, 2004, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: FinallyLearning ]</small>

Hi FL,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> he even told me straight out yesterday that he does hope we can get past this. but he is so hurt.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is an answer to my prayers for your H...

FM, you and your H are goining to make it through all of this... You both have a very hard road ahead of you, but it's not an impossible road. Take it minute my minute, hour by hour, and day by day...

Please try to find a good pro-marriage MC... MC doesn't make rebuilding your M any "easier" but it will keep you both on track.

Wishing you and your H the best as you start rebuilding your M... and please know that my W and I will be praying for you.

Semper Fi,
RIF90

FL

Your H statement that if he had known about your A prior to your marriage that he would not have gotten married to you is right up there with the famous line "If my spouse has an affair I will divorce him/her without a second thought". Nobody knows what he/she will do until he/she crosses that bridge. I would bet my last dollar that if you were to suddenly become very ill, that he would be heartbroken over the possibility of losing you. For all his pain, there is still a man very much in love with you.

FL, I read a GREAT book by a woman whose H had an A, and when he finally decided to stay with the family, she also found out about a history of infidelity with him. It is called "Back from Betrayal: Saving a Marriage, a Family, a Life," by Suzy Farbman.

Her H actually wrote the Afterword, called "In Burton's Words: Giving Up Deception."

Maybe you and/or your H could find something in the pages of this very human book to find comfort, or hope.

Stay in the moment, take it all in, breath it all out, and go day by day. My grandmother's favorite quote: "Yesterday is gone, tomorrow never was, all you have is TODAY."

Spider Slayer

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FinallyLearning:
so, am i thinking H would be better off without me?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">When your mind drifts off into these sorts of "what if" areas... you lose focus of what you CAN do today.

"One day at a time"

"Todays stuff today"

Every day you need to PLAN what YOU will do to make your situation a little bit better. For THAT day alone. Every small step moves you away from "what if" ...

No more "what if" thinking.

Ask yourself... what WILL I DO today to make things better. Then do that one thing for today's sake.

Tomorrow will have a different thing you will do. (notice I did not say "try to do")

Pep

ok, so i took a long shower, laid on the bed for a while, let some tears come but then decided i just don't want to cry.

i think i've realized that it's not that i don't know what i'm feeling, it's that what i am feeling seems "wrong" on some level. but what i am feeling is hope and what i am feeling is some sense of peace because i have really broken free of all this on the inside for myself. but i guess it feels "wrong" because of the intense pain my H is in.

so i wasn't wanting to feel anything positive, it does not seem fair.

i stopped crying and turned to prayer again for guidance.

here's the guidance: take care of the man!! he is grieving, when his dad was sick and then died, i was not able to be at the forefront, i was needed at home, taking care of the kids. i would cook healthy meals for him (and his mom and brother when around). i kept the household running. i gave him the ability to focus on his grief so he could move thru it.

i can still to do the same things for him now.

Tonight I am going to make him beef and brocoli,
and I'll get all the bills out, and I'll help my son get his halloween costume done (he is william tell jr., on a bad day... there is an apple on his head but the arrow is not thru the apple but thru his forhead instead, cute huh? this was my son's own original idea, tonight we have to make a shirt that says "William Tell Jr." on the front and "on a bad day" on the back.) and i'll do all i can to keep the household running smoothly and peacefully.

granted this is different, i have caused this pain. and so i have added work. I have to answer all questions, i have to show him that he can express all his feelings to me and he can ask all the questions he needs to ask and that i will be honest and strong.

he wants to meet with my IC, he is hoping to go next week when i have my normal session. i've left a message with her to set it up. I asked him if he wanted to see her alone or with me there, he says he does not care. either way. i asked him if he has a perference but he says no. when i left a msg for IC, i asked her what she thought would be better. i suppose i would prefer being there but i did not tell her that cuz my true preference is to have it be whatever is best for him. it's just hard to know what is better since he is stating no preference. maybe the point is it will not matter to him at all and so i shouldn't worry about it.

it's hard because i am not getting much feedback from him as to what he wants. there have been a few times when i reached out to touch him that he has said don't. last night, after asking me some questions, he was close to tears, i asked him if i could hold him and comfort him, he responded with a definite no. but then this morning, when he was waking up early to go golfing, i started to rub his back some, something i have done often to help him wake up. but i wasn't sure if doing that was good or bad so i finally asked him if this was ok. he said he didn't know. after thinking about it, i decided to continue to rub his back. do you think that unless he says a definite no, i should assume it is ok and not be afraid to try to bring him some sort of comfort??

i was thinking it is better to aire on the side of giving than holding back, but i'm not sure. i mean that is what i would want, but that does not mean it is what he wants. but he has told me no when he has not wanted to be touched. when he says he does not know, is he really not wanting it but not wanting to have to say so? are my attempts to reach out to him bad because they may be putting pressure on him or are they good as long? as if he responds with a no, i can withdrawal without feeling hurt.

anyone have thoughts on all this?

FL- I think our emotions shut down during periods of extreme stress. I know that when my 4 year old went into DKA this spring (which is EXTREMELY dangerous for anyone- never mind a 4 year old. She has type 1 diabetes) I was OK with her at the hospital. I kind of felt like you are describing-numb- and just getting through each hour. It wasn't until we had my daughter home- and knew that she was going to be ok- that I totally broke down.

My thoughts and prayers continue to be with you.

Editing- I posted this before I saw your next response...sorry if it isn't helpful!

<small>[ October 28, 2004, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: Sadfww ]</small>

hi pep, just read your post. looks like i must of gotten that idea from you even before you posted cuz i have my one thing for today. beef and brocolli for dinner. not that that will be the only thing, but it is the one concrete thing i was able to plan to do today.

by the way... when i asked the question "am i thinking he would be better off without me?" my answer (in too many words obviously) is not i'm not thinking that. i was kinda listing thru the possible scenerios of what i was thinking in order to help me jump back into my body. (i'm probably still not making much sense).

anyway, i do feel stronger right now. i have a plan for today. it won't be the same plan as for tommorow but i'll figure that one out tommorow. right?

<small>[ October 28, 2004, 12:07 PM: Message edited by: FinallyLearning ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> do you think that unless he says a definite no, i should assume it is ok and not be afraid to try to bring him some sort of comfort?? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Coming from the BS POV, I think you should continue with the comfort unless told no. Many times, I accepted the comfort from my H, but didn't ask for it. Like I needed comfort, not sure if he was the one for the job, but he was there and I allowed it. Little things like that slowly broke down my protective walls - that he was always there when I needed him to be, and wasn't there when I needed him to NOT be there.

I am a woman, though, so maybe for men it is different.

Thoughts and prayers to you. I am also reading another good book right now, "Forgive for Good" by Fred Luskin, and in it he talks about the stress chemicals, and how they physiologically induce the "fight or flight" response. No wonder I vacillated wildly from wanting to never see H again and run away far away, to revenge and hurting him back. Even though the feelings are strong, and I regretted feeling that way at the time about my very own H, it is somehow comforting to know that those very feelings are the way we are wired to feel in great times of stress. Apparently, our brain doesn't differentiate much between being chased by a wild animal, and the pain caused by infidelity.

Spidey

sadfww, your post was helpful. i think you are right, i've done the same thing, when in the middle of a crisis, especially one that is about physical danger, i am good at letting my brain call all the shots, do what has to be done. and then when all is said and done, i let myself fall apart. this seems to only be the case when it's been about physical danger where i realized my immediate actions were 100% neccesary to help the situation.

i guess that also makes me realize that i probably better watch myself closely because maybe sometime in the not so distant future i AM going to totally emotionally melt down some. once i feel that maybe it will be ok to let some of those emotions out again.

hi spidey, thanks for you support and book suggestions. i got to tell you, there is NO way i have energy to read anything right now!!! but maybe in a week or so.

and thanks for you feedback about what was good for you. but like you said, you are female. i'm hoping some BHs might give their thoughts too.

RIF90, RH, (or any other BH) are you reading this??? what helped you the most?

Oh the pain...
it is always
just under the
surface. I am
hurting for you
today & in the
days to come.
but remember him-
he is hurting newly
from this-you
have been dealing
with it internally-
let him have some
space & quiet.
that is what my H
needed the days
after DDay. Let him
set the pace for talk
and touch-just be
there when he is
ready for you.
Love is so amazingly
resilient. do you
own "road less
traveled" by m scott
peck? read the "love"
chapter-it is true
words written.
prayers-peace-love
pal

thanks pal. the support of everyone here is so helpful. (as you can tell, i am reading A LOT today). i think i better figure out a way to get something done here at work now too!!!

Finally Learning:

As far as the comfort, if he's not receptive right now....then tread lightly with it.

When my W "came clean" on our 2nd D-day...with all the details and stuff she had been lying to me about....I like your H was in total shock.
I was hurting.....but I just could NOT accept (especially very early on) ANY type of comfort from HER.
It was just too much to handle.

I mean, I was still there, I was still trying & I was doing my Best to process all this Info.....but I sure as Heck did Not want her to be the one to comfort me.

That's not totally true. Part of me wanted it, but the "survival" part of me... just couldn't let her be the one to console me.

NOT THEN!
It was TOO early and the Pain was Too Raw.

He's going to need time to get a handle on all this.
If its NOT helping HIM (by your actions) then stop them.
You can always re-approach him again, when a week or 2 or whatever time frame you sense is appropriate by watching and talking with him.

He will want you back.....but NOT right now.

Understand that a man has to make himself "vulnerable" to a woman to accept any type of "emotional" warmth or compassion.
Unfortunately, Right now he is in pure "survival" mode.

As you are the reason for all of this Pain......he just can't make himself open to YOU.
Inside himself he can't take that "risk" of you hurting him anymore then he is.
He's probably right at his own personal breaking point.
Anymore and he might just crack.

Hence his true "need" to protect himself from the cause of his Hurt.
So NO, what you would want right now is not what he needs.

In fact, right now your suggestion to help and support in "other" areas is a Great one.

But as far as personal touch and emotional support.......that is something he can't open himself up to at this time.

Cause to get through this he has to deal with it kind of piece meal.
If he were to "let" himself FEEL all of it at once (on every level and on every subject) he would drown in the pain.
So he kind of numbs himself and thinks and feels about pieces of it at a time.

But if he lets you back "IN"....then he HAS to face it ALL at Once.

At this early stage he's just not emotionally strong enough for that.

I strongly remember my wife wanting to hold me as I cried and my response was similar to your H's ... to say "NO' and pull away.
Its just too much to take at the beginning.

Truly, it was OK to be around her (for stretches), but I didn't want her "touching" me. Somehow that seemed to suggest some type of "intimacy" that I just didn't feel and sure as heck couldn't handle at the time.

In my head to let her comfort me, seemed to say (in its own way) that I somehow forgave her.....and I didn't know WHAT I was feeling at the time.
What I did know was that her touch and her "comfort" made it harder for me to DEAL with my confusion and emotions (not easier).

Sorry....but take heart.... it did get better.
(Just NOT right away).

2 x post. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

<small>[ October 28, 2004, 12:41 PM: Message edited by: top rope ]</small>

FL

you have expressed so well the feelings I have gone through just recently.
I wish I had some great words of wisdom to share with you but I really don't.
All I could do was grit my teeth and get through it.

I have noticed a pattern of around 10 good days followed by 3 or4 days where I just fall apart. Its an effort to just get up to cook dinner for the kids let alone to try & comfort my H.
He's still not keen on being touched at times, though I am not sure if it this is the A response or the fallout of his PTSD from the war. My DD says he still is very discomforted at times when she hugs him as well so.....???? we just get through it with the least amount of fuss as possible.

Perhaps it was a good sign that he enjoyed holding & playing with my sisters baby. She is such a beautiful little girl and when she held those chubby little arms out for Uncle Aussie I swear I almost cried when he took he into his lap and started playing with her.

I'm not sure what I'm doing right or wrong exactly at the moment, it seems better, I accept the occasional rant, the odd look of pain which he ties to hide from the world, all as well as I can. Its hard not to run to him and just hold him at these times but you don't because he doesn't like it. Is that good or bad.... I don't know.
I ask him if I can help and get much the same response like 'I don't know'.

Now with his regiment on alert status its all kind of just sitting in a puddle, not good, not too bad. I don't want to push any issue as right now its important he is firing on all four cylinders.
I admit to a feeling of bitterness and anger that he has go fight again. I just feel its so unfair. Our family has paid enough.
Its a limbo of sorts I suppose. Just drifting along telling him I'm here, and I will be when he returns no matter how long.

I've been taking St Johns Wort - had to change to different type of pill as well - not sure if it is helping but I seem less prone to crying and expecting the worse all the time. One has hope I suppose.

Sometimes I think FL all we can do is wait, let them know we're here for them for as long as it takes.
But it is so hard when you want to help and you can't!!!

top rope,

thanks for you thoughts. so it seems you are saying i should not do any touching until he specifically says he is ready?

maybe that is better advice. i was thinking i would continue to reach out to him knowing sometimes he would say no and being able to be ready and ok with that response but assuming that if he didn't say no then it would be ok/good.

maybe i should just back off and let him take the lead. in the past, he did let me know when he wanted contact between us. thanks for sharing.

aussieswife, thanks for sharing too, sometimes just knowing that how i am feeling, others have felt to helps. it is hard to want to help but not be able to but i think that can be handled by looking at it differently. it's not that we cannot help, it's that we cannot help in a specific way that we want to help. which of course means we are helping more to fullfill our own needs not theirs. know what i mean?? so the trick is to understand that you can help but you need to figure out what defines "help" for them. which, of course, is tricker when we get answers like "i don't know" but i figure that is the truth, i don't think he does know right now.

i am very sorry to hear aussie is being deployed again, you are right, it is not fair!

Hi FL,

Haven't had time to read all of your posts yet.... I'll check back in a bit and see if I can answer any of your questions!

Semper Fi,
RIF90

Hi FL,

Right after my W confessed "all" to me, she went into a severe state of depression.... in fact, she was so bad that she needed medical attention. She was diagnosed with bi-polar disorder and started AD meds and IC. Once she leveled out, be started MC with our church.

So my perspective is from a HB that had absolutely no support from my W for the first 3-6 months after her final confession. My POV is mainly what I would LIKED for her to have done.

IMHO, I think that you should firstly take care of yourself... Recognize the fact that you both are hurting, but that right now, you need to take care of yourself so you can "be there" for your H. I'm not saying that you shouldn't address your feelings or sadness, just try not to let it consume you... You have a goal now. That goal is to rebuild your M... never lose sight of this goal.

As for the affection, I would have LOVED it if my W had been affectionate with me... Once she leveled off with her meds, she still wasn't very affectionate. As we started MC, and I was able to start dealing with all of the pain and hurt. I became really angry with her for her lack of affection and her lack of "caring" about my hurt and pain. Her attitude was "can't we just move on"...

Please, Please, do NOT minimize his pain. I know that you are very sensitive to his pain right now because it is so "fresh"... but as you continue rebuilding, there will come a point where your H will most likely still have many questions, and you will be sick and tired of hearing the same questions over and over... Recognize that you will get to this point and try not to fall into the "let's just move on" trap.

MC will help keep both of you focused and keep you from making many "common" mistakes. I'm glad that your H is going to meet with your IC. Perhaps you could ask your IC if he/she could recommend a good pro-marriage MC for you and your H...

Lastly, cover your H with your prayers... Several others have recommended books so I will too... Get a copy of The Power of a Praying Wife by Stormie O'Martin. When you are up to reading again, get this book. Pray for your H constantly. Pray that God would protect his heart and comfort him as he deals with this pain... Oh, a good book for your H is Torn Asunder by Dave Carder. This book is a bit 'harder' on WS but for me as a BH, this book seemed to address my true feelings better than Surviving an Affair...

You have taken the "hardest" step on the road to rebuilding your M. You and your H still have a long way to go and you will both hit many "bumps" along the way... Take everything day by day and try not to focus on the past. This will be hard for you, especially when your H starts questioning you... but you can do this... and you CAN have the marriage that God inteneded for you and your H.

If your H would like to e-mail me, I'd be glad to offer him any help that I can.... my e-mail is rif902000@yahoo.com

Semper Fi,
RIF90

<small>[ October 29, 2004, 10:33 AM: Message edited by: Rebuilding in Faith 90 ]</small>

thanks to those that have replied. i will read again some other time when my brain is able to focus.

we had a really bad night. I guess i should of known it was coming, H is not good at immediate reactions, he takes his time to process first.

prayers appreciated for God to guide me and comfort my H.