LM:

You have advocated that is suicidal to stay married following an affair. You have given strong opinions that IMHO are hard to refute.

I am choosing the marriage, but when I read your words I nod in agreement because I thought about all the things you mentioned.

Briefly let me tell you why I stay married:

1. WW wants the marriage; perhaps even more than I do.

2. OM was dumped on D-day

3. OM is no competition

4. Five children (4 adults, one kid) who know nothing about the affair. I don’t want to destroy their lives by leaving the marriage.

5. 29 years of fidelity by WW

6. WW wants to make the marriage work even if she is still in some withdrawal.

7. WW and most other WWs are not bad people------ they simply tend to have some low self-esteem------ you know the story---- is always the same.

8. At age 54 (next week) I don’t want to go thru a divorce and then spend a couple of years dating women in my age group. Not a pleasant adventure unless I go for a young woman------- and that could be trouble in the future. I like my wife and I am not likely to find a woman like her just like that.

9. Don’t want to split my state in half plus messing up my retirement plan. I don’t want to pay alimony so WW can live with OM in luxury. The last thing I want is OM living the good life with my money.


10. I don't want my WW to get together with OM in the event of a divorce. I know this would end up badly for her and I would hate to see her suffer. In the long run OM would be her worst punishment. I don't want her to go thru that!

11. And lastly the most important reason: I REALLY LOVE MY WIFE!


Let me ask you a question:

After D-day I rediscovered my love for my wife and developed a severe case of sperm competition syndrome. Did you experience anything like that? Or perhaps you were already detached from your wife?

BTW, if WW falls again I am a goner. I can only forgive this sort of thing once in a lifetime.

<small>[ November 01, 2004, 09:41 AM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

I am not Lemmonman but had to stick my nose in here anyway (hope you don't mind)

VERY WELL SAID Stanley!!!!

I like the way your mind works. And of all the things you listed, in the words of our Lord -

The greatest of these is love

<small>[ November 01, 2004, 09:24 AM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Stanley568:
<strong> LM:

You have advocated that is suicidal to stay married following an affair. You have given strong opinions that IMHO are hard to refute.

. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hey Stanley,

You know, I really like LemonMan but let me assure you he does not know what he is talking about when he says that it is "suicidal" to stay in a marriage following an affair. He speaks from a clear lack of experience.

I have seen way too many cases, including my own, that have clearly had the opposite result. What is often more tragic is divorce. Many people can and do successfully recover from adultery with better marriages than they had before. I have been on this forum for years and have seen numerous such examples [including myself] so I know its true.

I am interested in Lemonman's POV. We are better than we were before the A, a more mature marriage.

I have to agree with all the above. I love my FWS more than ever because he has done all the right things since the A, which was a huge wake up call for all of us. Everyone deserves a second chance.

<small>[ November 01, 2004, 10:41 AM: Message edited by: new jersey ]</small>

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Stanley568:
[QB] LM:

You have advocated that is suicidal to stay married following an affair. You have given strong opinions that IMHO are hard to refute.

Stan:

I think you have misquoted me. I have NEVER said that it is suicidal to stay in a marriage after an affair. Ofcourse I believe that recovery is possible...HOWEVER, what I have been saying is that to stay in a marriage in which the WS continues to see the OP, continues to lie, cheat, produce financial ruin, in the "hopes" that they will see the "light" by some charading and "PLAN" is quite ridiculous. Yes, people make misatkes (even infidelity), but the CONTINUED cheating despite a D-Day is IMO unforgiveable and hence where I have a problem with those plans on here. I think too many people come here and think that marital recover is the norm after an affair, and I THINK IT IS CLEARLY NOT. I myslef gave my wife a chance after her infidelity and yest she DID IT AGAIN, and lied, and destroyed a family doing this. I cannot and will not advocate trying to PLAN A -(aka doormat oneself) CONTINUALLY in the hopes that this will "lure" the WS back and have them come back to the marriage--and usually a marriage that is not and was not ever that great.

MELODY: Congratulations on your marriage RECOVERY. I am happy for you.

Thanks for the clarification, LM. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

LM:

I agree with your comments and my wife would also be in agreement. My WW knee jerk response was to dump OM even after I told her I was filing for divorce. But, to be honest, my wife is so unique that I would be shooting myself in the foot by leaving her. In my case divorce would clearly be worse.

The issue of withdrawal is very real and perhaps even stronger than when two unattached people break off a relationship. The addiction affected my wife who does not have an addictive personality. However, in the midst of all she was clear she wanted to stay married and broke it off with OM.

Was there a temptation to get it on with OM again? Sure, remember this is like being addicted to drugs. These relationships do not seem to have the normal relaxed mode in which unattached people date. This is all about forbidden short moments and somehow they become very precious. I have to accept all of this (whether it is crap or not) to rationalize how in the world my wife would pay any attention to her OM. In the real world--------------- if she was unattached I seriously doubt she would date this guy. But, within the framework of the affair everything is different--- any person with the right verbal skills will do.

When the WS decide to keep up the affair despite D-day it simply means they are HIGHLY addicted or that the OP is better than the BS.

Why not give someone who is highly addicted a chance? After all addicts will sell their brothers, sisters, and parents if they have to------- so they can have their fix.

<small>[ November 01, 2004, 01:02 PM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

Lemonman,


I agree entirely with your quote


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, people make misatkes (even infidelity), but the CONTINUED cheating despite a D-Day is IMO unforgiveable and hence where I have a problem with those plans on here. I think too many people come here and think that marital recover is the norm after an affair, and I THINK IT IS CLEARLY NOT. I myslef gave my wife a chance after her infidelity and yest she DID IT AGAIN, and lied, and destroyed a family doing this. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But I believe one very important factor is ,did the WS display characteristics that were NOT present before the A. In other words was this an aberration of the WS's character makeup, or was it just part of a predictable character flaw( especially a deep sense of entitlement). In my case I was not able to focus on , WHAT WILL I HAVE IF MY WW DOES RETURN?. Unless there is an epiphany, just more of the same with the accumulated old and new history. Noodle said it best when she said love has nothing to do with it. It is up to the BS to decide if they are willing to abandon enough boundaries and put in the herculean effort to permit this deeply flawed WS and M to continue