Please all of you, please reconsider. I am so sorry you are all so disheartened by yesterday's events. EVERYBODY HURTS on this board. There are many different ways to say things, and ways that don't wound are the best but Noodle has explained her thought process when posting and apologized to Dreamcatcher, did you see?

I know it was the supportive responses to what was most likely an ill thought out post that added insult to injury but can you cut the others some slack? I know that they didn't cut any slack to the WS in general but please remember, every opportunity we take as a board (BS AND WS!) to be gracious and forgiving towards those who offend us, is yet another step towards recovery in our own marriages and lives. Being here is a big part of the process for so many but you have decided to go, you don't feel safe or welcome here anymore. I am SO sorry! I'd hate to see any of you go, truly.
As for me, I didn't take Noodle's post personally any more than my BH triggered over Bob Pure's excellent thread on the BS's agony. I would love to see you all get to the point where you can say the same. There will always be something upsetting or offensive on any forum, and in fact you or I might be the ones to accidentally say it ourselves! From one former wayward to others, PLEASE reconsider Sadfww, Sleepless, Dreamcatcher and Weaver. I would miss you all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> KB

Oh Jen, not you too!! Oh dear. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I am mostly interested in posting and reading what FWWs have to say. I hope all of them stay------ they give me so much valuable info and understanding.

STAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I realize that it hit close to home, however I do not think it was intended as to be offensive to you. WE all learn alot from one another from this place, if you leave what do we have left? A one sided depressing place to be. Come on you guys we have all been hit by a 2x4 or heard things we did not like, but we did not run, that is what makes this place so great.

I am sorry that you feel you need to leave, I just do not see where you found that need from.

Please reconsider and stick around. ALl you talk about SYMC- I just do not feel comfortable over there yet.. I have found all your advise helpful and encourageing.

Thank you Knewbetter, for caring. I'm going to take a little break from MB as I have needed to for awhile. I'm sorry for my outburst and display of emotion.

Don't see YOU posting much girl! That's a shame.

weaver

weaver, just in case you missed it, I left you a post on the thread about a forum for just WS's.

God bless.

Also I will put my vote in here. Please Stay. These forums need you. If GQII is not comfortable for a while, what about the R forum?
Please stay!

Personally, I Prefer to have ALL the differing points of view voiced here.

It has helped me gain valuable insight into my W's actions, as well as thought process.

Its helped me to see her perspective better (as I now KNOW what she's done/thought/felt is NOT unique to HER alone).

WE Need the contributions of our WS's. (And they need us as well).
It's what makes this place WORK ...as opposed to becoming a mutual pity party / bi*ch fest.

To all considering leaving:
Please take a day or 2 or a week and let the emotions calm down.
Hopefully after some reflection you'll decide its BETTER for All concerned for you to stick around and participate (not just lurk).

To any of the new ones- Just keep in mind that these ARE very volatile subjects and there is much pain out there. NOT everyone can recognize when and to whom, certain ways of communicating are appropriate or effective.

Don't let a few comments or even what you may consider a bad or Hurtful thread deprive you of the mostly wonderful gifts of this place.

Unfortunately, these "firefights" break out from time to time. Then they calm down and things get back to normal. Sorry for any that got caught in the cross fire.

IMO most of it came down to people just not "getting" the others point of view.
Sadly with this type of medium....its going to happen.

Bottom line is stay......we are all stronger with you than without you.

I wasn't sure wish thread to post my thoughts, as there are several dealing with the same issue: where FWW should post.

We could write that OM meant nothing to us, we got over him instantly, no tears...And many have to let on that we DON'T still care in order not to get judged and ridiculed.(sp)

It is hard for the BS here at MB to hear us say that we also couldn't eat or sleep and cried for months missing the attention from the OP; many times an emotional attachment was extreme...we thought of them as our really good friend and then they are GONE and we feel an emptiness that is hard (impossible at first) for our H to fill.

In case you missed what Melody Lane posted to me yesterday in "Private Forum for WS's? I am going to paste it in the next post.

Rachel

This is my 18th post.

MELODY LANE has posted 6,542 times.

Yesterday I wrote from my heart the following:

"I need a place where others will understand the pain not only of the BS but our pain of missing the addiction of the OM and the affair!"


MelodyLane
Member
Member # 9787

posted November 02, 2004 09:11 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Make, if you want to talk about things like missing the OM and the affair, etc, you might try gloryb.com. You won't get alot of support for such destructive talk around here. This is a marriage building forum, not a romanticize the sleazy affair forum.

As far as Bob's reference to humping, my hat is off to him for being so mild. He is more reserved than I, for sure. I usually refer to two affairees getting it on as 2 pigs rutting in the pig pen. I just can't think of a more respectful way to describe sleazy, illicit sex. What's disrespectful is the ACT and it deserves no respectful language in description.

So, I wish you the best in finding the kind of forum where you can get that kind of support and thank God it is not this forum."

***********************************************
MB friends: PLEASE TELL ME HOW ML REPLY CAN HELP ME OR ANY FWW IN ANY WAY? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Very sincerely, Rachel

<small>[ November 03, 2004, 07:31 AM: Message edited by: MakeYourOwnSunshine ]</small>

Rachel, please tell me how it is helpful to anyone, especially yourself, to come here and romanticize a sleazy affair with comments like:

"I need a place where others will understand the pain not only of the BS but our pain of missing the addiction of the OM and the affair!"

and

"Any of us that really had sincere feelings for the OM, did not look at the intimate time with him as 'HUMPING'."

How does that help your marriage exactly to romanticize an affair?

Your demand that BS's be silenced into treating your illicit sex with "more respect" is completely inappropriate. No one here is required to afford respect to such an act.

Rachel, you can help your marriage by ceasing with the romantization of your affair. As I said before, this is a forum that supports marriages, not one where you freely continue to destroy it by engaging in romanticization. Anyone that encourages your fantasy is doing you no favors.

Now, this is a free country, so to speak, and you can romanticize all you wish. But I can object all I want. And so can others. You can probably expect numerous challenges and likely won't be successful in shutting up folks who don't agree with your characterization.

Just because Rachel says that she wants a place to put her feelings or thoughs about the affair or OM, does not mean she is is being romantic about it. It is true that there is pain at the beginning of the breakup of an affair, not because it was something beautiful and worth it, but because it was part of us for a while. Anything that you cut abruptly you will miss.
Some people here like to voice the truth of their thoughts and others dont! Some others try to silence what they are feeling or thinking and post otherwise.
I think that the secret for truly recovering from an affair its to admit what you are feeling all the time, wheher is right or wrong!
No one should be critize so harshly because they are saying what they truly feel.

MYRTA-WW-DD-6-1-04

sorry about the name mix up!!!

This post is for MELODY LANE, about RACHEL!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

<small>[ November 03, 2004, 08:29 AM: Message edited by: Myrta ]</small>

Pssst Myrta,

I think you got those names backwards. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Myrta,
When an alcoholic is in recovery, they don't recover by pining and fantasizing over the last gin and tonic, they recover by focusing on life without it.

They recover by focusing on the truth, rather than delusions: that alcohol is destructive and ruinous to everything good in life.

And it is the same with affairs. They are one of the most destructive, poisonous forces known to mankind and to pretend like they are "lovely" is the sickest kind of rationalization that should not go unchallenged.

What she is doing is romanticizing her affair when she goes on about how wonderful it was. And she is perfectly free to do it all day long on this forum. No one is stopping her.

But she can't stop others from challenging her when she does. Nor can she shut up others who point out the truth about affairs or use corresponding language to describe a putrid, disrespectful act.

She just wants to do it unchallenged and censor the remarks of others. In other words, she wants to do to others what she complains is being done to her. She wants to shut up people like me and Bob Pure from characterizing illicit adulterous sex as what it is: sleazy.

Accommodating her glowing mischaracterization of adulterous sex is not supportive of anyone. That is simply not a supportive action to accommodate the fantasies of anyone.

Even so, she is free to post about the wonders of her sleazy affair all day long. No one is stopping her. Just as she cannot stop others from challenging her.

<small>[ November 03, 2004, 08:30 AM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

MelodyLane-The fact is that when you are in the affair, you really think its beautiful and perfect and lovely. Maybe Rachel is stil in the fog and she still cannot see this. Time will tell her how horrible it was to have the affair.
I too, wanted to see only beautiful things in the affair. But now I see how WRONG I was. But right now, I am completely clear in my thoughts.
She is obviously still not there yet.
I dont think what anyone says really influences how you are going to feel.
I think that these are feelings and emotions that have to run on their own, until your mind clears. And it will clear, sooner or later it will.!!
Myrta

The truth is that WWs consider the OM as the soul mate and often place him in a pedestal. Quite often the OM becomes their mentor and most important person in the world with dozens of communications a day.

As a BH I have no problem accepting this. However, once out of the affair the WWs that reconcile with the H admit OM was mediocre. Maybe this is a mechanism of defense to accept the dismissal of OM---- who knows? The WWs that leave the marriage perhaps always think of OM as the soul mate. Or perhaps OM is a better man than the BH. However, any man who chooses to be an OM is not the real deal IMHO.

In any event I would love to hear what WWs really have to say about the OM and why they glorified these men. I think this is a very important point of view and I want to hear it.

I could care less about my wife’s OM and in fact I advised her to go live with OM on D-day. However, my wife rejected the idea instantly.

<small>[ November 03, 2004, 08:44 AM: Message edited by: Stanley568 ]</small>

Myrta, I don't think you help someone by accommodating their fog, you help them by telling the truth. Affairees are helped by being exposed to the TRUTH, not silence.

I would also add that BS' here are not required to accommodate those fantasies by policing their language. Rachel objected to Bob Pure's use of the word "humping" to describe illicit sex because it hurt her tender sensibilities. She would have preferred more "respectful" language to describe her illicit, adulterous sex.

I am sorry, but no one here, is required to dress up that pig for anyone. We don't have to alter our language to protect the fantasies of anyone.

Melody, most of the BS’s posting here is understanding and tolerant of the feelings and inner struggles of a WS, BUT then there is usually one or two ‘rotten apples’ between all these good and caring people with nasty, snotty and insensitive remarks who scared of WS’s from this board and make it an unsafe place for them to post thier feelings honestly. If these insensitive and nasty remarks is coming from a BS who is still very early recovery and new to this board, but you are suppose to know better and suppose to have developed some sensitivity, emphaty and understanding for FAITHFULL WS's who are still in withdrawal.... This is unacceptable behavior from a BS like you who view yourself as a ‘veteran’ of this board with thousands and thousands of posts. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Withdrawal from the OP and A is very hard, intense and painful for most WS’s. BS’s know this but most of them don’t want to hear about this. The residual feelings a WS often have for an OP after an A IS very real and the grief IS very painful... Yes, certainly the WS ‘deserve’ the pain because of their own wrong choices and actions, but the pain ‘deserved’ is REAL and EXISTS..it can't be denied by the BS, WS or anyone else! But still...many BS’s like you can't tolerate this and expect the WS to keep ‘silent’ about their feelings of withdrawal and thier inner struggles to get rid of those residual feelings... I have struggled through these residual feelings myself and I think any other FWS will agree with me that it would have been much easier if those feelings could just disappear with the press of a button. Hell, how much easier recovery would be then! But unfortunately it doesn’t work that way! Even if a FWS focus on the M and S and try to rebuild the M, the residual feelings for the OP still exists for some time, but often it is expected from a FWS to ‘sweep this feelings under the rug’ and not talk about it... Even if the WS don't talk about it and keep silent about it, the feelings is STILL there... Tell me, how on earth can a FWS recover and work through these feelings if they are not allowed to talk about it and get it out? Those feelings will not just dissapear in the sky...especially not if the WS is not allowed to talk about it, get it out and work it through. And certainly withdrawal and residual feelings for the OP is not about romanticizing the A. Give me a break! Repentant and remorsefull FORMER WS's also feels guilty about those residual feelings. Aren't you suppose to know this by now? Get real!

MelodyLane,

You said -

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> When an alcoholic is in recovery, they don't recover by pining and fantasizing over the last gin and tonic, they recover by focusing on life without it.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My father was an alcoholic. He tried to recover. He tried to focus his life without the alcohol. Did he MISS it? YES!!!! Did he wish he could just take a drink when something bad happened to him? YES!!!!! This does NOT mean that he wanted to go back to that lifestyle or that he condoned it or that he thought alcohol was "good", it meant that he MISSED it. He missed the way that it made him feel at the time that he needed it. He knew that alcohol wasn't the proper way to "escape" his problems, that he needed to face them head on, but it didn't stop the feelings of withdrawal.

It's the same way for a WS. Don't you see what Rachel said? She said -

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I need a place where others will understand the pain not only of the BS but our pain of missing the addiction of the OM and the affair!"
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She recognizes the A as an ADDICTION. How on earth is she romanticizing it? She is human & has real feelings of withdrawal & feels the need to voice what her feelings are & get some support from someone who's been there & can give her the encouragement to continue NC.

All I can say is that I'm very glad my H has never posted here. I myself have felt pushed out of the crowd b/c of my views on things & have felt very unwelcomed on more than one occasion. And I am a FBS. I have limited myself to lurking now with all the anymosity I sense lately, except from the true MB friends I have acquired who will be with me forever.

MELODYLANE--The truth will be upon her sooner or later!!!
I agree with you, Bob PUre can say whatever he wants to refer to the OM. They are pigs! ANybody that goes out with a married person, is not a good person!!
But I am sure Rachel will see it. I think sometimes, people like to go against the current, just because, they want to be scandalous. Maybe Rachel, feels the same as Bob and you about the OM. Only she knows how she truly feels.
OMs are not good people. Even when I was in the fog and told my husband he was a good person, I knew in my heart he was not!!!

Myrta