FM

For as long as I've been reading on here, yes you have done all that you can. Time to let her go fight her demons elsewhere, and time for you to restore peace and harmony in your childrends and your life. There comes a time when we must be tough, now is the time that love must be tough.

Bless your heart, FM!!


What is going on with your daughter?

dbl

<small>[ November 13, 2004, 12:34 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by weaver:
<strong> FM

For as long as I've been reading on here, yes you have done all that you can. Time to let her go fight her demons elsewhere, and time for you to restore peace and harmony in your childrends and your life. There comes a time when we must be tough, now is the time that love must be tough.

Bless your heart, FM!!


What is going on with your daughter? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I feel so crushed about my D. My attentions should have been on my D not my WW!!!!!
My D felt unloved by ME, like all my attention was on my WW, my D even told me this the 2nd time my W left.

D: Daddy you shouldn't let her come back
ME: Do you realize what you're saying?
D: Yes daddy, she's just going to keep hurting you and hurting you. I think you shouldn't take her back anymore!!
ME: This is your mother you're talking about....
D: I know daddy I lover her but she's just going to keep hurting you...

See I should have had my attention on my D, I was WEAK, I thought I needed their mother...I DID NOT!
I am learning now, really I am. If I had the strength to do this earlier maybe my D would be home and maybe my W would have already ended this nonsense. I prolonged it by not being FIRM enough and being willing to let my W go and be with OM if she wanted to. I know my role now, I really do.

My D was in a group home, and would have been coming home for the weekends but when they took her to school they left her unattended and she fled. No one knows where my D is now. We have yet another police report filed, now I have a S who's lonesome, a W who chooses OM and flees as well and ontop of it all...
a D who is a runaway/delinquint...

its all up to me ...

scratch that, WHAT am I saying....
It's all up to GOD and my ability to do what I need to do....

I know people shy away from my threads because they are catastrophic and I don't blame them.

Thanks for responding Weaver.

<small>[ November 13, 2004, 12:36 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks friend, its the weekend and you know how slow it gets on weekends. Thanks for listening and the validation.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OK....Selfish moment...You don't know how much these words just meant to me. Validation, right?

Your wife: Somewhere beneath it all, is that woman you fell in love with and had a good marriage with and two beautiful kids. She's there. Somewhere. She's dealing with NOT only her A, but a large, unsurmountable dose of depression. And she hasn't done a dang thing about it. Not your control, right? She's making the choices about herself.

You: you have done what you could, right? You have been there. You've spoken your feelings, plan'd A, been there for her to lean on, right? It's real tough admitting that one can actually lean on there spouse for help and support, if they want it. (I've finally woken up to this. Brown isn't some fragile, brittle piece of dog dung (that I've been treating her like) that has been exposed to sub-zero temperatures for quite awhile that will just disintegrate in one's hands.) She's a strong woman. You are a strong man. You have been there for her to lean on and she just hasn't accepted the call.

The truth: how so very, very true: "The truth shall set you free." She hasn't even gotten past this part.

Validation and a safe environment; security. You have provided this for her; she's turning her back. (And no; it's not over--that would be your choice. But she has made her own choice(s) in this.)

If this is her choice, I will be more than selfish and you can guide me how to provide these crucial elements to provide brown the same as you have provided for your wife.

Prayers and hugs, friend.

Oh good Lord FM. I didn't know she was on the run and missing. I'm praying for her!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> [QUOTE]

If this is her choice, I will be more than selfish and you can guide me how to provide these crucial elements to provide brown the same as you have provided for your wife.

Prayers and hugs, friend. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I appreciate your entire post LINY but I'd like to help you brother so let me at least try.

OWNERSHIP! I made a conscious decision that I was responsible for my family and I took ownership of all that transpires within these doors. So my choice to extend my W these courtesies of my undullible support was all apart of that responsiblity to my household. It was/is my obligation, but once she chose not to free herself from OM than she dissolves my OWNERSHIP from this point forward as it pertains to her as my W. She will not be welcomed into this HOME, this FAMILY anymore until she has made that FIRM CHOICE and ACTED in a way that demonstates that committment...WHY? because I have a committment to my SON to provide a safe, peaceful environment, I have a committment to my Daughter to preserve this family structure even if my W does not choose to be apart of it. I still lay claim to ownership of my HOUSEHOLD and all that reside in it. My W chooses not to reside in it, so my W is not here anymore but if my W stays here I MUST under penalty of my own INTEGRITY, CHARACTER, SOUL I must protect, secure, love, care for and most of all RESPECT my W....I repeat it wasn't until she made it clear she has not chosen to end her R with OM that I felt justified in removing her from this HOME because her actions are wreaking HAVOC, DISCORD, INSANITY, TENSION, IMBALANCE on this household and I will protect whats left of my HOUSEHOLD even from its MOTHER, WIFE and QUEEN.

Not because I am all powerful or some tough guy but because that is my JOB, DUTY and RESPONSIBILITY.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">its all up to me ...

scratch that, WHAT am I saying....
It's all up to GOD and my ability to do what I need to do....</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I didn't know your D took off again. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I just showed brown my post to you, with tears ever so slowly inching there way down my cheek. She said, "And that's what I worry about alot: what the kids have seen and how they will act on all of this."

And that just kills me.

FM, you said it awhile back: she has her mom as a female role model. And she's obviously a good observer. BUt one, day, one day when your DD gets past all of this, she will find a terrific husband--you are her male role model.

It all breaks down to what is in your control, I suppose. You can only do what's in your power; leave the rest for Him.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know people shy away from my threads because they are catastrophic and I don't blame them.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maybe that's why I was so gravitated to you when we both started posting some 4 months ago: subconciously (brought to the concious), I knew I was creating my own catastrophic results.

But it's all in the choices.

2ble

<small>[ November 13, 2004, 12:53 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I repeat it wasn't until she made it clear she has not chosen to end her R with OM that I felt justified in removing her from this HOME...</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">YOU did not remove her; it was her choice.

It was your choice to give her enough room and love and compassion et al to make that decision by her own free will with you.

Don't start beating yourself up again--read too many of your posts to know when that will begin and the above is the first sign of when that will begin; let me do the beating of onesself; I deserve it--you don't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by weaver:
<strong> Oh good Lord FM. I didn't know she was on the run and missing. I'm praying for her!!!! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">YUP...

It wasn't always like this but during my M separation my D was with her M. My D saw her mother with OM often. My W did not hid her R with OM to her D or her S. My W turned this family upside down for OM, my W lost everything, job, car, home, band accounts I do mean everything...

What is my D doing?

The exact same thing seeking love from guys while throwing away everything that matters in her life disintergrates, school, family bonds, home, everything.

My D also witnesses my mother running away from home during our reconciliation. My W has fled at least 4 times during the last 2 years...

What has my D learned?

To runaway when things are difficult, to flee responsiblities regardless to who she hurts in the process.

My W doesn't see the correlation between her actions and the effects on her children. This is a very sad fact, I attribute many of the problems with my D to be a indirect reaction to her mothers actions and the way to fix it is not to RUN AWAY AGAIN, but to RECOMMITT and be an ADULT.

My W has chosen that her need to keep her foot in OM's door is worth more than all of us, H, S, D and Family. I am not preaching, this is my life but I know GOD will see us through one way or another.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I repeat it wasn't until she made it clear she has not chosen to end her R with OM that I felt justified in removing her from this HOME...</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">YOU did not remove her; it was her choice.

It was your choice to give her enough room and love and compassion et al to make that decision by her own free will with you.

Don't start beating yourself up again--read too many of your posts to know when that will begin and the above is the first sign of when that will begin; let me do the beating of onesself; I deserve it--you don't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your absolutely right friend.
She made her own decision. I merely defined a boundary. Thanks for reminding me.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ November 13, 2004, 01:06 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

I hope and will work on, that one day I will have the strength and conviction you have; I know I'm in here somewhere.

I need to go now. I'll check in with ya later.

Head up, brother.

(I know it's cold out here on the right coast today, but, get out in front of the 'puter and take that son of yours to toss the pigskin, or something. Just hold and love that boy of yours. He needs it. You need it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong>

I just showed brown my post to you, with tears ever so slowly inching there way down my cheek. She said, "And that's what I worry about alot: what the kids have seen and how they will act on all of this."
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hey you and Brown need to realize that your children witnessing these hardships in your M is not the damaging part. NO!!!!!!!!!!!
The damage comes in when we don't handle these hardships in a healthy way.
Your children are becoming educated, yes M is hard work, yes mom and dad are not perfect...

The part we need to focus on as parents is how you deal with the mistakes.

Dad gambled, mom and dad fought and mom and dad divorced is a sad story...

but

Dad gambled, mom and dad fought, mom and dad sought help, dad gave up gambling,
mom and dad are still together loving each other to this day is a triumphant story...

Which one will your children tell their children????

<small>[ November 13, 2004, 01:11 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

I started a thread to get some help for you regarding your DD. My gosh she is only 13 years old and on her own. My stomach is in knots!

I too had a rough childhood, loved my parents but they were both addicts. I was a drug addict at 13 and a runaway. Ended up being put in juvey for awhile and then a foster home for a year. I LOVED my parents but boy did we have a strange family and very complicated. Always had so many other people in the house besides our family, I think I often got lost in the crowd.

I am praying for safety for your daughter and that you be reunited quickly.

Patience:

This is my biggest hurdle, always has been, but I am hoping to change it starting now. I've never been a good furniture assembler....hahhahah. My dining room table was replaced by the retailer, of course it was dropped off dis-assembled. After todays stress and upheaval can you imagine a W leaving her S and H for the 4th time in the last 6 months and each time she returned she proclaimed..."I am here to stay!!!!!"

Anyway, so I'm cleaning up the house and I look over at these boxes of furniture parts and I'm thinking "It would be nice to have this assembled, polished and set for Sunday dinner with my S!" There was only one problem like I stated earlier, I'm not very patient and usually I'd get frustrated and chuck the directions, now in some instances doing it your way is just fine, but not with highly detailed machine crafted parts, they only fit one way and one way only. I felt today was going to be different, and it you know what? It was!

I took my table and allowed myself to enjoy the process. I did not rush the steps instead after each step was complete I patted myself on the back instead, until finally all the steps were done and my Luxorious Dining Room Table was complete. Not a scratch, not a blemish, it is perfect. Of course I called my S out to show him. We had missed our table it was the centerpiece of our dining room. This is the place we have Sunday dinners, I lead the family in prayer from this table, we enjoy holiday meals at this table and we also do routine things like pay bills, homework, and read the paper from this table. It's awfully nice having our table back and I'm going to try practising the art of patience in more areas of my life besides furniture assembly, but I have a feeling being patient regarding my W's abduction will be more difficult to overcome.

I noticed my S hasn't asked even once where his mommy is?!?!?!?

And that is the saddest part. My S is so used to being abandoned by her that he isn't even surprised anymore, its a usual occurrence and so is the fact that I'm still here. Yes, it's best that she leave if she cannot dedicate herself to us and tell OM she is through with him. It is also best for me to decide if I want her to return at all. I noticed she didn't leave the house keys AGAIN THIS TIME!! No problem, the locks will be changed Monday. I may be learning patience, but I'm also learning some other things as well, BOUNDARIES.

Thanks for listening, Ive gotta run my S is excited about it being dark and the MEN get to go to the trash dumpster. YAY!! Time for the MEN to haul out the boxes and cartons from the new table.

We are MEN...and he pounds his imagination aka chests... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> .hahah

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
<strong> ...your children witnessing these hardships in your M is not the damaging part. NO!!!!!!!!!!!
The damage comes in when we don't handle these hardships in a healthy way.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm sooooo with you on this one.

Life is not easy. Life is not fair. But that's life and what we call our 'life' depends entirely on how we perceive, interpret, and deal with the curve balls life throws us.

As for the 'manly accomplishment' part of this thread... viva la MAN!!!! Today I tackled a rat's nest of wiring in a house I'm renovating and somehow (divine intervention) no one got electro-fried, there were no explosions and get this... everything worked properly the FIRST TIME!!!!

Whooooo-hoooooo!!!!

dewt

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by dewt:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by FamilyMatters:
<strong> ...your children witnessing these hardships in your M is not the damaging part. NO!!!!!!!!!!!
The damage comes in when we don't handle these hardships in a healthy way.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm sooooo with you on this one.

Life is not easy. Life is not fair. But that's life and what we call our 'life' depends entirely on how we perceive, interpret, and deal with the curve balls life throws us.

As for the 'manly accomplishment' part of this thread... viva la MAN!!!! Today I tackled a rat's nest of wiring in a house I'm renovating and somehow (divine intervention) no one got electro-fried, there were no explosions and get this... everything worked properly the FIRST TIME!!!!

Whooooo-hoooooo!!!!

dewt </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Way to go you manly man!
Pass me Ale to go along with this Mullet <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

FM...somehow I'm a very impatient person...but only use patience when it is convenient for just me. I'm changing that, now. I hate waiting!!! (Nothing, of course, to do with my impulsive behaviour, AND being a man on top of that!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The part we need to focus on as parents is how you deal with the mistakes.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know you were referring to the children, but how I deal with the place where I have put my family in will also define me as a person.

OK, since we are chatting about manly stuff...
Finally finished staining. (Long story short--I promise <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ): Before we moved in here, kids had broken in and vandalized some of the doors--painted & magic marker. Tried *everything* to get it off. Finally had to sand them last week. And...finally stained all of the doors!! And dewt--one thing I will not touch is wiring. I will even attempt anything else, not electricity though! So, kudos to you! FM--I absolutely love assemblying furniture. If ya need any help in the future...

PS dewt, good to "see" you again.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LINY:
<strong> FM...somehow I'm a very impatient person...but only use patience when it is convenient for just me. I'm changing that, now. I hate waiting!!! (Nothing, of course, to do with my impulsive behaviour, AND being a man on top of that!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The part we need to focus on as parents is how you deal with the mistakes.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know you were referring to the children, but how I deal with the place where I have put my family in will also define me as a person.

OK, since we are chatting about manly stuff...
Finally finished staining. (Long story short--I promise <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ): Before we moved in here, kids had broken in and vandalized some of the doors--painted & magic marker. Tried *everything* to get it off. Finally had to sand them last week. And...finally stained all of the doors!! And dewt--one thing I will not touch is wiring. I will even attempt anything else, not electricity though! So, kudos to you! FM--I absolutely love assemblying furniture. If ya need any help in the future...

PS dewt, good to "see" you again. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Today was food gathering..(grocerry shopping)
FYI. My son lived with me for over 2 years so he is very used to being with his dad. My S is very emotional all of a sudden and I'm doing my best to compensate for the pain he feels due to his mommy leaving AGAIN.

Oh, btw I had the locks changed as well!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
This is the 4th time my W has left, but this is the 1st time I've had the locks changed. This time it's different. This time it's personal. This time I know its because she's still seeing her friend. This time she will feel the consequences of her actions and I'm not talking just her own personal guilt either. A W and Mom who contiually abandons her family to maintain a R with another man should face the consequences of her actions. This is not spite this is for my families protection and best interest.

Well, everytime my W does this for some reason I do sort of a sping cleaning. This time lets call our cleaning spree The Family Matters Winter Cleaning Task! Hey I've gotta get the home in shape for the holidays. I bet my W did this now just so she could spend the holidays with OM and OM's family. What a slap in the face.

Its time I get back into shape, I've gained 10-15 lbs during all of this garbage not to mention I picked up a few pounds since I've quit smoking. It' time to claim my life and funnel my energy into positive options. I'm beginning to feel empowered it almost has me thinking, Hey FM where the heck have you been buddy,..............
WELCOME BACK TO YOU!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ November 14, 2004, 02:40 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>

Update:

It looks like we're getting a divorce. My soon to be XW has already rented a room and would have filed today, but had outpatient surgery scheduled. I was upset at her actions intially, but now that I've had time to think about it, I am okay with her decision. I am disappointed that in my heart I feel she's never let OM go completely and that in itself was the downfall of our marriage. I know my marriage isn't over yet, but I do feel this time it will be. It's amazing how this last episode was speared by me demanding that she contact OM and let me hear that their R was infact OVER, she leaves that night and 4 days later she emails me that she is renting a place and she's filing for divorce; isn't that a coincedence.

Here's a copy of the email she sent:

As depressing as this situation is, it is in the best interest of everyone that each step in this transition is handled as cordially and maturely as possible. I promise not to spring any surprises on you and will not be motivated to do or not to do anything based on emotions. For the sake of both your and my sanity, I do plan to file for divorce on Wednesday and will ask for visitation/partial custody of S and D. All of this is troubling and I know this decision may be the downfall of my very existence or it may not but we cannot continue to live like this. What happened last Thursday happened for a reason - that’s the only way I can see that situation right now.

I am not seeing nor do I have any contact with anyone from the past. The more I tried to focus and be steadfast on the future of us and our family, the more the past was brought up. The more the past was brought, the worse I’d feel about myself and everything I’d caused. I keep saying and believe that what I’m going through is more INTERNAL than EXTERNAL. I’ve yet to see Dr.%#$#% but hope to next weekend.

This is such a load of crab apples!!

I brought it up? Life would be going fine, just fine and then she'd start acting depressed, down, moody, sarcastic, then she'd start coming in late, all of the sudden instead of coming home at 6:30 she'd show up at 7:30, 8:30-9:00...
What am I an idiot? If she isn't continuing her A she is at least guilty of being very insensitive or unapologetic for her actions.

I'm not going to fight this anymore, actually a small piece of me welcomes it. Imagine that? I guess the title to this thread sums it up. I'm too tired to save anyone besides my children and myself. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Thanks for listening

<small>[ November 17, 2004, 11:42 PM: Message edited by: FamilyMatters ]</small>