I had an affair 10 years ago which was atypical because my husband pretty much knew about it from the day it started until the day it ended (about 9 months). During the affair I wrote a daily journal, in the form of letters to my lover. My husband discover these and read them. We just celebrated our 20th anniversary, by going away for the weekend, he was wonderful and showered me with gifts and attention. I spend hours looking for a special gift to buy him but could find nothing fitting. I mentioned buying lingerie, but never found the time to do it. Anyway, after we got back he was quite sullen and distant. I asked what was wrong and he told me that our anniversary had brought up the affair and he questions whether I love him or whether he can love me, he said he spend hours preparing for the trip and that I apparently did nothing. He quotes the venom I spurted in the journals, stuff I wrote 10 years ago, the stuff I barely remember (I burned the journals after the affair was over) and the same stuff that is imprinted in his mind and can't forget. What do I do??? I love him very much and we have to beautiful teenage boys.

Reassure him.

Some things you never quite get over, and this is one of them. Perhaps there will always be triggers that re-evoke all this pain. Sounds like things have been pretty good for ten years -- so he's hardly been dwelling on the past.

Obviously, you have been very successful in reassuring him so far -- he's spent ten years with you since the A. He's hardly looking for reasons to leave.

Too bad it happened at a time that should have been happy -- but I often found the same thing happened to me (during our false recovery).

You hurt his feelings. You didn't get a gift for him, nor go all out like he did for you.

You hurt his feelings and triggered the old affair hurts, which may have been buried and not dealt with enough.

Start showering him with love, attention and a special aniversary gift. Show him how important and cherished, he and your marriage is.

When my feelings are hurt, I need lots of TLC, maybe he does too.

Ellen & H,

Welcome to MB. Unlike most here you are dealing with a past error in judgement. Unfortunately as a BS, those events are embedded in our minds and hearts forever. Part of your marital innocence has been lost. But your M doesn't have to be lost. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Sounds like your H wants to be recognized for his efforts. Who is the giver and who is the taker in your family?

Please review the books: His Needs/Her Needs and Giver/Taker. Both are by Dr W. Harley.

Sounds like U 2 would also benefit from some good MC work. If you are both willing, read the concept section above, take the Emotional Needs Questionnaire and setup some phone counseling with Steve Harley. Steve is quite good when talking with the guys in our lives and can offer pratical ways to help your H bring closure. They can be very bonding experiences for you and your H. Not always romantic or beautiful but learning, healthy and helpful.

The book His Needs/Her Needs was helpful for me to see how to communicate with my H. Granted at the time I read it, I was married to a WS with his head up someone else's bu++. Now he is bad to the land of the sane and no longer carries the stench of the A.

So there is hope. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Just some suggestions.
L.

I agree withh Weaver. It sounds like you neglected your husband terribly on a special day. It not only brought up memories of the A but possibly the aura of him being second best in your life before and AFTER the A.

Shower him with attention. He needs it. You BOTH deserve it.

Ellen

On our 20th wedding anniversary I gave my W an expensive diamond ring, a wonderful night out together without kids, romantic dinner, etc...
I received nothing.

One year and seven months later, DDay, I find out that my W has been in an A for the last three years.

What do you think your husband thinks?

Sorry to threadjack, brought back a painful memory. AMM hit the nail on the head. You need to reassure him. Lots of TLC. Good Luck

Hurtin'

Ellen,

I must agree with the crowd..not much effort on your part for the 20th.

k

Well, I have to offer her a degree of sympathy. My WH was never much of a gift-giver -- some people are like that -- and even with the best of intentions, sometimes it just doesn't come together. And 20th? Well, it's a big deal because culturally we make it a big deal. Because we live in a base ten numerical system. For some people, it's just an arbitrary number.

You will have some catch-up to do, however -- because obviously it was a big deal to him.

Orchid's questions about giver and taker seem apropos too. Might be something to look into.

Thanks everyone! You're right, I was being very thoughtless. Although in my defence I asked him if we should buy each other gifts and he said "no" that the trip was our gift to each other... I guess I should really know by now not to take what he says at face value. I have tried to make amends, I bought a beautiful leather photo album to put pictures from our trip into (along with personalized captions) and I spent a whole day lingerie shopping (which I really hate) and bought some really sexy stuff I know he'll like. Anyway, my question now is: The album and lingerie are Christmas presents, I'd love to wait and give them to him for Christmas, but should I give them to him now (to show how much I'm really trying). I think I can wait, but I'm looking for outside opinions. We're very civil and nice to each other, there's just an underlying tension that something's wrong.

Ellen - I'm very new to this and apologize for my previous post. But IMHO you need to reassure him now and continue to reassure him as long as he needs it or forever, whichever comes first. I know that is what I want and need, and truly believe that is what your H is looking for. Good luck.

Hurtin'

Ellen,

Why do you want to hold it ?. Think something else for Christmas <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> . Better yet, think something else every night and day ... don't hold back anything.

I suggest you print out ENQ and fill one up as if your H fillin it. This way you could guess his top 5 ENs.

-rh-

Thanks again for all of your comments, they really give me another perspective. I have one comment though, I don't understand all of the short form lingo. What's IMHO,Bh, WW etc?????

I've heard Harley on his radio show say that wedding anniversaries tend to bring up memories of the affair for the BS. I remember thinking at the time that maybe it's good that D-day was four days after our wedding anniversary.

Cherished

Ellen,

This is more complicated than you seem to realize, far more complicated. If you were to read here the common thing for a wayward spouse, WS, to think after an affair is "get over it" and they hope that their betrayed spouse, BS, will do that.

But, think about this for a moment for 9 months you conducted an affair under his nose and in his face. I don't know what your marriage was like before or after the affair, but no one deserves what you did. I am sure the scars from this affair are still in your H's heart. It sounds as if you don't appreciate what it took out of him to survive this. He can still quote "chapter and verse" of those journal entries and you are surprised. You should not be.

You say "I love him very much and we have to beautiful teenage boys." Does this sound to you something that would reassure him?? What do your sons have to do with your marriage other than they are likely the only reason he did not leave you.

Saying you love him or giving him Christmas presents early will NOT show him a darned thing. You missed an opportunity to express your love for him. You missed an opportunity to show him and tell him that you are glad he remained married to him. You missed an opportunity to assure him that he is not "second choice" or that you "stayed just for the boys." You missed an opportunity to show via ACTIONS that you cared for him and his happiness.

Do you see why this is complicated? ACTIONS mean something, words unaccompanied by actions mean little. Do you know what he fears? Do you know if he thinks about your A? Do you know if he is happy? Do you know why he went to a lot of trouble for your anniversary? Do you understand why it was not important to you? Is your focus on the marriage or the kids? You need to answer these questions and think about this carefully.

Ellen In My Humble Opinion, IMHO, you need to avoid trying to do a quick fix here, but to look for a REAL fix of this and this means putting your marriage first, yes above your children.

Do you know what would have very likely have been the perfect gift on your anniversary??? It would have been a letter expressing your feelings about him and why you love him, and want to continue to be his W.

If you would be kind enough to read the articles here as written by Dr. Harley. I think you will get some insights into the issues your H is still struggling to deal with. I would guess that he has a huge issue with self-esteem, that he is NOT your real choice, that he failed as an H, that is just needed for the money. Ellen, this anniversary event should be an eye opener for you. Your marriage is not nearly as strong as you think because you have not acknowledged and addressed that your H needs your love, respect and appreciatation. He needs it more than many H's because of what he has been through.

Please read the section on NEEDS and Love Busters. I like to point out that one of the really deadly love busters, LB's, is the disrespectful judgement, DJ. It is an assumption by one spouse concerning the other that is not based on fact. I think you have assumed that your H has "gotten over it" and that he can withstand you neglecting him in someway. Apparently that is NOT correct.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Ellen 85:
<strong> Thanks again for all of your comments, they really give me another perspective. I have one comment though, I don't understand all of the short form lingo. What's IMHO,Bh, WW etc????? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ellen,

Here is the link that explains what those acronyms mean: Acronyms definitions

BTW, please make sure you read "Just Learning's" last post to you. He has a lot of points which are worth considering.

L.

That was quite a mouthful, and quite painful to read...but most of it's true. I am trying, I even suggested marriage counciling, to which he replied that it can't change who you are. I told him that I was going to do whatever it took to save our marriage. I'm sure he'll believe it when he sees it. I am determined, we were both caught up in raising the kids and that left little time for each other. He keeps saying what great parents we are, as if that's a reason to stay together (it's a reason, just not a good one). I can tell he's in a great deal of pain, and that I caused it ... I don't know why I didn't see it until now. Anyway, thanks again to all who have posted (I'm sure I'll be back), I know what I have to do now, and I feel I'll be doing for the rest of our marriage ... and you know, that's not a bad thing!

JL's letter sounds like a great idea, Ellen. Keep coming back to us. We're here, and cheering for you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Ellen 85:
<strong> Anyway, my question now is: The album and lingerie are Christmas presents, I'd love to wait and give them to him for Christmas, but should I give them to him now (to show how much I'm really trying). I think I can wait, but I'm looking for outside opinions. We're very civil and nice to each other, there's just an underlying tension that something's wrong. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi Ellen,

I second what the others have said... but wanted to bring up an even better 'gift' that you can give your H... Find a good pro-marriage marriage counselor and start going with your H.

You never mentioned if you or your H ever dealt with the issues of WHY you had the A 10 years ago... I suspect that neither you nor your H have really dealt with the A, thus your comments of an 'underlying tension'... Believe me, I know all about that feeling... My W had multiple A's during our first three years of M and I didn't find out about many of them until 10 years later.

It's good to try and meet your H's needs, but I suspect that there is a bigger need for both of you right now, and that is to actually deal with all of the issues that caused you to stray in the first place... then you can put your A's to rest and focus on rebuilding your M...

Semper Fi,
RIF

I will ask about marriage counciling again, but I can't force him to go. We went a few times during the affair but he felt that the councilor was on my side and didn't want to go back. The affair started shortly after our second son was born. Pretty typical I guess, I felt overwhelmed and isolated being an at-home-mom (which I wanted to be), I didn't have any help (we lived quite far from any relatives)and the job I had quit had no female employees for me to make friends with. (It wasn't a job related affair, it was an old high school flame, who was also very long distant). My husband felt that since I was at home it was my place to do all the domestic chores without much help from him, I became lonely and depressed and overwhelmed. This old high school flame called out of the blue one day and started slowly to tell me all the things I wanted my husband to tell me, I let the whole thing snowball out of control. I didn't end it when I should have (when I realized that I didn't have any real feeling towards the other man). I was very hurt and angry and felt impowered for the first time in my life. I returned to my husband (emotionally, (I never physically left)) after he said he'd had enough and said he wanted a divorce. The calls continued from the OM for a few months until I realized that there was no way not to hurt him and I literally screamed at him to leave me alone and never call again ... he didn't for 5 years, then he called again twice, I again told him to never call again that he had ruined my life, he never called again. Ever since then my H and I have lived peacefully but with an underlying tension that comes from NEVER wanting to talk about the subject, he's still not great around the house, but much improved and it doesn't help that I have a very low libido. He always wants sex whereas I prefer to cuddle, I'm afraid to caress him in fear that it always will lead to sex ... anyway, that's how I ruined my marriage. Thanks for letting me vent

Ellen,

I have a question for you, but it is really a general question. Why is it that women seem to ALWAYS judge their husbands by how much house work they do, all the while wanting to stay home with the children? In all of my years this is one mystery I have never fully understood. You are by the way not unique in making this assessment. But doesn't his work count for anything? Doesn't the pay check that allowed you to remain home mean anything?

I ask this because if a male says his W is lousy at house work, cooking, etc. The women will tell him to pipe down and get to work helping. If he posts that she is not interested in sex as strong need, he is told to deal with it.

Now here things are a little different, the issue of failing to meet a sposues EMOTIONAL needs (sex is an emotional need) is taken seriously and so should you.

Now I asked you this rhetorical (sp) question for a reason. You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I even suggested marriage counciling, to which he replied that it can't change who you are. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My question is in fact the response you should give your H. An MC will NOT change you. So to go there thinking that is to guarantee failure. What they will do IF THEY ARE ANY GOOD, and many are not, is to change your PERSPECTIVE. That is precisely what the people here will try to do with you as well. We don't expect to change you, but rather change your perspective, hence my question about how you evaluate your H.

You AND YOUR H need to appreciate that your perspectives on this marriage and what it takes for a good one requires a change of perspective NOT a change of a person.

Sexual needs are emotional needs just as your need for domestic support or finacial support. If you start to see this you will see sex in an entirely different way...you will gain a new perspective.

I still think you need to write him a letter. You let him down big time and what you may not realize is that he may have been making his last attempt to change this marriage. He may not have but I guess this was closer to a last attempt than you think. It is time for you to step up. I would strongly suggest two books: His Needs Her Needs by Harley and Surviving an Affair also by Harley. Get them and read them. Perhaps he will see you reading this books and have a look at them, but the main thing is for you to see this from a different perspective.

I doubt he would have married you if he felt you needed to change. You need to remember that.

God Bless,

JL

<small>[ November 28, 2004, 09:37 PM: Message edited by: Just Learning ]</small>