W called this morning in bad mood, said her and the OMs W talked about "something that has been going on right along", she wouldnt tell me what, just that it was something that shouldnt be discussed with me, then she said, get this, "I dont like to be lied to anymore than the next person", that got to me, anyway, she said that it started a fight between W and OMW, then with the OM and it has spilled over into today. I feel bad, but at the same time I am hoping this will be the beginning of the end for them.

Steve,

I think you should start to plan to go to plan B fairly soon. I have read many of your posts and I think you will ultimately need to remove yourself from the scene if things do not turn around.

I will tell you why? You say and I will accept that you love your W. If you continue to plan A for too long you will lose that love and then the chances of recovery are not good. Why? Recovery is very hard and it takes a lot of love to get through it.

You worry that if you go to plan B your W/GF/SO ? will forget you. It is possible she will move on, but it is more likely that the OM will NOT be able to meet her needs and that she does in fact love you. She does call regularly but she acts with great disregard for you, such as removing the Christmas tree so SHE can have it. You will need to preserve your love for her and acts like these and her lies will erode it faster than you think.

I am not saying go to it now. I am saying start planning and pick a date in the not to distant future to evaluate and move to plan B unless things are very different. Most here go to plan B too late, very very few ever go too soon.

God Bless,

JL

Steve - unlike JL, I have not read any other of your posts. But something you wrote here attracted my attention -the part about your W and OM's W talking and fighting.

Were they friends pre-affair?

Are you acquainted with OM's W?

The reason I ask is that my WS was best friends with OM's W. Following d-day, OM's W played the perfect role for the affairees to use her as blame for everything nasty that took place - effectively projecting all their bad bahevior onto her.

If this is happening in your sitch, it may pay to try to get OM's W to come here to MB and learn why fighting with your W is likely counterproductive.

Thank you JL for your post, I didnt think anyone actually read all my posts, Im so confused and hurt most of the time and I know I tend to ramble then. As far as planning to go to Plan B, I have already written the letter and stashed it, in my heart I know I need to do this soon, and your right, Im very worried she will just walk away, even if she does love me, because I dont feel she is strong enough to come home, that it will be just easier for her to stay her course, then, we will have both given up. I sort of feel like Im trying to be strong for the both of us right now, that if she sees me give up, it will justify her actions by saying "see, he didnt really love me", which is what she believes anyway. Im trying so hard to be strong, which is something Ive never been good at, and add being strong for her to and I feel overwhelmed all the time, I feel like Im carrying dead weight right now (and I know I am), but I do love her, and I feel Ill carry all the weight I have to right now, for awhile. I did think that Saturday will be the day for me, but I guess Ill have to see how things are going then.

Im also thinking that maybe this little bump in thier road could just strengthen thier R, Im really scared of that.

Worthatry - No, my W and OMW were not friends before this, and Ive never met either one, dont even know what they look like, and I have no clue how to get in touch with OMW, dont even know her name, and she moved in with another guy, so who knows where to even start looking. I know that my W and OM wont tell me anything, Im kinda hoping that this conversation they had, had someting to do with OM telling his W that he still wants her back, and him telling my W thats not true, speculation and dangerous to do, but thats what I hope.

I know my W was hurting this morn, and it really saddens me to know she is that upset about him lying to her, makes me think that there is nothing left for me to do but Plan B and just move on. Thanks for your input tho, it is greatly appreciated, I would love OMW to come here and want to work on thier M, maybe thats where the fight came from, maybe she is seeing things different and wants to go home, or thinking about it, who knows, I just pray something happens soon before I lose everything I ever felt for my W.

Your WW being upset with OM is good I think. I have been lucky in that my WW kinda pushed me into talking to OMW.

Me and OMW keeping in touch helped WW see OM for what he is. It is almost funny that when there is a drama going on it seems to be WW and OM on the phone then me and OMW on the phone.

Very crazy time. I wish you could get in contact with OMW....phone/cell bills might show numbers???

Every time WW gets upset with OM (which started on D-Day) she removes herself a little more from the fog.

Have you asked her what they talk about? If she has said she won't tell you have you patiently insisted?

I have found that some of my requests for information have met with anger from WW, but when I carefully push I get more info. It is almost like she is testing me to see who much I really care for her.

Good luck and keep fighting if that is what you want and you feel any kind of hope coming from your wife.

BTW: When I showed my WW that I could be her friend and could take hearing about some of her woes about OM she started sharing more and more with me and we ended up talking more and more about where she and I went wrong.

I would take it as a good sign that she has called you and shared even a little bit of her problems with OM.

I know for me I told WW that I wanted her to be able to tell me anything, but I have shared with her that some times I don't want to know all the details.

I do like details about what they have argued about though.

Gadget,

Plan B is NOT giving up on the marriage. It is simply letting the A die while preserving your love. A plan B letter is a love letter with a very specific message. "I love you, I want you in my life, your A is hurting me, I must be away from this until the A is over, after the A is over lets see if we can work this out."

That is the message of a plan B letter in a nutshell. It is not quiting on the marriage. It is hangin there until the A is over but in a different status.

Please reread the articles on plan B. That is why I said start to prepare, which really means make sure you understand plan B well for it will drive her away for awhile but gradually your absence may be noticed especially if the A starts to fall apart. It is tough but effective in protecting YOU. It may have an affect on her, but until the A is over whatever affect it has is minimal.

God Bless,

JL

JL - I understand what Plan B is, and I appreciate the comments, I guess what I meant was Plan B without the letter, just go dark and move on, not necessarily "give up" on it, but Im almost at the point of not really caring either, the more she is away from me, the more I start to think that she is not going to do what it is going to take to make our M work, and I only think that from knowing her the way I do, talk about a conflict avoider, I looked it up, her pic is there, check it out.

Greergan - Yes, I have patiently insisted, this afternoon around 4 she called me again to tell me she wsant going to be stopping over tonight, go figure, I saw that coming, at least this time she said "I didnt want to just not show up", which is a rare case, anyway, I told her I was sorry for pushing a little this morning and that I didnt have the right to intrude in her life like that because of my feelings, she of course graciously accepted that. She said she is going to be stopping by early in the morning though, early is like 5, she works at 7 and has barn chores for 5 horses also. I wish I knew a way to get ahold of OMW, boy do I lol. No cell records as W didnt take hers with her, which was nice that she let me get the $100 shared plan with unlimited minutes and all, so she could talk to OM ALL THE TIME!, and leave about 1 month after, so now I pay for 2 phones and get to use only 1, but hey, I could cancel and pay the $20 a month cancel fee till the end of the contract, lets see, only $460.
It was nice to hear they are fighting already, only been a month, took us about 2 years before our first fight.

Went to IC for the first time tonight, gave him the web address here, he seems to use basicly the same principles, just different names. It was nice though, some I knew, some I didnt, correction, most I didnt.

Anyway, I LOVE MY FAMILY AND FRIENDS!! They all worked together today and made me about 50 ornaments lol, brought me a 6 ft tree, lights, everything I needed to get a damn tree up in here!! Where were they all before?? lol, they all did say I seem different, more confident or something, I owe that to everyone here, I probably would have gone insane had I not found this site, thanks everyone.

I hear your pain and honor it. I am sad for you because I empathize greatly with you.

I am also happy for you, sounds like the very good start on x-mas for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Steve, I am by no means an expert or a vet here. I'm rather new at this myself. But it seems to me that your Dday is pretty recent, although I don't know your whole story. I'm only two months myself but am throwing everything I have into my M, although I'm not getting anything back and fear losing my love of her.

I guess my point is that you married this woman for certain reasons and that if you can you should try and hold on as long as you can before you plan B. So that you can look back later and say that you gave your all and have no regrets. But not until you lose you love like the others have said.

Good luck!
Native

Native - Good points, sometimes I just feel in my head its time to move on, my heart says to just suck it up and hold on.

Actually because of my situation, I am actually using a bit of Plan A & B. My W was just here and I told her what the Plan B letter would have. I love you, but I have to move on, Im bettering myself and I dont feel that you intend on coming home, I told her her actions speak louder than words to me and she can say all she wants, but I dont see her wanting to come home, I dont see her caring at all what I do, I told her I wanted to tear down what we called a M and rebuild it from the foundation of the bond that we share into something great.

The reason I did this now was I think I see her teeter tottering on this whole issue of coming home yada yada yada, if I know my W shell be home before to long. I dont think I need a full blown Plan B yet, just enough to get her thinking, its working so far I think.

She said this morning, "Well it looks like you made up your mind with this." I told her that she made up my mind for me, it doesnt take much to see shes not coming home and right now I would still like to see her home. The look on her face told me hows shes feeling and I dont think she likes the idea of what I was saying. Only time will tell. I also told her that I dont think she could handle coming home anyway, there are to many things that she would not be willing to do to help save our M, and Im not sure she could handle the person I am becoming, I think it sank in that I am not the same person I was just a month or so ago.

ditto Steve, I am feeling all those things also. The difference is that I am still in the same house/bed with my W.

Damn life hurts this morning.

Greergan - I truly feel for you, it is a good thing to at least have the W still there with you, in a way, there are many many many nights when I see movies in my head of what is going on in the bed at OMs house while I am alone in ours, it truly hurts.

I wish neither of us, any of us for that matter, had to go through this, but, we do. There is a reason though, and its really hard sometimes to see what that is, you have to think though, "If God leads you to it, God will see you through it"

I don't know if I am lucky or not to have her at home. That remains to be seen I suppose.

You are right about how God treats us though. Some times it is just plain hard to hear and accept though.

That is what I take with me through my day though so thanks for saying it.

Very odd how people in the same situation can bounce back and forth between care giver and care needer from their support group. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Have a good day everyone.

Greergan - I totally agree about the bouncing back and forth off each other, it truly is amazing that with all the pain here, everyone is still willing to reach out and help another try to feel better. Gotta love it!