Why do WW stray?
Why do BH stay?


How long does it take for WW to get over OM?
How long does it take BH to get passed the A?

All answered in "surviving an affair" mate. All complex answers !

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

all blessings

If we had all those answers we would be rich!!!!!

There are no easy answers to these questions, these are all things that you are going to need to search deep within yourself and your R with your W to figure out.

My 2 cents and short take on this as a FWW:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong> Why do WW stray?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">A WS can stray en be vulnerable to an affair because of
1) Unmet EN’s and/or problems in a M
2) Pure selfishness and/or a character flaws and/or lack of morals.
3) For reasons/ circumstances other than problems/issues within the M e.g. personal problems/issues and baggage a person bring into the marriage and/or personal weaknesses & vulnerabilities and/or failure of WS to protect themselves against their own weaknesses/vulnerabilities.
4) Combination of the above.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>How long does it take for WW to get over OM?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Withdrawal is not the same for each person. I believe it depends on many factors such as the length and intensity of the A; the way the A ended and if there is still unresolved issues; personality; ‘sensitivity’ level of the WS etc. I good estimation of the time of withdrawal can be the length of the A. According to Harley it can take anything between 3 weeks and 6 months, but it may even take a year or longer before symptoms will start to fade. As I’ve said, it’s not the same for each person and every situation is different. Especially if the WS have unresolved issues regarding him/herself, it can have a influence on withdrawal and recovery.

Suzet

<small>[ December 01, 2004, 10:06 AM: Message edited by: Suzet* ]</small>

I'd put it as lack of character, pure and simple, as to why people commit infidelity.

Other things may serve as triggers or make infidelity harder to resist, but the choice to actually cross the line is a matter of character. Fortunately all people have the potential to grow and strengthen their character.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by greergan:
<strong>Why do BH stay?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because we love our spouses.
Because we believe in the sanctity of our unions.
Because we believe that people can make mistakes (sometimes bad ones) and recover and repent and learn and be more than worth it in the end.

dewt

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Suzet*:
4) Combination of the above.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> yeppers !

Pep

Hello Greergan,
I'm a BH as are you.

Early in my recovery I truely believed that some people cheat while others don't simply because of lack of character or morals.

I took that opinion into my attempts at recovery. It held me back.

I've said it before on MB that I had several opourtunities to cheat during the last few years running up to my wife's affair, but didn't. They would have been ONSs not a longer term relationship.

Does that make me morally superior to my wife? The reality is that I didn't have a situation and oppurtunity where a relationship could develop slowly.

Most married women's affairs develope very slowly at first. They usually start as a friendship/ working relationship with someone at work or in the community. Despite what we see on "Sex in the City", "Desperate Housewives" and other high quality TV shows, married women unlike men rarely go out looking for a ONS. (I realize there are exceptions.) They would never think of such a thing.

Have you heard of the "How to Cook a Frog" parable. Briefly it describes a process that develops slowly. The frog starts out in cool comfortable water. As the water heats it's gradual so the frog gets used to it each time the temperature rises. Finally the water gets to the temperature that cooks him.

Conversely if you throw the frog into boiling water what happens? He jumps out.

I realize it's more complicated than this simple parable but there is truth there.

So nearly 15 months after the true DDay, our relationship has begun to truely heal. It definitey takes work from both sides.

BTW, there are days when the anger, resentment & humiliation come boiling out and I still consider dumping my wife to get some sort of justice or revenge.

Just a few thoughts.

Take care

Mac

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cwmac:
<strong> Have you heard of the "How to Cook a Frog" parable. Briefly it describes a process that develops slowly. The frog starts out in cool comfortable water. As the water heats it's gradual so the frog gets used to it each time the temperature rises. Finally the water gets to the temperature that cooks him.

Conversely if you throw the frog into boiling water what happens? He jumps out.

I realize it's more complicated than this simple parable but there is truth there.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There is indeed SO much truth in this parable. It describes exactly how my involvement progressed from friendship into EA. I’m just glad I could get out of the heated water before it totally burned me!

As stated by the Baltimore psychologist and marital researcher Shirley Glass: “There is a new ''crisis of infidelity'' breeding in the workplace. Often it does not involve sexual thrill seekers, but ''good people,'' peers who are in good marriages. The new infidelity is between people who unwittingly form deep, passionate connections before realizing that they've crossed the line from platonic friendship into romantic love,''.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by mineownself:
<strong> I'd put it as lack of character, pure and simple, as to why people commit infidelity.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">A very generalized statement… IMO A’s can happen to ANYONE – even good, religious people with high morals and strong conscience can get involved in an A... In fact, sometimes the so-called ‘good’ people are more vulnerable to an affair than anyone else because they think they will never get tempted and are not aware of their own human weaknesses & vulnerabilities... I can also speak of myself here: I consider myself as a person with a good character and high morals who’ve made the wrong choices and failed to protect myself from my own weaknesses/vulnerabilities (I wasn’t even aware of those weaknesses/vulnerabilities at the time). But fortunately people can learn from their mistakes and become wiser and stronger people… Before my EA I was very judgmental of people who get involved in A’s and I also had the opinion that such people are weak and without conscience, morals and character. How ashamed am I to admit this today… But luckily my experience taught me humbleness and that’s the one thing I’m truly thankful for...

Very well put, Suzet. Myownself , is the BS also lacking of character if he or she failed to meet the WSs emotional needs, thus aiding in the weakening of the marriage? Maybe some of us are misinterpreting your statements, but to me it sounds like you're on your moral high-horse.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by tobs:
<strong> Very well put, Suzet. Myownself , is the BS also lacking of character if he or she failed to meet the WSs emotional needs, thus aiding in the weakening of the marriage? Maybe some of us are misinterpreting your statements, but to me it sounds like you're on your moral high-horse. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">tobs (tired of being sad)

I'll just say it...

Your thinking is highly influenced by the fact that your marriage fell apart and neither of you had the tools to fix what was wrong.

Harley's tools are a great place to start learning... what you learned from your family growing up may not be useful to you now as an adult woman.

Some of your "emotional needs" you expected your husband to meet may well have been very heavy emotional baggage carried over from your youth ... needs and holes in your heart that no marriage partner is prepared to satisfy.

The affair did not kill your marriage ... I gather from reading your prior posts that your family of origin was a very chaotic and disruptive place to grow up ... have you been seeking therapy for your old wounds?

Pep

<small>[ December 02, 2004, 07:21 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

Pepperband ,

I'll just say it...

Yes, I know the "affair did not kill" my marriage. And yes, "Harley's tools are a great place to start learning"...that's why I'm here. I also learn from the posters on this site, whether I agree or identify with all of their comments or not.

I'm quite aware that my "emotional needs" are tainted by "very heavy emotional baggage carried over from my youth." Pepperband, I've been aware of those issues for a very, very long time, darlin'! And yes, I've dealt with them in therapy. I actively work on those issues every day of my life.

But let's be honest, BS's are also inflicted by their own baggage. My BH didn't come home from a business trip before, during, or immediately after my miscarriage because he was a workaholic with a strong desire for approval from his superiors. No doubt his behavior was influenced by his childhood baggage. Using your words, you're correct in suggesting that he was not "prepared to satisfy" all of my emotional needs.

Purely and simply, I do not believe there is a cookie-cutter explanation as to why individuals (including BSs and WSs) act and react as they do. Again, Myownself may not have intended for the post to sound one-sided, but from where I'm sitting, that's how it sounded.

Of course my "thinking is highly influenced by the fact that your (my) marriage fell apart"...it's
my experience. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

<small>[ December 02, 2004, 08:07 PM: Message edited by: tobs ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by tobs:
Again, Myownself may not have intended for the post to sound one-sided, but from where I'm sitting, that's how it sounded.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Here's part of what Myownself said:

"Fortunately all people have the potential to grow and strengthen their character."

Sounds generous and open-minded to me ! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Myownself also said:

"The choice to actually cross the line is a matter of character."

Again, pretty common-sense remark, no matter what "the line" represents. Be it an adulterous relationship or ignoring a spouse's need to be comforted in the middle of a great loss like a miscarriage.

From Myownself:

"Things serve as triggers or make infidelity harder to resist."

This does not sound judgemental or one-sided (to me), Myownself seems to be stating an obvious fact.

If we define a lack of character as recognizing something to be morally wrong, but we do it anyway ... what else is a lack of character?

Myownself did not say WS have an exclusive lock on lack of character behavior. Just that the choice to have an affair is a choice that reflects a lack of character ~at that time~ and Myownself goes on to say that the lack of character is not necessarily permanent, but can be remedied!

I just don't see the one-sidedness... but I am biased too.

Pep

<small>[ December 03, 2004, 10:33 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by tobs:

My BH didn't come home from a business trip before, during, or immediately after my miscarriage because he was a workaholic with a strong desire for approval from his superiors. No doubt his behavior was influenced by his childhood baggage. Using your words, you're correct in suggesting that he was not "prepared to satisfy" all of my emotional needs.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Perhaps your H's motivation and intent was to meet one of your emotional needs --->(financial security) and doing so, H lost sight of your other needs ... ??? Maybe other needs he did not feel so skilled at or well equiped to meet?

Maybe, like so many men, your H was raised to think that if he provided a good living for his family, he was doing what is right for you.

Pep

<small>[ December 03, 2004, 10:45 AM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>