Ok-so today was a horrible day. I went to work and H kept the kids (I work 12 hr days). So I called and I guess I was in a bad mood b/c I started picking at him. He was ill b/c he had worked over this week and was tired so we got in a HUGE fight. I said some things I should have NEVER said-I feel so horrible about it. It really hurt his feelings. He started crying-I mean BAWLING and said he was so ashamed of the things he had done....how the kids deserved better...how he was no good for anyone. I said I was sorry and that we needed to stop this nonsense and just get along for the kids-try to do this easy for them. I have been selfish and have thought about me....and the kids are the important thing here. Granted they are just babies-but they need us to get along for them. H feels so bad and he is carrying around so much guilt-but I am not helping. I don't why I felt the need to start a fight today-but I wish I hadn't....I feel so bad about it.

When I came home I tried to hug him and tell him I was sorry but he wouldn't let me. He told me "you have nothing to be sorry about-you were right. You made me realize some things about myself. But I am ok-I'm over it". He looked like he had cried all day-he looked awful. I feel awful for making him feel so bad.

When did things get so messed up? When did this become my life?

Hang in there. You've got a lot of issues to deal with and you just slipped up. Remember you wouldn't be in the position to slip up if it wasn't for WH...

Miker

This sounds a lot like my WH and I. Only my husband doesn't usually cry. I just finished reading the book Surviving an Affair and it has helped me tremendously. It is good to know that you H is still living with you. I know how hard it is with kids to try and meet your H's needs ( I have 4 the youngest is 3 weeks old) but I recently discovered how essential it is. My WH moved back in with his parents and does not want to work on things now probably because neither of us stopped the cycle. He is enjoying being single he says without fear of criticm and guilt (my Love Busters). If your H is willing to work on things I would suggest reading the book if you haven't already and have him read it to. I really hope that you work things out with him and you both get to the place where you can meet each others needs and keep the family intact. For me the picking was a result of clinical and post partum depression which started 5y ago. I recently started antidepressants and found them to be of great help in calming down. I finally feel normal again. When you talk to your H try to be specific about what you did that hurt him and acknowledge his feelings. He probably will not respond to your physical affection until he feels that you understand him. Keep up your hard work and your faith it will pay off in spades if done the right way.

Natasha

FW (me)-30
WH (H)-31
Married 7 yrs
Separated 05~25~2004
4 kids

Thanks for the replies guys. Just to clarify-H and I aren't living together-he comes here and keeps the kids while I am working. And as of right now he does not want to work things out. I fear that yesterday was the final straw for our marriage. I was also very critical and picked and H says it feels like a huge burden has been lifted from him. I am also on anti-depressants and they do make me feel much better.

Right now I am mostly concerned for H. He is carrying around a LOT of guilt over what he has done and he is very depressed. he won't admit it-but he is upset and miserable and I am worried if he doesn't work on that and deal w/ it he will never feel better. He doesn't talk about things a lot-but when he does he explodes and then he shoves it all back down again like it never happened.

H does want to spend christmas eve here w/ us. He asked me again this weekend if he could and I told him I guessed it would be ok. He said he would sleep on the couch and I said "well-duh". I told him I didn't know if he would spend christmas w/ us or someone else and he said "you would think that". We have to take our son to the dr tomorrow-so that should be interesting. I hate all the tension and drama-it is easier to not see him or be around him at this point but that isn't fair to the kids.

Anyway-thanks for listening!

Well-I called H this morning b/c I heard he was seen about town w/ OW. I don't know why-but everytime I hear about it it feels like the first time. Anyway-when he answered he sounded as if he was still crying-from last night. I told him what I had heard and he started screaming and crying and he hung up. So I called back and we talked for a bit. He said for me and the kids to forget about him-we would all be better off. The old him was gone and this person he has become is nothing to anyone. He said no one cared about him anyway-that he had drove everyone away. I told him that was NOT true-I told him I cared about him SO much-otherwise none of this would hurt me. I told him to never think I didn't care about him b/c I did w/ all my heart. I told him I was worried about him and the things he was doing. He said I was just saying that and he didn't want to listen to it anymore. I told him he needed help-that there is more going on w/ him than just falling out of love w/ me b/c we fought a lot. He said "no-I'm fine" while he was sobbing. He kept telling me to forget about him and that we didn't need him. I am so worried about him-if he does not deal w/ whatever is going on I am afraid of what is going to happen. Him leaving, the OW, all of it is SO out of character from him-everyone that knows him knows something is definitely wrong w/ him. I wish he could see that-and I wish he knew people DID care for him so much-that our hearts are breaking for him. Cheating was something he was so against-he would NEVER have done it.....ever. I wish I knew how to help him. I told him his kids loved him and they needed him in their lives-we all needed him. I finished the call w/ telling him I did care about him and that I always would. I told him NOTHING he has done is unforgivable....he thinks God could never forgive him but that is so not true! How do I help him? He still insists he doesn't care about me....and that may be true-but what is going on w/ him? Anyone else been through anything like this? This is a man that before was the happiest, most outgoing, most friendly, carefree guy in the worls and now he says he feels like he is going crazy. I don't know what to do. I don't even care about the marriage anymore-I want to help him...as a person....HELP!

Good to see a WS cry but gotta wonder how much of it is crocodile tears. Your H inside maybe trying to bust out and you need to let the WS know you are searching for your H not the WS. The WS can go be with the OW since he is doing that anyway but if the H can come home, there maybe a chance.

Don't give him a comfortable place to bring the WS. Let him know the home is for the H and father, not the WS and OP.

His statements to you are conflicting and that maybe because he is in internal conflict. Acknowledge it but don't enable it.

If he is prancing around with the OW, he isn't confused he is making a diliberate choice. His doing it with the WS personality and you have to decide if you want to enable that personality or not.

My WS went through that kind of drama. I let it play out until I got too tired of the games. Then I pulled out and gave the drama back to him. He started asking if I loved him and I said, I love my H not the WS. If you can find my H, ask him to come back so we can talk and so I can tell him goodbye. That made that man cry. I was not sorry for what I said.

I see this time not for one with apologies but for a time to stand strong for your family.

However that strong stance can be taken once your heart and mind are in sync.

L.

I really don't think any of this is crocodile tears. He is honestly VERY confused and upset.

I know him going out w/ OW is intentional-he said "she called and asked me to lunch ...I don't know why this is a big deal-you KNOW about her". I asked him how he could honestly believe what he was doing was ok! We are STILL married....and he said "legally only". If he were truly ready to leave this marriage behind he wouldn't be dealing w/ all this conflict-or thats my thought anyway. To him-he is doing nothing wrong. He thinks since he left before this started it isn't an affair and everyone should be ok w/ it.

It hurts a lot-sometimes I just want to do away w/ him and get on w/ my life. But then I remember the man he was-and I so wish he could be him again. He may never be that person again though-and I need to prepare for that. In all reality we will get a divorce and I know he will regret that one day.

It just makes me so sad that this is my life. But it isn't something I can control anymore-I just hope and pray he works things out for himself.

Tomorrow should be loads of fun-we have to take my son for a medical appt-yippee! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
I want to help him...as a person....HELP! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Call his mother, or his father, or his brother, or his best male friend. Ask someone else to step in and help him.

When a man's ~wife~ takes on the role of his nurse, his psychiatrist, or his caretaker, it is very emasculating for a man and his self-esteem drops lower than before.

Yes, he needs help, he will not accept that help from you ... it increases his discomfort coming from you. Most men want to be admired by their woman ... and that is impossible if you are placed in the "healthy" role and he is the "unhealthy" one in the marriage.
Pep

Well-today turned out better than I expected. H and I took our son for a dr appt this morning-it was about an hr away so we had an hr drive both ways. We had conversation-didn't fight or pick or anything. We ate breakfast. Coming home we were talking about jobs and H hates his and would like a new one. So-we were talking about the place my dad works and he called my dad and talked to him about it and said he might try to apply there. H and my dad still talk a lot-as odd as that is....they always got along real well. I still talk to MIL every day-so I guess thats about the same.

Anyway-the new job would be good b/c a) H would be back in our hometown instead of the next one over where OW lives and b) H would not be working at the same place that OW works.

H cracked some jokes, laughed w/ me and was pleasant. When we got out of the car he said "well-I had fun" and he touched my back. I looked at him and said "don't touch me" and laughed and he started poking me and chasing me-we were both laughing.

I know better than to have a LOT of hope about anything-but it was nice to have a pleasant time w/ him and to laugh w/ him. I did catch him looking at me and watching me a lot. I finally asked him what he was looking at and he said nothing.

Well-just wanted to tell you all how it went!

I don't know if anyone is reading this-I don't get any replies-but it helps me to get it out anyway.

Today was more of the same. I found out yesterday one of my very dearest friends has breast cancer-and it has spread. It is not at all a good situation and has me very upset. On top of everything else-I just lost it today-had a bit of a breakdown.

I called H to ask him something about our son (I have to take him to get blood drawn sometime this week and I was going to see if he could help me w/ our daughter.) He didn't answer his cell so I jumped the gun and assumed he was w/ OW. When I finally got a hold of him he was at home-alone....but I was already angry. he said he had his phone off.

Anyway-we started arguing and I just broke down. I LOST it-I told him I felt like I was smothering w/ everything going on and I just wanted some peace. He had some real hurtful things and he apoligized and told me he wanted to help me more w/ the kids-he wanted to be "here" for us. In his defense I was the one that asked him to stop dropping in all the time. He said he would start watching them on Wed for me for I can do something for me. Then he told me how sorry he was about all this and how he really wished I had never met him b/c he had ruined my life. I told him to never think that b/c our babies were worth it all! We hung up on good terms.

Then about 2 hrs later-he called back and told me again how sorry he was and how she not have said the things he said to me. I told him it was ok-we both said bad things and he said "no-it is ALL my fault". I tried to make him understand that this was "our" fault-not his or mine alone.

I just feel like at this point our marriage is dead in the water and hopefless. He doesn't love me (so he says) and we have both been so hurtful, there is no trust.....it is so sad. I honestly have no idea what to do next or where to turn....I just want some peace....and I want this to end one way or the other.

S&TM,

When your WS apologizes for the A related actions (including his angry outbursts). Let him apologize and don't water it down by taking some of the blame. That is not what he or you need.
Just thank him for the aplogy and let it go. He needs to apologize, it is part of how he needs to heal. When he uses the apology as an excuse to keep doing more of the same wrong, then you can put your foot down. Either way you are not accepting the blame and watering down the impact of his apology.

JMHO,
L.

<small>[ December 08, 2004, 03:45 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

S&TM,

Have you read any of the articles here? If not please take the time to read about Love Busters. You really need to stop using them, and I mean you really really need to stop it.

You will find two things will happen. You will feel better about yourself AND you are likely to find that you and your H have many fewer fights. No matter what else happens in your relationship, fewer fights is a good thing.

Finally, if you quit LB'ing him you might find that his responses and defenses will change as well. Please do the reading and think about this it is for your own good, the good of your relationship with your H, and just maybe your marriage. I know for sure it will be for the good of your children. They don't need Mom and Dad fighting or even crying in front of them all of the time.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

Thanks guys for the advice. I know I am doing ALL the wrong things but it is so hard not to-I need to work on that. It is all so odd to me-the crying and arguing....him crying and telling me how awful he feels....the failing of our marriage. I had NO idea that separation and divorce was this hard-NO idea. It is like a new universe.

I will try real hard to reverse my actions and check myself-I have tried to stop doing any of this in front of the kids-they DON'T need to see it-you are right.

Thanks again!