C,

I won't get into specific details about what you should do, Orchid is way more qualified on that front. I can tell you, as someone who is almost to the point BobPure is, that 30-60 days from now you will feel so much better about life that you can't imagine it now. Stick in there, develop a plan and go to work on Plan A. It does work, and it will work in your sitch as well.

Well, keeping the daycare spot open for him will work in my favour, should it come to the courts. It is in my sons best interest to still go to daycare some of the time (he has never gone fulltime.

As for this OM, still not sure how to go about it ... debating whether I should TXT him, and also what should go into the TXT.

C5

I was going to suggest you keep the daycare spot open and also to go see a lawyer.
Now don't panic, I mean to get info on the following:-

1 what you HAVE to pay and no more,

2 What rights do you have with your child. This arbitary 1 weekend a fortnight is dangerous as it sets you up what you have 'accepted' with the courts. At the VERY least you should be insisting on 50% time and joint custody more if you can work it in with your employment as she is clearly not thinking straight and her behaviour may be detrimental to your child.
The 50% time can be say a weekend and 3 days one week & 2 days the next - INSIST they run together e.g Mon Tues Wed or Thurs Fri etc etc whatever can reasonably work out. This is good for your child and you can argue in court if you have to that its promotes stability for him.

Now, full time Mom, well not on your $$ until she becomes your wife again is a good move, again check it out with a lawyer, explain her abandonment of your child with distant P, how this is so unstable for your child etc etc. .

I just feel you need some facts before you can decide what you want to do here. Unfortunately there no other real way of getting it.

Hey aw, yep I have already got legal advice, and it is currently going through our lawyers. I have asked flat out for 50%, as I am still living in our home, and she is living at her parents.

The case is looking pretty good on my end, but she is still arguing every alternate weekend, plus 2 or 3 hr visits once or twice during the week. Not on her life!

C,

How R U doing today? Looks like you had good support.

As for texting OM, I'd wait and do your background/pi stuff 1st. Don't make life changing or difficult decisions when your emotions are running high.

Right now, get your support and plan in place. Work with your MC or do the phone counseling as previously suggested. You have some reading homework that will prove invaluable.

Secure arrangements to see your son. Put it in writing and give it to a reliable 3rd party. This w/b good in case you need to go to plan B.

I'd be very concerned about her taking your son t/b around the OM. Check with the lawyer about your options to put restrictions on that.

take care,
L.

Orchid,

Do you think he has enough evidence at this point to confront her?

If you are having your son on Christmas afternoon, I wouldn't give him his presents early. Whatever you give him as a personal gift from yourself, should be opened at your house. This isn't addressing the Santa Claus issue. If he's still a believe, hopefully WW and G&G will take care of it.

Celebrate your Christmas with your child. Try to not let it be a pathetic thing. Do something fun. Give you son a really cool video you watch together. Start a new tradition.

I also think it is the nature of WS to jerk us around as much as possible. I guess we just have to think of the big picture.

Good luck!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by AndrewA:
<strong> Orchid,

Do you think he has enough evidence at this point to confront her? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Andrew,

Confront who? His WS? Here's what he recently wrote: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Confused5:
<strong>....She goes out at night sometimes (with the OM), and leaves him at her parents (which he hardly knows, my W and her parents had a major fallout and they have not spoken to each other for 3 years... until 6 months ago).

Yes, my son has met the OM. How many times, I do not know. She took him around there one time, even before we separated. She later told me that. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So what started as no proof is showing up as some proof. What he doesn't have is a full confession.

Irregardless of what he has, if he can ID the OM, then he should do a background check. For the safety of his child. C/b playing with fire here, so he has to take the safer and more cautious road.

JMHO,
L.

Well, it all hit the fan last night. Got my W telephone bill in the mail, so I TXT her to tell her I got it, and that she had been a busy girl. She got very aggressive and basically told me to f**k off! I said, if she is seeing someone else, at least have the decency to tell me ... and guess what? I got no reply. She is ignoring it!

Now she knows I have her phone bill ... And it was not through me snooping (which I have been anyway), but basically because it was sent to our house. Where do you think she will go from here? I asked her flat out to tell me, and that if she was seeing someone then that was her decision, but ... yes, no reply!

My main concern is my son, but I would also like to hear from her what she is doing ... at least that way I know where I stand. She is still ignoring the issue of telling me, and has been telling everyone that I am controlling, I have changed etc. She has always had the freedom of coming and going, and I guess this is her way of not feeling guilt over what she has done.

Cancel her cell phone. Let her get her own. That way she can't be mad at you while getting you to enable the A. You won't be able to view the call records but you already know how she reacts when the A is ongoing so you can use that as a measuring stick.

L.

I dont know if I can do that ... the cell phone is still under contract from the phone company - it has like a year to go! She is racking up the bills for it, and I sure as hell do not want to be left with them, but if it comes to that, I will just pay it with the child support! She did pay some off it the other day, but that was only because I asked her to do it, and that was before last night!

It really got to me last night, I was hell angry. I asked her a straight up honest question, and she did not even have the decency to reply back. Is that normal? I assume if she is having an A, that she wouldn't tell anyone until it was concrete between them.

I also got a letter from her lawyers today (in terms of child custody), where she states I am controlling etc, and has lied about many of the situations in there (and I mean blatant lying). She has also stated in the letter, that she does not want to reconcile between us.

If that is the case, what is my plan now? Should I resume NC? My sister also got involved and TXT'd my W a couple of times, and she is basically saying exactly the same thing to her.

C,

Even though your phone is under contract, you can put it on some sort of standby mode. This will disable the phone. Just let them know that the user no longer lives at your residence and you will need to put the phone on an inactive status until you can secure residence (or make up something). Check out the options. Bottom line is to prevent her from receiving or making calls.

You see her babble is now going outside of the family and including others (SIL). Ok, well let her hang herself with her own words. Let her babble to the lawyer and others. You keep yourself as blameless as possible. Not everyone is gonna all themselves to be manipulated. Just preempt your convos with legal and judge folks that you are dealing with a W who is having an A. They will understand when the babble starts in and they will recognize it.

For now work on you and cut off that phone. As for her paying some of the bill. She certainly isn't doing you any favors. She is still in debit as far as your Love Bank goes, right?

take care,
L.

My sister also asked if she was seeing someone else, and my W said no. I am gonna talk to my sis more in detail tonight. She never mentions anything in her letter back to me re half the points I bought up, and in many occasions she says one thing in one point, and then a few points later says another thing. Pretty poor lawyer from my POV. She is also attacking me on a personal level with our relationship, not going into much about our son at all (how I am controlling, possessive, no friends etc - which is all a lie).

I am going to have to think about the phone, I will tell her next week to pay some more off it, if she doesnt ... then BAM! i will cut it off. She threatened me last night, with 'transfer it to my name, or you can pay it urself' type message.

She is also bringing up the fact, that she wants to come over and get her belongings - still not sure how to deal with that. I was going to tell her, to put everything she wants in a letter and mail it to me. Then I will get her stuff together and let her know when she can collect it ... that is fair, yes?

My LB? Well, she certainly has not done anything to credit it. Still no talking with her, no reasoning etc. She is also turning my letters to her (2) since separating into her favour. Basically saying that if I do not accept the separation then it will be difficult for us to parent together efficiently - how should I respond to that?

Don't warn the enemy. Let her find out by turning off the phone. She will rant and rave but you have already seen that. Just be prepared for it. When she does be ready with your response. Something like:

WS: How dare you turn off MY phone.

BS: Your phone? It's not in your name.

WS: I demand you turn it back on.

BS: Ok. (do not commit to when).

... a few days later - WS: How come you did not turn on my phone yet.

BS: Your phone? It's not in your name.

Ws: I demand you turn it back on.

Bs: ok? (again no date commitment). If she asks for commitment, tell her it is a family phone and can not be used for any A stuff. Can't trust her with NC right now, so no phone til she earns back the trust.

(At this point expect a frontal attack - step back a bit).

WS: How dare you tell me what to do.

BS: I am not telling you what to do.

Ws: How dare you turn off my phone.

BS: One more time....it is not your phone. (don't tell her to get one).

WS: Well, I will get my own phone then.

BS: Ok.

WS: I will get it you know. I will.....

BS: Ok.....(walk away from convo).

(a few days later) ws: When will you turn on my phone?

BS: Didn't we already discuss that you don't have a phone? Where is the one you bought?

WS: I don't have it yet. Can you pretty please turn my phone back on?

BS: No.

WS: Arrrgh....

BS: No response required....just leave quickly. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

L.

Sounds good in practice <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> However, if I cut the phone or ask for it back, I think she will gladly give it back to me, and go get a cheaper deal. Why? Because she will see it, as she doesnt have to pay all this money each month for it, and can get a cheaper plan ... she already has the numbers of these OP so she can easily just start it up again using the other phone.

Then ... I am stuck with the phone and the contract!

Yes but she will have to put time and effort into getting that new phone and probably can't use her old number. Which means a new number and the time it takes to give it out to all that need that new # not to speak of the initial cost. Oh it will make her work a bit and that s/b what you want. You want her to have to work for her A as much as possible. Not you do the work and she have the A.

BTW, I thought you were going to be getting some much needed rest tonight?!?!?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

IMHO,
L.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
She is also bringing up the fact, that she wants to come over and get her belongings - still not sure how to deal with that. I was going to tell her, to put everything she wants in a letter and mail it to me. Then I will get her stuff together and let her know when she can collect it ... that is fair, yes?

My LB? Well, she certainly has not done anything to credit it. Still no talking with her, no reasoning etc. She is also turning my letters to her (2) since separating into her favour. Basically saying that if I do not accept the separation then it will be difficult for us to parent together efficiently - how should I respond to that?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What do you think about these other points? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It early here, I am in Australia!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Confused5: She is also bringing up the fact, that she wants to come over and get her belongings - still not sure how to deal with that. I was going to tell her, to put everything she wants in a letter and mail it to me. Then I will get her stuff together and let her know when she can collect it ... that is fair, yes?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: She can. Let her get her things. Unless you don't trust her in your home or can't be there when she gets her stuff, I would let her come in and take what is her's. When my WS took his stuff, he found out that most of the things belonged to the family except for his clothes, tools and a few office items. The rest was all family stuff. Sad for what was at that time 10+ years of M.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Confused5: My LB? Well, she certainly has not done anything to credit it. Still no talking with her, no reasoning etc. She is also turning my letters to her (2) since separating into her favour. Basically saying that if I do not accept the separation then it will be difficult for us to parent together efficiently - how should I respond to that?

What do you think about these other points? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Fog babble has a way of taking the most innocent of actions into something sick. So now you know what she is capable of....use that to your family's advantage. She stated if you don't accept the separation it w/b difficult to parent together effectively. I wouldn't agrue that, I would agree then say, so why are you separating and creating this hardship on our children? See? Throw it back to her. Called reverse babble. Kinda go with the flow then give her back her babble.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Confused5: It early here, I am in Australia! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: So that's where U R!??!?! Not sure of the time difference but we have a few Aussie's out there. Seahorse, KiwiJ, Aussie, Aussie's W
and a few more. Ok, but don't miss anymore of your beauty naps, ok? Even guys can get old and wrinkly B4 their time, eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

L.

<small>[ December 09, 2004, 04:02 AM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

I will try not to!

She has also put in the letter, that she does not want to reconcile, and like I said that I am controlling and she felt closed in. My W has always had these problems, she cannot hold down a long term friendship, and she is always the one to shut it down should anything happen that she doesnt like. Its a proven trend. What I did to cause this? I have no idea.

I have no doubt, that she is focusing all her efforts on this OM. While she is doing that, there is nothing much I can do. Do I still keep getting in there every now and then, or should I stick with my NC?