Arj:

When I feel like crap I have to talk or I write things on the forum and my wife eventually reads them. It has been seven months since d-day and it gets better, however you never know when a trigger is coming and it brings you down again. Today I have been down and wrote stuff that I have said to Myrta many times before. One thing about recovery is that one visits the same theme over and over again. I read in another thread that to discuss things at nauseum improves the post affair traumatic stress disorder. You are probably a much more contained and subdued individual than me and I admire your stamina, but sometimes folks like you bottle up everything and then one day there is a major explosion. Do not allow yourself to be full of resentment. Deal with your feelings now and try to talk, and then do some more talking. The couples that recover the best are the ones that talk.

Regarding your idea of telling her that you will consider a divorce if she does not cooperate:

I say go for it. Three minutes after d-day I was already begging Myrta to leave me so I would not have to be the one breaking up the marriage. If she had taken up my offer she was going to leave me no matter what I said. At least when she said I don’t want top leave I was filled with some reassurance. So go tell her the door is open if she is not going to work on the marriage. That is not a love buster! You are simply telling your wife that you feel very low and at this point see no hope. Tell her that if she sees no future you need to know what to expect. Do it in a calm and soothing voice----- pretend you have the voice of an OM- be smooth---- however, make sure you let her know she is draining your love bank and that you will not be working 24/7 to fix the marriage the rest of your life. She needs to acknowledge she will do her part even if she is depressed.

Arj; your wife is going nowhere. She is in NC and it seems the OM has some residual integrity and has kept his word. Consider yourself lucky!

Arj,

Just wanted to point out something that Stanley just said. He said, "One thing about recovery is that one visits the same theme over and over again." That's SO true! I see him beat himself up over similar things every few weeks, and you know what? It's GREAT that he posts them here, for us to read, or for Myrta to read, or just to hear himself think, and that's what you're doing too. We'll never tire of you talking things out. Occasionally you DO need a wake-up call, and that's what we're here for. Occasionally you do need some reassurance too. It's all okay. It's all good. You're working through all of this. It's recovery and rebuilding. It takes time. TIME AND PATIENCE. Remember that!!

BTW, when I'm triggered (8 months into recovery!), I'm sometimes afraid to complain about it here, since I'm the WS, and since I fall back into similar triggers. I half-expect some posters to say, "Gawd! Get over it! You just complained about that last week..." but they don't! They're supportive and encouraging! So, keep writing... You'll get there!

Stanley, I hope that the rest of your day (and night now) was better!

Nite, guys! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

CC <-----off to tend to my sick hubby! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

ArjDAD--Hi, good morning to you!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
I really think you should let your wife know some of your thoughts. She needs to know that you are hurting a lot and that you need some kind of positive response from her in order to keep going. Tell her that it seems you are working in the Marriage on your own.

Nothing will happen if you voice yourself to her. She is not going to walk out or anything like that!!

If you dont want to tell her, then write an e=mail and tell her. Thats fine too!! But she really needs to know where you are standing and YOU need to know where she is with you!!

Good luck. Take care

MYRTA

hello all,

thanks for all the advice.

stan-ley, it helps me to to be able to write this down.i guess then i can re-read it and see what i am thinking. i am trying to not hold on to rresentment, i know i need to talk to her more.

i am not too worried about her leaving if i say i will consider divorce, i am worried about rushing her andpushing her away. everyone's time of healing is different, but i do feel like she needs a push.

buttercup,

thanks for encouraging, and i do feel comfortable posting here, knowing i will get support and straightened out if i need it.

don't ever feel like you can't do the same. vent all you want. when you say you have bad days, it just means you are making progress.

keep up the good work.

myrta,--

i think iwill write her an e-mail. tell her my thoughts. when i have said in the past that it
feels like i am the only one trying, she gets mad and says she is trying too. maybe she is and i am looking for the wrong signs.i wish she knew that she needs to reach out to me and try to meet some of my en's, if she wants this to work.

i have not heard from her wether she ever read the post from just learning i sent her. it seems to me, she needs to put more time and effort into her marriage. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

and i agree, i need to know where i am with her.

thanks all, i will check in later,


arjdad

Arj:

There has to be a happy medium where one talks at the right time and with moderation. Not talking at all depletes your love bank and with time you will be full of resentment and then indifference. It will be you who ends the marriage when you cannot feel anything. I have seen many on this board who have lost all love for the WS after trying very hard to save the marriage. So talking is a must.

I must warn you that it is likely an art form in determining when and how to talk (WWs are like old English sports cars). I am very bad at it and quite often my conversations with Myrta are seen as love busters. Obviously the last thing I want to do is send Lbs, but one has to deal with the internal struggles and how to find relief by talking things over. I am blessed to have a wife like Myrta who has been perfect all her life with me even thou she derailed for a couple of years. She is able to handle my Lbs, but I don’t want to keep doing that.

The emails are a highly effective way of communicating and writing things down is very therapeutic if you do not have a live person in front of you. Myrta read everything I sent her and in the end knew MB principles better than I did. For many weeks all I ever did was email her over and over again. I would talk to her by email and send her info several times a day. This should not overwhelm your wife--- try it.

Aww, Stanley, you're so cute sometimes! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I love to hear you sound so supportive of Myrta!

Arj:
Hope you get to talk to her at some point SOON! She does need to give you some feedback at some point!

I'll check on you later.

CC

ok all,--

i just sent her e-mail, but i don't think our e-mail is working right, right now.

i said a lot of things, hoping for some feedback. i don't think i said anything i will regret later.

i basically said that i needed her to make a commitment to reconciling our M. and that i wished she would read on this website and get familiar with the MB principals.

i did tell her that i love her, and am willing to change to meet her needs.

i also told her i printed the en's questionaire, and ask her if she would fill it out.

we'll see what happens, arjdad

ArJDAD---YOu need reassurance that you did allright!!Well, you did!! I am sure she has to answer you now and give some kind of idea where she stands with you. Dont feel you did anything wrong by sending her the e-mail. YOu are just human, and as a human being you need affection,love, from your wife. If you are willing to give her so much love and consideration after what she did, you deserve something back from her!!

Have you been feeling better today? You were pretty down the last couple of days!! Ihope so!!

Well, take care of yourself!! Keep your spirit up!!

MYRTA

myrta,-

i am feeling a little better today, but i don't know why. i try to cuddle with her on the couch and hold hands, she doesn't pull away, but she doesn't seem very receptive either. i don't know how to read her.

i made us an appt. with MC for next monday, and she said she would go. i guess that is a good sign, although i don't know if she is going because she wants to or just because she feels like she has to.

she is so busy, but i am planning on talking to her this weekend. i have got to have some answers.

i love her so much, and i just don't understand why she is not trying to save this M.it is starting to drive me crazy. and that is a short drive. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

i guess i am going to have to give her a push, but i am thinking on waiting until MC on monday.

i think she might be somewhat uncomfortable in MC, because she lied to MC for the last year also. obviously, MC was not happy about that. but she did not say anything to wife.

our MC is very pro marriage, and even tho unfamiliar with MB concepts, she agrees with everything i have told her about it.wife says sometimes she feels like it is two against one there. duh, me and MC are trying to improve the M

sorry to ramble, i am off to bed, i will check in for you guys' words of wisdom in the morning.

g'night........

arjdad

ArJdad==It seems that you are feeling more upbeat, I am glad for you. It is a good sign indeed that she is willing to go to MC. Do you think that maybe she is not too receptive to it, is because , she lied to Mcounselor before.? Have you considered changing counselors? Or you think this one is an effective one?

Arjdad-dont think she is not trying to save the marriage. Maybe you are reading her the wrong way. My husband always does, still today!!He thinks he knows whats in my mind, but he hardly never knows!!

Its a good idea that you really and seriously talk to her and see whats in her =mind from her own mouth. Dont try to guess whats inside of her!
I hope she responds to your e-mail. Sometimes writing its easier than talking. Less intimidating.

Take care

MYRTA

arjdad,
Glad she's willing to go to the MC with you! Good sign.

Hope you're feeling a little better today. Hang in there!

CC

oh i don't know what to do now.

isent her an e-mail telling her how i felt. ask if she would fill out the questionaire.
told her i felt like i was the only one trying. just told her how i felt.


she mailed me back, i just saw it . she says she doesn't now what i want or expect her to do. she read JL's post on page 19, and said that is what MC has been saying,"fake it til you make it". she said she has been trying that for years and it doesnt semm to be working. i told her i didn't know how she felt back then, and i ask her what she thought would happen if we both tried to meet each others en's, and both tried that theory.

she said she can't remember the last time she knew without a shadow of a doubt that she loved me like she should. god, that hurts.

i questioned her faca to face about NC, and i am convinced she has had NC since oct. 19. this truly seems to be about me and her, and less about him.

i just wrote her back and ask if she would study up on the MB principals and take that EN test.

i told her that i wanted to make this work.

i asked her if it was worth her time and effort.

i told her if she wants to give up on us and everything else, i needed to know. i told if she didn't want to give up, i needed to know to.

i asked her if she wanted me to make it easy on her and see a lawyer.

i told her if she wants to leave this m, we can make up another excuse, and not tell the kids she had an affair.

i told her I LOVE YOU and want to make this work.

i don't remember all i said, but i am not feeling to good about it now. i hope i did not burn any bridges.

i told her i did not want her to stay just because she was afraid people would find out she had an affsir.

sorry for going on and on, i feel like my world is crumbling.

she said" i don't think either one of us wants me to pretend something i am not feeling. that is what got us here in the first place".

i said i disagree, what got us here was/is failure to communicate.

i gotta take d to b-ball practice, i will check back in a while

arjdad

ok i am back.

i am not doing so good, i am afraid i am heading for divorce.

she says she doesn't know what to do.

i don't know if i should have told her i didn't want her to stay if the only reason was she is afraid of exposure.

maybe i rushed her too much and it is too late to go back now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

i just want to be happy again.
i want her to be happy again.

i don't even know if i should be posting here, this doesn't even seem to be about the affair anymore. it is about the fact that she fell out of love with me a long time ago, and doesn't know how/ what to do about it. this sucks.

arjdad

ok, i am back from picking up d from practise. i have been reading some other threads and am starting to think maybe this is all fog babble. i don't know.

i think maybe i need to step back and re-group.

go back to trying to meet her en's and expect NOTHING in return.

we are still getting along good as friends.

her aunt that she is closest to called from okla. today. she could tell something was wrong with the wife and asked her about it. wife told her we were having problems and broke down crying. she did not tell her about the affair. her aunt is omly about 2.5 hour drive away, and told wife that she was there for her to talk and cry on her shoulder if she ever wants to come down. i think it might be good for wife. she still talks to only one person besides me and mc, and that is with her friend out of state on the computer.

strangely enough, i am feeling pretty good and optimistic again, tho i don't know why.

do you guys think she is still in fog/withdwrawal?

thanks for listening, i am a windbag today. all this and 3 e-mails to wife.

help me, i'm talking and i can't shut up. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

arjdad

Arjdad---Well, just want to tell you that your wife wrote me back <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> , but it seems that my e-mail was not welcome very well. She flat out told me that why should she open up to me, that I dont know her,or her feelings and that she has someone,(a good friend of hers) that she talks to.

I will write you an e-mail later on.

Take care.

Myrta

arjdad,

Sorry-I've been out most of the day again today. I'm so sorry that you're still feeling down. Can you hang in there until you two can go to the MC? Are you both going on Monday???

CC

ok,

last night she said she is sill willing to try. i don't know what that means.

should i just be trying to meet her en's right now?

i don't think this is about the affair anymore.

she just doesn't love me anymore. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

i will hang in there, but i must admit, my detemination is weakening.

maybe i need to just leave her completely alone and play " hard to get"? just a thought.

i am going to MIL house to help her clean up her yard. lots of tree limbs down since the ice storm.she loves me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

considering telling her that her D doesn't think she loves me anymore. and that we may be headed for the big D.

ramblin, sorry,

arjdad

Arjdad--I dont know if you saw my other post about your wife e-mailing me. She did!!

It seems that your problems according to her started about ten years ago. She does not think your problems are the "affair" per se.

But it is a good sign that she told you she is willing to try to save the marriage.

Take care!

MYRTA

myrta,--

was my wife rude in her response to you?
i am sorry if she was, there has been a little tension in the house lately. probably my fault. but thank you for trying.

i have decided to tell her that i will no longer initiate any physical contact with her and when she does i will try not to expect more. that is what she said i do when she tries to show me affection[expect more]

i seem to be in a different place now, i am just so tired of this.

have you followed my thread i started with bob pure? it is somewhat encouraging.

plus, she did tell me she was willing to try still.

still thinking of playing "hard to get"

i quit saying ily, and when i left today, we had a mutual hug and i said," you know i care about you" she said "i know"

i just helped her mom clean her yard, now i am at the public library. don't really feel like going honme just yet.

thanks all for trying to help,

arjdad

ARJDAD- No, she was not rude, she was dry in her e-mail, thats all! She feels no need to talk to anyone about whats going on because she thinks we dont know her or know whats she is feeling. I wrote her another e-mail telling her, that I was here if she ever need it a stranger to talk to about similar experiences <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> .

Thats a very good sign ,yes, that she told you she is willing to try. You both need to talk a lot about everything,before the affair, and examine how was your marriage then.

Keep on being cool, thats good. Dont look to press for her attention.

Take care Arj!!

MYRTA