Well, there has been contact. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I was in Plan B once already, and came out only after A was over & NC in place. Guess it didn't last. Do I plan B again? We don't have any C, and WH is not currently dating OW, so I think conventional wisdom is to try to Plan A as much as possible and keep negotiating NC, etc. (Also, my first Plan A could have been better and I had a couple of accidental LB's lately, thought I was setting boundaries in a nice way, but H went off in a big, angry way.) Advice?

I haven't forgotten you Cute.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Just don't go into that addy too often. Sorry.

Here are the basics:

1. Read concepts section and take the EN questionnaire. If you both can do it fine. If not you take it twice, 1st as you then as him.

2. Read Surviving an Affair, His Needs/Her Needs. Both are by Dr. W. Harley. If he is giving you a hard time, check out Love must be tough by Dr James Dobson.

3. You get with a good MC or better yet, call Steve H @ MB. He will help you develope a good plan B.

4. As for plan A, remember this is about you taking care of you. To a WS even 'good morning' c/b an LB. Don't measure your LB by his reaction if he is a WS. In fact, when my WS got angry for something stupid, I would tell him that he was babbling and I couldn't understand him..... now if that wasn't an LB, don't know what w/b. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> But when he had a legitimate gripe, I was all ears and patiently listened.

5. Setup your immediate support. See your doctor, minister as needed. This place c/b a support also. Not all supporters (including children, the pet, neighbor, co-worker, relative, etc.) has to know all, just ask them to respect your decision and then you give what they need to know not neccessarily the whole story.

6. If you are concerned, check out your financial options or make sure they are secure for you.

Those are the general starters.

take care,
L.

Orchid,
I have done those things. Now I'm at a loss. Guess MB just didn't work for my M.

1. done
2. done, and read many others, did the full Plan A, then Plan B, even wrote out recovery plan with H & agreed to NC and using the 4 Rules of marital recovery and he's been so-so on practicing those, but I keep thanking him for small progress (admiration <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )
3. done both, although H not interested in phone, but did go to MC (I also talked w/ SH several times)
4. true, thank you
5. done, but they are weary & tired of WH's broken promises & my broken heart
6. done, but WH holds all the financial cards, so no leverage or need to meet there

Should I go back to Plan B, or will that just cause the death of our M? Is it better for me to keep Plan A-ing while I keep negotiating/ requesting NC and following 4 rules, MC, etc.? I don't know what to do.

Good to know you have tried those basic steps. Now let's see how well you did in your plan A. For that I would like to get a few other's opinions. They can help you evaluate your prior plan A and help you see about a good plan B timing. ok? Let me know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

BTW, when you last met w/Steve how long ago was it and what did he say?

L.

cute,

When REcontact occurs....the anti goes up...not down. You don't go back to a lengthy Plan A....even if the one you did was less than perfect. Because it's Christmas time....the next few weeks is a perfect time to do a short Plan A during a time when family and children are so important and the bonds of marriage are so visible. But as soon as Christmas is past....it's time to go back to Plan B. Please don't assume this has failed for you....A's are extremely addictive, and sometimes, it takes more than one try to break free....but since you know about contact....Plan A will only enable an affair.

so HE broke contact..
did he disclose

how did you find out..

is it closure contact..
or re-grouping relationship contact..
not that it matters contact is contact..but what is he say it was is..

ante definitelty up..
back to plan b...total darkness....

Should I go back to Plan B, or will that just cause the death of our M?

I don't understand this thinking at all..explain to me how YOU saying I am not part of a triangle
I am not to be disrepected
I am not one to share my spouse

how do these actions cause the death of a marriage...
and NOT
the fact that the WS is betraying three people...
HOW DOES THIS BECOME THE BS FAULT>..
now that's fogged up thinking...

plan B today....
otherwise you condone his contact..
either YOU mean no contact inspite of what he says or does...or YOU say OK to contact...

ARK

Thank you for the advice. I'll try to respond to the questions.

Orchid, my Plan A-ing was pretty good since end of the end of my Plan B, and we made lots of progress (even H commented), but recently things started to slide. I spoke with SH about 2 months ago, and he was encouraging MC and attending a MB seminar - thought it was important for H to hear from someone else (not me) some basic concepts / advice about M.

Starfish - thanks for the advice. I actually thought about this and I've been trying to Plan A hard, but H is putting distance between us (cancelling dates, etc). <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I will continue to Plan A through the end of the year (we have plans for Christmas, but no plans for NYEve yet, so I'm very worried my Plan A ends at Christmas). I've asked him once again for NC and the 4 Rules of recovery, and did it in a positive way. Do I prepare another Plan B letter? (I doubt he remembers the first one very well.)

Ark - yes, he broke it. She has never stopped trying to call, etc, and he took some of those calls. This is the time of year for some of their "anniversaries" and some of my Ddays. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> He did not disclose. He was getting negative about the M, so I started checking everywhere I could. Saw the call logs one day, and her # was there, so I asked, and he blew up and started screaming about anything I had ever done wrong. I just listened, as usual, and the next day he apologized for being so cruel. (the usual cycle for him) I'm sure there are other calls to work or home that I don't know about. I don't know the extent of the contact. He says he's just being nice to her and that she did a lot for him during a difficult time ( <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> difficult because of his choices), and she means a lot to him.

He swears there are not dating again. I actually believe that, because he has started to talk about ending our M so that he can get out there, meet & date other people. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I think the contact with OW has made him distant and cold towards the M, as opposed to wanting to be back with her. Either way, I cannot endure contact with OW or any potential OW. I think H is having a lot of doubts that we can be happy again and regain our love and the calls with OW don't help.

By death of the M I meant that H has not regained all his love for me, so the Love Bank is still low, and if I go to Plan B, I won't have a chance to keep filling the Bank and the love won't be rebuilt. I agree that all contact has to stop.

So, I'm going to Plan A through at least Christmas, but not longer than Jan 1st, and then it's either NC/4 rules or Plan B. Do I write another Plan B letter? Thank you everyone.

IMHO if you don't go to plan B now, you will lose whatever love YOU have for him. You can't even count the love he has for you. This is where most BS' lose focus on both plans. Neither of the plans are the for WS. They are both for the BS and family.

re: No one can control the actions of the WS. Sometimes not even the Ws. So their perception is not reliable. Yea, they may recognise some changes but even then they are not reliable for reiterating it accurately nor controlling their positive changes.

So if you have done a stellar plan A, then plan B is a neccessity unless recovery is solid.

No WS is 'nice or loving', never....what you may periodically see are sightings of your H trying to peek through his dual personality. Can't let that fool you. Plan B will help you find your H but if you are in plan A too long, you won't be able to because the WS w/b sucking the life out of you and laughing all the way to the A. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Sad but true.

L.